Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 2 MOD NOTE POST 1*

MajaDon · 11-06-2016 12:03AM

KK have a tall HF line but the Dublin HB line is actually taller. They are each team's best line. But your HB's could well kill us - not one of our forwards is great at winning dirty ball. We are not very hopeful up here in the capital.
BTW why don't we have a home and away arrangement? Would prefer this in either Nolan or Parnell.

brookville · 11-06-2016 12:09AM

I don't think anyone is writing us off but there's probably a few question marks hanging over us since our last outing.the general feeling is dublin have a great chance of catching us but we've heard this time and time again over the years with differant teams and we've always responded.Dublin won't be taken for granted and i expect us to have our homework done and be ready for the challenge but it'll be interesting to see how quick the likes of larkin and murphy and co get up to speed

Realt Dearg Sec · 11-06-2016 12:16AM

MajaDon wrote: »

KK have a tall HF line but the Dublin HB line is actually taller. They are each team's best line.l.

Nah, our half back line is our strongest. And if I was to choose one line on the field to be strong in...

What I'm saying is, weaknesses and uncertainty notwithstanding, I'm quietly confident we'll get the job done.

MajaDon · 11-06-2016 09:30AM

I still think ye're HF line is your strongest. Kilkenny's HB area is always the most important zone on the pitch and Cody believes if you win that area, you win the game and he is right. So your midfield and full backs and even half forwards are all focused on winning the battle around your HB line - that sometimes makes the actual half backs look great. Wally, M Fennelly (fit) and TJ is better than any HB line anywhere and for a long time.

Overall, there seems to be a consensus that Dublin might put up a good show, but very few believe we'll win. Since we won 4 years ago our forwards have only one player from then and Dotsy is great but is getting to the end. The replacement forwards don't inspire confidence for today's challenge. They are particularly weak at winning hard ball. So KK horsing us out of it around your HB line and piling on pressure on our defence (which is first class but has 4 youngsters all with almost no experience at this level) will be the order of the day. I hope I'm wrong but a reasonable performance from us and keeping it under 7-8 points would be as good as we can expect.

unrealtime · 11-06-2016 10:04AM

Tommy Walsh and JJ were the greatest half-backs that I ever saw over the past 60 years, if not the best of all time. With Hogan they never needed any help to dominate the game. In fact they made everything easy for the FB line which had little to do and hurled copious ball into the forwards who had men like Henry and Eddie etc. to beat other teams handsomely for a decade or so.

We are more vulnerable this year than last - without the other 4 that started the final. I would be worried about how many holes are created in our defence. today.

Bonniedog · 11-06-2016 10:12AM

adrian522 wrote: »

Who is writing us off?

Shortest price - 3/10 - Kilkenny have been against Dublin since 2011!

This is "writing off" ?

Anyway, looking forward to it. Should be an interesting match.

Spotted a good bet too. both teams to score a goal. 2/5.

No, no..... don't thank me.... I'll be in Square Bar. Just leave a vodka behind the counter.

minty81 · 11-06-2016 03:52PM

Jackie ruled out. Lennon in. Joey to corner possibly?

Realt Dearg Sec · 11-06-2016 04:00PM

minty81 wrote: »

Jackie ruled out. Lennon in. Joey to corner possibly?

With Lennon at full back? Don't like the sound of that. A friend of mine suggested Lennon at wing and Walsh in the corner. That could work.

phkk · 11-06-2016 04:17PM

Can't see Cody taking Holden out of fullback, Lennon will go into corner as a straight swap I feel

minty81 · 11-06-2016 04:18PM

Yea I'd prefer that change myself but i think Cody will leave the half back line intact.

kk1970 · 11-06-2016 04:25PM

phkk wrote: »

Can't see Cody taking Holden out of fullback, Lennon will go into corner as a straight swap I feel

Cody could regret getting rid of brian kennedy before this evening is out

MfMan · 11-06-2016 05:34PM

What is wrong with Tyrell?

dastardly00 · 11-06-2016 07:43PM

We're doing okay so far apart from Holden. He's looking like a liability. Larkin is rusty and Conor Fogarty hasn't been in the game at all. Mick Fennelly is involved in a huge amount. If TJ can get some more space he will do serious damage. Wally, Paul Murphy and Buckley doing very well. Farell as well.

