Louise O Neill on rape culture.

Zulu · 10-11-2016 11:40AM

demfad wrote: »

Tumble weed? I've addressed this already. Maybe if boys (and girls) grew up without core beliefs that school and study was for girls or weak boys then more boys would respect the value of learning and study. What are your suggestions?

My suggestion? That it's not boys fault, but the providers of the education system - you know, the educated adults running the show, not the 3,4,5 year olds.

That you'd blame the children is just a little sickening.

FortySeven · 10-11-2016 11:41AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I support father's for Justice, as any normal human being would.

They are seeking equality in an area. They are promoting men's rights. You dont hear shouts of mannazis from women, which is like something a 2 year old would say.

A woman on contrary, speaks about women's rights, and is called a feminazi, deluded, and crazy.

Big bully boys!

They are fighting for children's rights to see both parents. Rights that are enshrined in law but not respected largely by one gender.

They get called plenty. Sexist, bullies, mysogynistic, retarded, dangerous etc. Etc.

midlandsmissus · 10-11-2016 11:41AM

The Specialist wrote: »

You clearly understand nothing about that group but sure when has that ever stopped a feminist from mouthing off?

mannazi!

Lol.

Speak to the monkeys, act like a monkey.

Advbrd · 10-11-2016 11:43AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Believe me when I say your condescending tone means nothing to me.

That makes me so happy pet.

Widdershins · 10-11-2016 11:44AM

Deleted User wrote: »

She, and that tv programme, offend every culture with that crap. You can almost hear the producers saying "this audience is so dumb, they'll even watch this".

No idea who Honey is. I don't believe in cultural appropriation to the extent it's being sold. If some people were to be taken seriously we'd be condemning most of our best works of fiction, and probably quite a lot of artwork, too. It's called inspiration.

The Specialist · 10-11-2016 11:45AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

mannazi!

Lol.

Speak to the monkeys, act like a monkey.

Charming but not unexpected. Feminists often have a grossly overestimated image of their own intelligence compared to the actual level they possess. You've just confirmed that.

midlandsmissus · 10-11-2016 11:45AM

FortySeven wrote: »

They are fighting for children's rights to see both parents. Rights that are enshrined in law but not respected largely by one gender.

They get called plenty. Sexist, bullies, mysogynistic, retarded, dangerous etc. Etc.

And how is that any different from feminists seeking equal rights in areas for women? Its not and you know it. It comes down to maturity, in listening to where other people feel that they are suffering.

I can see men are syffering in this area.

midlandsmissus · 10-11-2016 11:47AM

The Specialist wrote: »

Charming but not unexpected. Feminists often have a grossly overestimated image of their own intelligence compared to the actual level they possess. You've just confirmed that.

Someone called me and other feminists a feminazi. I in response called them a mannazi.

You in response turned on me.

Warped male bullying logic that means f all to me. F all.

Bullying ways got you guys so far. No more guys, no more.

The Specialist · 10-11-2016 11:49AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Someone called me and other feminists a feminazi. I in response called them a mannazi.

You in response turned on me.

Warped male bullying logic that means f all to me. F all.

Bullying ways got you guys so far. No more guys, no more.

You make the mistake of thinking I care about feminism or feminists enough to apply "bullying logic" - I don't. Feminism is nothing to me. I simply have an intense dislike for its more deluded followers or just people in general with ****ty confrontational attitudes.

midlandsmissus · 10-11-2016 11:50AM

The Specialist wrote: »

Charming but not unexpected. Feminists often have a grossly overestimated image of their own intelligence compared to the actual level they possess. You've just confirmed that.

I have a Master's degree. A little poster I have never met tells me I am unintelligent.

Cry me a river.

Where are all the ****s I give for this. Oh there they are - none! Have a nice day fellows.

FortySeven · 10-11-2016 11:51AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

And how is that any different from feminists seeking equal rights in areas for women? Its not and you know it. It comes down to maturity, in listening to where other people feel that they are suffering.

I can see men are syffering in this area.

Handily skirting the issue that they are fighting for rights that are currently law for children who cannot fight for themselves.

It is law. Women are not respecting the law and their children suffer for it.

Tell me what Ares women are still struggling for equality in?

