Motorway from Dublin to Sligo Needed Badly

marno21 · 08-02-2017 8:41pm

feardeas wrote: »

That would make a big difference. If the recession had held off a few years Mullingar to Carrick might have been done. Then lots of things would be different.

They could up the limit to 120 from Mullingar to Coralstown. Having it at 100 is daft.

The N4 between J13 and J15 has several T junctions and private accesses and is not suitable for 120km/h running. The Mullingar BP is but they won't redesignated such a short stretch

Mint Sauce · 08-02-2017 8:45pm

marno21 wrote: »

The N4 between J13 and J15 has several T junctions and private accesses and is not suitable for 120km/h running. The Mullingar BP is but they won't redesignated such a short stretch

I thought sections, if not all off the N4 improvements around Mullingar was already uped to 120.

Not that I ever 100% recall doing 120 on it, it would not be difficult to do so, especially after doing 120 all the way from Dublin.

Banjoxed · 08-02-2017 8:51pm

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Can you imagine a long stretch of dual carriage Motorway from Sligo to Dublin , 120kmh, with no bends , traffic lights, roundabouts, junctions (apart from slip roads) would it not be bliss to drive on and get you from A-B in excellent journey times.

Whats it about at the moment on a good day, something like 2hours 45 mins on a good day to travel to Dublin by car ... you imagine how that journey time could be cut down travelling at an average of between 100-120kmh - I am not good with calculations but I bet it would shorten the travel time considerably, not even the Dublin train or bus eireann expressway can do those speeds consistently at the moment

I used to drive the M4 from Celbridge into Dublin and out on a regular basis. Bliss is not a word I would use for it.

Andy From Sligo · 08-02-2017 9:15pm

exaisle wrote: »

And no need for a four-lane M50 when that was being built....but they'd be glad of it now...

The fact that there is not sufficient traffic volume at present does not mean that there won't be in the future. If there was a motorway built, traffic volume would increase BECAUSE there's a motorway.

A bit of forward planning please, lads....

Although given the choice, will the National Roads Association* for F*** sake get their fingers out and build a motorway from Limerick to Cork. Long beyond a joke now.

wow , totally agree with that, if there was a full motorway built the traffic I am alamost certainly sure would increase, and exactly you got to look ahead too , to the future, definately

Andy From Sligo · 08-02-2017 9:17pm

topmanamillion wrote: »

You`re talking like there isn't any road now. There are far more pressing investments needed in the region than a road to no where.

road to no-where ? ... Dublin? haha

MayoSalmon · 08-02-2017 9:38pm

Mullingar to Longford Motorway is needed sharpish enough, then Carrick BP, then Frenchpark to Strokestown.

Andy From Sligo · 08-02-2017 9:43pm

marno21 wrote: »

Come here to me Sligo has a population of 20,000. A motorway has capacity for 55k vehicles a day, how do you see that filling? ....

I can see it filling with more than just your casual commuters , i can see it filling with increased trucks and other logistical transport and tourists among other traffic especially coming from Dublin to get to the north-west - if its more attractive than the train and bus (and quicker) I can see maybe people switching over from them forms of transport to get to Dublin

Jayop · 08-02-2017 10:08pm

lawred2 wrote: »

Metro north and dart underground have greater immediate national significance

This would be the Sligo forum. We're talking about significance to Sligo and the north west.

One project doesn't mean that others can't be done. Every time anything is mentioned for the West the same stuff comes up, this or that in Dublin is more important. There's no rule to say only one infrastructure project can happen at a time.

moleyv · 08-02-2017 10:14pm

Pie in the sky stuff.... Ye need a Jackie Healey Rae type to fulfill something like that.

Jayop · 08-02-2017 10:15pm

marno21 wrote: »

Come here to me Sligo has a population of 20,000. A motorway has capacity for 55k vehicles a day, how do you see that filling? The M4/N4 is already above capacity east of Kilcock so any time savings made by having a motorway north of Mullingar will be cancelled by the increased congestion closer to Dublin.

Come here to yourself.

Sligo has a population of 65k
It would also serve leitrim, 31k
Longford 40k
Donegal, 158k
North Roscommon 32k (half Roscommon)
North Mayo 30k (conservative estimate)

So that's now 356k that it's serving not your nonsense 20k.

You could then see parts of Fermanagh and maybe West Tyrone using it too.

topmanamillion · 08-02-2017 10:23pm

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

road to no-where ? ... Dublin? haha

I suppose it`ll be handy for people from the North West to leave en masse on an expensive motorway that was prioritised over business and tourist initiatives within Sligo.

lawred2 · 08-02-2017 10:42pm

Jayop wrote: »

This would be the Sligo forum. We're talking about significance to Sligo and the north west.