JJs Left Hand · 11-06-2016 09:44PM

Decent win. Dublin were pathetic. They need to get rid of Cunningham as their style of hurling is shambolic.

We learned nothing about ourselves other than our full back line is there to be cleaned out. Joey has got into an awful habit of attacking a ball Paul Murphy is underneath and mullering him. Lennon slow as a boat and takes as long to turn. Disappointed with him in the air as well considering that should be his strength. Only other concern was Larkin looked well off the pace but to be expected in his first game back.

Positives: Murphy majestic in the corner. Half back line dominated as we expect them to. Mick Fennelly is still a God in the middle and didn't get injured. Lester was brilliant, as was Wally in the half forward line. And Jonjo was class as well.

No injuries, game under our belts - onto the next one

blackcard · 11-06-2016 10:05PM

JJs Left Hand wrote: »

Decent win. Dublin were pathetic. They need to get rid of Cunningham as their style of hurling is shambolic.

We learned nothing about ourselves other than our full back line is there to be cleaned out. Joey has got into an awful habit of attacking a ball Paul Murphy is underneath and mullering him. Lennon slow as a boat and takes as long to turn. Disappointed with him in the air as well considering that should be his strength. Only other concern was Larkin looked well off the pace but to be expected in his first game back.

Positives: Murphy majestic in the corner. Half back line dominated as we expect them to. Mick Fennelly is still a God in the middle and didn't get injured. Lester was brilliant, as was Wally in the half forward line. And Jonjo was class as well.

No injuries, game under our belts - onto the next one

Buckley and Paul Murphy were excellent, JonJo Farrell had his best game for Kilkenny, happy with most performances. Thought Rob Lennon was fine considering he is not a corner back. Tougher tests ahead.

tobothehobo · 12-06-2016 12:16AM

blackcard wrote: »

Buckley and Paul Murphy were excellent, JonJo Farrell had his best game for Kilkenny, happy with most performances. Thought Rob Lennon was fine considering he is not a corner back. Tougher tests ahead.

Completely agree! I also think Michael Fennelly was immense but Dublin didn't show up in the second half. Hard to gage how we are going after that game

Realt Dearg Sec · 12-06-2016 12:43AM

tobothehobo wrote: »

Completely agree! I also think Michael Fennelly was immense but Dublin didn't show up in the second half. Hard to gage how we are going after that game

Agree. Dublin played the exact gameplan that we expected them to and we plucked then asunder. With only one forward really clicking we completely negated their short passing gameplan that they hadn't the skill to execute anyway. Dotsy revealed some weaknesses that we need to sort out but today was a walk in the park, a quick half time talk and they never looked back. Dublin are gone back a fair bit, not our problem but we needn't think we learned much from that. Very interested in galway now...

Bonniedog · 12-06-2016 01:24AM

Congrats.

Dublin were as bad I've ever seen them.

Desperate sh1t.

Cornerback1 · 12-06-2016 01:41AM

JJs Left Hand wrote: »

Decent win. Dublin were pathetic. They need to get rid of Cunningham as their style of hurling is shambolic.

We learned nothing about ourselves other than our full back line is there to be cleaned out. Joey has got into an awful habit of attacking a ball Paul Murphy is underneath and mullering him. Lennon slow as a boat and takes as long to turn. Disappointed with him in the air as well considering that should be his strength. Only other concern was Larkin looked well off the pace but to be expected in his first game back.

Positives: Murphy majestic in the corner. Half back line dominated as we expect them to. Mick Fennelly is still a God in the middle and didn't get injured. Lester was brilliant, as was Wally in the half forward line. And Jonjo was class as well.

No injuries, game under our belts - onto the next one

Just back from game. Agree with the above. Thought Murphy was excellent in both halves..really attacks the ball at pace. Thought Larks was quiet and a bit off the pace but he'll be right for the Leinster Final.

I was watching the communication between Eoin and Joey and it was good this time. Joey held the ff off legaly to ensure Murphy controlled the high ball and cleared well. Far more communication than against Clare but I still think a higher standard team could score a few goals against us.

