Funerals .... wake and / or mass and burial

BettePorter

Recently a friends parent died. I never met the parent but I'm
Obviously friends with the daughter and will of course pay my respects. I'm
Going to both wake and funeral next day but tbh only because I feel I must/ should.

I hate wakes , ( who enjoys them) don't know anyone but my friend, have no religious or personal compulsion to pay my respects to the body, ( tbh I feel voyeuristic unless u knew the person personally) , but feel etiquette suggests I should go both.

What is the general consensus. I'm
going to both like, but id just go to the mass / burial if I felt I could . Are wakes only for ppl who cant go to funeral?

What do you do? Personally id think ..... if I'd met the person i'd go both. If not, one or other!

retro:electro

Generally I pay my respects by going in to the funeral home and shaking hands with the family. It's not something I'm at all comfortable with but it's what society tells me is respectful. I never usually go to the mass and burial the next day, unless it was a very close family member I tend to leave that bit for just the effected family.

BettePorter

anna080 wrote:

I never usually go to the mass and burial the next day, unless it was a very close family member I tend to leave that bit for just the effected family.

See i'd have always thought the opposite was true..... that if u went to mass/burial you'd (made more effort ) given ud prob left work to do so . If u went to just wake u were doing ur duty. If u went to both u were either very close to family or very voyeuristic.

Aimeee

Most people I know including myself would attend one or the other. Usually the wake, ie funeral home/house and shake hands with family. WouId not really attend church the next day unless they were friends or family.
It doesn't bother me anymore as it used to especially when i first returned to Ireland. It's just so normal now I think.
I find it depends on the amount of funerals attended. Over the last few years there have been a lot, including family. Changes your perspective a bit when you are on the receiving end of all the handshakes (in a positive way).

doubtfir3

Usually for me if I've never been in the house I won't go to the wake.. I will go to a funeral home and generally that suits better than the church.

The only time i'd really go to a house/wake is if I either knew the deceased or a family member well (part of the mourners).

I'd imagine it is pretty exhausting for your friend to shake hands all evening with people they may largely not know, and you might find that you're a welcome familiar face giving a bit of a break.

Up to you really though.. I think that people generally accept and fully understand that funerals and wakes/removals are difficult for people and I don't think there is any one specific "right" thing to do.. just do what you feel ok with and I'm sure it'll be appreciated

dresden8

Best piss up you will ever be at.

Laughs, tears, stories.

Nobody enjoys a funeral, but the events around it are a time to meet friends and family. Share a laugh and make/maintain connections.

That's why we're the best at funerals.

buried

Its good to pay your respect to people who are grieving no matter what day you choose to go. It may seem a grim job for you but it pails in comparison to what the immediate family are going through and I know from experience, the immediate family appreciate all those who take the time out of their day to pay their respects. Its all about support and community. Its a real, small but important comfort to people in times of grief, it shows your there for them, that's all you can do at that moment

BettePorter

dresden8 wrote:

Best piss up you will ever be at.

I really think thats a thing of the past. I don't know the last wake/ funeral I was at that involved drink. I really think people realised that it was seen as a free for all by people who were there only for that reason . I never even relate drink to wakes anymore. Whereas at my mothers funeral in the eighties I recall ppl calling to the door crate / bottle in hand. Seems crude now.

Chain Smoker

Pfft, unless you're close family or something along those lines, you only need to show up at one of them. They'll be so busy they won't really notice/care who's around a bit and who's around a lot (although they'll notice a bit more if you go to the wake than just being one of those hand shaking people at the removal/funeral).

As a friend of the daughter the important thing is to make a bit more of an effort to get in touch with her and check on how things are going over the next few weeks/months.

FrKurtFahrt

Where I live the usual protocol is to bring the body directly from the morgue to the family home for the wake (funeral homes are all but unheard of). Its very rural, and its my own preference to attend the wake, where I have no doubt ones presence is appreciated and noted. Perhaps I'm being selfish, but 15 minutes at a wake beats an hour plus at a funeral - other than someone who is particularly close in terms of family/friend/neighbour.

