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11 police shot, 4 officers dead after coordinated sniper fire at Dallas protest rally

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Comments

  • #62
    volchitsa
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,116 ✭✭✭✭volchitsa


    conorhal wrote: »
    He has been an abysmal President. Here's a bullet point for you, after eight years of Obama in charge, race relations in the US are at an all time low. It's the one subject that you could argue he election was specifically intended to address and he dodged it at every turn. Shameful man.

    That's a single point, not a list. Starting - and losing/failing to win - international wars is a much bigger single point against George Bush, so what's your point here? That he didn't deliver on a single issue - and no, he was not elected on a promise of improved race relations. If people imagined that the mere fact of a black president would solve race relations in the USA that's their problem.

    What exactly should he have done that you feel would have improved race relations during his 2 terms of office?

    "If a woman cannot stand in a public space and say, without fear of consequences, that men cannot be women, then women have no rights at all." Helen Joyce



  • #63
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,059 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    I see the usual playground arguments have broken out, luckily none of you is armed on this thread!

    What's interesting is that this happened in a location well away from the cities that the police shootings took place in - and obviously the short time frame means whoever did this in Dallas had little time to organise a multi-person, multi-location attack that's more elaborate than the usual.

    This in turn makes me wonder if this attack was going to happen in Dallas at some point soon anyway and actually has nothing directly to do with the events earlier in the week but they decided it was a good opportunity to attack cops in one place.


  • #64
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,377 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    I see the usual playground arguments have broken out, luckily none of you is armed on this thread!

    What's interesting is that this happened in a location well away from the cities that the police shootings took place in - and obviously the short time frame means whoever did this in Dallas had little time to organise a multi-person, mulit-location attack that's more elaborate than the usual.

    This in turn makes me wonder if this attack was going to happen in Dallas at some point soon anyway and actually has nothing directly to do with the events earlier in the week but they decided it was a good opportunity to attack cops in one place.

    Why Dallas?

    Access to weapons?
    History of racial tensions?


    Would it really take long to plan something like this?



    I guess there's a small chance that it isn't related and this could be a terrorism incident but it's hardly likely.


  • #65
    Diemos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,417 ✭✭✭Diemos


    Deleted User wrote: »
    There was something crazy going on where Fox news, I believe (and possibly other agencies) identified someone as one of the snipers. Turns out it was just a random guy that brought his rifle with him, to flaunt the open carry permits I believe they have there, but as soon as the shooting happened, he walked straight to the cops, handed in his gun, and allowed himself to be taken away, yet the news still said he was part of it.

    His brother appeared on the news, pleading with them to stop showing it and to stop saying he's a sniper, because it'll destroy his life.

    That's some bad luck right there!

    Bad luck? That's out right stupidity.

    Bringing a gun to a peace rally. It was at the very least a provocative act.

    At least he had enough sense to turn himself in.


  • #66
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,059 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    Jayop wrote: »
    Why Dallas?

    Access to weapons?
    History of racial tensions?


    Would it really take long to plan something like this?



    I guess there's a small chance that it isn't related and this could be a terrorism incident but it's hardly likely.

    I'm not suggesting its "terrorism" (btw any such incident should be considered a terrorist action - they aren't just created by funny foreigners) and yes it could be race-tension based but as said maybe it was going to be a stand alone attack which is now assumed to be linked to the previous two incidents this week. The identities of the gunmen could tell us a lot.


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  • #67
    conorhal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭conorhal


    volchitsa wrote: »
    That's a single point, not a list. Starting - and losing/failing to win - international wars is a much bigger single point against George Bush, so what's your point here? That he didn't deliver on a single issue - and no, he was not elected on a promise of improved race relations. If people imagined that the mere fact of a black president would solve race relations in the USA that's their problem.

    What exactly should he have done that you feel would have improved race relations during his 2 terms of office?

    It's the single relevent point to the thread, you want to discuss Obama's many failings start a different one.

    As for your weak whataboutery, yes, Bush was a spectacularly awful president but all the whataboutery in the world doesn't make Obama much better, after all it's not as if he hasn't gotten involved in a bit of regime change since he came to office or didn't Libya and Syria happen under his watch?