KKCATDownUnder · 12-06-2016 04:47AM

Pretty good result putting all things into perspective . Great second half although Dublin didn't get going in the second half at all.

Congrats to JJ Farrell who had a wonderful game and 1-5 from play , so credit where credit is due, brilliant return. I've posted many concerns of his performances in the past but he proved me wrong today. well done. Hope you continue play like this , might just the performance you needed .

Onwards again

dubcat51 · 12-06-2016 08:56AM

Good performance last night should bring us on a tonne.half back line are the best in the game.mick fennelly a colossus in midfield. Paul Murphy brilliant.
Thought Murphy really sharp in goal and Rob Lennon good for first championship start.larks off the pace and Colin fennelly can do better. Really impressed with Walters work rate and physicality. Lester not as good as he has been in the league and blanch field and kelly didn't get on the board when they came on.really loved the reception the lads got coming out at the start of the game and when larks and mick fennelly came off.great respect shown to great servants for kilkenny. Ever since we were written off in 13 the supporters starting with that great night in nowlan park v tipp have really bonded with this team.also great to see 15 on 15 hurling.

citykat · 12-06-2016 09:05AM

KKCATDownUnder wrote: »

Pretty good result putting all things into perspective . Great second half although Dublin didn't get going in the second half at all.

Congrats to JJ Farrell who had a wonderful game and 1-5 from play , so credit where credit is due, brilliant return. I've posted many concerns of his performances in the past but he proved me wrong today. well done. Hope you continue play like this , might just the performance you needed .

Onwards again

This shouldn't be a surprise given it was in effect Dublin's 'third' half. I had to marvel at their 'warm-up' routine and how elaborate and exhausting it was. You'd have to wonder to whose benefit are these warm-ups? Is some highly paid coach trying to justify his retainer? One particular routine involved nearly twenty players covering practically their entire half of the pitch criss-crossing at near full speed and ultimately trying to score a goal. It all ran like clockwork and looked impressive. The only problem was when it came to the match, there wasn't one movement like it during the game.

IanVW · 12-06-2016 09:18AM

dubcat51 wrote: »

Good performance last night should bring us on a tonne.half back line are the best in the game.mick fennelly a colossus in midfield. Paul Murphy brilliant.
Thought Murphy really sharp in goal and Rob Lennon good for first championship start.larks off the pace and Colin fennelly can do better. Really impressed with Walters work rate and physicality. Lester not as good as he has been in the league and blanch field and kelly didn't get on the board when they came on.really loved the reception the lads got coming out at the start of the game and when larks and mick fennelly came off.great respect shown to great servants for kilkenny. Ever since we were written off in 13 the supporters starting with that great night in nowlan park v tipp have really bonded with this team.also great to see 15 on 15 hurling.

Didnt see much 15 on 15!! What game were you watching?? Dublin played with 2 inside

citykat · 12-06-2016 09:29AM

IanVW wrote: »

dubcat51 wrote: »

Good performance last night should bring us on a tonne.half back line are the best in the game.mick fennelly a colossus in midfield. Paul Murphy brilliant.
Thought Murphy really sharp in goal and Rob Lennon good for first championship start.larks off the pace and Colin fennelly can do better. Really impressed with Walters work rate and physicality. Lester not as good as he has been in the league and blanch field and kelly didn't get on the board when they came on.really loved the reception the lads got coming out at the start of the game and when larks and mick fennelly came off.great respect shown to great servants for kilkenny. Ever since we were written off in 13 the supporters starting with that great night in nowlan park v tipp have really bonded with this team.also great to see 15 on 15 hurling.

Didnt see much 15 on 15!! What game were you watching?? Dublin played with 2 inside

They almost went 15 on 15 in the first half. One of the full forwards played closer to the half forward line. Presume they were trying to stretch the KK FB line. Poor reflection on Dublin management in the second half though. Once Kilkenny pulled away they pulled Treacy back into a man-marking role on TJ. Bizarre stuff. Looked like damage limitation more than anything else.