One project doesn't mean that others can't be done. Every time anything is mentioned for the West the same stuff comes up, this or that in Dublin is more important. There's no rule to say only one infrastructure project can happen at a time.

in many cases - yes it does

this is exactly why badly needed projects in Dublin continually get shelved

Mint Sauce · 08-02-2017 10:46pm

Jayop wrote: »

Come here to yourself.

Sligo has a population of 65k
It would also serve leitrim, 31k
Longford 40k
Donegal, 158k
North Roscommon 32k (half Roscommon)
North Mayo 30k (conservative estimate)

So that's now 356k that it's serving not your nonsense 20k.

You could then see parts of Fermanagh and maybe West Tyrone using it too.

Whilst I agree all those RoI locations would benefit, Fermanagh and Tyrone probably already benefit from the M3.

If we are taking about benefiting NI roads though, N16/A4 Sligo to Enniskillen could do with major improvements, considering it forms part of the main route on to Belfast, and A4 section is how I remember it for the last 30 odd years.

Jayop · 08-02-2017 10:52pm

Mint Sauce wrote: »

Whilst I agree all those RoI locations would benefit, Fermanagh and Tyrone probably already benefit from the M3.

If we are taking about benefiting NI roads though, N16/A4 Sligo to Enniskillen could do with major improvements, considering it forms part of the main route on to Belfast, and A4 section is how I remember it for the last 30 odd years.

Personally I use that more than I'd ever use the Dublin road and from Sligo to enniskillen is an absolute disgrace for a main national route. Not sure how a lot of it could be improved though given the terrain past manor Hamilton.

Jayop · 08-02-2017 10:56pm

lawred2 wrote: »

in many cases - yes it does

this is exactly why badly needed projects in Dublin continually get shelved

It not. They're shelved because of government ineptitude not because of a road somewhere else in the country.

Infrastructure projects can be borrowed for.

And again this is a Sligo forum. A train in Dublin is as relevant to me as one in London.

marno21 · 08-02-2017 11:08pm

How many of these people regularly use the N4 to get to Dublin? and would in the event of the M4 being upgraded?

The North Mayo population would use the N26/N5 to get to Dublin as it'll be upgraded before the N4 is done.

The majority of Donegal would use either the N3 or N2 corridors to get to Dublin. People from Letterkenny are not going to be anywhere near the N4.

Think of the catchment of the M8 (Cork city and county, Cashel, Clonmel, Thurles, Cahir, Mithcelstown and large swathes of rural Tipperary and Laois) and parts of the M8 have less than 15000 vehicles a day.

The single carraigeway part of the N4 near Boyle is hardly under pressure and has 1/4 the capacity of a motorway. It's simply not justified.

All the same, I do believe the N4 needs upgrading, especially around Carrick-on-Shannon and the Mullingar-Longford stretch. The money saved on making this a 2+2 dual carriageway instead of a motorway would be very well invested in an upgraded N15, N16 and N17.

Needles73 · 08-02-2017 11:11pm

Radharc na Sleibhte wrote: »

Most of Mayo come on to the N4 at various points. I'm genuinely surprised Enda hasn't done something at this stage. He's two ends of a gob***** but he tends to try and look after his own crowd in castlebar in particular. The road from Castlebaldwin to Mullingar is ok, so even if they just finally took their thumbs out of their holes and did something with the road out of Sligo. It's not as if there hasn't been enough accidents, injuries and deaths on this stretch to know that it is long gone past being badly needed.

So what exactly had he done in Castlebar. Nothing is the answer, have u been lately

Jayop · 08-02-2017 11:45pm

marno21 wrote: »

How many of these people regularly use the N4 to get to Dublin? and would in the event of the M4 being upgraded?

The North Mayo population would use the N26/N5 to get to Dublin as it'll be upgraded before the N4 is done.

The majority of Donegal would use either the N3 or N2 corridors to get to Dublin. People from Letterkenny are not going to be anywhere near the N4.

Think of the catchment of the M8 (Cork city and county, Cashel, Clonmel, Thurles, Cahir, Mithcelstown and large swathes of rural Tipperary and Laois) and parts of the M8 have less than 15000 vehicles a day.

The single carraigeway part of the N4 near Boyle is hardly under pressure and has 1/4 the capacity of a motorway. It's simply not justified.

All the same, I do believe the N4 needs upgrading, especially around Carrick-on-Shannon and the Mullingar-Longford stretch. The money saved on making this a 2+2 dual carriageway instead of a motorway would be very well invested in an upgraded N15, N16 and N17.

If you got from kinnegad to longford motorway and from longford to say Boyle or Carrick dual carriage way then everyone would be happy if the Boyle to colooney was fixed as a single lane with overtaking sections.

The kinnegad to longford will serve the n5 and the n4.

blackwhite · 08-02-2017 11:48pm

Jayop wrote: »

It not. They're shelved because of government ineptitude not because of a road somewhere else in the country.