    As to what he could have done, uh, actually address the issue?
    As opposed to, as little as possible while making terse speaches after the fact whenever police shootings occured. He could have addressed the ingrained problems with policing in America to ensure racists and cowboys weren't carrying guns and perhaps encouraged those we believe black lives matter to focus on the ingrained problems within the African American community where black lives seem to matter least. And that's the least he could do, but yeah you're right, what could the President of America possibly do? He's an awful coward.


  • #68
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,130 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    Jayop wrote: »
    That's not justifying something. This is an awful tragedy but could you honestly say that in light of the videos that we've seen over the last year or two and in particular this week that you're surprised some nut jobs have decided to take revenge on these poor innocent people for the crimes of some of their colleagues?

    Reasoning something isn't the same as justifying it.

    Colleagues? These are people working in different states, with vastly different circumstances. Yes I am surprised because any rational thinking person would not murder people indiscriminately based on the actions of a few. I read that dallas police have worked to reduce complaints by 64% over the past several years.

    There was no need to target them,if in fact that was the motivation, and we dont know that right now


  • #69
    beans
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,886 ✭✭✭beans


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    This in turn makes me wonder if this attack was going to happen in Dallas at some point soon anyway and actually has nothing directly to do with the events earlier in the week but they decided it was a good opportunity to attack cops in one place.

    This got me thinking... could be a coincidence, but The New Black Panther Party was formed in 1989 in Dallas.


  • #70
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,130 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    Deleted User wrote: »
    There was something crazy going on where Fox news, I believe (and possibly other agencies) identified someone as one of the snipers. Turns out it was just a random guy that brought his rifle with him, to flaunt the open carry permits I believe they have there, but as soon as the shooting happened, he walked straight to the cops, handed in his gun, and allowed himself to be taken away, yet the news still said he was part of it.

    His brother appeared on the news, pleading with them to stop showing it and to stop saying he's a sniper, because it'll destroy his life.

    That's some bad luck right there!

    No. The Dallas police department tweeted a picture of him as a person of interest. Nothing to do with Fox News or anyone else. Obviously every news channel is going to pick that up. As you said he handed his weapon over. He'll be compensated I'm sure


  • #71
    Lollipops23
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,420 ✭✭✭Lollipops23


    I'm aware that these cops had nothing to do with the murders earlier in the week- but how much is the African American community supposed to take before sh*t like this starts happening? Shootings like earlier in the week have been happening constantly over the last few years. What good is a hashtag?
    I am not for one second saying killing policemen is the right thing to do-just expressing empathy and frustration that the AA community may feel like there's no other option.


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  • #72
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,377 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    Colleagues? These are people working in different states, with vastly different circumstances. Yes I am surprised because any rational thinking person would not murder people indiscriminately based on the actions of a few. I read that dallas police have worked to reduce complaints by 64% over the past several years.

    There was no need to target them,if in fact that was the motivation, and we dont know that right now

    Oh of course they're colleagues despite working for different pd's. Don't be pedantic.

    So you're surprised in a place with thousands of gun murders every year that someone decided to murder some people? Doesn't take much to surprise you.

    How many times do you want me to repeat that I agree there was no need to target them. There's no need to murder anyone in cold blood. It happens a hell of a lot though.


  • #73
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,059 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    Two devices found, could be nothing but this points to a pre-planned operation for me.


  • #74
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,377 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    No. The Dallas police department tweeted a picture of him as a person of interest. Nothing to do with Fox News or anyone else. Obviously every news channel is going to pick that up. As you said he handed his weapon over. He'll be compensated I'm sure

    Dallas pd specifically said he was a suspect not a person of interest.


  • #75
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,377 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    Two devices found, could be nothing but this points to a pre-planned operation for me.

    If true then I'd tend to agree. I assume these people must be ex military if they were able to do such damage sniping from a distance with only one non police officer shot.


  • #76
    Kerrydude1981
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,192 ✭✭✭✭Kerrydude1981


    CNN saying now that one suspect has been killed


  • #77
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,377 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Kerrydude1981 wrote: »
    CNN saying now that one suspect has been killed

    Suspicion that he shot himself.


