Men of boards, what innocent behaviors have you changed out of fear?

_Whimsical_ · 19-06-2017 07:45PM

Avatar MIA wrote: »

My work overlooks the schoolyard my kids go to school. At lunchtime you could look out and see them play from a stairwell window.

Other staff and the public could walk past. I felt really awkward, and felt like I should mention my kids were down there.

I didn't look out as often as I'd have liked.

That's really sad. Wanting to look out and see your kids playing is exactly the kind of traits we should be actively encouraging in men and fathers. What a wonderful world we'd have if every kid had a dad like that.

It's very sad, I can think of so many times in my childhood when men I was not related to were kind to me and it was such a positive influence on my life. Other times too when I saw men I was related to be kind to kids outside the family taught me a lot as well. My grandad picked me up from school and always helped the "bold" kid in my class put his coat on and made sure his shoes were tied and insisted on him crossing the road with us so he knew he'd be safe to get home. That child was not flagged as special needs early in school, he was the troublesome kid but I've since found out he was diagnosed with a genetic condition and had very serious difficulties with motor skills like being able to get shoes or a jacket on. Not one of the mothers at the gate or teachers ever helped him though and in school we were not taught to respect his difficulties at all. He always came straight to the gate to my grandad with his coat in hand. Sad to think now he'd be seen by a man and would have to be ignored rather than helped across the road.

wakka12 · 19-06-2017 08:28PM

I dont know if I'm just particularly inhibited but do any other men feel uncomfortable when you meet friends or whatever with little kids and theyre playing around and jump up and down on your lap in case somebody might think you're enjoying it or something? Maybe its even more irrational than other stuff on this thread but I cant help shake the feeling

19-06-2017 08:42PM

The paranoia around children is definitely a big issue for me, but all in all, I'd say the world around me has changed a lot since I was a kid, and it has changed most of us for the better.

I think a lot of us guys are more respectful towards women, towards guys who are gay, and towards minorities, than previous generations. Yes, sometimes so-called "political correctness" (also called 'being compassionate') goes a little too far, with crazy people on Twitter getting offended because someone in Roscommon 'appropriated' a Native American word, or whatever, but that's an extreme.

I know I'm generalizing across age groups here, but I genuinely do think there are a lot of guys in the older generations who act completely inappropriately in front of women, who don't understand why homophobic slurs aren't funny, and so on.

You see that behaviour amongst younger guys too, but I think it's dwindling, largely because of cultural shift.

scopper · 19-06-2017 08:54PM

wakka12 wrote: »

I dont know if I'm just particularly inhibited but do any other men feel uncomfortable when you meet friends or whatever with little kids and theyre playing around and jump up and down on your lap in case somebody might think you're enjoying it or something? Maybe its even more irrational than other stuff on this thread but I cant help shake the feeling

I would consider that irrational yes. You are defo overthinking it. Unless you are actively isolating a kid or something actually weird I doubt anybody is thinking you are enjoying that.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5 · 19-06-2017 09:08PM

My friend's son went through a brief phase of basically going full Donald Trump and grabbing em by the p*ssy, because he thought the reactions were hilarious. I have to say it is very weird to have a five year old touch your bits, he never got me in public thank god but I can see how I would have felt...uneasy or weirdly guilty. And there's a ****load more suspicion directed at men of course.

Kids are just so unselfconscious and physical and frequently naked that it can be a strange experience for people who don't have or spend much time with children, not just men. I'd wonder about generational differences too, I was in school in the nineties and there was SUCH a high level of awareness about paedophilia and what to do if someone made you uncomfortable and so on, I'd say it does still influence me to some extent in how I now deal with children.

Whereas my dad recently stopped dead as we were driving through some housing estate to ask a wee girl what game she was playing and tell her she was a lovely wee pet. I asked him afterwards why didn't you just go ahead and offer her sweets and he said he would if he'd had some :pac: Hadn't crossed his mind that people might see the interaction as sinister and in his words "I refuse to live in that world"

indioblack · 19-06-2017 09:09PM

anna080 wrote: »

My boyfriend was telling me about a time he was outside working on his car and the neighbours two 6 year old nieces came over. They were asking him questions and asking could they sit in his car and would he bring them to the shop.
He said he felt like a creep for even talking to them and as a male, society has made you feel so paranoid about even speaking to children alone. He said he'd have loved nothing more than to have gone inside and gotten the two girls an ice pop and had a laugh with them but he just felt odd and told them they should probably go home and he felt ashamed about that.

