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Funerals .... wake and / or mass and burial

2

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 81,077 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I kinda liked this take on wakes:
    http://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/michael-harding-the-mysterious-promise-of-a-room-with-a-corpse-1.2750298
    I was at a funeral recently of an elderly woman who lived alone. Her sons were in the backyard drinking mugs of tea and smoking cigarettes. There was an air of good humour in their faces.
    “I like your black suits,” I said, “but where are the ties?” Because they were all in open-necked shirts.
    “Things are going smoothly,” one of them said as he watched men in high-vis jackets directing traffic on the road.
    Road signs that read “Wake House” had been planted at the crossroads, and bollards were in place to stop people parking in the mouth of a field that had been recently cut for silage and was being used as a temporary car park. The big black bales had been rolled into a corner and the field was lined with flashy new cars.
    The woman was in her 80s but “she was never a day sick in her life”, one of her sons remarked. “She took a turn last Tuesday. Fell down at the television. She loved Fair City,” he added.
    I heard him tell this again and again to other neighbours who came around the gable into the yard. Over and over he recited the story of how she fell, and how they found her soon afterwards because she wasn’t answering the phone. When they got to the house, the television was still on.
    The ritual recitation of her story was repeated over and over again, to clarify her death, and to ease the children’s sorrow in the simple act of remembering the details.
    Mahogany sideboards
    “She’s in the parlour,” one son said, to indicate that I should go inside, through the back door, and then through the kitchen to a front room; a hushed world of mahogany sideboards and silver ornaments and a smart television that someone had draped with a cream crochet tablecloth.
    The curtains were drawn and the room was filled with a ghostly light, even though it was the middle of the day.
    Her sons are all married and live in houses with big kitchens and what they call “front rooms” or “lounges”, but I suppose “parlour” was the word they must have used years ago for this particular room when they were children and their mother was sitting in the corner watching Dallas.
    It was a room where she sat at the window every week for 25 years, since her husband died, waiting for a neighbour or one of the sons to take her to town for the messages.
    The corpse was white. Her face had lost all expression. That’s what I find amazing about the dead. Their muscles let go, and the face loses all traces of anxiety that had shaped their sense of self for a lifetime. What remains is a washed-out shell, a beautiful object, like the indifferent mask of a Buddha, or the track of a splendid animal that has gone elsewhere.
    I can’t resist the possibility of eternity when I see a corpse. No matter how substantial the world may be, or how enclosed we are in our own histories, there is always a hint of something invisible in a room where human remains lie in repose. They maintain an exquisite emptiness, like a sanctuary just after the Mass is ended that is difficult to leave.
    I queued with neighbours, who lined up to view the coffin one by one, some touching the dead fingers, some blessing themselves, and some just standing there gawping. In the yard later, I was handed a mug of tea and offered cocktail sausages, as if I had done some task that needed reward.
    Old men munched sandwiches as enthusiastically as if they had just finished cutting a bank of turf, although most of them were far too old to have done farm work for years.
    Mug of tea
    “Thanks for coming,” each son said in turn, when I had drained the mug of tea, to which I responded with the words “Sorry for your troubles”.
    It completed the ritual of another country funeral. We had fabricated heaven out of kindly phrases: she’s happy now; she has gone to a better place; she has no more pain. A mythic heaven was woven in genteel formalities.
    I imagined the old woman as a tiny bird recently flown away, and the coffin as an abandoned nest that still carried the shimmer of a living thing. As if the open-necked shirts were vestments and her sons were all pagan priests, there to witness her safe passage to that other world beyond their imagination’s reach.


  • Posts: 26,219 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Where did I say it was? Can I just re iterate I AM GOING TO BOTH! this isn't a thread asking how do I swerve one or other. I just wanted a consensus of the etiquette.

    You're taking me up wrong. What I meant is let your friend tell you if she needs you at every event as it's about what she needs from you as a friend, rather than it being about what you think should be done. The etiquette is secondary to her needs, if you're very close friends.

    She might not want you at the house at all, she may not be up to seeing anyone. Just ask her what would help, and let her call the shots.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,561 ✭✭✭hairyslug


    You know your friend so you'll have an idea as to what she would prefer.
    For my mother's wake, I was glad to be able to have some quiet time alone, for my dad's, there were a lot of people there, and I had to wait to have some time alone with him just before the removal and felt pressured to talk to everyone. At both funerals I could not tell you who was there outside of direct family. Everyone is different, some will want company, others will want time alone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,275 ✭✭✭Your Face


    Time to read what I actually said. I am and was always going to both!

    Time to grow up.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,949 ✭✭✭✭IvyTheTerrible


    lawlolawl wrote: »
    "Left behind" after what? A perfectly natural occurrence? What good does it do someone to make a huge ****ing deal out of someone popping their clogs like we all will? There isn't anything special about dying, any fool can do it.