IanVW · 12-06-2016 09:34AM

citykat wrote: »

They almost went 15 on 15 in the first half. One of the full forwards played closer to the half forward line. Presume they were trying to stretch the KK FB line. Poor reflection on Dublin management in the second half though. Once Kilkenny pulled away they pulled Treacy back into a man-marking role on TJ. Bizarre stuff. Looked like damage limitation more than anything else.

Yeah it was shocking stuff from Dublin in the second half!! Awesome stuff from kk overall though! Makings of a good final:)

unrealtime · 12-06-2016 09:50AM

If Dublin didn't have the non-nationals they could not put out a team that would be competitive in any way. Dublin hurling seems to be going back to what it was.

I imagine success in football has something to do with it.

mountgomery burns · 12-06-2016 10:47AM

Not trying to stir anything here, but Farell was the only man inside the 21 for a good portion of the second half from what I could see.

I counted there at the end at least 8 men in the Kilkenny 21 or just outside when preventing a goal, certainly outnumbering the Dubs.

Is it fair to say that Cody will adapt the numbers at certain points in the game to suit their targets at that point in time? When they need to score, they'll push up a bit, when they need to defend they'll drop men back a bit deeper?

Topcat32 · 12-06-2016 11:57AM

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Not trying to stir anything here, but Farell was the only man inside the 21 for a good portion of the second half from what I could see.

I counted there at the end at least 8 men in the Kilkenny 21 or just outside when preventing a goal, certainly outnumbering the Dubs.

Is it fair to say that Cody will adapt the numbers at certain points in the game to suit their targets at that point in time? When they need to score, they'll push up a bit, when they need to defend they'll drop men back a bit deeper?

It seems like everybody sees different things, maybe influenced by what they would like to have seen, but I was standing behind the goal and it looked to me like Kilkenny always at least had 2 men in the full forward line in the 2nd half and usually 3, as they were attacking for most of the half and our half back line was dominating, the forwards stayed in a traditional structure, apart from the last 10 minutes when the game totally lost its shape.

JJs Left Hand · 12-06-2016 12:27PM

Do people think Cody is standing on the sideline sending Dempsey in telling everyone to sit back inside our 21?

60 minutes into the game, lads getting tired so Dublins short passing started to get them space in their half as the forwards aren't able to chase as hard. This causes the half back line and midfield to drop 10 yards to stop the ball going over their heads and leaving them stranded. This causes the half forward line to drop deeper. Lads chasing Dublin defenders carrying the ball up the field are then out of position and are too tired to get back into position for the puck outs or the clearances. Domino effect causes any shape to go out the window. This is where the tactics talk is over-thought in hurling for me. The game is so fast that by the end of a really tough game if your players are still working hard it's near impossible to retain a shape. So while people think we've tactically set up differently for me its just the players trying to see out the 70 minutes in the least damaging way possible.

Cornerback1 · 12-06-2016 12:37PM

citykat wrote: »

KKCATDownUnder wrote: »

Pretty good result putting all things into perspective . Great second half although Dublin didn't get going in the second half at all.

Congrats to JJ Farrell who had a wonderful game and 1-5 from play , so credit where credit is due, brilliant return. I've posted many concerns of his performances in the past but he proved me wrong today. well done. Hope you continue play like this , might just the performance you needed .

Onwards again

This shouldn't be a surprise given it was in effect Dublin's 'third' half. I had to marvel at their 'warm-up' routine and how elaborate and exhausting it was. You'd have to wonder to whose benefit are these warm-ups? Is some highly paid coach trying to justify his retainer? One particular routine involved nearly twenty players covering practically their entire half of the pitch criss-crossing at near full speed and ultimately trying to score a goal. It all ran like clockwork and looked impressive. The only problem was when it came to the match, there wasn't one movement like it during the game.

I was down at that side watching them. It was very complicated. I looked at Kilkenny and it was the simple 3 on each side with them pucking the ball hard and fast...touch, touch, touch every couple of seconds. The Dubs touched the ball every 20 secs in their routine. Then the 'coach/trainer' would blow a whistle and then they'd all do a piece of the Activate warmup. Then they went in for 5mins, then came out again. Not sure what that was about.

Kilkenny keep it simple but appropiate.

Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 2 **MOD NOTE POST 1***

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Kilkenny GAA Thread Part 2 MOD NOTE POST 1*