That comment earlier about drink at a wake is utter nonsense nowadays. I've known funerals, however, to be the best of craic - but only in the case of an 'old-age' death - a celebratory sending off, as opposed to a tragic or early or sudden passing.

freshpopcorn

The wake is generally held in a funeral home and sometimes in the person home. I generally find a lot of people who are connected to the family attends and just pops and heads home. A few people might hang around but their generally close to the family.
The funeral itself in the church I find it's mainly attended by people close to person and family.
The bit in the grave yard is generally attend by people who mightn't have being able to attend the wake the evening before because they get to met the family at the end and sometimes people who attended the wake attend!
I find sometimes people can attend all parts of the funeral even when their not that close!

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

How close are you to the daughter? I don't think there's a need for you to go to both, especially if you're uncomfortable. I know when my own dad died, my best friend came to the removal that night, and I was so relieved she was there.

Your Face

Go to both and support your friend.
Time to put on the Big Person Pants.

_Brian

Round here wakes are all in the house, I go if I really know a family member, but only go into the room with the deceased if I actually knew them well myself.

Try to go to removal or funeral as well as a show of support, only go to both for a family member.

Would be traditional that the deceased isn't left alone during the night and typically friends and neighbours would stay up during the night and let the family sleep. I've done the 2-8am sitting a few times in cousins houses where a parent has died.

Winterlong

Your decision should be based on 'what is the right thing to do' rather than your preferences. You should go to both to support your friend IMO.

lawlolawl

I hate funerals. Everything about them is so unnecessary.

Tote the corpse around the place putting out people who are just trying to go about their lives under the guise of "remembering" or "honoring" someone. Pretty sure the people who the dead lad mattered to can remember them without all the bull**** ceremony.

When i die, i want my corpse removed from where ever it happens, cremated ASAP and they can flush the ashes down the jax for all i care. I'll be legit pissed off if people take one second out of their day to do anything ceremonial.

Death is an inevitable natural occurrence. Don't see anyone having a get together when i take a ****e.

philstar

cremation for me

and i made it abundantly clear to my family that i want this song played as i'm popped into the furnace

BettePorter

LexieOnRale wrote:

How close are you to the daughter? I don't think there's a need for you to go to both, especially if you're uncomfortable. I know when my own dad died, my best friend came to the removal that night, and I was so relieved she was there.

I'm not uncomfortable as such ( no more than anyone is in these situs) but I would prefer to just go to the mass and burial.

I am however going to both cause I feel shes a close enough friend to warrant that.

Just to clarify I wasn't asking should I go to both or which should I go to. I was just wondering what the general expectation was.

Do whatever your friend wants you to do. If she wants you to hold her hand for the whole thing, do that. If she just wants you there for the funeral and burial, do that.

It's not really about you.

BettePorter

Candie wrote:

It's not really about you.

Where did I say it was? Can I just re iterate I AM GOING TO BOTH! this isn't a thread asking how do I swerve one or other. I just wanted a consensus of the etiquette.

BettePorter

Your Face wrote:

Go to both and support your friend. Time to put on the Big Person Pants.

Time to read what I actually said. I am and was always going to both!

Dr Crayfish

The last funerals I've been to haven't had that mass thing the evening before, thank god, one ceremony is bad enough. I think culchies still do it though?

deisemum

OP when my dad died he was brought home from hospital and waked overnight where his close friends and neighbours sat with him throughout the night and reminisced about his life which was actually very comforting and between the tears there was plenty of laughter when we heard some of the antics or funny things that happened to him. As heartbroken as we were it was also lovely to see another side of my dad from his friends.

The following afternoon/evening we sat for over 4 hours shaking hands with people before he was taken to the church and the following day his funeral mass and invited people to the local hotel for a meal afterwards.

I really appreciated seeing my friends.

Galwayguy35

lawlolawl wrote: »

I hate funerals. Everything about them is so unnecessary.

