Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

wonderfullife · 23-05-2017 07:30PM

Do You Mr Jones? wrote: »

STAND UP AND FIGHT. 'Tolerance' will not protect you or your family.

What do you want done genius seeing as you have the answers? Stand up and fight how? Grab pitch forks and golf clubs and go on a rampage against all Muslims?

endacl · 23-05-2017 07:31PM

wonderfullife wrote: »

What do you want done genius seeing as you have the answers? Stand up and fight how? Grab pitch forks and golf clubs and go on a rampage against all Muslims?

2 posts? Anti-furriner rant?

I wonder what his last account on here was called...?

pjohnson · 23-05-2017 07:31PM

wonderfullife wrote: »

So you're saying we should be far more worried by things that are intentional as opposed to unintentional, despite the unintentional things posing far higher problems?

Splendid.

At what point will any of you admit the actual threat posed by Radical Islamic Terrorists in the UK has been statistically extremely low?

Why the disproportionate and irrational attitude towards this one problem? It's the same in America..... if it's an Radical Islamist who bombs somewhere killing 20 people you have this extremely xenophobic, racist reaction but if it's just regular old mass murder committed by non-Muslims there's a "meh" reaction.

I dont think statistics will cheer up the bereaved families. It might make you happy and let you sleep easy that you've shown muslims are harmless people. 22 families are wrong.

Achasanai · 23-05-2017 07:32PM

Nabber wrote: »

Integration won't work.

My current employer is a large multinational corporation.
They re-structured my org so as two Muslim men wouldn't have to report to my colleague (Irish/white/female)

The two guys also refuse to shake hands with any female colleagues but are fine with shaking men's hands.

Over the canteen talk this comes up a lot, that they have made little or no effort to adapt to our society. That women are equal amount men.
These two men are well educated and from their own mouth they are from respectable families. Based on their past education they would appear so.

From all but one interaction with Muslim men and women, I have found none have adapted or accepted our way of life.

There was one guy, but he kept his life in Ireland secret from his family in Jordan.

1st, 2nd & 3rd generation are not integrating into our society. It was a failed experiment.

If you want to make your society 'better' then attack Islam with the same ferocity that Christianity has had. Same for Hinduism and Judaism

I work with a fair few Muslims, and they make up a fairly substantial amount of the students too, and we haven't had any issues along those lines. They integrate well, no issues with shaking hands with women, happy to have women bosses. Most of them have their religion as completely separate from their social/public life.

So, I'm going to say that integration does work. Because anecdotal evidence is great like that.

Help!!!! · 23-05-2017 07:34PM

wonderfullife wrote: »

So you're saying we should be far more worried by things that are intentional as opposed to unintentional, despite the unintentional things posing far higher problems?

Splendid.

At what point will any of you admit the actual threat posed by Radical Islamic Terrorists in the UK has been statistically extremely low?

Why the disproportionate and irrational attitude towards this one problem? It's the same in America..... if it's an Radical Islamist who bombs somewhere killing 20 people you have this extremely xenophobic, racist reaction but if it's just regular old mass murder committed by non-Muslims there's a "meh" reaction.

You do realise there were over 12 foiled attempts in the UK last year & over 20 in France. This was not an isolated threat

23-05-2017 07:35PM

Nabber wrote: »

Integration won't work.

My current employer is a large multinational corporation.
They re-structured my org so as two Muslim men wouldn't have to report to my colleague (Irish/white/female)

The two guys also refuse to shake hands with any female colleagues but are fine with shaking men's hands.

Over the canteen talk this comes up a lot, that they have made little or no effort to adapt to our society. That women are equal amount men.
These two men are well educated and from their own mouth they are from respectable families. Based on their past education they would appear so.

From all but one interaction with Muslim men and women, I have found none have adapted or accepted our way of life.

There was one guy, but he kept his life in Ireland secret from his family in Jordan.

1st, 2nd & 3rd generation are not integrating into our society. It was a failed experiment.

If you want to make your society 'better' then attack Islam with the same ferocity that Christianity has had. Same for Hinduism and Judaism

That is disgraceful.

Your organisation is obliged to obey laws on equality, just like everyone else.

Equality and tolerance does not mean choosing one groups rights over the rights of another group.

The law is the law - or should be. Those who don't like it are free to leave.

Yourself isit · 23-05-2017 07:36PM

martingriff wrote: »

Except you are the 1 who is trying to say the IRA never targeted woman and children. and that is what I was replying to not those who and trying to defend the IRA so that is what I am replying to you and your quiet frankly ludicrous accretion that the IRA never targeted women and children. So how about you try to make an argument for mine against yours or realise that you could have been wrong

What I said was that the IRA wasn't the same as Isis. And I said "by and large" they didn't deliberately target civilians. Ask someone with the reading ability of a 12 year old to explain that phrase because you clearly can't. My personal opinion on northern ireland is it can stay in the UK. No republican here.

