Clean Air/Congestion Charging set to be introduced by 2030

MOH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948666#Comment_121948666

Because we don't have any actual journalists left in the country

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949295#Comment_121949295

By exactly who will they be restricted? The Green Industrial Fascists? Sorry boyo, they'll be gone for a decade and more, come back in 2035.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949506#Comment_121949506

Yeah I hope. What a terrible future I yearn for.

Except that what I hope for is actually being legislated for. What you hope for, is some kind of anti environmentalist populist takeover in which case we'll all suffer from worse air, worse water, worse congestion, poorer health etc etc etc

daheff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949280#Comment_121949280

go down the quays in rush hour. tell me how many bus lanes are not congested.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949617#Comment_121949617

You literally spoke to someone... were you trying to trade in a BEV when you spoke to him, or was he trying to sell you one of the ICE cars he has on his forecourt and spinning you the story he wants you to hear?

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949625#Comment_121949625

Electric busses and trains are much much much quieter than diesel ones. And are emission and noise free when they're stopped at bus stops and traffic lights

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949626#Comment_121949626

I have had plenty of Passats over my life, also Golfs. Big VW fan.

None of them have come close to the performance or speed of an electric car. Plus it didn't cost me 50k to buy

Over that 10 years the cost in repairs and fuel you put into the car will be how much? Im not saying to sell it by the way, the best thing for environment is to keep old cars on the road.

But in terms of driving experience a Passat wouldn't touch my car. Test one and come back to me about "milk float"

I seen a mechanic on another page posting that electric cars would run out of battery because you have to use the wipers in Ireland 🤣 the internet is full of mechanics making videos and dont understand the difference in a hybrid and an electric car.

I also drive a nice big Q7 diesel and guess what, that cost a lot more than 50k and a couple of years later it is worth probably less than half. It's called depreciation, all cars have it

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949638#Comment_121949638

Nobody needs a 7,000 sq ft house. Then you are complaining about trying to heat it

Slapping a big 2,000 sq ft extension onto the side of it is not protecting the building either.

daheff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949680#Comment_121949680

go listen to the scrapes of metal of the dart & luas as they go by. they arent quiet at all. Dublin bus barely use their BEV buses.

and if your suggestions are right, they'll not be stopped for long in congestion. so noise emitting most of the time.

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949391#Comment_121949391

Leafs are basically worthless after 10 years or so. A lady on our road bought one brand new 2012 reg and after around 8 years the battery was only doing 60 klms to a full charge and she just bit the bullet and sold it for pennies as the new battery cost was prohibitive.

Here's a milk float that would have cost circa 33k out the door with only 89k miles and it's as good as done 10years later. I can guarantee the battery doesn't do anything like 160klms sold as seen also might as well be throwing money into the toilet. A diesel equivalent with 89k miles would be good for another 10 years at least if looked after.

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/leaf-ev-2013-sold-as-seen-needs-nct/36338056

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949625#Comment_121949625

Moving 100 people in one bus v 100 people in 100 cars? which is better

Plus if they get the rollout of low emission buses then it will make it even better

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949681#Comment_121949681

I'll trust what a professional mechanic and what friends in the trade say about milk floats over some random lad on the internet thanks very much. I've driven electrics many times also and the high end ones like Tesla's are nice to drive alright but the cheaper ones like the leaf or that MG yoke are complete trash and feel cheap. Hey you do you and i'll do me 👌

highdef

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949695#Comment_121949695

True, I don't need a 7,000 sq ft house (or a 5,000 sq ft, for that matter) but it's the size it is. I didn't design or build it. We could all live in studio apartments but I would imagine few posters here do so it's likely that most of us live in dwellings that are bigger than they actually need to be.

There was originally a smaller but fully rotted extension at the side of the house that was completely off limits so the new replacement in its place was designed in a manner that would complement the existing structure and was given permission by all the official bodies.

Finally, I'm not complaining about trying to heat it. From the outset I was aware that it would cost more to heat than my previous home. My complaint is that the government (with the Green Party being the main pushers) is continually diminishing the ways that my house can be heated in an efficient and affordable manner for the nature of the building but yet they fail to provide viable alternatives despite it being the same government who will not permit me to have more energy efficient glazing.

Kiteview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949664#Comment_121949664

So you are saying we need to double or trouble the amount of bus lanes on the Quays?

eightieschewbaccy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949723#Comment_121949723

Driving a Cupra ATM and love it, I've had an Audi owner drive it and they loved it. This more just seems like certain people not accepting the direction things are going.

I've heard similar said about plenty of technological leaps. When digital cameras started becoming a thing, people said film was better and maintained that line as it became the norm. (And early on it was better for the record)

Overall adoption of EVs will be slower as costs normalise. But they're very much the way things are going.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949782#Comment_121949782

Biggest issue on the Quays is the amount of cars using the bus lanes, similar across Dublin

For the success of bus corridors etc the bus lane enforcement will have to be implemented.

opinionated3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949672#Comment_121949672

No I wasn't trying to trade in a bev. I will be going to upgrade my wife's car in the coming year and was trying to decide between full hybrid or full electric. ( We have solar panels at home so I'm trying to figure out what's best for us). He was merely stating facts about that particular dealership and he's actually a personal friend so no, he wasn't trying to pull a stunt on me. The second hand ev market is in the gutter right now. That's not too say it won't improve sometime in the future but right now if I'm mad enough to drop 50000 on a new car,I won't be losing my hat on an EV. We have no public transport near us to get us to our workplaces and I certainly ain't cycling in to do a full shift in our glorious weather ☹️.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949723#Comment_121949723

Im not trying to convert anyone but first off you called them a milk float based on someone working as a mechanic. Now you claim to have test a Tesla which is one of the fastest and most responsive cars on the market, across any fuel. Doesn't really add up does it?