That is sad.
Some years ago I was walking my dog along the canal towpath and a girl of about eight years came alongside and began to chat. She made friends with my dog and chattered away and I gathered she didn't live locally, but was staying with her grandmother in a hamlet some two miles further along the towpath.
We reached a point where I could see the hamlet where she was staying, this was where I branched off and took another route home. As it was getting late I asked if she would be alright and to go straight home. She said yes and it wasn't far.
I then asked her if her grandmother had cautioned her about talking to strangers and she replied yes to that also. We said goodbye and I never saw her again.
Some days after, my sister was walking the dog along the same stretch of canal towpath and the girl came alongside her, reintroduced herself to the dog, and accompanied my sister, chattering all the way.
When they parted she asked my sister to thank me for my concern on her behalf.

retro:electro · 19-06-2017 09:10PM

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

That's really sad. Wanting to look out and see your kids playing is exactly the kind of traits we should be actively encouraging in men and fathers. What a wonderful world we'd have if every kid had a dad like that.

It's very sad, I can think of so many times in my childhood when men I was not related to were kind to me and it was such a positive influence on my life. Other times too when I saw men I was related to be kind to kids outside the family taught me a lot as well. My grandad picked me up from school and always helped the "bold" kid in my class put his coat on and made sure his shoes were tied and insisted on him crossing the road with us so he knew he'd be safe to get home. That child was not flagged as special needs early in school, he was the troublesome kid but I've since found out he was diagnosed with a genetic condition and had very serious difficulties with motor skills like being able to get shoes or a jacket on. Not one of the mothers at the gate or teachers ever helped him though and in school we were not taught to respect his difficulties at all. He always came straight to the gate to my grandad with his coat in hand. Sad to think now he'd be seen by a man and would have to be ignored rather than helped across the road.

I love this post. Your grandad sounds like such a lovely man.

Ubbquittious · 19-06-2017 09:12PM

Madeline Handsome Ump wrote: »

Whereas my dad recently stopped dead as we were driving through some housing estate to ask a wee girl what game she was playing and tell her she was a lovely wee pet. I asked him afterwards why didn't you just go ahead and offer her sweets and he said he would if he'd had some :pac: Hadn't crossed his mind that people might see the interaction as sinister and in his words "I refuse to live in that world"

I think (hope) if enough people "refuse to live in that world" this fearful nonsense will die off and things will go back to the way they were

pappyodaniel · 19-06-2017 09:19PM

I was driving to ennis one day and just passing a traveller halting site when I notice a small boy (about 3 years old) walking out into the middle of the road. I stuck on my hazard lights and stopped the car. I rushed out and picked him up and brought him into the halting site to look for a parent. I was met with a few teenage girls and they started shout at me to "put that child down" and a few lads came over to see what the commotion was.
I explained the situation and the danger of it, but I was more or less treated with suspicion and was ran out of the place. No gratitude ..... just allegations of being a pervert.

Ubbquittious · 19-06-2017 09:26PM

pappyodaniel wrote: »

I was driving to ennis one day and just passing a traveller halting site when I notice a small boy (about 3 years old) walking out into the middle of the road. I stuck on my hazard lights and stopped the car. I rushed out and picked him up and brought him into the halting site to look for a parent. I was met with a few teenage girls and they started shout at me to "put that child down" and a few lads came over to see what the commotion was.
I explained the situation and the danger of it, but I was more or less treated with suspicion and was ran out of the place. No gratitude ..... just allegations of being a pervert.

Don't let the halting site crowd taint the reputation of everyone else

zig · 20-06-2017 08:06AM

If people feel like this can you imagine how priests must feel around kids. I actually feel sorry for them.

Dravokivich · 20-06-2017 08:16AM

None.

I've ripped into someone somewhere around these parts before, who was pushing such an idea and tip toeing to it, makes it more of a self fulling prophecy.

If some one or a bunch of people think wrongly of my actions. That's there problem to be honest. I ain't going to skirt around things just in case.

nice_guy80 · 20-06-2017 08:19AM

I work in a school

I'm not paranoid at all about helping children, in the majority of situations both inside and outside of school. Maybe because I do it every day

AudreyHepburn · 20-06-2017 08:28AM

I think it's sad that men feel the need to change the behavior to avoid be labeled perverts or rapists or child molesters.

It says something not very complimentary about society as a whole, and about women/mothers in particular that it's come to that.

As a woman I cannot understand the need to assume that just because chooses to walk down the road behind me, watch me as I go by or smile at my children that he must be a danger.

Ubbquittious · 20-06-2017 10:13AM

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

I think it's sad that men feel the need to change the behavior to avoid be labeled perverts or rapists or child molesters.

