Hostage situation in French church

Zxclnic · 28-07-2016 09:27PM

unseenfootage wrote: »

Christians don't do that either. I don't think he is one.

Well I don't think that matters as morality predates religion.
I suppose the old phrase: 'Don't lower yourself to their level' is what I'm trying to say to the chap.

SILVAMAN · 28-07-2016 11:11PM

Alive1 wrote: »

The same applies for Judaism and indeed other religions both in the UK and throughout Europe.
But you concentrate only on Islam, why???

Where are Christians and Jews murdering people in Europe, either by suicide bombers or mowing them down with a lorry or shooting them as they sit on a beach?
There is something fundamentally not right with Islam-it is an appalling and regressive belief system, which condones slavery, child rape, subjugation of women, and which sanctions the murder of anyone not of that belief system, who repudiates that belief system, and which refuses to countenance freedom of thought or expression. In an way it's like Catholicism 400 years ago, but something called the enlightenment happened to that religion.
You get the odd Christian lunatic shooting up an abortion clinic, or Hasidim spitting at goyim, but that's about the worst that happens.
Do we want a situation where we have vigilante muslims stoning cars that might enter a predominantly muslim neighbourhood, or going around telling women to cover up, or young men to stop drinking. Their attitudes are light years behind us.
More to the point, most muslim states are dictatorships, their cities collapsing, and frankly goddamned ****holes. And these states are based on Islam......
The only shining beacon in the middle east, despite its treatment of Palestinians, is Israel, where agriculture thrives, people can be themselves, and the cities clean and hygienic.

cfuserkildare · 29-07-2016 09:13AM

Do we want a situation where we have vigilante muslims stoning cars that might enter a predominantly muslim neighbourhood, or going around telling women to cover up, or young men to stop drinking. Their attitudes are light years behind us.

The only shining beacon in the middle east, despite its treatment of Palestinians, is Israel, where agriculture thrives, people can be themselves, and the cities clean and hygienic.[/QUOTE]

Firstly, there have been documented instances of this already happening in England, both news and documentary channels have had this broadcasted, remember the Imam who is campaigning to have Sharia law imposed in England?

Also, due to its Human Rights record, Israel is not really a state that many Western Europeans would want to copy.

SILVAMAN · 29-07-2016 09:26AM

cfuserkildare wrote: »

Do we want a situation where we have vigilante muslims stoning cars that might enter a predominantly muslim neighbourhood, or going around telling women to cover up, or young men to stop drinking. Their attitudes are light years behind us.

The only shining beacon in the middle east, despite its treatment of Palestinians, is Israel, where agriculture thrives, people can be themselves, and the cities clean and hygienic.

Firstly, there have been documented instances of this already happening in England, both news and documentary channels have had this broadcasted, remember the Imam who is campaigning to have Sharia law imposed in England?

Also, due to its Human Rights record, Israel is not really a state that many Western Europeans would want to copy.[/QUOTE]
This guy has it right

Sofiztikated · 29-07-2016 10:06AM

I can't believe people are still banging on about desecrating bodies, so they "can't get to heaven."

Would you stop a second, and fúcking listen to yourselves?

Firstly, have a bit of cop on and respect for yourself. Does that sound like the reaction of a sane person?

Secondly, if you think that will stop them, look at it like this. If we got word that ISIS had captured/killed soldiers on the ground, and had done something to the bodies to stop them reaching their own respective heavens, what do you think our reaction would be? Would it be one of "Oh, well maybe we shouldn't have soldiers on the ground?" or would it be one of "Well, fúck you, now we're really going to fúck you up."

Dyr · 29-07-2016 11:12AM

Sofiztikated wrote: »

Secondly, if you think that will stop them, look at it like this. If we got word that ISIS had captured/killed soldiers on the ground, and had done something to the bodies to stop them reaching their own respective heavens, what do you think our reaction would be? Would it be one of "Oh, well maybe we shouldn't have soldiers on the ground?" or would it be one of "Well, fúck you, now we're really going to fúck you up."

It does'nt matter what the people at home think, its the guys who are doing the dirty work on the ground that you want to target.