I only replied to the IRA thing in general so as to thwart the whataboutary. Thats my last comment on them. Meanwhile free to feel as appalled at yesterday's attacks as you clearly are about attacks that happened decades ago

martingriff · 23-05-2017 07:37PM

tomofson wrote: »

We almost got two pages without a mention please dont go starting that off again.

Sorry tomofson. It was the point he was trying to back out of a point he was making got me wound up. I shouuld take my own advice and step away from the keyboard

Help!!!! · 23-05-2017 07:39PM

Seemingly theres 3500 active terror suspects in the UK, how many more they dont know about?

Yourself isit · 23-05-2017 07:40PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

That is disgraceful.

Your organisation is obliged to obey laws on equality, just like everyone else.

Equality and tolerance does not mean choosing one groups rights over the rights of another group.

The law is the law - or should be. Those who don't like it are free to leave.

In theory. In practice there are hierarchies of "dis privilege". The organisation has guys who would probably shout racism if they were fired over this and apparently the women managers are not upset enough to take a case.

Obvious thing to do for hr is go put these guys under male management.

tomofson · 23-05-2017 07:41PM

Help!!!! wrote: »

Seemingly theres 3500 active terror suspects in the UK, how many more they dont know about?

And i'd say they identified most of them through the "hate preachers", yet some people want the hate preachers driven underground not understanding they actually offer a useful service for identifying these people.

Richard Hillman · 23-05-2017 07:41PM

wonderfullife wrote: »

What do you want done genius seeing as you have the answers? Stand up and fight how? Grab pitch forks and golf clubs and go on a rampage against all Muslims?

No matter what side of the spectrum you are on, we can all agree that it is almost guaranteed that with these attacks increasing, the people will start to take it into their own hands. It's going to start happening soon, you know it and I know it.

pjohnson · 23-05-2017 07:41PM

Help!!!! wrote: »

Seemingly theres 3500 active terror suspects in the UK, how many more they dont know about?

Ah yeah but like theres more peanuts than that. They are the real crime apparently.

Danzy · 23-05-2017 07:42PM

martingriff wrote: »

Except you are the 1 who is trying to say the IRA never targeted woman and children. and that is what I was replying to not those who and trying to defend the IRA so that is what I am replying to you and your quiet frankly ludicrous accretion that the IRA never targeted women and children. So how about you try to make an argument for mine against yours or realise that you could have been wrong

Largely they did not, not to the same extent other actors in the conflict did, especially the Army.

Yet you are derailing the thread, which I suspect is your motivation in the 1st place.

Either that or you are stuck in the past and haven't the mental ability to break out of your rut.

Help!!!! · 23-05-2017 07:42PM

Deleted User wrote: »

That is disgraceful.

Your organisation is obliged to obey laws on equality, just like everyone else.

Equality and tolerance does not mean choosing one groups rights over the rights of another group.

The law is the law - or should be. Those who don't like it are free to leave.

Yeah but complain & there will be some liberal calling you a racist or bigot & you will be the one getting fired

Help!!!! · 23-05-2017 07:43PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Ah yeah but like theres more peanuts than that. They are the real crime apparently.

haha yeah, is it not racist to compare the two due to colour?

Danzy · 23-05-2017 07:44PM

Richard Hillman wrote: »

No matter what side of the spectrum you are on, we can all agree that it is almost guaranteed that with these attacks increasing, the people will start to take it into their own hands. It's going to start happening soon, you know it and I know it.

Given the refusal to deal with this and the shi7storm that a person would bring down upon themselves by the righteous types for even mentioning you though there was a problem, it will lead to a response, largely electoral but in places like France where tension is already at boiling point it may lead to intercommunal violence.

Ken. · 23-05-2017 07:47PM

Mod-Yourself isit do not post in this thread again. failure to follow a simple mod instruction to drop the IRA crap.

......... · 23-05-2017 07:53PM

Yourself isit wrote: »

In theory. In practice there are hierarchies of "dis privilege". The organisation has guys who would probably shout racism if they were fired over this and apparently the women managers are not upset enough to take a case.

Obvious thing to do for hr is go put these guys under male management.

More rubbish. So how should a non Muslim employee be treated in the same Irish company if they refused to work for a female manager.

Mr.Micro · 23-05-2017 07:55PM

There is no real solution or easy solution to the threat of terrorism. All this nonsense about deporting people. The naievety of some. People just have to be vigilant and try to carry on as normal. So long as there is conflict in the world, currently in the Middle East there will be an overspill to Europe.

