Do you have any sympathy for George Best?

Royale with Cheese

Mr.Nice Guy wrote:

Such compassion on this thread. Truly moving.

Just why does George Best deserve our compassion?

Mr.Nice Guy

Dr J wrote:

Just why does George Best deserve our compassion?

I can't answer that for you. I can only speak for myself.

Töpher

Personally, it is sad to see a fellow human being in this situation, but I have no extra sorrow because of who he is.

At the end of the day he has brought this on himself, it can happen. I feel sorry for his family, as they must be aware of the opinion of the masses being that he is a waste of a liver and he took somebody elses chance of life and ruined it.

I do not feel sorry for him because of his actions, but I get no joy from his demise.

d22ontour

After trawling through this thread i can only come to the assumption that no-one here actually knows an alcoholic.Pighead i actually thought most of your posts were decent on soccer until the crap you spewed here as for the retard that is canis lupus you seem to know feck all about alcohol so until you do why bother trying to post about things you have no comprehension of.

Guy:Incognito

Nala wrote:

Someone else probably died so he could have a new liver..

I'm sure if they didnt die beforehand they are well and truely dead now seeing as they would have given up their only liver. :-)





yes I realise what she meant

Red Alert

if somebody else gave me the gift of a new anything, i'd do absolutely everything i was told to, and if that meant no drink or whatever then so be it. his behaviour disgusts me, only slightly more so than his 'friends' who seemed to congratulate him on his behaviour. i just hope there was no other suitable recipient who would have enjoyed the new liver responsibly.

Jonny Arson

This thread has proven to me what I've always thought about Irish people..... most of us are selfish, uncompassionate '' human beings.''

Alcoholism is an addiction and an addiction is a proven psychological disease/illness which is also infulenced by biological and social factors.
Some of you ''people'' seem to believe that alcoholism is something that you choose. Yes you pick up the bottle but you don't choose to become addicted to it.
He's been an alcoholic for years upon years. With an illness like alcoholism many people can't simply click their fingers and give it up.
We are all vulnerable to addictions. God help some of you if you get addicted to drugs, gambling or alcohol.
Don't forget as we are seeing with George right now alcoholism kills. How no one can have any sympathy and compassion towards a man struggling to live is appalling. Tells me alot about people in our society.
I wonder what some of your attitudes would be towards people with another psychological illness like depression? Some people with depression kill themselves you know. So you'd have no sympathy towards someone who ends their own life because they ''chose'' to do so? Obviously alcoholism and depression are different illnesses but their results can be equally as tragic.

There's things about the way George lived his life that I don't have much sympathy towards him for like the way he treated some of his close ones. However I've no doubt alcohol was a prime reason as to why he could be such a volitle person at times.

George will ALWAYS be a hero of mine. I'm deeply saddened by what's happening and I fear over what might happen. All I can do is say prayers for George and keep my fingers crossed that he'll pull through.

I'm disapointed but not shocked by some people's attitudes towards George's troubles. Everyone has a right to an opinion but some people's opinions do show a huge lack of compassion and thought which is something that badly lacks in our society. There is a narrow minded stigma towards alcoholism and it has to stop. We have got to help, understand and give these people hope (rich or poor) instead of shooting thme down and saying it's all their own fault. Alcoholism is on the rampage in our country. It's an incredibly serious issue since we have kids as young as 12 drinking cans every night of the week. We need to think and develop understanding because it's evident to me in our society and culture that it's perfectly acceptable to drink alot of alcohol but it's not acceptable to become addicted to it.

Silverfish

-ism
suff.

1. Action, process; practice: vegetarianism.
2. Characteristic behavior or quality: puerilism.
3. State; condition; quality: senilism.
4. State or condition resulting from an excess of something specified: strychninism.
5. Doctrine; theory; system of principles: Darwinism.


A disease is something you contract.

Alcoholism is, as far as I'm concerned, self-destruction.

People with diseases rarely choose to contract them. I know my sister and mother did not choose to have cancer, and its not like they were told 'You have to stop doing x, y and z' and chose to ignore that advice.

Plenty of people have recovered from alchoholism. It can be done. I've watched some of my family members do it. Alcoholism is not a disease, it is a weakness. I do have some sympathy for alcoholics. I would like to see them recover. I wish them well.
But to ignore the repeated advice of doctors, AND to choose to spend their money on alcohol instead of a cure, is a weakness. So, no, I don't have much sympathy for someone who drank their way through two livers, when so many have given up before this point in the past.

funky penguin

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

This thread has proven to me what I've always thought about Irish people..... most of us are selfish, uncompassionate '' human beings.''

So you must be selfless and compasionate to be a human being?

You rightly say that everyone is entitled to their opinion but you also say it should be compasionate? A persons opinion is their own, compasionate or not.

(I also see the irony in arguing your opinion with this statement....)

Maguined

To all those who posted complaining that those who do not feel sympathy towards Best "do not understand alcoholism" etc please post their qualifications. just because someone does not automatically agree with your opinion does not mean they are any less qualified. you have no proof that your own qualifications or experiences with alcoholism is vastly superior to those with no sympathy towards Best so it is just arrogance to assume so.