    I need counseling every time someone i know takes a piss. This inevitable part of human life is too much for me to handle. Please drape it in pomp and ceremony so that i can understand it.

    EDIT: Also, we aren't "left behind" when someone dies. They didn't go anywhere. They just died and ceased to exist as a result of that.

    Please don't say that to anyone who has lost someone recently. It's just so cold and unfeeling.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,678 ✭✭✭lawlolawl


    Please don't say that to anyone who has lost someone recently. It's just so cold and unfeeling.

    My grandmother died a few days ago and i still feel this way.

    Don't presume that everyone is into this hushed-tones nonsense. People die, it's just something that happens and it isn't that big of a thing.


  • Posts: 26,219 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    lawlolawl wrote: »
    My grandmother died a few days ago and i still feel this way.

    Don't presume that everyone is into this hushed-tones nonsense. People die, it's just something that happens and it isn't that big of a thing.

    I guess it depends on how much you loved them, and how big a hole their absence would leave in your life.

    If my grandmother died, it would be a huge deal to me, and I would be devastated.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    I personally hate wakes and funerals and this applies to both attending them and hosting them as such.

    Everyone is different of course but I know the ones I "hosted" the last thing I wanted was endless lines of people I hardly knew repeating the same nonsense countless others did. This may bring comfort to some but it certainly didn't to me.

    I prefer to remember someone privately and dislike this whole public show. The other thing I dislike is people going on about the size of a funeral/wake as if it's an accurate measure of a man/woman.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,005 ✭✭✭Letree


    I go to a good few wakes but very little funerals unless i know the person very well. I don't stay for tea generally i'm in and out, shake hands with the family speak to the ones i know best for a bit, stand at the body for 30 seconds or so and then out the door.

    I think its important to go in to see the body.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    Letree wrote: »
    I go to a good few wakes but very little funerals unless i know the person very well. I don't stay for tea generally i'm in and out, shake hands with the family speak to the ones i know best for a bit, stand at the body for 30 seconds or so and then out the door.

    I think its important to go in to see the body.

    Why is it important to see a dead body? Out of interest. That's the thing I definitely don't want to see. Are you a pathologist? I run a mile at the sight of dead bodies.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,005 ✭✭✭Letree


    timthumbni wrote: »
    Why is it important to see a dead body? Out of interest. That's the thing I definitely don't want to see. Are you a pathologist? I run a mile at the sight of dead bodies.

    I feel its important for the friend or person you know to go and acknowledge the body of their deceased parent, wife, child etc. That person meant so much to them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    Letree wrote: »
    I feel its important for the friend or person you know to go and acknowledge the body of their deceased parent, wife, child etc. That person meant so much to them.

    Fair enough. I have a different view. When my close one was buried I didn't even want to see the body myself. And I certainly have no interest in seeing a friends or relatives dead body. I prefer not to see dead bodies. I'm not in CSI here....

    To add acknowledge seems a strange word. I realise and accept they are dead already. I don't need to acknowledge anything.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭dennyire


    timthumbni wrote: »
    Fair enough. I have a different view. When my close one was buried I didn't even want to see the body myself. And I certainly have no interest in seeing a friends or relatives dead body. I prefer not to see dead bodies. I'm not in CSI here....

    To add acknowledge seems a strange word. I realise and accept they are dead already. I don't need to acknowledge anything.
    I dont really think you get it. People may not have seen a friend / relative for a few years. Seeing the body brings a sense of closeness/ remembrance...Im not George Bernard Shaw/ Oscar Wilde who could put my sentiments into words they deserve but hope you know what i mean


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,980 ✭✭✭buried


    timthumbni wrote: »
    To add acknowledge seems a strange word. I realise and accept they are dead already. I don't need to acknowledge anything.

    Hardly "strange" tim, you are acknowledging the loss of the deceased, paying respects to the rest of the family left to deal with the real grief of the event.

    Bullet The Blue Shirts



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    dennyire wrote: »
    I dont really think you get it. People may not have seen a friend / relative for a few years. Seeing the body brings a sense of closeness/ remembrance...Im not George Bernard Shaw/ Oscar Wilde who could put my sentiments into words they deserve but hope you know what i mean

    Yes, but often I've been shown towards the body of a work friends, other, whose deceased one I have never seen nor know anything about.

    I decline always as if I didn't know them when they were living I don't want to see them dead.

    Everyone is different but I really hate the current wake/funeral situation. I find it so false and most people really don't want to be there.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    buried wrote: »
    Hardly "strange" tim, you are acknowledging the loss of the deceased, paying respects to the rest of the family left to deal with the real grief of the event.

    Well, I suppose as I'm not religious I feel different. It all seems like a load of bull**** to me though. Expensive coffins you would want sir????

    Yes, because the more expensive coffin the more you love the deceased......

    It's all a scam and a very good one at that.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭dennyire


    timthumbni wrote: »
    Yes, but often I've been shown towards the body of a work friends, other, whose deceased one I have never seen nor know anything about.