......... · 23-05-2017 07:56PM

Mr.Micro wrote: »

There is no real solution or easy solution to the threat of terrorism. All thus nonsense about deporting people. The naievety of some. People just have to be vigilant and carry on as normal. So long as there is conflict in the world, currently in the Middle East there will be an overspill to Europe.

There's been "trouble" in the middle east since at least the 30's, only in very recent years have so many been allowed to move from their own countries to most European ones. Bottom line is the billionaires of Europe want cheaper labour all round.

Danzy · 23-05-2017 08:00PM

Mr.Micro wrote: »

There is no real solution or easy solution to the threat of terrorism. All this nonsense about deporting people. The naievety of some. People just have to be vigilant and try to carry on as normal. So long as there is conflict in the world, currently in the Middle East there will be an overspill to Europe.

Things like gay marriage, women's rights, atheism, materialism, social life that could be considered sinful by some, all of these are as much of a motivation than what went on in Iraq.

There also explain why so many States that opposed the Iraq invasion are being hit, repeatedly.

martingriff · 23-05-2017 08:01PM

Danzy wrote: »

Largely they did not, not to the same extent other actors in the conflict did, especially the Army.

Yet you are derailing the thread, which I suspect is your motivation in the 1st place.

Either that or you are stuck in the past and haven't the mental ability to break out of your rut.

WHOOOOOOOOOOO back up there. First of all read my very first comment of this thread and ask if I really want to derail this thread. Second of all I admit I got caught up in an argument that was because someone tried to say the IRA did not target women and children and further when he tried to wriggle out of it that is my bad. I am not stuck in any rut in the past what so ever.

I answered a post which I should not have as it was off topic for here again my bad but hey you just did the same thing

ilkhanid · 23-05-2017 08:02PM

infogiver wrote: »

I have many Muslim friends like you.
I know you are ashamed of these people but you have no need to be
They're version of Islam is nothing to do with the real version.
Stand up and make some noise.
Let them know that they're not speaking for you.

The thing is...I really don't believe that there is any such thing as the "real version".

neverever1 wrote: »

Well maybe the Muslims I know in Ireland are different because we haven't been dropping bombs on the Middle East for decades.

Like the Danes and the Swedes?

Danzy · 23-05-2017 08:04PM

martingriff wrote: »

WHOOOOOOOOOOO back up there. First of all read my very first comment of this thread and ask if I really want to derail this thread. Second of all I admit I got caught up in an argument that was because someone tried to say the IRA did not target women and children and further when he tried to wriggle out of it that is my bad. I am not stuck in any rut in the past what so ever.

I answered a post which I should not have as it was off topic for here again my bad but hey you just did the same thing

Reversing, reversing.

martingriff · 23-05-2017 08:14PM

Danzy wrote: »

Reversing, reversing.

OK

Samaris · 23-05-2017 08:16PM

Mod Note: Martingriff, don't post in here again, the "drop the IRA stuff" was made pretty clear.

Danzy, drop it, or you'll be shooed too.

Danzy · 23-05-2017 08:17PM

martingriff wrote: »

OK

You said wow back up, I won't say more lest the moderator come back and finish me off. Rgds
Posted before I saw your above warning.

23-05-2017 08:17PM

Yourself isit wrote: »

In theory. In practice there are hierarchies of "dis privilege". The organisation has guys who would probably shout racism if they were fired over this and apparently the women managers are not upset enough to take a case.

Obvious thing to do for hr is go put these guys under male management.

There clearly are hierarchies of privilege - but there shouldn't be.

I used to work in HR, years ago. Believe me, I would not have changed Company structure.
At the first sign of trouble, I'd have called them in, explained equality legislation, and asked if they had a problem with it.

If they had, the senior member of staff wouldn't have been the one to be discriminated against.

If they were long-term staff, they'd have been offered a sideways move, or a lesser job.
If they were new staff, they'd have been invited to comply with legislation in the existing structure.
It would be their choice whether or not to take the job, after that.

Help!!!! wrote: »

Yeah but complain & there will be some liberal calling you a racist or bigot & you will be the one getting fired

Too bad. Women are equal to men under Irish legislation.
Those who refuse to accept that fact are free to leave, or find alternative employment, either within the existing Company if they're long term employees, or in another company, if new employees, if they're not willing to comply with the law.

23-05-2017 08:22PM

I remember when the photo of Alan Kurdi was plastered across the front page of all newspapers for about a week and was subsequently used to mobilise support for the accepting of unlimited numbers of unvetted migrants in Germany and elsewhere in 2015.

I wonder will the photo of the 8 year old girl Saffie Roussos be similarly used to garner sympathy and spur politicians to act. Not holding my breath to be honest.

Terrorist Attack in Manchester (Read MOD WARNING in OP Updated 24/05/2017))

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