All Ireland SHC Final (formerly SHC thread) - READ MOD NOTE POST #1

PTH2009

kala85 wrote: »

Is it open draw for the winners that come through those matches

Think so unless teams have previously meet in the championship this year

Have a feeling this will be the draw for round 1 (I'm no mystic meg lol)

Limerick vs Offaly
Kilkenny vs Waterford
Tipperary vs Westmeath
Laois vs Dublin

MfMan

letowski wrote: »

Long way to go yet, but it seems like Galways best chance to win an AI this year. But its a very open championship, there will be more surprises yet.

There will be huge interest in the provincial finals.

There's a popular saying at papal election time that anyone who enters a conclave as Pope comes out a cardinal. Nothing preordained (pardon!) yet for sure.

C__MC

MfMan wrote: »

There's a popular saying at papal election time that anyone who enters a conclave as Pope comes out a cardinal. Nothing preordained (pardon!) yet for sure.

Believe it or not, Tipperary are still the team to beat in my eyes.

Jayop

Edit: I posted a graph in the wrong thread.

dastardly00

^^^
Need more info to make any sense of that graph.

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Jayop

The main thing to take from it is that I posted it in the wrong thread.

Sorry guys, that was a football post.

Mokuba

Odds of the top 7 contenders with PP as of today -

Galway - 2/1
Tipperary - 7/2
Cork - 9/2
Clare - 13/2
Kilkenny - 10/1
Wexford - 10/1
Waterford - 11/1

Realt Dearg Sec

Jayop wrote: »

The main thing to take from it is that I posted it in the wrong thread.

Sorry guys, that was a football post.

Is there a hurling equivalent of it? Be interesting to see.

dastardly00

Patww79 wrote: »

2017 is higher than any of 2001-2016 in cumulative points at this stage. It was 2nd from games 16-22.

I was referring to there being no scale on the y-axis (points). Not much use without it.

*I know it was the football championship but my point is still relevant*

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

HurlingRanker

Mokuba wrote: »

Odds of the top 7 contenders with PP as of today -

Galway - 2/1
Tipperary - 7/2
Cork - 9/2
Clare - 13/2
Kilkenny - 10/1
Wexford - 10/1
Waterford - 11/1

I couldn't believe Kilkenny were 10/1 but sure enough that's exactly what they are on Paddy Power.

10/3 each way bet on Kilkenny. 10/3 for them to reach an All-Ireland final is massively tempting. They may not be what they were but they still have the beating of any team in the country.

Jayop

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Is there a hurling equivalent of it? Be interesting to see.

It was posted by this guy on twitter. I'll have a look and see if he does any hurling.

@gaelicstats

Rumpy Pumpy

I think Galway at 2/1 is silly, and I say that as a proud Tribesman. Backed them at 7/1 before the league final. They are an extremely physical team, but I'd have questions about the backs under low ball. Bench is a little bit light in certain areas as well.

Think Kilkenny at 10/1 is a great e/w bet - can see them having a big say in the Championship yet.

thelad95

Lads this is the poorest Kilkenny team I've ever seen in my twenty-two years on this earth as a Kilkenny man. The team has badly badly regressed and Cody seems a bit clueless as to what to do with his charges.

Some of the new fellas who've come through wouldn't have made the January training panel if it was 2006-2012.

Bonniedog

thelad95 wrote: »

Lads this is the poorest Kilkenny team I've ever seen in my twenty-two years on this earth as a Kilkenny man. The team has badly badly regressed and Cody seems a bit clueless as to what to do with his charges.

Some of the new fellas who've come through wouldn't have made the January training panel if it was 2006-2012.

Ah stop. The man is the greatest hurling man in history. I shall give you the benefit of your short time on the planet.

Realt Dearg Sec

thelad95 wrote: »

Lads this is the poorest Kilkenny team I've ever seen in my twenty-two years on this earth as a Kilkenny man. The team has badly badly regressed and Cody seems a bit clueless as to what to do with his charges.