    I decline always as if I didn't know them when they were living I don't want to see them dead.
    Thats fine but im really talking about people you knew and havent seen in a while

    Everyone is different but I really hate the current wake/funeral situation. I find it so false and most people really don't want to be there.

    Thats fine but im really talking about people you knew and havent seen in a while


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,995 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    One thing I've always appreciated especially, are those who have stayed up the night of a family wake. It usually ends up being a collection of people who may have interactions with the family of the deceased from different perspectives but may be not with each other so much.
    Its a vigil, whilst the family gets some rest.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    dennyire wrote: »
    Thats fine but im really talking about people you knew and havent seen in a while

    Again that's fine but I prefer to remember them as alive as opposed to have a picture of their dead body in a coffin hanging over me.

    I'm a NI unionist though an atheist in religion so maybe it's that but we wake the bodies much the same and it's the showing of the bodies I dislike. Mine will be a closed casket and a very cheap one at that. I don't intend to make the undertaker richer to bury a piece of oak under the fecking ground.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,980 ✭✭✭buried


    Water John wrote: »
    One thing I've always appreciated especially, are those who have stayed up the night of a family wake. It usually ends up being a collection of people who may have interactions with the family of the deceased from different perspectives but may be not with each other so much.
    Its a vigil, whilst the family gets some rest.

    I took part in one night vigil at a wake and a couple of other older people who stayed vigil started telling all these old folk tales and stories from the locality, It was a surreal experience but a great one. 5-6 people in the room all listening to these great mad whispered stories in the dark with the deceased. You could get a real feel for why these vigils and wakes became such a tradition.

    Bullet The Blue Shirts



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭dennyire


    ok...see your point and agree to disagree.
    on a side note i have a story about a quakers wake which would be in apprropriate for this thread so i will post in new thread..hope nobody takes offence...none meant


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    dennyire wrote: »
    ok...see your point and agree to disagree.
    on a side note i have a story about a quakers wake which would be in apprropriate for this thread so i will post in new thread..hope nobody takes offence...none meant

    This seems interesting. I don't think it would be inappropriate to post it here. Keeps things tidy. Who would find it offensive on this thread as opposed to a new thread. Post it ya wimp.... ;-)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭dennyire


    timthumbni wrote: »
    This seems interesting. I don't think it would be inappropriate to post it here. Keeps things tidy. Who would find it offensive on this thread as opposed to a new thread. Post it ya wimp.... ;-)

    Posted as a separate thread:)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,845 ✭✭✭timthumbni


    dennyire wrote: »
    Posted as a separate thread:)

    Now I know why..... A cracker style joke;-)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭dennyire


    timthumbni wrote: »
    Now I know why..... A cracker style joke;-)
    Thread has disappeared......mods...can you explain why????????
    Have I offended quakers oats or what?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,835 ✭✭✭dennyire


    dennyire wrote: »
    Thread has disappeared......mods...can you explain why????????
    Have I offended quakers oats or what?
    Apologies to mods(ken)..see it was moved to best joke you ever heard thread..thanks


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,383 ✭✭✭Heckler


    I went to both the funeral home (removal) and the next day mass and burial recently. It was a mother of someone who while I wouldn't be social friends with, i've worked closley with them for the last 20 years.

    Just felt like the right thing to do.

    He thanked me later for showing up at all the services. He appreciated it.

    I did hang back a bit at the cemetery figuring it was more of a family thing.

    After burying my father many years ago I couldn't remember the next day who showed up. Its a bewildering blur of handshakes. But I do appreciate anyone who makes an effort. Simpathising is hard.

    As is spelling simpathising. I know it ain't right !


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,184 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    It's up to the family of the deceased how much or little they want to spend on a coffin, it's not something that would be of any concern to me.

    Any wake I've been to the deceased is in the centre of the room with the family members sitting there so people can shake hands and pay their respects, there's no pressure to even look at the body if it makes someone uncomfortable.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,995 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Funeral homes down our way with a long time. But its now becoming more usual to have a wake in the house, even if only for a few hours. Bring the person back home.
    Its choice, whatever the family are comfortable with.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,184 ✭✭✭riclad


    IF your sister, parent , uncle ,aunt,spouse passed away ,
    you have a chance to go to the funeral home and see the body.
    if you are not a close relative ,i don.t think theres any need to see
    the body.
    You can express your sympathy by going to the funeral,
    and maybe to the cemetary .
    theres usually a place to go for a meal ,
    it,ll be announced at the funeral .
    go to hotel or pub x if you wish
    Do people have wakes at home anymore at all ?
    i just think its weird , this idea ,
    bring someone back home,
    family can go to the funeral parlour,
    it seems strange to me .
    The funeral mass is a formal religious ceremony,
    and theres a social event after the burial,
    for family and friends to meet up .
    so all this about bringing a body home seems just over the top to me .


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