Boom_Bap · 10-11-2016 11:51AM

Can you please get this thread back on the topic and stop with the back and forth nonsence.

ohnonotgmail · 10-11-2016 11:52AM

FortySeven wrote: »

I have a boy and a girl in school. They are both doing great. I'm guessing the problems will start around puberty when my son starts being told his perfectly normal behavior is toxic.

starts being told by who?

FortySeven · 10-11-2016 11:59AM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

starts being told by who?

The lie of toxic masculinity is pretty ingrained in society by this point. I'm pretty sure he'll come across it.

ohnonotgmail · 10-11-2016 12:01PM

FortySeven wrote: »

The lie of toxic masculinity is pretty ingrained in society by this point. I'm pretty sure he'll come across it.

well then it is your responsibility as a parent to tell him otherwise.

demfad · 10-11-2016 12:06PM

FortySeven wrote: »

They are fighting for children's rights to see both parents. Rights that are enshrined in law but not respected largely by one gender.

They get called plenty. Sexist, bullies, mysogynistic, retarded, dangerous etc. Etc.

You're making things up as you go along just like your hero Trump!
Substantiation please!

FortySeven · 10-11-2016 12:06PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

well then it is your responsibility as a parent to tell him otherwise.

That's why I'm a member of fathers4justice. To try to fulfill that responsibility as is my sons right. I don't have a say you see. I don't even get to see them.

Now, back on topic before I get a ban.

Mortpourvelo · 10-11-2016 12:08PM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Are you going to call Fathers4justice, whom storm TV shows in England and Ireland to promote men's rights -mannazis?

Deluded,crazy mannazis! Lol. That makes me feel big and powerful to say that.

Anytime I here someone saying the word Feminazi, it says reams more about who you are, than anything else ever does.

I'm female, consider myself a feminist - all for equality.

HOWEVER when you go on a rant about all men being rapists, and the b*****ks about equal pay, you move into nutjob territory.

Seriously, jobs pay the same for whoever gets the job. If a woman earns less because you spent 12 years as a "stay at home mum" - when your kids are at school for the whole day and then someone with 12 years MORE experience earns more than you, that's your choice.

Fathers4Justice are just as ****ed up too, see - equality!

midnight city · 10-11-2016 12:08PM

Deleted User wrote: »

You seem very angry and defensive.

Good for you that you'd vote Le Pen. That just says to me your racism trumps (hur hur) your sexism. Not something to fist pump about.

It must be so easy to be a leftist in a discussion. Just put an ..ism after a word and leave it there.

demfad · 10-11-2016 12:10PM

FortySeven wrote: »

Handily skirting the issue that they are fighting for rights that are currently law for children who cannot fight for themselves.

It is law. Women are not respecting the law and their children suffer for it.

Tell me what Ares women are still struggling for equality in?

Dont be ridiculous. It is the courts who uphold the law on behalf of children not women's or men's groups. The court decides what is best for the child and rightly so? What's your problem with this?

Mortpourvelo · 10-11-2016 12:11PM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

Someone called me and other feminists a feminazi. I in response called them a mannazi.

You in response turned on me.

Warped male bullying logic that means f all to me. F all.

Bullying ways got you guys so far. No more guys, no more.

I'm a girl (well I was a few years ago!!!)

FortySeven · 10-11-2016 12:18PM

demfad wrote: »

Dont be ridiculous. It is the courts who uphold the law on behalf of children not women's or men's groups. The court decides what is best for the child and rightly so? What's your problem with this?

A child has a right to see both parents. Human rights legislation.

Courts award access, yes. Mothers choose not to allow this to happen.

Now go and compare mothers punished for this by the courts and fathers not paying maintenence.

I'll give you a clue. One is zero, the other fills our prison system.

Please don't pretend that you are not well aware of this fact and stop wasting my time.

I'm out. Due to mod warning earlier. Please do not equate this as a win, if I wasn't a step away from a permaban I would devote the rest of my day to wiping the floor with you.

demfad · 10-11-2016 12:18PM

Walter H Price wrote: »

Kinda sad isn't it , the Snow Flake generation , what a sham
.......
Stop labeling people , stop jumping to accuse people of being XYZ its pretty irksom to be honest.

:rolleyes: They say hypocrisy and self righteousness are two sides of the same coin.

Widdershins · 10-11-2016 12:30PM

Mortpourvelo wrote: »

I was told the other day I was "gender fluid" and should complain that there's no such box to tick on a form!!!!
.

Someone actually informed you you are gender fluid?