Some of the new fellas who've come through wouldn't have made the January training panel if it was 2006-2012.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_bias

Rumpy Pumpy

Bonniedog wrote: »

Ah stop. The man is the greatest hurling man in history. I shall give you the benefit of your short time on the planet.

Absolutely. He's a bit of a bastard, but there is no doubting his living legend status. He sums up that Kilkenny belief - there are a bigger pool of players to choose from in Cork, Galway, and possibly Tipperary. He also has that ruthless streak that marks him out as a great manager - the chopping of Charlie Carter always stands out.

mountgomery burns

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_bias

In fairness, I know its early in the year too, but would you be surprised if its the worst Kilkenny team Cody has managed?

Realt Dearg Sec

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_bias

In fairness, I know its early in the year too, but would you be surprised if its the worst Kilkenny team Cody has managed?

No, my point was that claiming it's the poorest Kilkenny team in one's living memory is a fair thing to say if you're twenty two years old, but it isn't a particularly damning judgment because the sample is completely skewed by just how ludicrously good the team was from 2006-12. On a longer timeline I don't think the current team are too bad, and I've certainly seen worse in the pre Cody era.

Realt Dearg Sec

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_bias

In fairness, I know its early in the year too, but would you be surprised if its the worst Kilkenny team Cody has managed?

No, my point was that claiming it's the poorest Kilkenny team in one's living memory is a fair thing to say if you're twenty two years old, but it isn't a particularly damning judgment because the sample is completely skewed by just how ludicrously good the team was from 2006-12. On a longer timeline I don't think the current team are too bad, and I've certainly seen worse in the pre Cody era.

mountgomery burns

Fair enough, just think the championship is very competitive this year and that I really can't see them beating 4 of Waterford, Tipp, Cork, Clare and Galway based on the Wexford performance, which they'll likely have to do unless they get a lucky draw up to the quarters.

Realt Dearg Sec

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Fair enough, just think the championship is very competitive this year and that I really can't see them beating 4 of Waterford, Tipp, Cork, Clare and Galway based on the Wexford performance, which they'll likely have to do unless they get a lucky draw up to the quarters.

I don't disagree with any of that.

danganabu

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

No, my point was that claiming it's the poorest Kilkenny team in one's living memory is a fair thing to say if you're twenty two years old, but it isn't a particularly damning judgment because the sample is completely skewed by just how ludicrously good the team was from 2006-12. On a longer timeline I don't think the current team are too bad, and I've certainly seen worse in the pre Cody era.

Exactly, my 6 month old son swears its the best KK team he has ever seen, and I cant argue with him tbh :D

Realt Dearg Sec

danganabu wrote: »

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

No, my point was that claiming it's the poorest Kilkenny team in one's living memory is a fair thing to say if you're twenty two years old, but it isn't a particularly damning judgment because the sample is completely skewed by just how ludicrously good the team was from 2006-12. On a longer timeline I don't think the current team are too bad, and I've certainly seen worse in the pre Cody era.

Exactly, my 6 month old son swears its the best KK team he has ever seen, and I cant argue with him tbh :D

I thought my daughter was doing well knowing the dog's name at 18 months old, she hasn't expressed a strong opinion on the state of Kilkenny hurling yet.

galwaylad14

As a long suffering Galway fan I'm genuinely starting to get wary about how well everything is going. The way everything has shaped up over the last two month things really couldn't be looking any rosier from our viewpoint. Destroyed everyone's All Ireland favourites Tipp in the league final and then went on to hammer fairly poor Dublin and Offaly teams in the Leinster Championship.

Added to this the other 3 teams that made up last year's semi finalists seems to be in varying degrees of disarray. Waterford, Kilkenny and Tipp all had bad provincial defeats and seem to have a lot of hard work ahead to get their various issues sorted. Even if they do manage to get up and running again they all now face a very long and difficult road to September. Tipp I think just need to re-focus after whatever did or didn't happen in the lead up to the Cork game, the break should do them good and by all accounts they're starting to motor well again. I think Waterford and Kilkenny's problems look more difficult to fix in the short term. Kilkenny just look very short of the requisite quality in the full back line and they also look short of another forward. Hard to see what they can really do to amend that unless the top quality guys they undoubtedly have can really hit top form and make up the shortfall. Waterford look like a team that didn't know what they were doing on Sunday, there seemed to be no real plan and the players didn't look sharp at all. Maybe it's an issue with McGrath, impossible to know. I definitely think of these 3 though that Tipp have the most chance of lifting Liam, they just have so much quality, particularly up front.

