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The State of the Refugee Crisis in Germany

1356

Comments

  • #62
    mansize
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    dr.bollocko wrote: »
    Initiating a debate needs some useful data. Not some crap from down the pub.

    Though if you want crap from down the pub then I'm regularly in Germany with work, converse with Germans and immigrants on this matter and none take issue with the refugee policy.

    It's pretty straight forward to provide counterpoints because it's all hearsay.

    Pure and Simple


    (Sorry, not sorry)


  • #63
    Renegade Mechanic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,928 ✭✭✭Renegade Mechanic


    mansize wrote: »
    The Daily Telegraph we would be used to is the UK one, I don't know if many read the Aus Versiom

    I doubt any read it, but somewhere along the lines the "Daily" bit got muddled - probably when I read up on everything he does own - with the "Mail" bit, thus leading to the original assumption.


  • #64
    mansize
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    Renegade Mechanic wrote: »
    I doubt any read it, but somewhere along the lines the "Daily" bit got muddled - probably when I read up on everything he does own - with the "Mail" bit, thus leading to the original assumption.

    I read it at 6 Nations time. Good rugby coverage.


  • #65
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    What was the film this line was from?

    'I love the smell of an anecdotal rabble rousing rant in the morning'


  • #66
    mansize
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    What was the film this line was from?

    'I love the smell of an anecdotal rabble rousing rant in the morning'

    Apocalypse Now (Refugee)


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  • #67
    Ralf and Florian
    Site Banned Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭Ralf and Florian


    Alive1 wrote: »
    Nah, looks more like a rant by a virulent racist who provides no evidence other than "I heard from someone who knows a guy whose brother was speaking to a friend who said he heard"

    Typical generation snowflake response.You can't start a discussion on refugees or Islam without being labeled a racist.If the op had described similar behaviour by Irish skangers would you be so critical?


  • #68
    Wigglepuppy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 397 ✭✭Wigglepuppy


    Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »
    I don't think we can keep on dismissing people who question what seems to be happening re immigration in Europe as racists or Islamaphobes. That is a great way to shut down debate. One feels ashamed for bringing up the subject, as though having suddenly morphed into a fascist. But from news given to me by friends (very liberal and altruistic people) living in Sweden, there is a very big problem going on...in schools, in hospitals, in hostels, on the street, where peoples elder parents are being assaulted, where boys are ready to attack for simply being looked at, where scissors and sharp implements are thrown at teachers who are told then that their mothers will be raped. These are some very few samples of incidents I have heard in past month from small Swedish town. I am a life long liberal type, and my own daughter has been volunteering in refugee shelters in Germany and has made good friends among the new population. But this whole scenario that parallels the ordinary families seeking shelter, has me confounded. I believe what the OP is describing to be real.
    Agreed. But already the claims of racism have started and the "this person is also an immigrant" stuff (thought they would be the very ones to point out that it's not the being an immigrant that should be focused on, it's the behaviour). The cognitive dissonance is amusing. :)


  • #69
    mansize
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    Ralf and Florian wrote: »
    Typical generation snowflake response.You can't start a discussion on refugees or Islam without being labeled a racist.If the op had described similar behaviour by Irish skangers would you be so critical?

    And want to leave Ireland???


  • #70
    Richard Hillman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,033 ✭✭✭✭Richard Hillman


    dr.bollocko wrote: »
    Initiating a debate needs some useful data. Not some crap from down the pub.

    Though if you want crap from down the pub then I'm regularly in Germany with work, converse with Germans and immigrants on this matter and none take issue with the refugee policy.

    Yep because people often like to express their true feelings on immigration in front of an immigrant.


  • #71
    mansize
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    Richard Hillman wrote: »
    Yep because people often like to express their true feelings on immigration in front of an immigrant.

    They did with the op apparently


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  • #72
    Alive1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 99 ✭✭Alive1


    Ralf and Florian wrote: »
    If the op had described similar behaviour by Irish skangers would you be so critical?

    Yes I would if it was based on the same " I heard from a guy who knew a fella whose mate told him".....


  • #73
    Drakares
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 904 ✭✭✭Drakares


    Pro Hoc Vice wrote: »
    I was recently in Germany taken by taxi from airport too hotel by immigrant who spoke passable English and perfect German. At hotel served by many immigrants including a bar man who spoke German perfect English and when he discovered I was Irish even spoke a bit of Irish. My friend lives in a mainly Turkish area many Turks all I came across spoke German.

    The Turks here are not refugees. They're immigrants that have been here for 1-2 generations, most of them in their teens - 20s were raised here. Never mentioned the Turks in my post.