I don't know what to say to that. A little knowledge s a dangerous thing?

Mortpourvelo · 10-11-2016 12:36PM

Widdershins wrote: »

Someone actually informed you you are gender fluid?

I don't know what to say to that. A little knowledge s a dangerous thing?

Yeah they'd read it somewhere because I'm not a typical "girl"!!!

I didn't want to look at 143 pictures of a wedding dress and preferred to talk about the win over the All Blacks.

"You don't like anything you're meant to, you must be gender fluid".

The world is slightly messed up!!!

Widdershins · 10-11-2016 12:39PM

Mortpourvelo wrote: »

Yeah they'd read it somewhere because I'm not a typical "girl"!!!

I didn't want to look at 143 pictures of a wedding dress and preferred to talk about the win over the All Blacks.

"You don't like anything you're meant to, you must be gender fluid".

The world is slightly messed up!!!

I'd worry about their children! I was a tomboy too, a little bit less so now but I probably don't like most of what your friend must think I'm supposed to.

ligerdub · 10-11-2016 12:56PM

Zulu wrote: »

I suspect that the Hillary message of: "If you don't vote for me, you are not a feminist" backfired. Royally.

People aren't stupid, and trying to back them into a corner with their vote isn't welcome. This message was aimed at educated women, who, lets face it, understand that it's fu(kin sexist. You're feminist, ergo you vote for me because I'm a woman. That's bound to rile people, especially when it's a message that coming along with the email scandal, the Bernie Sanders shenanigans, and all the dirt that was being dug up about her by the otherside.

Educated women saw through the bs and voted the way they saw fit. I can't say I agree with their candidate, but that's their choice (the irony that some feminists don't respect their opinion/vote isn't lost on me).

Now, lets see what comes out of the ashes, and lets all hope he isn't in the mood to launch a nuke.

Feminism is usually very much aligned with pro-choice for women.......except when it comes to voting, or choosing to be a stay at home mother rather than working, and when it comes to anti-porn filters on computers.

demfad · 10-11-2016 01:03PM

Widdershins wrote: »

I'd worry about their children! I was a tomboy too, a little bit less so now but I probably don't like most of what your friend must think I'm supposed to.

Lets be fair. It is not feminism that seeks to define what masculinity and femininity should be. Our culture defines it. Our culture should be accepting and tolerant enough to allow children to be themselves as feminism does.
It is problematic when 'masculinity' in a culture that tells boys that learning is for nerds, or 'femininity' means there is something wrong girls who like sports or to play with boys or whatever. That is wrong and you are barking up the wrong tree to attach the blame to feminism. Feminism addresses this.

As regards the OP scholarly studies have shown that the motives for domestic violence rape etc, (even family annihilation which is pertinent recently) tend to revolve around a sense of male superiority/entitlement of the perpetrator. If our culture brings us up to believe that boys are better than girls then some boys will grow into men who will be capable of these crimes and such a society will make it difficult for justice to be done.

As an example of the latter in the almost 3 decades that it became illegal for a husband to rape his wife there has only been one conviction. Although the box has been ticked in legislation clearly Irish society does not believe that a husband can rape his wife. That is rape culture.

ligerdub · 10-11-2016 01:06PM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

I have a Master's degree. A little poster I have never met tells me I am unintelligent.

Cry me a river.

Where are all the ****s I give for this. Oh there they are - none! Have a nice day fellows.

Gender studies?

LLMMLL · 10-11-2016 01:06PM

"me_right_one wrote:

Murders sometimes happen in Ireland. Do we have a murder "culture"?
Robberies sometimes happen in Ireland. Do we have a thieving "culture"?
People sometimes donate their organs to others, eg. Joe Brolly. Do we have an organ sharing "culture"?

The answer is obviously no, and you know it.

The difference between murder culture and rape culture is that there is no general atmosphere in society that leads to Murders.

Whereas sexual interactions pervade society. People flirt at work, daydream about attractive people they see on public transport. That's harmless. But for many people this crosses the line into harrassment. All you have to do is type everyday sexism into Google and you'll find the EVERYDAY inappropriate sexual behaviour that (mostly) women experience.

As for murders and the low level violence that might be thought to lead to murders, ask people to post their experiences of violence and there's no way anyone who wasn't in a drugs gang would have everyday experiences of that.

Louise O Neill on rape culture.

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