Calls for State to build Mosque in Roscommon

jippo nolan · 21-03-2017 7:51pm

Lt Dan wrote: »

Hang sandwiches?

Would the gargle and ham be against some Muslim traditions?

There allowed toasted hang sandwiches!

The Oort Cloud · 21-03-2017 7:54pm

taylor3 wrote: »

Yeah I live in Roscommon (not Ballaghadereen) and have to say from the get go I thought what on earth will these people do in a town like Ballaghadereen with respect to that town there is not much going on there. I think things like the poor Broadband and lack of public transport will be headwrecking enough for them. Lacking a mosque in town probably wont be the only thing that'll piss then off.

I already mentioned the fact that these refugees will be housed in different locations in the counties. There is no problem in regards to this question. The refugees will first enter their new abode in the large hotel, then they will be given guidance in respect to the law of the land, and then they will have to do a course on integration methods so that they can understand the system and the society they have entered.

When these education courses of integration/law/society have ended, then they will be sent to very good accommodation in a county they would like to live, they will be given a decent choice of what county they would feel comfortable in. This notion that all the refugees will be held in a center for years are over. They will be fast-tracked into housing accommodation around all counties of Ireland. They will be spread out vastly to all areas.

The government have this sorted already, and did have before we even knew what was going on.

How about a hang shandy?

Grayson · 21-03-2017 8:01pm

Lt Dan wrote: »

Yeah yeah. Ruairi Quinn called on the people to discuss getting rid of Catholic Run Schools. It did not really work.

You are going to struggle to find Catholic dogma still being taught in most schools

As in abortion? In Ireland Catholics ain't the only ones who oppose abortion in all cases.

The State failed to investigate allegations that had been made years ago. The State entrusted their role to the Church because the State was unable and unwilling to do their jobs eg provide State Run Hospitals, Schools, and Orphanages

Last time I checked , several churches have needed renovation. The renovations were self funded . No State Grants. No State funds were sought for building of churches either, many of whom are older than this State.

You can start by noting that Islam is an enemy of the Western World, or their teachings are at odds with the Western World, or , again, State do not fund the Catholic Church in Ireland.

The article was from The Irish Times

Thanks for fisking. It makes the post so much harder to reply to without fisking.

96% of national schools in Ireland are under religious patronage. 90% are under catholic patronage. In these schools children are taught catholic dogma and doctrine. They are prepared for their first communion and confirmations during class time. Religion permeates the schools. These schools can refuse anyone who isn't catholic on the grounds that they're not catholic. They force non Catholics to sit in, but not participate in catholic lessons. And they are all state funded. The state will build and staff a catholic school for free. The state has spent billions doing this over the years.

The nuts thing is that in any discussion about the state funding of catholic education the argument is normally Catholics who are for it and atheists against it. There's no-one who actually denies it exists. Except you.

The vast majority of people against abortion in this country are Catholics. Look at any pro life groups in this country and you'll find that the vast majority are catholic organisations or run by staunch Catholics. An individual who is pro life isn't necessarily catholic but to deny any link between Ireland's anti abortion stance and the catholic church is stupid.

BTW, the state don't build churches but they do fund their renovation. A church can be designated a historic building and then the state pays for the refurbishments. The catholic church complained abut this. Not because they didn't want the free money but because they weren't allowed upgrade or change the layouts of the buildings. Apparently planning authorities will only allow renovations on buildings if it restores them, not changes them.

As for Islam being the enemy of the west? You don't actually know any Muslims do you. They'd laugh at you. They're just people getting on with their lives. They're not part of some secret conspiracy to invade Ireland. When I hear people say that they're the enemy of the west I think of the Jewish conspiracy. How they were working to destroy christian Europe. You can see how accurate that was and how that turned out.
But this isn't really the thread for that discussion. there's loads of threads about that so feel free to go there and have a rant. Or even go and hop onto the BNP or Britain first homepages. Maybe even join these guys, http://www.sundayworld.com/news/crimedesk/anti-islam-group-patrolling-dublin

gw80 · 21-03-2017 8:01pm

Lt Dan wrote: »

Wash your mouth ya filthy pup you :rolleyes:

Cash in hand. Labour jobs where cash will be paid instead of the usual PAYE pay into the account . Locals have no time for that paper work lark

Footing turf, painting etc, farm work or, wait for it, (try not to explode) sheep shearing

You really think all those lads from Pakistan ,Chinese, Afghanistan, India etc working in the rural chip shops or convenience stores have legal status to work? Some do, but not all!

