Bouncer punches woman who tried to punch him.

seamus · 19-04-2017 08:49PM

I'm reminded actually of the case Adrian Moynihan who choked to death when bouncers restrained him.

There's no such thing as the perfect or ideal course of action, just the most reasonable immediate one available to you at the time.

Sometimes a smack might knock someone over and crack their head on the ground. Some other time a simple restraining hold will choke them to death.

BorneTobyWilde · 19-04-2017 08:49PM

Would a cop punch a girl who swings at him?
Would a doctor punch a girl who swings at him?
Would a teacher punch a girl who swings at him?
Would a priest punch a girl who swings at him?

A bouncer is there to stop trouble, to keep peace. So he was an idiot to punch her.
No one in a position of power should think they are above the law/

19-04-2017 08:50PM

Are Am Eye wrote: »

They can eject someone from the private property. They can't detain them
in the premises. They can't lock them in a room. They can't hold them in a judo hold on the ground for half an hour.

If you are contradicting that fact you must quote the relevant law?

I never said detain, this is what I said and I've seen done before

Restrain her, move her away from the door, then go inside and call the police and let them deal with her. I've seen something similar happen before, I'm sure trained bouncers have a protocol on how to deal with it

19-04-2017 09:00PM

seamus wrote: »

I'm reminded actually of the case Adrian Moynihan who choked to death when bouncers restrained him.

There's no such thing as the perfect or ideal course of action, just the most reasonable immediate one available to you at the time.

Sometimes a smack might knock someone over and crack their head on the ground. Some other time a simple restraining hold will choke them to death.

True enough, which is why bouncers should be trained in appropriate and not dangerous techniques before being allowed to work.

I don't know if it happened in the end or not but here's an article from 2010 in England showing a proposal to require proper training to safely remove and eject people after a number of deaths and injuries

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/10186122/bar-and-club-bouncers-to-get-restraint-training

infogiver · 19-04-2017 09:00PM

Paddy Cow wrote: »

I'm all for self defense but I watched the video and she was no threat. I would say the same thing if she was a man. She was so drunk he easily ducked her pathetic punch. He could easily restrained her or pushed her over. In this case it was a complete over reaction on his part.

I'd love to know how long she'd been making a complete an utter pest of herself at that door, and how many times she'd tried to hit him and how much drunken slurred abuse she'd been doling out.
Ten to 7 on a Spring evening no self control no personal responsibility no dignity and no pride.
This 4th wave feminism is so working out for these women, isn't it?

Are Am Eye · 19-04-2017 09:03PM

No you said the bouncer should have put her in a restraint.
I know you've inching away from that post by post but that was your
point. That rather than strike her he should have put her in a restraint.

I appreciate your sentiment in that you see the girl would be least harmed if she was merely restrained than if someone hit her. However I am just pointing out the legal position to you. The security man is a civilian in a public space. He is not legally entitled to hold anyone. You can choose whatever language you want. Restrain, hold, arrest, take into custody, sit on etc etc. But it is not legal for him to do it. Not in response to a common assault (s.2 nfoapa)
He could hold her, restrain her if she stole something. Then hand her over to the police. But not for taking a swing at him. That's the legal position whether you like it or not and regardless of what you claim you seen.

wakka12 · 19-04-2017 09:11PM

His punch wasnt as square and premeditated as I was expecting. Seemed like a kind of knee-jerk reaction,somewhat. I also don't think it looked all that hard, she deserved a good knock for her troubles, maybe she'll be less of a **** next time. Doubt it did her much lasting damage

19-04-2017 09:13PM

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

not very professional by the bouncer swinging digs at a punter provoked or not

One reactionary slap to back someone up is swinging digs? Nope, not having that.

Timberrrrrrrr · 19-04-2017 09:15PM

end of the road wrote: »

slight correction, he wasn't doing his job. his job is to stand on the door.

No it's not.

armaghlad · 19-04-2017 09:17PM

Does anyone justifying the bouncers actions actually work or have experience working in the industry?

I mean it's in everyone's interests (the door staff, the club, the drunk girl, other customers, police) that these things are minimised as much as possible. Legally it can be classed as assault and that is what the police in Liverpool are treating it as. If it went to court, how would a judge view it? Self defence is watery to say the least and I'd say they'd favour the girl. The bouncer is a professional and should know better.

19-04-2017 09:18PM

armaghlad wrote: »

Stand there and take it because he's a sober professional doing his job. It is what he is paid to do. Gender completely comes into it, women are physically weaker than men. Next thing you'll be saying it's ok to hit a child when they swing a dig for you

My f*cking god this is pathetic. Stand their getting punched is not his job, it's not anyone's job. I work in a jail and it's certainly not my job. If someone is hitting out at you you've every right to defend yourself. Are you seriously giving women carte blanche to hit whoever they want and expect no consequences? People like you are why blokes are afraid to report domestic violence perpetrated by women on men. Pathetic post and pathetic attitude.

armaghlad · 19-04-2017 09:20PM

Omackeral wrote: »

My f*cking god this is pathetic. Stand their getting punched is not his job, it's not anyone's job. I work in a jail and it's certainly not my job. If someone is hitting out at you you've every right to defend yourself. Are you seriously giving women carte blanche to hit whoever they want and expect no consequences? People like you are why blokes are afraid to report domestic violence perpetrated by women on men. Pathetic post and pathetic attitude.

You're a screw so I'd expect nothing different

Mod-Banned for personal abuse.

19-04-2017 09:21PM

Are Am Eye wrote: »

No you said the bouncer should have put her in a restraint.
I know you've inching away from that post by post but that was your
point. That rather than strike her he should have put her in a restraint.