Some of you ''people'' seem to believe that alcoholism is something that you choose. Yes you pick up the bottle but you don't choose to become addicted to it.

Alcoholism is not a disease. they choose to have it. eveyone knows the risks of drink and drugs and so picking up the glass etc is accepting the responsibility that you may become addicted. someone who drinks ten pints then gets into their car does not "choose" to run someone over but it is still their responsibility because no one forced them to drink ten pits etc. Best did not choose to become addicted to drink but he knew it was a possibility and as such has to accept the responsibilty for his actions.

Again as other posters have commented Best was given a second chance and still ****ed it away, he is an extremely selfish man. i pity any human being in such a disgusting situation but that does not mean i close my eyes to the simple fact that there is no one to blame but himself and his choices probably ****ed over another human being who could have put a much better use to that liver. i do feel sympathy towards his family as i always have, i feel sorry that someone they loved caused them so much pain through his own selfish behaviour.

Best is worse than your common alco as because of his fame he acquired a liver an ordinary man in his condition would probably not get. Also he had the resources available to him to make quitting easier than for any other pperson. most people are not fortunate enough to be able to take X amount of months off work and sign themselves into some rehabilitation clinic for the rich and famous.

Laguna

No, I have no sympathy for alcoholics. The man was granted a new lease of life with a liver that could have gone to someone else who would made better use of it. Just because he was a footballing legend, people seem to give him more leeway than the average piss head you see on the side of the street.

The above poster (Mikaboshi) beat me to it

Mikaboshi wrote:

Alcoholism is not a disease. they choose to have it.

I couldn't have put it better myself, I think it's a cop out when people argue alcoholism (and gambling) is a disease, it's an addiction.

Cancer is a disease - People don't choose to get it, it happens to them.

Alcoholism is not a disease - People choose to pick up that pint/shot.

The Sweeper

If George Best got in whatever flash motor he now drives, drunk off his bonce, lost control of his car, mounted the pavement and killed a mother and her two small children, do you think "It's not my fault guvnor, I have a disease, it was the alcoholism made me do it" would be a credible defence?

WhiteWashMan

Seraphina wrote:

totally agree, no one else with a history of drinking like his would have been given a liver transplant. he got it because he was rich and famous, and someone who would have appreciated it probably died for lack of a liver.

****in disgraceful i think, i have no sympathy.

actually, in order to get a liver, he would have had to have passed the same series of tests as any other patient.

he passed those tests as any other person who would get one would have to.
therefore, he didnt 'rob' a liver from anyone.

he just happens to be in the public eye. the other thousands of people who get liver transplants and yet fall off the wagon again tend to not be in the public spotlight.

Seraphina wrote:

he got it because he was rich and famous, .

not true. he got it becuase he needed one.

Seraphina wrote:

and someone who would have appreciated it probably died for lack of a liver.

now that is just pure speculation and conjecture. almost dramatic...

Seraphina wrote:

****in disgraceful i think, i have no sympathy.

i actually do have sympathy for him, in the same way that i have sympathy for any person who is slowly dying from something they cant control.

i think its a shame that he has come to this. the man was a footballing genius, and absolute legend on the field and has influenced generations of young footballers, and entertained millions of people.

i think perhaps many people are far too critical of others.

galwaydude

wish him all the best and hopefully he will pull through and if he does he needs to stay of the drink for good. He was one of the best footballers of all time and rightly so and thats coming from a liverpool fan!!!

Maguined

WhiteWashMan wrote:

i actually do have sympathy for him, in the same way that i have sympathy for any person who is slowly dying from something they cant control.

in what way exactly does he not have control ? who is forcing him to drink ? this whole concept that people are not in control of their actions and that alcoholism is a farce. there is nothing making him keep drinking apart from his own lack of willpower. yes addictions are horrible abd can be hard to break but it is completely in the control of the addictee, what magical powers do all the people in the world who do kick addictions have that Best and others like him do not ?

patchouli

Mikaboshi wrote:

it is completely in the control of the addictee, what magical powers do all the people in the world who do kick addictions have that Best and others like him do not ?

"Others like him". I don't think it is helpful to just lump everyone together like that!
Some people have problems around alcohol, yes. But not everyone is the same. For some people, it is of course going to be a bit more difficult to give it up than for others.
It's like any other illness/condition/affliction. There are degrees of seriousness.

In relation to alcoholism specifically, I think that if a person doesn't/or isn't persuaded to give it up by mid-life(30's, 40's), then it is much less likely that they will give it up in the autumn of their lives.

People don't seem to be aware that an addiction/disease - whichever - consists of stages, a time line.
It is not as black and white as some people are trying to make out.

By the way, I have no interest in soccer and don't know much about
George Best's own condition, apart from his story appearing on the
news over the years.

I voted "Yes". I do have sympathy for him. Alcohol seems to have taken him over body and soul.