Plenty of chancers will be only too happy to get some cheap labour and there won't be any immigration officers looking around

I know what ya meant,(: just joking

But i think this happens a lot with groups of refugees and similar groups when they end up in an alien country and culture, the local holy man jumps on them, and makes sure that they can never get out of the grip of whatever religious dogma they have probably left behind, through shame or fear of being ostracized from the group

Lt Dan · 21-03-2017 8:01pm

jippo nolan wrote: »

There allowed toasted hang sandwiches!

The local cafe will be delighted so

Lt Dan · 21-03-2017 8:03pm

gw80 wrote: »

I know what ya meant,(: just joking

But i think this happens a lot with groups of refugees and similar groups when they end up in an alien country and culture, the local holy man jumps on them, and makes sure that they can never get out of the grip of whatever religious dogma they have probably left behind, through shame or fear of being ostracized from the group

I know you were joking.

Well, let us set these poor creatures free and tell the local holy man to stay away ?

Grayson · 21-03-2017 8:04pm

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Peoples fear of Islam is entirely justified, and it is not an irrational fear. Islam once it puts down firm roots anywhere starts going bat$hit crazy. No religion/cult should have taxpayer money funneled into it. Fuq them all. That goes for the RCC too, they are all pure poison.

At least we agree on the church

As for the islam thing. As I mentioned in a previous reply to someone else. We have loads of threads about that. Let's not let this thread descend into that. Let's see if we can declare this thread a DMZ

Grayson · 21-03-2017 8:10pm

gw80 wrote: »

I know what ya meant,(: just joking

But i think this happens a lot with groups of refugees and similar groups when they end up in an alien country and culture, the local holy man jumps on them, and makes sure that they can never get out of the grip of whatever religious dogma they have probably left behind, through shame or fear of being ostracized from the group

Actually first generation refugees/migrants are generally ok. The issues generally occur in a second generation. And then it's nearly always when poverty and discrimination gets thrown into the mix. The people who get radicalised feel isolated and under siege. When you look at any terrorist group of any religion or political movement you'll see that most recruits are very poor people.

I say generally. There are exceptions like the boston bombers. But there's a definite link between poverty and both crime & terrorism.

Nekarsulm · 21-03-2017 8:19pm

In any radio interview about the refugees in Roscommon, its been amusing listening to the reporter trying to find a local with a bad word to say about them.
Now, living in rural area myself, there is a tendency for media types to head for the most hill billy looking character they can find. And said hill billy usually obliges with a tirade of "colourful opinions", to the general merriment of all.
Thankfully, in Roscommon, people seem to be fairly " on message" and determined not to be seen as introverted curtain twitchers, with racist undertones.

Widdershins · 21-03-2017 8:23pm

Nekarsulm wrote: »

In any radio interview about the refugees in Roscommon, its been amusing listening to the reporter trying to find a local with a bad word to say about them.
Now, living in rural area myself, there is a tendency for media types to head for the most hill billy looking character they can find. And said hill billy usually obliges with a tirade of "colourful opinions", to the general merriment of all.
Thankfully, in Roscommon, people seem to be fairly " on message" and determined not to be seen as introverted curtain twitchers, with racist undertones.

I know people from the area. They've been trying to donate things and help in any way they can. The locals are determined to help. But if there are people with reservations I'm sure they are not curtain twitchers or racist either. Most of the reservations involve the financial side and the lack of consultation.

runawaybishop · 21-03-2017 8:24pm

Widdershins wrote: »

I know people from the area. They've been trying to donate things and help in any way they can. The locals are determined to help. But if there are people with reservations I'm sure they are not curtain twitchers or racist either. Most of the reservations involve the financial side and the lack of consultation.

It helps that the hotel is trying to find staff exclusively from the area.

Widdershins · 21-03-2017 8:26pm

runawaybishop wrote: »

It helps that the hotel is trying to find staff exclusively from the area.

That seems like a good idea.

Grayson · 21-03-2017 8:27pm

Widdershins wrote: »

That seems like a good idea.

To be fair, that probably includes the counties around it

runawaybishop · 21-03-2017 8:34pm

Grayson wrote: »

To be fair, that probably includes the counties around it

Just the town itself is what i heard. Trying to alleviate any bad feelings from the locals who hoped the hotel would reopen and provide jobs.