Buy whatever you want, I personally don't feel the need to slag off another car because of what fuel is uses. I love my diesel and I love my electric. People are far far too hung up on fuels thse days.

In terms of mechanic, already gave an example. We also recntly had some "in the trade" on radio talking about having to keep electric car batteries at room temp. So lack of knowledge isn't restricted to people outside the "trade"

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949651#Comment_121949651

All parties in government and opposition will be doing similar stuff.

Climate targets need to be met or huge fines imposed on Ireland, so unless we leave the EU this stuff will be enforced regardless of who's in power.

rowantree18

I live at one end of the Dart line and work a few stops from the other end. I work 3 x 13 hour days per week. It takes me approx 45-50 minutes to drive door to door as I'm not driving in peak traffic. In theory I could take the Dart- 1 hour 30 minutes , plus 15 minutes walk my end and 10 the other. So, rounded off - 2 hours each way -= a 17 hour day versus a 15 hour one. Not until they literally ban cars will I stop driving.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949681#Comment_121949681

Yeah, I've driven around all my adult life in petrol cars that some other guy spent 50k+ to buy new (adjusted for inflation) that I bought used for way less than 20% of the purchase cost, and still got multiple years of comfortable reliable driving with very little depreciation

Depreciation has always been a thing. It's crazy to me how many anti bev fanatics there are out there today who think depreciation only applies to electric cars.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949840#Comment_121949840

High end cars always have huge depreciation. Normally when you talk about electric cars they will pull out the eTron or a Porsche and say "look at the depreciation", totally ignoring the initial depreciation on a similar combustion car in that price bracket is high as well.

In reality some of the electric cars for years have been overpriced. But that was because of demand and supply, like any product the price is high if they can sell high. But the same happened on diesels a few years ago and never seen the outcry we see now.

The new prices of cars have levelled off, an electric car now is similar to a combustion version if buying new so then its a simple decision of pick the fuel that is best for you. Don't see why people get so defensive about someone deciding an electric suits their needs perfect

In reality, every household with 2 cars and have access to a home charger are silly not to have one of them as electric. IMO anyway. The saving on fuel etc is incredible, also for all these famous "long distance" trip people claim to make you can have a second combustion car if required. In my case the electric is used for at least twice the mileage the diesel is, all the short trips to shops/sports/etc etc which rack up all the miles it is used for. PLus no need to wait on public system and a full tank every morning to start the day

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949835#Comment_121949835

but you are one person. This is mass movement of people from cars to public transport. You will always have the odd person who it doesn't suit

The reality is majority of people are 9-5 Monday to Friday and hence why you have rush hours in cities. You cannot implement policies that will cover every single person in Ireland.

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949835#Comment_121949835

i've always looked for jobs that are within a reasonable commute by public transport or ones that i can cycle to. if i was living in greystones i'd never consider taking a job in sutton, or wherever it is you need to get to, too much of a trek.

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949835#Comment_121949835

I think that people are viewing this as a "Ban on Cars" when it isn't at all.

If people wish to drive their vehicles through certain areas then there's a charge attached to it, that's all.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949835#Comment_121949835

Here's the thing though, when you're driving all you can do (apart from drive) is listen to the radio or a podcast. If you're on the dart, you can listen to the radio, read a book, sleep... An hour driving is not the same as an hour on public transport. I used to get through a book a week when I got public transport to work. I started cycling instead, which was great, but my reading fell off a cliff as a result.

Kiteview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949798#Comment_121949798

The simplest way to do that on the Quays is to ban all non-bus (or bicycle) traffic from the Quays during peak travel times. That will sort out the bus lane problems on the Quays.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121950019#Comment_121950019

I dunno. This idea of snoozing and relaxing on rush hour public transport - have ye actually USED the services at those times?

I have. At it's worst my commute involved a commuter train from Blanch to town and then a DART back out and a shuttle bus from my stop to the office. Very often the DARTs would be delayed or not show ("leaves on the line" was always my favourite), or because of this I'd end up stuck at Pearse for an hour until the train home arrived.

You'd almost never get a seat on the morning Commuter train or DART (until it got further out) and while this wasn't so bad on the way back, it's hardly what I'd call relaxing and conducive to reading or snoozing.

Even before this when I was solely reliant on buses, the amount of time lost to waiting for services that never arrived was massive - my record was watching 14 number 39 buses head up towards Ongar in an hour but not one of them came back! This for a service that was supposedly every 5-7 minutes.

Public transport works if you have a very simple A-B journey and live on a main route with frequent (in theory) services… but forget about it if there's any changeovers involved or a non-core route.

Besides, I personally have always gotten MORE done in the car. I can join calls on Teams or catch up on other calls en-route (I'm an IT manager) - things that aren't possible or appropriate sitting in a crowded train carriage or bus.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121950200#Comment_121950200

The reason public transport isn't more door to door is because of settlement patterns - people's houses and places of work are too spread out.

Why? Because it's assumed everyone has cars. Car centric development has ultimately gotten us here to this situation where so many people have no option but to drive and sit in traffic for 90mins a day. Until we start to prioritise PT it will always be this way.

magicbastarder

have i slept on public transport? yes, a lot. i used to get the luas from bride's glen to stephen's green in the afternoon and would usually be asleep by the time it reached sandyford. and the great thing was as stephen's green was the terminus, there was no danger of sleeping past my stop. decades ago, i used to get the 10 from terminus to terminus (NCR at phoenix park, to UCD) and had a similar experience.

it's very rare that i've been on teams calls where people have joined from cars. i think it's frowned on officially where i work (i work in IT in a large multinational).