It says something not very complimentary about society as a whole, and about women/mothers in particular that it's come to that.

As a woman I cannot understand the need to assume that just because chooses to walk down the road behind me, watch me as I go by or smile at my children that he must be a danger.

I wonder is it partially caused by people's fixation on bad news that perpetuates a lot of this codology. Nobody really wants to hear about how someone is a great lad and all the nice things he does like handing out sweets and giving kids lifts home from school if they're caught in the rain.

If you add a sinister element and vilify him as a perv everyone gathers around the table with pointed ears to hear the next installment of the story. Those people will go on to spread the news "I heard so-and-so down the road did this and that thing which means he could possibly very well be a dirty perv beware stay well away"

silverharp · 20-06-2017 10:18AM

Society has lost something for sure, When I was a kid I had a great time with the older dads on the road and they had lots of time for the kids. They might be working on their cars and whatnot and they didn't mind me hanging out asking loads of stupid questions, messing with their tools, scamming fizzy drinks and biscuits off them. Now I'd politely shoo them on

jmayo · 20-06-2017 10:44AM

silverharp wrote: »

Society has lost something for sure, When I was a kid I had a great time with the older dads on the road and they had lots of time for the kids. They might be working on their cars and whatnot and they didn't mind me hanging out asking loads of stupid questions, messing with their tools, scamming fizzy drinks and biscuits off them. Now I'd politely shoo them on

But in some of those scenarios it is not just fear of being viewed as a would be predator after children, but fear of lawsuits if anything happened.

Years ago the stuff we got up to as kids not alone on our own farms, but on other people's farms as well, would cause a modern Health & Safety officer to go into convolutions.

Nowadays a lot of people are worried that if anything happens to not alone an adult but worst still a kid then lawyers would be involved.

And no I am not talking about things like riding quads, driving tractors or playing around slurry pits, but things like climbing on bales in a hayshed. climbing on parked up trailers or machines, jumping off pit walls etc.

Likewise with kids around garages and cars being fixed.

silverharp · 20-06-2017 10:50AM

jmayo wrote: »

But in some of those scenarios it is not just fear of being viewed as a would be predator after children, but fear of lawsuits if anything happened.

Years ago the stuff we got up to as kids not alone on our own farms, but on other people's farms as well, would cause a modern Health & Safety officer to go into convolutions.

Nowadays a lot of people are worried that if anything happens to not alone an adult but worst still a kid then lawyers would be involved.

And no I am not talking about things like riding quads, driving tractors or playing around slurry pits, but things like climbing on bales in a hayshed. climbing on parked up trailers or machines, jumping off pit walls etc.

Likewise with kids around garages and cars being fixed.

I used to spend a lot of time on a farm too in the summer and yep there was a lot of freedom back then, you just walked in to peoples houses. I wouldn't say its an insurance thing in Dublin but would agree that messing on people's farms was a little dangerous in hindsight so would fully agree with keeping kids off farms today.

PandaPoo · 20-06-2017 11:06AM

My husband was swinging my son and daughter around by the arms up on the green where we live, some other girls on the road came up and asked him to do it with them. He was going to do it but I stopped him and told him to never touch another child, they are between the ages of 7 and 10.

I know their parents and they had an argument with another neighbour once because he drove too slow coming into the estate and stared at the kids too much. Same parents give out that people drive too fast and don't pay attention to the kids out playing and will cause an accident. You can't win.

seamus · 20-06-2017 11:24AM

silverharp wrote: »

Now I'd politely shoo them on

Why?

Plenty of times I've been working on stuff in the front garden and had the local kids coming over asking questions or just watching. No reason to fear being branded a pervert tbh.

If you're giving into this fear, then you're part of the problem, being perfectly honest.

In any case, I think the reality is that this perception is massively overblown and only really exists in strange corners of the Internet. In some parts you'd be led to believe that simply being a man near a child is likely to have some battleaxe marching up to you and screaming in your face.

I've been to many, many playgrounds with my child, spent plenty of time walking around, looking around, taking photos. I've spoken to many children who've wandered up to me for whatever reason.
I've never once had someone even look sideways at me, never mind this idea that you'd be branded a pervert for having the temerity to say "Hi" to a child.

take everything · 20-06-2017 11:31AM

wonderfullife wrote: »

I saw 2 kids in a car on their own in ALDI car park (parked in the sun), I'd say they were maybe 6 and 3 and they were banging on the windows. So I hovered for about 60 seconds to make sure they were ok and just as I was about to go into ALDI to get them to make an announcement, their mam came walking towards the car with a full trolley and ate the face off me, told me to get the F away from her car/kids before she'd call the Guards.