Infrastructure projects can be borrowed for.

And again this is a Sligo forum. A train in Dublin is as relevant to me as one in London.

The problem is, when it's all coming from the one national pot, then ignoring the fact the there's higher priority schemes elsewhere is simply sticking the head in the sand.

Oddly enough, when the last big capital funding plan was announced, the Collooney to Castlebaldwin Rd was one of the projects getting some flak as being responsible for "diverting" funding that could have been used on a Cork-Limerick MW.

Jayop · 08-02-2017 11:56pm

blackwhite wrote: »

The problem is, when it's all coming from the one national pot, then ignoring the fact the there's higher priority schemes elsewhere is simply sticking the head in the sand.

Oddly enough, when the last big capital funding plan was announced, the Collooney to Castlebaldwin Rd was one of the projects getting some flak as being responsible for "diverting" funding that could have been used on a Cork-Limerick MW.

Again, this is the Sligo forum. If the thread was in a general forum, a Dublin forum or a transport forum then I'd be more inclined to have a big picture view, but it's here and as such it's posts should be related to Sligo.

Anyone complaining about that csstkebaldwin road getting funded is an arse. The amount dead on it is scandalous.

blackwhite · 09-02-2017 12:15am

Jayop wrote: »

Again, this is the Sligo forum. If the thread was in a general forum, a Dublin forum or a transport forum then I'd be more inclined to have a big picture view, but it's here and as such it's posts should be related to Sligo.

Anyone complaining about that csstkebaldwin road getting funded is an arse. The amount dead on it is scandalous.

Focussing on what we can realistically get or hope to get tends to be a more useful way to spend time than pretending there's no constraints on anything.

The complaints likely came from people who'd never driven in the north-west, let alone on that stretch of the N4. But it's the same mentality as those complaining about infrastructure in Dublin, or Cork, or Galway, or anywhere else, getting funded ahead of their own region

Jayop · 09-02-2017 12:27am

blackwhite wrote: »

Focussing on what we can realistically get or hope to get tends to be a more useful way to spend time than pretending there's no constraints on anything.

The complaints likely came from people who'd never driven in the north-west, let alone on that stretch of the N4. But it's the same mentality as those complaining about infrastructure in Dublin, or Cork, or Galway, or anywhere else, getting funded ahead of their own region

I am realistic the kinnegad to longford section of the n4 should be motorway. After that a mix of duel carriage way and decent non death trap single lane would suffice.

Also with this new holiday center in longford there's another reason to extend the motorway.

I don't complain about other people getting roads that are needed. Or hospitals that are needed or schools or whatever. It would be nice though if well over a quarter of the country could get a decent road to the capital and a decent road from letterkenny to galway. Given the decision to close hospital services in the nw it would be nice to be able to get to the the new "centers of excellence".

While there's not a limitless pool for infrastructure, it's an investment in the future and can be paid for by borrowing. It also provides an immediate boost to the economy.

marno21 · 09-02-2017 12:29am

blackwhite wrote: »

Focussing on what we can realistically get or hope to get tends to be a more useful way to spend time than pretending there's no constraints on anything.

The complaints likely came from people who'd never driven in the north-west, let alone on that stretch of the N4. But it's the same mentality as those complaining about infrastructure in Dublin, or Cork, or Galway, or anywhere else, getting funded ahead of their own region

There can't be any realistic complaints about the N4 Collooney - Castlebaldwin scheme. It's a pathetic stretch of road and badly needs doing. Seeing as roads with that traffic volume are done to Type 2 DC standard, and it'd be foolish to upgrade it only for it to be upgraded again it's justified as a Type 2 DC. It'll completely transform the stretch of road. The other sections of the N4 (bar Longford-Mullingar which I believe was planned as Type 1 DC) are also planned to be done to this standard. It's completely appropriate and not overkill, which a Motorway would be.

Jayop · 09-02-2017 12:30am

marno21 wrote: »

There can't be any realistic complaints about the N4 Collooney - Castlebaldwin scheme. It's a pathetic stretch of road and badly needs doing. Seeing as roads with that traffic volume are done to Type 2 DC standard, and it'd be foolish to upgrade it only for it to be upgraded again it's justified as a Type 2 DC. It'll completely transform the stretch of road. The other sections of the N4 (bar Longford-Mullingar which I believe was planned as Type 1 DC) are also planned to be done to this standard. It's completely appropriate and not overkill, which a Motorway would be.

So you think the motorway should come to longford thus serving the n4 and n5?

Edit. Trying to figure out the difference between type 1 and type 2 DC. Could you please give me an example of each.