  • #78
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,377 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Obama giving a statement soon.

    https://youtu.be/rKbUIW6wdxA


  • #79
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,130 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    This whole thing was too well organized for just being arranged after the protest was, which was like 24 hours ago. No one knows the motivations right now

    The suspect in the parking garage shot himself. That is confirmed


  • #80
    screamer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,210 ✭✭✭screamer


    Lollipops23 wrote: »
    I'm aware that these cops had nothing to do with the murders earlier in the week- but how much is the African American community supposed to take before sh*t like this starts happening? Shootings like earlier in the week have been happening constantly over the last few years. What good is a hashtag?
    I am not for one second saying killing policemen is the right thing to do-just expressing empathy and frustration that the AA community may feel like there's no other option.

    unfortunately if this happens to be the case it will just re-inforce stereotypes around the AA community and in fact could polarise opinion further.
    very sad for the families of those killed no one goes to work and expects to come back in a box


  • #81
    Ardent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,408 ✭✭✭Ardent


    Shooters definitely had military experience. Just watched a video on Liveleak - serious moves and balls of steel while under fire.


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  • #82
    jaykay74
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,630 ✭✭✭jaykay74


    Richard Hillman wrote:
    The leftists have now found another way to turn the blame on middle class white males. It is now Gun Control Policies that are to blame.


    Strange post


  • #83
    Bob24
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,886 ✭✭✭✭Bob24


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    This whole thing was too well organized for just being arranged after the protest was, which was like 24 hours ago. No one knows the motivations right now

    Quite possibly the plan had been ready for some time and they were waiting for the right opportunity.


  • #84
    conorhal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,097 ✭✭✭conorhal


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    This whole thing was too well organized for just being arranged after the protest was, which was like 24 hours ago. No one knows the motivations right now

    The suspect in the parking garage shot himself. That is confirmed

    I looked at one video of a shooter which was horrific and I won't post it but my overwhelming impression was that he was probably military trained, he moved in that practiced tactical manner. He certiantly wasn't a pray and spray gangsta. I wouldn't be surprised if the shooters were all current or ex military.


  • #85
    Atlantic Dawn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 86,596 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    GDY151


    Obama live now.


  • #86
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,046 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    LeinsterDub wrote: »
    Are you aware of Iraq, Syria etc ?

    Yep. I should have clarified that the population of the US is split on a huge range of social issues when compared to other stable countries and some of them seem to be getting a lot more visceral in the last couple of years.

    Like compared to Ireland, we had a few EU treaties, the abortion / gay marriage referendums and a smoking ban. When I lived back home, there weren't many issues dividing people.

    Iraq and Syria etc. are split on religion I guess and a lot of war.


  • #87
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    This is sure to improve the circumstances of young black men in America.


  • #88
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,130 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    conorhal wrote: »
    I looked at one video of a shooter which was horrific and I won't post it but my overwhelming impression was that he was probably military trained, he moved in that practiced tactical manner. He certiantly wasn't a pray and spray gangsta. I wouldn't be surprised if the shooters were all current or ex military.

    That was shown over and over on CNN here. Apparently he was 'slicing the pie' , a well known military technique.

    Obamas speech was a lot of nothing really


  • #89
    Dyr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Ardent wrote: »
    Shooters definitely had military experience. Just watched a video on Liveleak - serious moves and balls of steel while under fire.

    My immediate thought when I saw all this being reported was this scene from full metal jacket

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKbtvxAX_jI


  • #90
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 4,896 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Lollipops23 wrote: »
    I'm aware that these cops had nothing to do with the murders earlier in the week- but how much is the African American community supposed to take before sh*t like this starts happening? Shootings like earlier in the week have been happening constantly over the last few years. What good is a hashtag?
    I am not for one second saying killing policemen is the right thing to do-just expressing empathy and frustration that the AA community may feel like there's no other option.

    There was a documentary on BBC1 a few weeks ago about the relationships between the police and and the AA community. Dallas was one of the areas filmed in. Whats clear from it is that there is a near total breakdown of relationships between the two of them in certain areas. It also showed the existence of armed black miltias.


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  • #91
    Gatling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    It also showed the existence of armed black miltias.

    Vastly out numbered by the number of white armed militas
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




This discussion has been closed.
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