My quote is there in black and white a few pages back, restrain and move away, I never said detain.

If you want to go by legislation, are you arguing that punching is allowed as self defense but holding and moving them for some seconds is not? I'm not a lawyer but I'd say it falls under section 18

Timberrrrrrrr · 19-04-2017 09:25PM

armaghlad wrote: »

You're a screw so I'd expect nothing different

Seems you have a serious chip on your shoulder when it comes to people in authority.

Are Am Eye · 19-04-2017 09:26PM

riffmongous wrote: »

My quote is there in black and white a few pages back, restrain and move away, I never said detain.

If you want to go by legislation, are you arguing that punching is allowed as self defense but holding and moving them for some seconds is not? I'm not a lawyer but I'd say it falls under section 18

You can't restrain her. Or restrain and move her. Or restrain and dance with her.

enfant terrible · 19-04-2017 09:26PM

armaghlad wrote: »

Does anyone justifying the bouncers actions actually work or have experience working in the industry?

I mean it's in everyone's interests (the door staff, the club, the drunk girl, other customers, police) that these things are minimised as much as possible. Legally it can be classed as assault and that is what the police in Liverpool are treating it as. If it went to court, how would a judge view it? Self defence is watery to say the least and I'd say they'd favour the girl. The bouncer is a professional and should know better.

Would the girl not be done for assault too?

InTheTrees · 19-04-2017 09:27PM

Sorry. Didn't see the video but from what I hear she didn't hit him did she?

Everyone's reacting as though he got hit and he has some right to hit back but she only took some drunken swing at him right?

NIMAN · 19-04-2017 09:28PM

She must be real classy, that one.

Timberrrrrrrr · 19-04-2017 09:28PM

InTheTrees wrote: »

Sorry. Didn't see the video but from what I hear she didn't hit him did she?

Everyone's reacting as though he got hit and he has some right to hit back but she only took some drunken swing at him right?

The video does show her swinging at him and him defending himself, it doesn't show the minutes leading up to her attacking him and any previous attacks

19-04-2017 09:30PM

Are Am Eye wrote: »

You can't restrain her. Or restrain and move her. Or restrain and dance with her.

18.-(1) The use of force by a person for any of the following purposes, if only such as is reasonable in the circumstances as he or she believes them to be, does not constitute an offence-â€

(a) to protect himself or herself or a member of the family of that person or another from injury, assault or detention caused by a criminal act;

Restraining and moving is the use of force

mynamejeff · 19-04-2017 09:31PM

armaghlad wrote: »

You're a screw so I'd expect nothing different

and your an armaghlad

great to see you living up to the stereotype there bandit cuntRY :pac::pac:

19-04-2017 09:33PM

I hate all this hard man stuff now. Hit and be hit blah blah blah. Lots of wannabe MMA heads thinking every interaction means ground and pound. Whatever happened to acting like a civilised person and simply moving away, only using force when it's absolutely necessary, never hitting a woman whatever the provocation etc. etc.

PREG1967 · 19-04-2017 09:36PM

bouncer: I punched a girl and I liked it / The taste of her cherry slap stick / I punched a girl just to try it / I hope my boyfriend don't mind it

19-04-2017 09:43PM

armaghlad wrote: »

You're a screw so I'd expect nothing different

You challenged none of the points I made and zeroed in one thing with prejudice. Couldn't give a f*ck what your ignorant self expects. Judge all you want, you know nothing about me and how I carry out my duties. That chip on your shoulder is becoming more apparent. If a prisoner hits out, we're covered by law to fight back. Nobody is paid to be battered.

I've been assaulted outside of work by a woman before. She punched me right into the face. I said to her ''don't you dare do that again''. She went to do it again and I grabbed her by the wrists. When I let her go she went to do it yet again. I restrained her by the arms and shoved her away from me. She went on her arse in almost slow motion and start screaming that I assaulted her and she was now playing victim. What do you do in that situation? Keep getting belted? Nah, f*ck that noise.

I personally wouldn't feel right punching a woman full on in the face because I'd probably cave her face in but at the same time I'm not letting some scumbag have free reign on me. If you're provoked and pushed enough, you fight back. So while I'd not burst someone as hard as can, I still have no sympathy for aggressors getting hit back.

19-04-2017 09:46PM

mynamejeff wrote: »

cuntRY :pac::

:pac:

end of the road · 19-04-2017 09:47PM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Seems you have a serious chip on your shoulder when it comes to people in authority.

bouncers aren't in authority. screws would effectively be.

Tsipras · 19-04-2017 09:47PM

He's no Rocky :P

19-04-2017 09:47PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I hate all this hard man stuff now. Hit and be hit blah blah blah. Lots of wannabe MMA heads thinking every interaction means ground and pound. Whatever happened to acting like a civilised person and simply moving away, only using force when it's absolutely necessary, never hitting a woman whatever the provocation etc. etc.

I'm sorry but why the gender distinction? Nobody should be hitting anybody.

19-04-2017 09:48PM

end of the road wrote: »

bouncers aren't in authority. screws would effectively be.

Saying screw for Prison Guard is like saying pig for a Garda. Just saying.

#Triggered

Are Am Eye · 19-04-2017 09:49PM

riffmongous wrote: »

Restraining and moving is the use of force

No it's not.
He's not allowed to move her anywhere.

And what are you on about move her? Move her where? To a new house?
She's in a public place. She has no less and no more a right to be there than he does. He can't move her anywhere.

Bouncer punches woman who tried to punch him.

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