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Is Sinn Fein right? (The Stack Issue)

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Comments

  • #722
    billy few mates
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,920 ✭✭✭billy few mates


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    Would you rather the Stack family got no information? Would you rather Gerry didn't help any families?

    No, I'd rather the families weren't beholden to a man like Gerry Adams or his gang in order to see justice for the loss of their loved ones....


  • #723
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    billy few mates wrote: »
    No, I'd rather the families weren't beholden to a man like Gerry Adams or his gang in order to see justice for the loss of their loved ones....

    And I'd rather I was a millionaire but that's not reality


  • #724
    billy few mates
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,920 ✭✭✭billy few mates


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    And I'd rather I was a millionaire but that's not reality
    Only because 'golf club' rules trump the laws of our land in the minds of the old SF/IRA die hards...


  • #725
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    billy few mates wrote: »
    Only because 'golf club' rules trump the laws of our land in the minds of the old SF/IRA die hards...

    If Gerry started singing like a bird you can be certain he won't be able to get any information again so we won't have to worry about it, people are pretending like they care about victims families but if they really did they wouldn't be asking Gerry to sing as he would never be able to help another victim again.

    He's able to get this information because he is trusted


  • #726
    Dyr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Actually one of the more interesting things baout all this is that most political parties would not have allowed their leader within an asses roar of all this. A mid level party official would have dealt directly with Stack.

    Now Adams is'nt stupid, and I doubt he's just a guy with a heart of gold so I imagine Adams direct involvement has more to do with whatever dynamic exists between SF and Former Senior Republicans or whatever you call the Army Council retirees


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  • #727
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,518 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    billy few mates wrote: »
    No, I'd rather the families weren't beholden to a man like Gerry Adams or his gang in order to see justice for the loss of their loved ones....

    That's not what you were asked of course.

    What is your solution to all this Billy. From satisfying the wishes of the victims point of view?
    Suppress all the info like FG and FF conspired to do or arrange an all parties to the conflict truth recovery process and any justice issues arising from that that the Irish and British government committed to?


  • #728
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,968 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    That's not what you were asked of course.

    What is your solution to all this Billy. From satisfying the wishes of the victims point of view?
    Suppress all the info like FG and FF conspired to do or arrange an all parties to the conflict truth recovery process and any justice issues arising from that that the Irish and British government committed to?

    Which info did FF and FG conspire to suppress in this case ? A truth recovery process doesn't apply to the Republic Francie. Gerry Adams knows a person who knows who was responsible for killing Brian stack. I think it's only right that that persons name is passed on to the gardai so they can try and bring an end to the open investigation in the mans murder ?


  • #729
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Which info did FF and FG conspire to suppress in this case ? A truth recovery process doesn't apply to the Republic Francie. Gerry Adams knows a person who knows who was responsible for killing Brian stack. I think it's only right that that persons name is passed on to the gardai so they can try and bring an end to the open investigation in the mans murder ?

    And then? And then Gerry won't be able to get information for any other victims ever again


  • #730
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,968 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    If Gerry started singing like a bird you can be certain he won't be able to get any information again so we won't have to worry about it, people are pretending like they care about victims families but if they really did they wouldn't be asking Gerry to sing as he would never be able to help another victim again.

    He's able to get this information because he is trusted

    No one is asking him to walk into the middle of O' Connell street and shout the guys name so let's not make out that's the reason he won't speak.


  • #731
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,968 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    And then? And then Gerry won't be able to get information for any other victims ever again

    Brian stacks murder isn't anything to do with the truth recovery process ye seem to go on and on about though. My understanding is it's just the north. Brian stack(which is the original point of this thread) wasn't murdered in the north he was murdered in Dublin.


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  • #732
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    No one is asking him to walk into the middle of O' Connell street and shout the guys name so let's not make out that's the reason he won't speak.

    His word is his word if he breaks his word then you have as good a chance of getting info for families as him.


  • #733
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,968 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    His word is his word if he breaks his word then you have as good a chance of getting info for families as him.

    Gerry Adams word ? The man who the IRA requested be left out of prison to attend a meeting in London along with the top brass in the IRA ? The man who has been identified as a very high ranking member of the IRA by people who were actually in the IRA ? The guy who is in photos shoulder the coffin of prominent republicans ? Was he just passing and they were a man short and Gerry just did them a favour ? The man who unlike Martin mcguiness has point blank refused to admit what everyone knows.

    Yeah Gerry Adams word means a lot alright.