Lt Dan · 21-03-2017 8:40pm

Grayson wrote: »

Thanks for fisking. It makes the post so much harder to reply to without fisking.

96% of national schools in Ireland are under religious patronage. 90% are under catholic patronage. In these schools children are taught catholic dogma and doctrine. They are prepared for their first communion and confirmations during class time.

Education , in Ireland is legally defined to include religious education. Most parents are clearly content with their children receiving religious education during their class time and in preparation for their sacraments. Ruairi Quinn sought to change things. Parents told him to jog on. Enlighten us, what is contained in Catholic Dogma education in Ireland in 2017 ?

Grayson wrote: »

These schools can refuse anyone who isn't catholic on the grounds that they're not catholic.

Nor do they. They will cater,first to families who sent older kids to the schools . Fair enough.

Grayson wrote: »

They force non Catholics to sit in, but not participate in catholic lessons.

Lies. No one is forced to sit in. They are free to leave the class.

Grayson wrote: »

And they are all state funded. The state will build and staff a catholic school for free. The state has spent billions doing this over the years.

Schools built on Church land

Why did Quinn's pet project fail again?

Since 1970's how many brand new schools have the State built that are "Catholic Schools"?

State have also funded Church of Ireland Patronized schools, even a Muslim and Jewish school in Dublin

Grayson wrote: »

The nuts thing is that in any discussion about the state funding of catholic education the argument is normally Catholics who are for it and atheists against it. There's no-one who actually denies it exists. Except you.

Riuiri Quinn tried to change things. Parents said no. I made no comment about the argument being about Catholics for it and atheists against it. You did. I just said that Quinn's proposals were rejected

Grayson wrote: »

The vast majority of people against abortion in this country are Catholics.

The vast majority of this country were baptized Catholic.

I oppose abortion bar the grounds set out in the Constitution. I accept that abortion should be extended to other grounds. I am not a practicing Catholic and religious beliefs do not form part of my opposition to abortion on other all grounds.

Grayson wrote: »

Look at any pro life groups in this country and you'll find that the vast majority are catholic organisations or run by staunch Catholics.

Vast majority of Pro Abortion supporters are ALSO Catholic. Obviously, not "Staunch" Catholics

Italy is primarily Catholic, abortion is legal. Some 88 per cent of the population belonging to the Roman Catholic church

Catholicism is the largest groups in Spain, with about 66% of the population claiming that they are Catholics - that is not saying that they pay any heed to the Church. Abortion laws are way more liberal in Spain than they are in Ireland.

59 % of Austrians claim to be Catholic. They have abortion

France, the biggest enemy of any notion of State religion and we saw what happened in the Paris Riots in the 1960's claim about 61 % Catholic and they definitely have abortion

Grayson wrote: »

An individual who is pro life isn't necessarily catholic but to deny any link between Ireland's anti abortion stance and the catholic church is stupid.

What is even more stupid, dumb, disingenuous even , is to invent an argument that anyone has tried to deny that there is a link between anti abortion and the Irish Roman Catholic Church.

Grayson wrote: »

BTW, the state don't build churches but they do fund their renovation. A church can be designated a historic building and then the state pays for the refurbishments.

They make good tourist attractions. Lord knows why

Grayson wrote: »

The catholic church complained abut this. Not because they didn't want the free money but because they weren't allowed upgrade or change the layouts of the buildings. Apparently planning authorities will only allow renovations on buildings if it restores them, not changes them.

Hey, even they want to move with the times

:P

Grayson wrote: »

As for Islam being the enemy of the west? You don't actually know any Muslims do you.

A hell of a lot more than you and more than what you think! Deal with them 5 days a week!

Grayson wrote: »

They'd laugh at you.

Beats getting head chopped off so.

Grayson wrote: »

They're just people getting on with their lives. They're not part of some secret conspiracy to invade Ireland. When I hear people say that they're the enemy of the west I think of the Jewish conspiracy.

The Jews never claimed publicly to seek to attack the West. Hell, they wanted to be part of the West

On the other hand, how many more Christian killings, (in fairness, they prefer to kill their own) suicide bombings etc do you need to witness?

Grayson wrote: »

How they were working to destroy christian Europe. You can see how accurate that was and how that turned out.

Perhaps ask the French, German, Swedes, London.........