  • #74
    mansize
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,521 ✭✭✭✭mansize


    Drakares wrote: »
    The Turks here are not refugees. They're immigrants that have been here for 1-2 generations, most of them in their teens - 20s were raised here. Never mentioned the Turks in my post.

    Yeah that was Conorhal

    He jumped on your bandwagon


  • #75
    511
    Closed Accounts Posts: 532 ✭✭✭511


    Drakares wrote: »
    Hi Folks,

    This is going to be a long one.

    You are probably going to say "awh hell no not another thread" but I have to talk about this. I am currently living in Southern Germany, I have a good job and I love it here have been here for over 3 years but I am seriously considering moving back home to Ireland because of how out of control things are getting here..

    You should at lest stick around for the next federal election and vote for the AfD. Frauke Petry is a much smarter woman than Merkel and is the best hope for saving Germany from this mess.


  • #76
    LuckyRoche
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86 ✭✭LuckyRoche


    dr.bollocko wrote: »
    Initiating a debate needs some useful data. Not some crap from down the pub.

    Though if you want crap from down the pub then I'm regularly in Germany with work, converse with Germans and immigrants on this matter and none take issue with the refugee policy.

    It's pretty straight forward to provide counterpoints because it's all hearsay.

    We can look up polls and see how the German people feel about the issue.
    Deutsche Welle wrote:
    Merkel coined the motivational slogan "Wir schaffen das" (We can do it) last August during the height of the crisis as thousands of refugees were making their way to Germany on a daily basis.

    But now, a year later, the internet pollster YouGov found that when 1,017 Germans were asked: "How do you feel about Merkel's statement 'We can do it,' repeated several times in relation to the high number of refugees in Germany and the country's ability to accept them and look after them?" some 48 percent said they did "not agree at all" and a further 18 percent said they "slightly disagree," with an overall negative answer topping 66 percent.

    Those who "slightly agree" were 18 percent and 8 percent were in total agreement, meaning little more than a quarter of respondents had confidence in Merkel's promise.

    That means the numbers of those who agree with Merkel's optimism on refugees are at their lowest point since August 15, 2015, with her center-right Christian Democratic Union (CDU) party facing a general election next year.

    The online poll was conducted between July 26 and 29.


  • #77
    Drakares
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 904 ✭✭✭Drakares


    dav3 wrote: »
    None of that hysteria is unique to refugees, asylum seekers or immigrants. Your OP is about refugees though, so we'll stick to that. I think you're way off on your estimation of 1 million refugees in Germany btw.

    Germany registered 964,574 new asylum seekers in the first 11 months of the year, putting Europe’s top economy on track for a million arrivals in 2015, official figures have shown.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/08/germany-on-course-to-accept-one-million-refugees-in-2015

    Clearly way off, and that's just 2015
    Apart from you being friends with three Iraqi guys which I'm sure you'll be able to easily verify, you're expecting us to believe a stranger on an internet forum posting hearsay and conjecture.
    Never said I was friends with these people. But nice for you to add this in in the hopes way of degrading what I said
    What exactly do you want Irish people on an Irish forum to do about your German problem?
    This is a forum. It's for discussion. If you don't like discussing what is being in discussed in this thread then feel free to move on.


  • #78
    Drakares
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 904 ✭✭✭Drakares


    dubrov wrote: »
    I also fail to understand how someone could be considered such a danger to society that they require 24 hour surveillance yet there is insufficient evidence to charge them. It doesn't make any sense.

    My wife's aunt is responsible for teaching this guy German and therefore I know it's not a rumor. Of course I can't well prove it so naturally people say it's not true. Fair enough I suppose as it sounds too unbelievable..

    Refugees under 18 receive are treated as minors: https://www.destatis.de/EN/Publications/STATmagazin/Justice/2008_1/2008_1YouthCustody.html

    Young criminals in Germany almost never get sent to prison as it brings nothing in the long term. Rehab and educational measures are the most likely penalty.
    An educational measure is the most lenient sanction that can be imposed under Juvenile Criminal Law. Educational measures include, for example, instructions on how to live a normal and law-abiding life (e.g. participation in a social training course). A juvenile offender will be punished by disciplinary measures (e.g. community service work, payment of a fine, youth detention for up to 4 weeks) if educational measures are not sufficient. Disciplinary measures are the sanctions most frequently imposed under Juvenile Criminal Law.
    In a few cases, a judge will pass a sentence of youth custody if disciplinary measures are not sufficient or if the offence is particularly serious. In 2006, 16% (16,900) of the young offenders were sentenced to youth custody as their principal sentence. In 60% of these cases, the prison sentence was suspended, for example, to enable the offender to complete vocational training or to continue working and to move on to a life free of crime.