Tote the corpse around the place putting out people who are just trying to go about their lives under the guise of "remembering" or "honoring" someone. Pretty sure the people who the dead lad mattered to can remember them without all the bull**** ceremony.

When i die, i want my corpse removed from where ever it happens, cremated ASAP and they can flush the ashes down the jax for all i care. I'll be legit pissed off if people take one second out of their day to do anything ceremonial.

Death is an inevitable natural occurrence. Don't see anyone having a get together when i take a ****e.

With an attitude like that I don't think you need worry about anyone showing up when the Grim Reaper comes calling.

Galwayguy35

I usually just go to the funeral parlour or if it's being held at the house and shake hands with the mourners and out again in 5 minutes.

wakka12

More people paying respects does help the affected family, despite you thinking you'll just blend into the many faces who have already done so. Knowing their loved one was loved by others outside the family, and that people cared about him/her is nice peace of mind for the family members, from what Ive seen. It doesn't take that much time out of your life, and will help the family during this hard time.

ChippingSodbury

lawlolawl wrote: »

I hate funerals. Everything about them is so unnecessary.

Tote the corpse around the place putting out people who are just trying to go about their lives under the guise of "remembering" or "honoring" someone. Pretty sure the people who the dead lad mattered to can remember them without all the bull**** ceremony.

When i die, i want my corpse removed from where ever it happens, cremated ASAP and they can flush the ashes down the jax for all i care. I'll be legit pissed off if people take one second out of their day to do anything ceremonial.

Death is an inevitable natural occurrence. Don't see anyone having a get together when i take a ****e.

The ceremonies around funerals aren't for the dead person, they're for the people left behind.

lawlolawl

ChippingSodbury wrote: »

The ceremonies around funerals aren't for the dead person, they're for the people left behind.

"Left behind" after what? A perfectly natural occurrence? What good does it do someone to make a huge ****ing deal out of someone popping their clogs like we all will? There isn't anything special about dying, any fool can do it.

I need counseling every time someone i know takes a piss. This inevitable part of human life is too much for me to handle. Please drape it in pomp and ceremony so that i can understand it.

EDIT: Also, we aren't "left behind" when someone dies. They didn't go anywhere. They just died and ceased to exist as a result of that.

tradhead

Maybe it's a "culchie" thing as somebody suggested earlier but we would generally have a wake, a "removal" (service the night before which can be when the coffin is taken to the church) and a funeral.

Where I'm from, a lot of people would be waked at home and brought straight to the church the morning of the funeral, so the removal takes place without the coffin but it's nice for people who can't get off work the following day to be able to attend and pay their respects. I've only ever gone to wakes of close family friends or family members, so would usually just go to the removal if it's somebody I don't know that well but I still want to pay respects.

Some people here have strange ideas about funerals but I know I will never forget the people who made the effort to come to my granny's wake, removal and funeral when I was a teenager, I was devastated at the time but I still remember a few unexpected people that were there and came up to give me a hug, and how much it meant to me.

I also think the traditional wake being a place to tell stories and reminisce about the person, and particularly staying up all night with them is just lovely, and I hope it's a tradition that lasts.

ChippingSodbury

Do you have parents that are still alive? Or maybe a partner or kids?

Giz a shout if one of them dies and I'll flush toilet for you: it'll save you the bother.

Or maybe at that stage, you might be a little more understanding of the pomp and ceremonies that take place (and why).

You've missed the point if you think it's anything to do with religion. It's about caring for the loved ones "left behind" as in still living. That's what communities do...
Or maybe not in hipster world.

Or maybe you'll go like this instead of dying
Lawlolawl s/he was there,
he did his famous roll,
he stuck his head between his legs and vanished up his hole

ChippingSodbury

tradhead wrote: »

Maybe it's a "culchie" thing as somebody suggested earlier but we would generally have a wake, a "removal" (service the night before which can be when the coffin is taken to the church) and a funeral.