Maguined

what is wrong with the statement "others like him" ? why can't i lump all people who have not kicked an addiction into a category of peole who have not kicked an addiction ? Yes some people find it harder than others but that in no way makes it impossible for anyone to kick an addiction or justify those peole who do not kick the addiction. again there is no magical powers involved just human willpower, Best was also fortunate to be in a financial position to aid him kicking his alcoholism that most addictee's are not so fortunate to be in.

Yes if someone has not kicked an addiction by the middle of their life than it makes them less likely to kick it ever, again this does not diminish the responsibility of kicking the addiction to be theirs alone.

Alcohol seems to have taken him over body and soul.

How has it taken over ? he has willingly abused his own liver and then someone elses. his choice, his responsibility,his consequences.

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

scojones

Of course I have sympathy for him. He hardly sat down after he got his new liver and said "right, lets see how long this one lasts". He knew he shouldn't drink but could not stop. Speaking as a person who has had several family members die from surosis (how do you spell it?) of the liver brought on by alcoholism, yes, I do sympathise for him and his family more so. Alcoholism is a hard addiction to kick. Fair play to anyone who can tackle it, I know I certainly couldn't.

Red Alert

exactly! he seemed to be almost glad to be back on the drink.

galwaydude

look lads alcoholisim is a disease and the fact is george best is on his last legs. He has to stop drinking first and foremost but thats the hardest part. He has to want too, no point in everyone telling stop george!!! But it can be done as have a few experiences with family members close to death in the past and they turned their lives around.

galwaydude

well if he is more fool him. Cant see him last the next 6 months if he gets out of this if he doesnt stop drinking his life away.What a waste!!!

Kablamo!

Stekelly wrote:

To all the people who say thay have no sympathy and he brought it on himself etc etc, do you or anyone close to you smoke? If so if your father/mother/brother/sister etc got cancer, would you have any sympathy for them or when they announce it would you say "ahh sure thats you own fault, stop whinging"? Whats the difference.

I'm sure people with an alcoholic in the family or among the people they know will be able to see that its not a deliberate thing, its a disease at worst, an addiction at best.

of course i feel sympathy for george best.
fair enough; he's been stupid and selfish in wasting his second chance of life.
he couldn't help hitting the drink again.
he's made his bed and has to lie in it; how to say.
how anyone couldn't feel sympathy for him is beyond me- he's going to die from drinking; and he's more or less at this stage powerless to stop it.

Silverfish

Its not a disease.

Cancer is a disease. Aids is a disease. Can you catch or contract alcoholism? No? Hence the name alcoholism not Alcohol Disease.

He has to stop drinking first and foremost but thats the hardest part. He has to want too, no point in everyone telling stop george!!!

I believe if a child with leukaemia, or any other disease can stop everything, and you have no idea how much they have to give up - and they have to do it themselves - then a very wealthy grown man should have a bit more willpower, and a bit more sense.

One of the steps with alcoholism is accepting you have a problem. From everything I've seen of George Best, he's parrotting that he has a problem....but he hasn't accepted it. If I was being hit in the face constantly with newspaper headlines telling me I'd battered my partner, drank myself stupid, and I was going to die if I continued, then I'd sort the problem.

Scraggs

THe man is dying.... ok so it may be partially due to his alcoholism... but he is still a human being [also a football legend]. Yes i have sympathy for him and his family as i would with anybody in that situation!

scojones

Silverfish wrote:

Its not a disease.

Cancer is a disease. Aids is a disease. Can you catch or contract alcoholism? No? Hence the name alcoholism not Alcohol Disease.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcoholism

"Alcoholism is a primary chronic disease with genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors influencing its development and manifestations. The disease is often progressive and fatal. It is characterized by impaired control over drinking, preoccupation with the drug alcohol, use of alcohol despite adverse consequences, and distortions in thinking, mostly denial. Each of these symptoms may be continuous or periodic."

Dave!

Scraggs wrote:

THe man is dying.... ok so it may be partially due to his alcoholism...

lmao! There's a slight chance of that alright

Silverfish

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=alcoholism

http://www2.merriam-webster.com/cgi-bin/mwmednlm?book=Medical&va=alcoholism

I think we could do this all day.

Anyone can put anything they like on Wikipedia. Lets see them do it with Dictionaries and medical journals.

xzanti

Silverfish wrote:

Its not a disease.

Cancer is a disease. Aids is a disease. Can you catch or contract alcoholism? No? Hence the name alcoholism not Alcohol Disease.

Alcholism is an allergy to alcholol, any AA worker will tell you that.. it may not be a disease like cancer but its still an infliction on a persons life... I do feel sorry for him, Im sure if he could have foreseen the outcome of his actions he would not have had that first drink all those years ago, he would have kept his career, his wife and his health... I doubt he woke up one day and thought "Im bored with my life, maybe ill destroy myself with drink and hurt all the people who care about me in the process"

Silverfish

xzanti wrote:

Alcholism is an allergy to alcholol, any AA worker will tell you that.. it may not be a disease like cancer but its still an infliction on a persons life...

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/alcohol-allergy/AN00818/FORCESSL=false&

Still not a 'disease', imo.