  • #734
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Gerry Adams word ? The man who the IRA requested be left out of prison to attend a meeting in London along with the top brass in the IRA ? The man who has been identified as a very high ranking member of the IRA by people who were actually in the IRA ? The guy who is in photos shoulder the coffin of prominent republicans ? Was he just passing and they were a man short and Gerry just did them a favour ? The man who unlike Martin mcguiness has point blank refused to admit what everyone knows.

    Yeah Gerry Adams word means a lot alright.

    What? He was trusted in the IRA that's exactly what I was saying.

    He stood up to the British when the rest cowered in the Dail, when John Hume was begging Gerry was doing


  • #735
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,518 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Which info did FF and FG conspire to suppress in this case ? A truth recovery process doesn't apply to the Republic Francie. Gerry Adams knows a person who knows who was responsible for killing Brian stack. I think it's only right that that persons name is passed on to the gardai so they can try and bring an end to the open investigation in the mans murder ?

    I'm afraid it does. It was even discussed on the radio today.
    The case I am aware of, the files are all sitting with a solicitor waiting to go since the Stormont House Agreement.
    You are in for a bit of a shock.

    The gardai know who the man knows and we all know, as Adams knew and Austin Stack knew, The chain stops there.
    We know this as well because it was well known that the IRA and others would not reveal these secrets, before the GFA. The governments knew it too.
    Just like it was hypocritical to start complaining when certain prisoners started to get released for certain crimes after the entire island voted for the GFA (the agreement we were involved in because we were not 'involved' allegedly :) ) it is hypocritical to start whinging now.
    We have commitments under the GFA, the all involved parties to conflict Stormont House Agreement stems directly from those commitments.
    Start lobbying to repeal the GFA or rescind it maybe?


  • #736
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    What? He was trusted in the IRA that's exactly what I was saying.

    He stood up to the British when the rest cowered in the Dail, when John Hume was begging Gerry was doing

    Kneecapping, fuel laundering, kidnapping horses and Irish citizens, shooting gardai dead, raping kids and hiding their attackers, to name a few.

    Can you please tell how this was "standing up to the British"?


  • #737
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Kneecapping, fuel laundering, kidnapping horses and Irish citizens, shooting gardai dead, raping kids and hiding their attackers, to name a few.

    Can you please tell how this was "standing up to the British"?

    Would you grab certain incidents out of every conflict and say the same thing?

    Because if you wanted to you could


  • #738
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    Would you grab certain incidents out of every conflict and say the same thing?

    Because if you wanted to you could

    Nice deflection.

    So care to answer the question?


  • #739
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Kneecapping, fuel laundering, kidnapping horses and Irish citizens, shooting gardai dead, raping kids and hiding their attackers, to name a few.

    Can you please tell how this was "standing up to the British"?

    Next time you see someone supporting the British, US or French army you should ask them how killing children is standing up to Isis, or how killing children is standing up to the Taliban or how about you ask the British how dragging Catholics from their cars and kicking their heads in is standing up to the IRA.


  • #740
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,968 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Gerry Adams word ? The man who the IRA requested be left out of prison to attend a meeting in London along with the top brass in the IRA ? The man who has been identified as a very high ranking member of the IRA by people who were actually in the IRA ? The guy who is in photos shoulder the coffin of prominent republicans ? Was he just passing and they were a man short and Gerry just did them a favour ? The man who unlike Martin mcguiness has point blank refused to admit what everyone knows.

    Yeah Gerry Adams word means a lot alright.

    What? He was trusted in the IRA that's exactly what I was saying.

    He stood up to the British when the rest cowered in the Dail, when John Hume was begging Gerry was doing
    A organisation that relied on secrecy and silence let an alledged non member into high ranking meetings in the 1970s ?

    Jesus your last paragraph you'd swear he was the second coming. Gerry Adams isn't half the man John Hume is. I actually respect John Hume.


  • #741
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    A organisation that relied on secrecy and silence let an alledged non member into high ranking meetings in the 1970s ?

    Jesus your last paragraph you'd swear he was the second coming. Gerry Adams isn't half the man John Hume is. I actually respect John Hume.

    John bank balance Hume, a man of leisure


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  • #742
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,518 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    He
    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Kneecapping, fuel laundering, kidnapping horses and Irish citizens, shooting gardai dead, raping kids and hiding their attackers, to name a few.

    Can you please tell how this was "standing up to the British"?