Where I'm from, a lot of people would be waked at home and brought straight to the church the morning of the funeral, so the removal takes place without the coffin but it's nice for people who can't get off work the following day to be able to attend and pay their respects. I've only ever gone to wakes of close family friends or family members, so would usually just go to the removal if it's somebody I don't know that well but I still want to pay respects.

Some people here have strange ideas about funerals but I know I will never forget the people who made the effort to come to my granny's wake, removal and funeral when I was a teenager, I was devastated at the time but I still remember a few unexpected people that were there and came up to give me a hug, and how much it meant to me.

I also think the traditional wake being a place to tell stories and reminisce about the person, and particularly staying up all night with them is just lovely, and I hope it's a tradition that lasts.

I too am a culchie. Wakes are a great thing for families/ loved ones because it gives them time to remember the deceased and time to start to adjust to life without them while surrounded by their friends/ community rather than doing it alone.

FrancieBrady

I kinda liked this take on wakes:
http://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/michael-harding-the-mysterious-promise-of-a-room-with-a-corpse-1.2750298

I was at a funeral recently of an elderly woman who lived alone. Her sons were in the backyard drinking mugs of tea and smoking cigarettes. There was an air of good humour in their faces.
“I like your black suits,” I said, “but where are the ties?” Because they were all in open-necked shirts.
“Things are going smoothly,” one of them said as he watched men in high-vis jackets directing traffic on the road.
Road signs that read “Wake House” had been planted at the crossroads, and bollards were in place to stop people parking in the mouth of a field that had been recently cut for silage and was being used as a temporary car park. The big black bales had been rolled into a corner and the field was lined with flashy new cars.
The woman was in her 80s but “she was never a day sick in her life”, one of her sons remarked. “She took a turn last Tuesday. Fell down at the television. She loved Fair City,” he added.
I heard him tell this again and again to other neighbours who came around the gable into the yard. Over and over he recited the story of how she fell, and how they found her soon afterwards because she wasn’t answering the phone. When they got to the house, the television was still on.
The ritual recitation of her story was repeated over and over again, to clarify her death, and to ease the children’s sorrow in the simple act of remembering the details.
Mahogany sideboards
“She’s in the parlour,” one son said, to indicate that I should go inside, through the back door, and then through the kitchen to a front room; a hushed world of mahogany sideboards and silver ornaments and a smart television that someone had draped with a cream crochet tablecloth.
The curtains were drawn and the room was filled with a ghostly light, even though it was the middle of the day.
Her sons are all married and live in houses with big kitchens and what they call “front rooms” or “lounges”, but I suppose “parlour” was the word they must have used years ago for this particular room when they were children and their mother was sitting in the corner watching Dallas.
It was a room where she sat at the window every week for 25 years, since her husband died, waiting for a neighbour or one of the sons to take her to town for the messages.
The corpse was white. Her face had lost all expression. That’s what I find amazing about the dead. Their muscles let go, and the face loses all traces of anxiety that had shaped their sense of self for a lifetime. What remains is a washed-out shell, a beautiful object, like the indifferent mask of a Buddha, or the track of a splendid animal that has gone elsewhere.
I can’t resist the possibility of eternity when I see a corpse. No matter how substantial the world may be, or how enclosed we are in our own histories, there is always a hint of something invisible in a room where human remains lie in repose. They maintain an exquisite emptiness, like a sanctuary just after the Mass is ended that is difficult to leave.
I queued with neighbours, who lined up to view the coffin one by one, some touching the dead fingers, some blessing themselves, and some just standing there gawping. In the yard later, I was handed a mug of tea and offered cocktail sausages, as if I had done some task that needed reward.
Old men munched sandwiches as enthusiastically as if they had just finished cutting a bank of turf, although most of them were far too old to have done farm work for years.
Mug of tea
“Thanks for coming,” each son said in turn, when I had drained the mug of tea, to which I responded with the words “Sorry for your troubles”.
It completed the ritual of another country funeral. We had fabricated heaven out of kindly phrases: she’s happy now; she has gone to a better place; she has no more pain. A mythic heaven was woven in genteel formalities.
I imagined the old woman as a tiny bird recently flown away, and the coffin as an abandoned nest that still carried the shimmer of a living thing. As if the open-necked shirts were vestments and her sons were all pagan priests, there to witness her safe passage to that other world beyond their imagination’s reach.