Grayson wrote: »

But this isn't really the thread for that discussion. there's loads of threads about that so feel free to go there and have a rant. Or even go and hop onto the BNP or Britain first homepages. Maybe even join these guys, http://www.sundayworld.com/news/crimedesk/anti-islam-group-patrolling-dublin

You haven't a clue as to whom is coming into Ireland. Neither do those idiots! Suffice to say, bar a tiny but dangerous element that need watching, (and they are, by State Forces) we have been lucky. Fortunately, it should stay that way. Would not want to turn into dumps in England where the Islamic Fundamentals do not even bother hiding their attitudes anymore

jimmy blevins · 21-03-2017 9:16pm

Maybe we could compromise as we've got plenty of church's with empty seats, why not prioritise giving Christians asylum.

fiachr_a · 21-03-2017 9:38pm

jimmy blevins wrote: »

Maybe we could compromise as we've got plenty of church's with empty seats, why not prioritise giving Christians asylum.

Too sensible.

Jelle1880 · 21-03-2017 11:07pm

jimmy blevins wrote: »

Maybe we could compromise as we've got plenty of church's with empty seats, why not prioritise giving Christians asylum.

But are they the right type of Christians ? :pac:

readytosnap · 21-03-2017 11:11pm

Lt Dan wrote: »

sheep shearing

Around here they wont share their sheep with anyone.

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Thankfully, in Roscommon, people seem to be fairly " on message" and determined not to be seen as introverted curtain twitchers, with racist undertones.

But that is what they are?

SEPT 23 1989 · 22-03-2017 12:18am

jimmy blevins wrote: »

Maybe we could compromise as we've got plenty of church's with empty seats, why not prioritise giving Christians asylum.

They should always have been the priority in the western civilisation but the powers that be stood back and let them be slaughtered

the_syco · 22-03-2017 12:27am

Can we knock down a few churches, for equality purposes?

nice_guy80 · 22-03-2017 12:30am

put up a weather vane showing which way is south east

job done

Zebra3 · 22-03-2017 12:40am

Lt Dan wrote: »

GAA Clubs are de facto Community Centers in many rural Irish towns . Why do you feel the need to snigger?

Maybe because of their hypocritical views.

Certain foreign sports good, certain foreign sports bad.

Meant to promote Irish music, opportunity to cash in with foreign music in their stadia, no bother.

Grayson · 22-03-2017 12:41am

Lt Dan wrote: »

Education , in Ireland is legally defined to include religious education. Most parents are clearly content with their children receiving religious education during their class time and in preparation for their sacraments. Ruairi Quinn sought to change things. Parents told him to jog on. Enlighten us, what is contained in Catholic Dogma education in Ireland in 2017 ?

Nor do they. They will cater,first to families who sent older kids to the schools . Fair enough.

Lies. No one is forced to sit in. They are free to leave the class.

Schools built on Church land

Why did Quinn's pet project fail again?

Since 1970's how many brand new schools have the State built that are "Catholic Schools"?

State have also funded Church of Ireland Patronized schools, even a Muslim and Jewish school in Dublin

Riuiri Quinn tried to change things. Parents said no. I made no comment about the argument being about Catholics for it and atheists against it. You did. I just said that Quinn's proposals were rejected

The vast majority of this country were baptized Catholic.

I oppose abortion bar the grounds set out in the Constitution. I accept that abortion should be extended to other grounds. I am not a practicing Catholic and religious beliefs do not form part of my opposition to abortion on other all grounds.

Vast majority of Pro Abortion supporters are ALSO Catholic. Obviously, not "Staunch" Catholics

Italy is primarily Catholic, abortion is legal. Some 88 per cent of the population belonging to the Roman Catholic church

Catholicism is the largest groups in Spain, with about 66% of the population claiming that they are Catholics - that is not saying that they pay any heed to the Church. Abortion laws are way more liberal in Spain than they are in Ireland.

59 % of Austrians claim to be Catholic. They have abortion

France, the biggest enemy of any notion of State religion and we saw what happened in the Paris Riots in the 1960's claim about 61 % Catholic and they definitely have abortion

What is even more stupid, dumb, disingenuous even , is to invent an argument that anyone has tried to deny that there is a link between anti abortion and the Irish Roman Catholic Church.

They make good tourist attractions. Lord knows why

Hey, even they want to move with the times :P

A hell of a lot more than you and more than what you think! Deal with them 5 days a week!

Beats getting head chopped off so.

The Jews never claimed publicly to seek to attack the West. Hell, they wanted to be part of the West

On the other hand, how many more Christian killings, (in fairness, they prefer to kill their own) suicide bombings etc do you need to witness?