I suppose I can see her point of view but what am I supposed to do with 2 children whacking on a car window in 24 degree heat, just ignore it and carry on?

So basically this scene from About a Boy. I love how he completely turns the tables and exposes her failings.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPgbiSbYzfg

Well apart from the fact you didn't call her out on her bull****. In fairness I don't blame you. It would be a difficult thing to do in this climate of bull****.

I love the Will character in About a boy. And Hugh Grant plays him perfectly. One of my favourite characters in one of my favourite movies (apart from a too typical Hollywood ending it's a great film exploring masculinity in crisis).

BrokenArrows · 20-06-2017 11:33AM

Ah the freedom of being single and being able to let out a ripper of a fart in the middle of the night in bed.
Cant do that now out of fear the wife will murder me.

professore · 20-06-2017 11:38AM

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You do realise that discussing something is not the same as everyone nodding their heads and agreeing with each other? You sound very like the nuns that forbade any questions like if God was so good, why did he allow children to die of hunger. This is the new normal, where "free speech" is allowed only if it agrees rigidly with the status quo.

Thinking being gay or trans is a condition is not the same thing as being homophobic. Not in the least. I think coeliac disease is a condition but that's not the same thing at all as thinking that coeliacs are somehow inferior or whatever.

silverharp · 20-06-2017 11:41AM

seamus wrote: »

Why?

Plenty of times I've been working on stuff in the front garden and had the local kids coming over asking questions or just watching. No reason to fear being branded a pervert tbh.

If you're giving into this fear, then you're part of the problem, being perfectly honest.

In any case, I think the reality is that this perception is massively overblown and only really exists in strange corners of the Internet. In some parts you'd be led to believe that simply being a man near a child is likely to have some battleaxe marching up to you and screaming in your face.

I've been to many, many playgrounds with my child, spent plenty of time walking around, looking around, taking photos. I've spoken to many children who've wandered up to me for whatever reason.
I've never once had someone even look sideways at me, never mind this idea that you'd be branded a pervert for having the temerity to say "Hi" to a child.

In that situation and assuming I knew the families I wouldn't be thinking I'd be branded a pervert and in fairness for all the years ive been "hanging around" kids parks in Dublin with my kids I never felt uncomfortable or was made to feel so, the horror stories tended to be more from London where some parks banned men apparently.
I was just thinking maybe kids are less engaging these days anyway and there is just less overall interaction so kids aren't used to engaging with adults in general and vice versa, the idea of "the village being needed to raise a kid" is dead

20-06-2017 11:46AM

suicide_circus wrote: »

I've had to stop driving round in my van offering lifts to kids.

I had to sell my van.

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....... · 20-06-2017 11:48AM

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Glenster · 20-06-2017 11:50AM

silverharp wrote: »

Society has lost something for sure, When I was a kid I had a great time with the older dads on the road and they had lots of time for the kids. They might be working on their cars and whatnot and they didn't mind me hanging out asking loads of stupid questions, messing with their tools, scamming fizzy drinks and biscuits off them. Now I'd politely shoo them on

Regardless of the possibility of them being nonced off, I wouldn't want my hypothetical kids playing with 'tools' or eating sweets and biscuits with anyone, they might get hurt or ruin their appetite for dinner.

Good that things have changed.

Maximus Alexander · 20-06-2017 11:59AM

....... wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

As much as I don't agree with what the guy is saying, I more strongly disagree with what you just said.

"You're ignorant about something, so don't talk about it."

Yeah, that's definitely the key to thwarting ignorance. :rolleyes:

....... · 20-06-2017 12:02PM

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BrokenArrows · 20-06-2017 01:56PM

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Being gay does not mean your trans. But in the majority of cases being trans means your gay.

And i fully agree that being trans is certainly a form of mental illness. The belief that you were born the wrong gender is just lunacy. You are born the way you were born. End of discussion. Now its obviously not a mental illness that can be fixed so society must accept it, but accepting something doesn't mean its normal.

Same applies to being gay, its not normal and is some form of mental illness and its a personal choice by the person to follow their desires and have relationships with people of the same gender. Again its not something that can be fixed so society must accept it.

None of the above is "hateful ignorance" as you put it, it is imply my opinion and doesnt cause me to treat gay or trans people with hatred, although i believe trans is far more extreme and should not be accepted.

Men of boards, what innocent behaviors have you changed out of fear?

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