It's possible that one of them may have to beat the other two just to make a quarter final where they will have a very difficult challenge against either Wexford(!!), or the losers of Cork and Clare.

Whatever happens I hope two of three don't survive the qualifiers anyway.

Cork seem to be flying but I'm still not fully convinced. That's much the same team as the last 3 years or so when realistically they've been nowhere near winning an All Ireland. Though maybe it's just a case of the new manager and the one or two new guys being the catalysts the rest of the team needed to reach greater heights. For example I never seen Mark Ellis hurl as well as he did last Sunday before, looked a new man. Lehane and Pat Horgan looked in top form too as well as Harnedy who in fairness has been consistently excellent for them.

Clare are a team that seem to be a bit under the radar of everyone. They've a team of super hurlers that have buckets of All Irelands between them between minor, 21 and the 2013 senior. They weren't overly impressive against Limerick but still won comfortably with Tony Kelly and their free taker having an off day. 9/10 neither of those things happen which is probably worth another 8 points alone to them.

As I see it they are in equally as rude a health as the other 3 provincial finalists and yet there's no talk at all really about them. I think they might beat Cork in that Munster final, both teams play a similar style with their all action short stick passing games and I fancy Clare have the better individual hurlers which might be enough.

Wexford are flying at the moment, the best I can ever remember Wexford hurling in my lifetime. What Davy has done with them in 6 months is astonishing really. To think they went from also rans last year to winning promotion this year and beating Kilkenny in the championship (and it wasn't a shock result either). I still can't see them challenging for the All Ireland though and I think we'll beat them in Leinster too. Like all of Davy's teams they're very good around the half backline and midfield areas, they seem to have lots of good hurlers around here and work very hard for each other, with Lee Chin being particularly influential. I still think though they are lacking slightly on real top class forwards and also that full backline look a little vulnerable. Neither of these statements are applicable to Galway and that's why I think we'll beat them.

Finally Galway, although we've been close before and have been a genuine contender for the last 5 seasons this is the first time that I genuinely believe we have the best team out there. Just so well balanced with good hurlers all over the field and huge men too. Playing a lovely brand of hurling aswell direct but measured deliveries into the forwards who have just been on fire these past 6 weeks or so. The permanent placing of Joe in the half forward line is working a treat too. Absolutely flying at the moment and long may it continue. The worry for me though is that if we were to lose one of Daithi Burke, David Burke, Joe Canning or Conor Whelan that it'd be too much to recover from.

Time will tell. Should be a great summer.

PTH2009

They could of easily done the draw for the first round of the qualifers yesterday morning and give teams time to look at opposition etc

Instead teams only have 6 days too plan there game against the opposition

Stevecw

PTH2009 wrote: »

They could of easily done the draw for the first round of the qualifers yesterday morning and give teams time to look at opposition etc

Instead teams only have 6 days too plan there game against the opposition

It's bad form. The whole draw held up because IF Laois beat Carlow, they MIGHT be drawn against Westmeath again. So if a team has played already in hurling it can't happen again. But I notice in football it can happen. Weird

danganabu

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

I thought my daughter was doing well knowing the dog's name at 18 months old, she hasn't expressed a strong opinion on the state of Kilkenny hurling yet.

That's why we are known as the premier :D

danganabu

PTH2009 wrote: »

They could of easily done the draw for the first round of the qualifers yesterday morning and give teams time to look at opposition etc

Instead teams only have 6 days too plan there game against the opposition

No they couldn't as teams who have already played each other cant play each other so without knowing the result of Laois v Carlow as Laois can't play Westmeath