Perhaps ask the French, German, Swedes, London.........

You haven't a clue as to whom is coming into Ireland. Neither do those idiots! Suffice to say, bar a tiny but dangerous element that need watching, (and they are, by State Forces) we have been lucky. Fortunately, it should stay that way. Would not want to turn into dumps in England where the Islamic Fundamentals do not even bother hiding their attitudes anymore

Do you really have to reply to every single sentance one at a time. Is it an attempt at trolling?

I said I'm not going to reply to your rants about islam and said this isn't the place for it. Obviously you can't let it go. I'm not going to continue to discuss that with you and drive the thread off topic. There's loads of other places where you can post your hatred.

Back on topic(ish)...

You said that I'd struggle to find a school that taught catholic dogma or doctrine. 90% of national schools do. That's nearly all of them.

In your most recent reply you said "Lies. No one is forced to sit in. They are free to leave the class. ".
Did you even bother reading the link I supplied where parents describe how their non catholic children have to sit through religion classes in national schools. I supplied a link that backs up my point and you decide to call me a liar.
It doesn't matter if parents want catholic schools, the fact is that the catholic schools exist. They do teach catholic dogma and they are paid for by the state.

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000 · 22-03-2017 12:47am

"Pakistanis came there 15 years ago to work in a local halal slaughterhouse, which has since closed, he said."

Well it's time to go home then isn't it.

Beyondgone · 22-03-2017 12:48am

They'll build a mosque in Roscommon eventually. Might as well do it now and appear willing as opposed to building it later and appearing forced. The Muslim population is increasing. Mosques are inevitable. The state will acquiesce in fear of appearing "racist". Build it. They will eventually anyway.

Grayson · 22-03-2017 12:49am

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

They should always have been the priority in the western civilisation but the powers that be stood back and let them be slaughtered

Millions of arabs of all creeds have been slaughtered. Refusing to save someone because of their religion is stupid. Can you imagine if we prioritised anything else like that?
Imagine if there are homeless Christians, Atheists, Buddhists and Muslims on the streets of Dublin but we only help the Christians? We leave the rest on the streets?

Our priority should be people who need help. Sure we can prioritise amongst them. People who need medical help, children etc. But not by race, ethnicity or religion.

Jimmy Garlic · 22-03-2017 2:57am

Grayson wrote: »

Millions of arabs of all creeds have been slaughtered. Refusing to save someone because of their religion is stupid. Can you imagine if we prioritised anything else like that?
Imagine if there are homeless Christians, Atheists, Buddhists and Muslims on the streets of Dublin but we only help the Christians? We leave the rest on the streets?

Our priority should be people who need help. Sure we can prioritise amongst them. People who need medical help, children etc. But not by race, ethnicity or religion.

Whats better, helping a relative handful of mostly 16-40 year old men of questionable origin here by giving them a free life at great cost per head, or helping many more people who we know for sure are genuine refugees in Lebanon for example? Instead of squandering vast sums of money on chancers who were squatting and causing trouble in Calais the money would be much better spent on those who we know for sure are genuine. Oh and btw once upon a time refugees sought refuge until it was safe to go home.. When did that change to ''resettlement'', do you know?

Grayson · 22-03-2017 3:16am

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Whats better, helping a relative handful of mostly 16-40 year old men of questionable origin here by giving them a free life at great cost per head, or helping many more people who we know for sure are genuine refugees in Lebanon for example? Instead of squandering vast sums of money on chancers who were squatting and causing trouble in Calais the money would be much better spent on those who we know for sure are genuine. Oh and btw once upon a time refugees sought refuge until it was safe to go home.. When did that change to ''resettlement'', do you know?

That's a different issue though. It's not should be discriminate who we help based on religion. It's how do we get the most value for money or how do we help the most people. And that's a valid discussion.

Also, half of the initial group of 80 refugees arriving are children.

Resettlement makes sense since there are occasions where a refugee can't go home. Syria could last for another decade. Even if it doesn't the country may not be in any state to move back to, especially for families. You can't house millions in tent cities until then.

Victor · 22-03-2017 3:28am

SILVAMAN wrote: »

This isn't some Islamic dominated dump, rooted in the Middle Ages, which funds mosques, or any other type of religious building.

Yeah, this is a Roman Catholic dominated dump, barely 25 years from the Middle Ages, which funds church car parks, parish halls and religious schools and hospitals.

Calls for State to build Mosque in Roscommon

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