  • #79
    Wigglepuppy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 397 ✭✭Wigglepuppy


    I'd bet if the opening post was a critique of English immigrants to Spain and their carry-on, written by someone who lives there, there wouldn't be a word of criticism or referring to the writer as a racist (nasty tactic, deserves moderator comment in my opinion) but different story when it's a "protected" group. :)


  • #80
    A Little Pony
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,875 ✭✭✭A Little Pony


    Well I am just glad we have a history of para militarism in Northern Ireland regarding this current situation. Hopefully put them off from coming here in large numbers.


  • #81
    Kivaro
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    Ralf and Florian wrote: »
    Typical generation snowflake response.You can't start a discussion on refugees or Islam without being labeled a racist.If the op had described similar behaviour by Irish skangers would you be so critical?

    And it's easy to spot the ultra-liberal with their hyperbole e.g. "rant by a virulent racist". There are a small group of them on here to put the ignorant majority in their place.


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  • #82
    FalconGirl
    Closed Accounts Posts: 874 ✭✭✭FalconGirl


    I hear Germans are waking up to this madness and Merkel will be gone soon. She's a header in fairness.


  • #83
    Ken.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,898 ✭✭✭✭Ken.


    Mod-Good debate going on here folks but please keep it civil and no personal digs. Thank you.


  • #84
    Alive1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 99 ✭✭Alive1


    A Little Pony wrote: »
    Well I am just glad we have a history of para militarism in Northern Ireland regarding this current situation. Hopefully put them off from coming here in large numbers.

    Are you actually condoning the violent attacks on refugees and forigeners which have taken place in the North amongst other places?


  • #85
    munchkin_utd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,979 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    Drakares wrote: »
    Germany registered 964,574 new asylum seekers in the first 11 months of the year, putting Europe’s top economy on track for a million arrivals in 2015, official figures have shown.
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/08/germany-on-course-to-accept-one-million-refugees-in-2015

    Clearly way off, and that's just 2015
    yea, and obviously you arent following the matter in the slightest as you are extrapolating 2015 figures which included 100s of thousands of Balkan migrants (looking for free dental and a few grand hello money which some cowboy towns in Germany were paying in advance, not helping the situation) and a flood of Syrians combined with chancers from Afgahanistan/ Pakistan/ Iraq who were leaving comfy flats and a job in relatively safe parts of the country for promises of a house (yes, house + garden) that people smugglers were promoting to potential clients.

    The Serbians/ Kosovans are now siphoned off separately and sent back within days so very few are bothering with the journey. The others were coming via the "balkan route" which is now closed off, and others aren't even bothering to go as far as Greece as theres the threat of being sent back to Turkey.

    So to actually give REAL information, last month there was 1800 intercepted at the border and the half of them sent back as fingerprint records showed they were registered in another country previously, in July 2015 the figure was 79000 arriving at the border

    So extrapolate as you want but 2016 is quite different to 2015.


  • #86
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    OP your post echoes everything I have heard from friends from continentals Europe . Things have become very weird. None of my circle are right -wing daily mail reading types of people, quite the opposite .


  • #87
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 14,242 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    professore wrote: »
    This is very different to the normal rants we get on here. The OP doesn't come across as a xenophobe and is making valid points. The Germans have a history of extreme guilt about the war and some refugees are taking advantage.

    Drakares has been flogging this horse for a long time.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=98396265#post98396265


  • #88
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »
    Drakares has been flogging this horse for a long time.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=98396265#post98396265

    They obviously feel strongly about it . I don't see anything wrong with having made a previous post about such social problems .


  • #89
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 14,242 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    They obviously feel strongly about it . I don't see anything wrong with having made a previous post about such social problems .
    The OP is deliberately careful to come across as measured and restrained in his OP. In fact, he has a longstanding paranoia about migrants, he appears to think they are predisposed to bombings and mass sexual assaults.


  • #90
    A Little Pony
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,875 ✭✭✭A Little Pony


    Alive1 wrote: »
    A Little Pony wrote: »
    Well I am just glad we have a history of para militarism in Northern Ireland regarding this current situation. Hopefully put them off from coming here in large numbers.

    Are you actually condoning the violent attacks on refugees and forigeners which have taken place in the North amongst other places?
    No. That is the future as people see Islam raping white women and blowing shopping malls up. I can see a good unity in Ireland to try and stop Islam from spreading.


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  • #91
    catbear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,092 ✭✭✭catbear


    Well until substantiated all there is is rumours. don't forget the German girl who lied about being raped by a refugee.


This discussion has been closed.
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