BettePorter

BettePorter wrote: »

Where did I say it was? Can I just re iterate I AM GOING TO BOTH! this isn't a thread asking how do I swerve one or other. I just wanted a consensus of the etiquette.

You're taking me up wrong. What I meant is let your friend tell you if she needs you at every event as it's about what she needs from you as a friend, rather than it being about what you think should be done. The etiquette is secondary to her needs, if you're very close friends.

She might not want you at the house at all, she may not be up to seeing anyone. Just ask her what would help, and let her call the shots.

hairyslug

You know your friend so you'll have an idea as to what she would prefer.
For my mother's wake, I was glad to be able to have some quiet time alone, for my dad's, there were a lot of people there, and I had to wait to have some time alone with him just before the removal and felt pressured to talk to everyone. At both funerals I could not tell you who was there outside of direct family. Everyone is different, some will want company, others will want time alone.

Your Face

BettePorter wrote: »

Time to read what I actually said. I am and was always going to both!

Time to grow up.

IvyTheTerrible

lawlolawl wrote: »

"Left behind" after what? A perfectly natural occurrence? What good does it do someone to make a huge ****ing deal out of someone popping their clogs like we all will? There isn't anything special about dying, any fool can do it.

I need counseling every time someone i know takes a piss. This inevitable part of human life is too much for me to handle. Please drape it in pomp and ceremony so that i can understand it.

EDIT: Also, we aren't "left behind" when someone dies. They didn't go anywhere. They just died and ceased to exist as a result of that.

Please don't say that to anyone who has lost someone recently. It's just so cold and unfeeling.

lawlolawl

IvyTheTerrible wrote: »

Please don't say that to anyone who has lost someone recently. It's just so cold and unfeeling.

My grandmother died a few days ago and i still feel this way.

Don't presume that everyone is into this hushed-tones nonsense. People die, it's just something that happens and it isn't that big of a thing.

lawlolawl

lawlolawl wrote: »

My grandmother died a few days ago and i still feel this way.

Don't presume that everyone is into this hushed-tones nonsense. People die, it's just something that happens and it isn't that big of a thing.

I guess it depends on how much you loved them, and how big a hole their absence would leave in your life.

If my grandmother died, it would be a huge deal to me, and I would be devastated.

timthumbni

I personally hate wakes and funerals and this applies to both attending them and hosting them as such.

Everyone is different of course but I know the ones I "hosted" the last thing I wanted was endless lines of people I hardly knew repeating the same nonsense countless others did. This may bring comfort to some but it certainly didn't to me.

I prefer to remember someone privately and dislike this whole public show. The other thing I dislike is people going on about the size of a funeral/wake as if it's an accurate measure of a man/woman.

Letree

I go to a good few wakes but very little funerals unless i know the person very well. I don't stay for tea generally i'm in and out, shake hands with the family speak to the ones i know best for a bit, stand at the body for 30 seconds or so and then out the door.

I think its important to go in to see the body.

timthumbni

Letree wrote: »

I go to a good few wakes but very little funerals unless i know the person very well. I don't stay for tea generally i'm in and out, shake hands with the family speak to the ones i know best for a bit, stand at the body for 30 seconds or so and then out the door.

I think its important to go in to see the body.

Why is it important to see a dead body? Out of interest. That's the thing I definitely don't want to see. Are you a pathologist? I run a mile at the sight of dead bodies.

Letree

timthumbni wrote: »

Why is it important to see a dead body? Out of interest. That's the thing I definitely don't want to see. Are you a pathologist? I run a mile at the sight of dead bodies.