I assume type 2 would be like coloorneyto Sligo and type 1 would be what is the far side of Carrick with no hard shoulder?

blackwhite · 09-02-2017 12:37am

Jayop wrote: »

I am realistic the kinnegad to longford section of the n4 should be motorway. After that a mix of duel carriage way and decent non death trap single lane would suffice.

Also with this new holiday center in longford there's another reason to extend the motorway.

I don't complain about other people getting roads that are needed. Or hospitals that are needed or schools or whatever. It would be nice though if well over a quarter of the country could get a decent road to the capital and a decent road from letterkenny to galway. Given the decision to close hospital services in the nw it would be nice to be able to get to the the new "centers of excellence".

While there's not a limitless pool for infrastructure, it's an investment in the future and can be paid for by borrowing. It also provides an immediate boost to the economy.

Agreed on all of that.

Mullingar to Roosky had been at initial planning stages, but was suspended with no sign now of when it'll reactivate.

Sligo actually did well compared to many counties in the 2016-2021 Capital Investment Plan - Castlebaldwin-Collooney and the Eastern bridge over the Garavogue both included.
The extension of the M17/M18 to Tuam will hopefully mark the first phase of the Atlantic Corridor as well.

Jayop · 09-02-2017 12:40am

blackwhite wrote: »

Agreed on all of that.

Mullingar to Roosky had been at initial planning stages, but was suspended with no sign now of when it'll reactivate.

Sligo actually did well compared to many counties in the 2016-2021 Capital Investment Plan - Castlebaldwin-Collooney and the Eastern bridge over the Garavogue both included.
The extension of the M17/M18 to Tuam will hopefully mark the first phase of the Atlantic Corridor as well.

The Eastern bridge? Is that the doorley park bridge? I thought that was canned. Would be a great addition if it got the go ahead.

blackwhite · 09-02-2017 12:40am

marno21 wrote: »

There can't be any realistic complaints about the N4 Collooney - Castlebaldwin scheme. It's a pathetic stretch of road and badly needs doing. Seeing as roads with that traffic volume are done to Type 2 DC standard, and it'd be foolish to upgrade it only for it to be upgraded again it's justified as a Type 2 DC. It'll completely transform the stretch of road. The other sections of the N4 (bar Longford-Mullingar which I believe was planned as Type 1 DC) are also planned to be done to this standard. It's completely appropriate and not overkill, which a Motorway would be.

I fully agree - I drive the road most weekends coming home, so I'm fully aware of how bad it is.

I was pointing out that when parochialism takes over, projects that are actually very deserving can get blamed for "taking funding" from something else.

blackwhite · 09-02-2017 12:41am

Jayop wrote: »

The Eastern bridge? Is that the doorley park bridge? I thought that was canned. Would be a great addition if it got the go ahead.

Supposed to link from Ash Lane across the Garavogue, with a relief road going out to the south of the town

Edit:
It'd be a great boost for getting some business back into Cleveragh

Jayop · 09-02-2017 12:44am

blackwhite wrote: »

I fully agree - I drive the road most weekends coming home, so I'm fully aware of how bad it is.

I was pointing out that when parochialism takes over, projects that are actually very deserving can get blamed for "taking funding" from something else.

And that blame game is all usually rubbish. Pretty much every thread I see talking about investment in the West in rail (which I completely think isn't needed) to roads always has a few people come in to point out Dublin Dublin something something.

We know Dublin needs infrastructure, the reason it's in a state isn't because of a bit of a road outside Sligo, it's because of the idiots planning. The luas not connecting like. The fact there is a tunnel dug iirc for a metro and no train going. That wastefulness and bad planning us the problem.

marno21 · 09-02-2017 1:02am

Jayop wrote: »

So you think the motorway should come to longford thus serving the n4 and n5?

Edit. Trying to figure out the difference between type 1 and type 2 DC. Could you please give me an example of each.

I assume type 2 would be like coloorneyto Sligo and type 1 would be what is the far side of Carrick with no hard shoulder?

Type 1 DC is the same standard as the N4 Collooney-Sligo scheme or the N4 Mullingar BP. It can have motorway restrictions or not.

Type 2 DC is the same as the N4 Dromod-Roosky section. 4x 3.5m running lanes seperated by a wire barrier and no hard shoulders. Junctions can be compact grade seperated or roundabouts.

For the rest of the N4: Collooney-Castlebaldwin, Carrick-on-Shannon-Dromod & Roosky-Longford can be Type 2. Mullingar-Longford should be Type 1.

The N5 Ballaghaderreen-Scramoge will be Single Carraigeway. The N5 Westport-Turlough will be Type 2 DC.

The N4 Sligo BP was planned as Type 1 DC and the N15 north of Sligo for 6/7km was also planned as Type 1 DC. There was to be a Type 1 DC approach from the north similar to the one from the south already built. The N15 north of Sligo badly needs doing as well.

Motorway from Dublin to Sligo Needed Badly

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