I do like the idea though that ISIS are going to go "oh okay, now we're really taking the gloves off"

Widdershins · 29-07-2016 11:15AM

Yes ISIS have been so restrained so far

jmayo · 29-07-2016 11:42AM

Sofiztikated wrote: »

...
Secondly, if you think that will stop them, look at it like this. If we got word that ISIS had captured/killed soldiers on the ground, and had done something to the bodies to stop them reaching their own respective heavens, what do you think our reaction would be? Would it be one of "Oh, well maybe we shouldn't have soldiers on the ground?" or would it be one of "Well, fúck you, now we're really going to fúck you up."

You do know they burned to death a captured Jordanian pilot ?
How much fooking worse do you think they can be ?

Bob24 · 29-07-2016 03:50PM

Ted Cruz wrote: »

The French are talking about about banning foreign funded mosques. I hope they go through with it.

Overall I think it is a good idea, but the mater might be a bit more complex than it seems.

There are already not enough mosques in France for the number of followers, and there has been tension because of street prayers in Paris and other places (the lack of mosque being used as a justification by those praying on the street).

The other aspect is that (probably rightly) French law is banning the use a public funds to finance any religious building, so the sate couldn't finance the construction of mosques.

So basically the only solution left for all Muslims to have a place to worship will be for them to organise even more as a community to gather money and manage some kind of Muslim fund for France in charge of building the mosques.

I see both advantages and disadvantages in doing this ... no solution seems perfect really.

Widdershins · 29-07-2016 04:14PM

''there has been tension because of street prayers in Paris and other places (the lack of mosque being used as a justification by those praying on the street).'' This would be the traffic-stopping I hear about . If it's obstructive, ban it!

Bubbaclaus · 29-07-2016 04:19PM

Ted Cruz wrote: »

The French are talking about about banning foreign funded mosques. I hope they go through with it.

Not sure I'm seeing the logic/end goal of that suggestion.

A Little Pony · 29-07-2016 04:19PM

Widdershins wrote: »

Alive1 wrote: »

What character of the country?
The character that allowed women to die by denying them life saving medical tratment on the basis that "this is a Catholic country"?
Thats a character that needs changing!

That bit does for certain but how is mass immigration going to do that ? If the predominant religion is muslim how will that positively influence the woman's rights situation ?

It won't.

Homosexuals will have NO rights and women will be severely oppressed. Islam is a disaster for minority groups.

Widdershins · 29-07-2016 04:20PM

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Not sure I'm seeing the logic/end goal of that suggestion.

That would be to prevent radicalisation .

end of the road · 29-07-2016 04:25PM

Widdershins wrote: »

That would be to prevent radicalisation .

if that is the end goal, it has failed before it can even get going.

Widdershins · 29-07-2016 04:27PM

end of the road wrote: »

if that is the end goal, it has failed before it can even get going.

That doesn't make sense .

Bubbaclaus · 29-07-2016 04:27PM

Widdershins wrote: »

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Not sure I'm seeing the logic/end goal of that suggestion.

That would be to prevent radicalisation .

Step 1: Cut mosque funding.
Step 2: ?????
Step 3: Profit!!!

Bob24 · 29-07-2016 04:28PM

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Not sure I'm seeing the logic/end goal of that suggestion.

A number of mosques are being funded by rich businessmen front the middle-east with extremist ideology (Wahhabism, Salafism) and using them to spread those ideologies in Europe (once they have funded the mosque, they also pick the imams).

A Little Pony · 29-07-2016 04:29PM

They could just close all the mosques down and if Muslims whine about it, just give them directions to Muslim countries which have Sharia Law with a one way flight booked. It is France, not Iran or Saudi Arabia.

Bubbaclaus · 29-07-2016 04:34PM

A Little Pony wrote: »

They could just close all the mosques down and if Muslims whine about it, just give them directions to Muslim countries which have Sharia Law with a one way flight booked. It is France, not Iran or Saudi Arabia.

What?

unseenfootage · 29-07-2016 05:14PM

A Little Pony wrote: »

They could just close all the mosques down and if Muslims whine about it, just give them directions to Muslim countries which have Sharia Law with a one way flight booked. It is France, not Iran or Saudi Arabia.

Except, when they go by their own accord, we bring them back, where ultimately, they end up chopping our heads.

Normandy killer denied entry, deported from Turkey: official
http://www.middleeasteye.net/fr/news/normandy-killer-denied-entry-deported-turkey-official-944638733

Back to the drawing board kiddo.