I feel its important for the friend or person you know to go and acknowledge the body of their deceased parent, wife, child etc. That person meant so much to them.

timthumbni

Letree wrote: »

I feel its important for the friend or person you know to go and acknowledge the body of their deceased parent, wife, child etc. That person meant so much to them.

Fair enough. I have a different view. When my close one was buried I didn't even want to see the body myself. And I certainly have no interest in seeing a friends or relatives dead body. I prefer not to see dead bodies. I'm not in CSI here....

To add acknowledge seems a strange word. I realise and accept they are dead already. I don't need to acknowledge anything.

dennyire

timthumbni wrote: »

Fair enough. I have a different view. When my close one was buried I didn't even want to see the body myself. And I certainly have no interest in seeing a friends or relatives dead body. I prefer not to see dead bodies. I'm not in CSI here....

To add acknowledge seems a strange word. I realise and accept they are dead already. I don't need to acknowledge anything.

I dont really think you get it. People may not have seen a friend / relative for a few years. Seeing the body brings a sense of closeness/ remembrance...Im not George Bernard Shaw/ Oscar Wilde who could put my sentiments into words they deserve but hope you know what i mean

buried

timthumbni wrote: »

To add acknowledge seems a strange word. I realise and accept they are dead already. I don't need to acknowledge anything.

Hardly "strange" tim, you are acknowledging the loss of the deceased, paying respects to the rest of the family left to deal with the real grief of the event.

timthumbni

dennyire wrote: »

I dont really think you get it. People may not have seen a friend / relative for a few years. Seeing the body brings a sense of closeness/ remembrance...Im not George Bernard Shaw/ Oscar Wilde who could put my sentiments into words they deserve but hope you know what i mean

Yes, but often I've been shown towards the body of a work friends, other, whose deceased one I have never seen nor know anything about.

I decline always as if I didn't know them when they were living I don't want to see them dead.

Everyone is different but I really hate the current wake/funeral situation. I find it so false and most people really don't want to be there.

timthumbni

buried wrote: »

Hardly "strange" tim, you are acknowledging the loss of the deceased, paying respects to the rest of the family left to deal with the real grief of the event.

Well, I suppose as I'm not religious I feel different. It all seems like a load of bull**** to me though. Expensive coffins you would want sir????

Yes, because the more expensive coffin the more you love the deceased......

It's all a scam and a very good one at that.

dennyire

timthumbni wrote: »

Yes, but often I've been shown towards the body of a work friends, other, whose deceased one I have never seen nor know anything about.

I decline always as if I didn't know them when they were living I don't want to see them dead.
Thats fine but im really talking about people you knew and havent seen in a while

Everyone is different but I really hate the current wake/funeral situation. I find it so false and most people really don't want to be there.

Thats fine but im really talking about people you knew and havent seen in a while

Water John

One thing I've always appreciated especially, are those who have stayed up the night of a family wake. It usually ends up being a collection of people who may have interactions with the family of the deceased from different perspectives but may be not with each other so much.
Its a vigil, whilst the family gets some rest.

timthumbni

dennyire wrote: »

Thats fine but im really talking about people you knew and havent seen in a while

Again that's fine but I prefer to remember them as alive as opposed to have a picture of their dead body in a coffin hanging over me.

I'm a NI unionist though an atheist in religion so maybe it's that but we wake the bodies much the same and it's the showing of the bodies I dislike. Mine will be a closed casket and a very cheap one at that. I don't intend to make the undertaker richer to bury a piece of oak under the fecking ground.

buried

Water John wrote: »

One thing I've always appreciated especially, are those who have stayed up the night of a family wake. It usually ends up being a collection of people who may have interactions with the family of the deceased from different perspectives but may be not with each other so much.
Its a vigil, whilst the family gets some rest.

I took part in one night vigil at a wake and a couple of other older people who stayed vigil started telling all these old folk tales and stories from the locality, It was a surreal experience but a great one. 5-6 people in the room all listening to these great mad whispered stories in the dark with the deceased. You could get a real feel for why these vigils and wakes became such a tradition.