    It is equally possible to write a list of the stuff the British and Unionists were up at the same time and pretend what the conflict was really about and the huge changes brought about.
    Shame Paisley is dead because you could have asked who his sectarian state let had to 'allow about the place' by the time the conflict ended.


  • #743
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Johndoe86 wrote: »
    Next time you see someone supporting the British, US or French army you should ask them how killing children is standing up to Isis, or how killing children is standing up to the Taliban or how about you ask the British how dragging Catholics from their cars and kicking their heads in is standing up to the IRA.

    Is this thread about the French army?

    Can you answer the question?

    You see there is an argument for standing up to the British alright but the things I listed has nothing to do with that.

    Thankfully the majority see what the hero provos really were underneath it all.


  • #744
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,968 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Which info did FF and FG conspire to suppress in this case ? A truth recovery process doesn't apply to the Republic Francie. Gerry Adams knows a person who knows who was responsible for killing Brian stack. I think it's only right that that persons name is passed on to the gardai so they can try and bring an end to the open investigation in the mans murder ?

    I'm afraid it does. It was even discussed on the radio today.
    The case I am aware of, the files are all sitting with a solicitor waiting to go since the Stormont House Agreement.
    You are in for a bit of a shock.

    The gardai know who the man knows and we all know, as Adams knew and Austin Stack knew, The chain stops there.
    We know this as well because it was well known that the IRA and others would not reveal these secrets, before the GFA. The governments knew it too.
    Just like it was hypocritical to start complaining when certain prisoners started to get released for certain crimes after the entire island voted for the GFA (the agreement we were involved in because we were not 'involved' allegedly :) ) it is hypocritical to start whinging now.
    We have commitments under the GFA, the all involved parties to conflict Stormont House Agreement stems directly from those commitments.
    Start lobbying to repeal the GFA or rescind it maybe?
    who's winging Francie ? I'm trying to understand your point of view on this and I'm failing to as your not answering what is being asked of you. Btw what radio show and station was it discussed on today and I'll go and listen to it.


  • #745
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Nice deflection.

    So care to answer the question?

    What would you like me to say? It wasn't standing up to the British the killing of Gardai was carried out by a few scumbags simple as.


  • #746
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    He

    It is equally possible to write a list of the stuff the British and Unionists were up at the same time and pretend what the conflict was really about and the huge changes brought about.
    Shame Paisley is dead because you could have asked who his sectarian state let had to 'allow about the place' by the time the conflict ended.


    Is it OK to rape kids then hide their attackers because the British did it?


  • #747
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,518 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    A organisation that relied on secrecy and silence let an alledged non member into high ranking meetings in the 1970s ?

    Jesus your last paragraph you'd swear he was the second coming. Gerry Adams isn't half the man John Hume is. I actually respect John Hume.

    Hume was useful in the end but never forget he had to go on a solo run to do what he did. His party didn't favour it, prefering to not rock any boats and keep the comfy seats. The electorate showed them what they thought of that, when we finally got near to normal elections.


  • #748
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,518 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Itssoeasy wrote: »
    who's winging Francie ? I'm trying to understand your point of view on this and I'm failing to as your not answering what is being asked of you. Btw what radio show and station was it discussed on today and I'll go and listen to it.

    You are whinging about stuff we have all known was gonna happen when we voted for The GFA (the agreement we were involved in making because we were not 'involved' in the problem allegedly)
    The IRA and Adams and SF have been consistent on this.
    It is policy and there is a very good reason for it. Because if we don't have full disclosure then we will never know the full story of the conflict.


  • #749
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,518 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Is it OK to rape kids then hide their attackers because the British did it?

    Nope. And neither the IRA nor SF raped kids or hid their attackers.
    People who happened to be in both organisations may have done the above though.
    If a GAA footballer raped somebody, would you say the GAA raped somebody?

    A little less sensational Indo style language and thought might help.


  • #750
    marienbad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Nope. And neither the IRA nor SF raped kids or hid their attackers.
    People who happened to be in both organisations may have done the above though.
    If a GAA footballer raped somebody, would you say the GAA raped somebody?

    A little less sensational Indo style language and thought might help.

    If the GAA covered up for them what would you say ?


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  • #751
    Johndoe86
    Site Banned Posts: 16 ✭Johndoe86


    marienbad wrote: »
    If the GAA covered up for them what would you say ?

    Are you referring to Maria Cahill? I actually do believe that she was raped but her hate for the IRA is because her grandfather was a leading provisional (dead at the time) and the IRA didn't kill her rapist. I'd put money on it that she wanted that kangaroo court


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