Facism is running thick in this thread.

unseenfootage · 29-07-2016 08:17PM

Bloody Hypocrites.

Eastern European countries sold 1 billion+ worth of weapons to countries that sent them to Syria & then refused refugees from same country

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jul/27/weapons-flowing-eastern-europe-middle-east-revealed-arms-trade-syria?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

KingBrian2 · 29-07-2016 08:22PM

We in Europe are going about this all wrong. Our entire relationship with the Arabs is built around commercial considerations and not human rights. We tolerate their cruel inhumane treatments of minorities and then complain when the consequences play out in Europe until this relationship is reshaped we will continue to have yes Algerian French and Moroccan Dutch committing violence on the streets of Paris & Amsterdam. You'd be laughed out of the audience if you were to suggest that Saudi Arabia build a Catholic Church in Mecca or Medina yet in Europe we have Mosques, churches, temples, Synagogues & fortune tellers to cater to every religion.

jackofalltrades · 29-07-2016 08:25PM

Anyone else notice that this thread has lost a whole bunch of posts?
I've lost a least one of mine.

Bob24 · 29-07-2016 08:28PM

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Anyone else notice that this thread has lost a whole bunch of posts?
I've lost a least one of mine.

Yes - looks like what was posted between around 5.30 and 8 is gone.

Samaris · 29-07-2016 08:42PM

Serial rereg got banned again and his posts were removed, along with posts quoting/responding to him.

Grayson · 29-07-2016 08:45PM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

We in Europe are going about this all wrong. Our entire relationship with the Arabs is built around commercial considerations and not human rights. We tolerate their cruel inhumane treatments of minorities and then complain when the consequences play out in Europe until this relationship is reshaped we will continue to have yes Algerian French and Moroccan Dutch committing violence on the streets of Paris & Amsterdam. You'd be laughed out of the audience if you were to suggest that Saudi Arabia build a Catholic Church in Mecca or Medina yet in Europe we have Mosques, churches, temples, Synagogues & fortune tellers to cater to every religion.

The reason is because we're better than them. Not better than muslims. Muslims are people, some are good and some are bad, just like us. However our society is better than Saudi. We cherish our freedoms and that means everyone, no matter what their race or creed. We don't take our cues from Saudi, if we did we'd be no better than them.

Saudi is a monarchy, it's comparable to dictatorships of which there are many. The difference is that Saudi uses a messed up interpretation of a religion to enforce it's power. It's the same as any totalitarian state which uses an ideology. Wahhabism is to islam as Stalinism is to socialism.

KingBrian2 · 29-07-2016 08:50PM

Grayson wrote: »

The reason is because we're better than them. Not better than muslims. Muslims are people, some are good and some are bad, just like us. However our society is better than Saudi. We cherish our freedoms and that means everyone, no matter what their race or creed. We don't take our cues from Saudi, if we did we'd be no better than them.

Saudi is a monarchy, it's comparable to dictatorships of which there are many. The difference is that Saudi uses a messed up interpretation of a religion to enforce it's power. It's the same as any totalitarian state which uses an ideology. Wahhabism is to islam as Stalinism is to socialism.

So you say we continue to support the most vicious monarchy in the world. Europe is a wash with Muslims that reject Saudi Arabia's interpretation of Islam they should back in Saudi Arabia defying the monarchy and the clerical police. We should boycott Saudi Arabia.

A Little Pony · 29-07-2016 09:25PM

The problem isn't that Saudi has a monarchy. The UK has a monarchy and the Queen is head of state. The difference is Saudi is an Islamic controlled totalitarian sh*t hole.

unseenfootage · 29-07-2016 09:35PM

A Little Pony wrote: »

The problem isn't that Saudi has a monarchy. The UK has a monarchy and the Queen is head of state. The difference is Saudi is an Islamic controlled totalitarian sh*t hole.

You way too emotional kiddo.
How is Saudi a sh1thole?

Widdershins · 29-07-2016 09:37PM

There is a vast differendifference between rejecting the imposition of a religion that has an extensive influence over any society where it prevails and the type of things isis do. It's ridiculous to say we would be 'loweing 'ou level .

Hostage situation in French church

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