Will Andy Farrell get the adoration Jack Charlton got?

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211561#Comment_121211561

For young Irish stars rugby gives you a route to professional sport while having the ability to stay in Ireland and at home which gives you a higher success rtae to get to the top of the game compared to flying off to England and losing your support systems

More and more talented kids have copped this on and hence they are picking rugby, not all of course but more

as you said the fact I can go into Galway and bump into Connacht and Ireland stars with the kids mean more kids will start to play as well, Connacht have done an excellent job of going around schools etx

go back 20 years and you wouldn’t see Connacht jersey outside of Galway on match day, now you see kids in Mayoand all over wearing. Not as big as soccer orGAA but it’s growing

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211653#Comment_121211653

As I said, I suggest you do some research

No idea what the Lions has to do with the topic either.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211606#Comment_121211606

So, you weren't pulling the piss.

I'd talk to somebody of your feelings of inadequacies.

Had to laugh at impression of "florid language". It did amuse me though. Carry on.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211653#Comment_121211653

Go to bed.

fergiesfolly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211606#Comment_121211606

20 years???

Was it elites that filled Lansdowne in 82 and 85?

I can tell you it wasn't

gormdubhgorm

In my opinion he would have to win it to get that. Charlton took over a team that was a shambles unorganised. A few good players but no structure, poor defenders. Then Charlton got in lots of players on the Granny rule/parents rule Aldridge and Houghton from Oxford the same day was the famous one. In doing all this Charlton got Ireland to 8 in the world in a competitive worldwide sport, a team that used to be a laughing stock. At best they used to get moral victories.

Ireland are now the number 1 rugby team in the world thanks to the influx of players such as Lowe and Bundi Ake etc which has strengthened Ireland's pool beyond recognition. Exploiting Residency rules etc, 'project players' etc.

But Ireland are no1 in a sport where there is only about 10 competitive teams (in the whole world) at a push. In order for Farrell to get the adoration that Charlton received (make them exceptional). Farrell has to either win the world cup or at least narrowly fail in a final.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211718#Comment_121211718

Back when Charlton got Ireland to the quarters how many competitive team could have won that WC?

my recollection is it was either Italy, Argie or West Germany and West Germany form minute one looked like they would win it, which they did

Fats forward to today and international soccer is now in a steep decline and soccer clubs are far superior. Just look at England, they have been reduced to scrapping with Ireland for players. It’s dominated by a small number of countries which are the same 4-5 you can name and have been the same since1990

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211718#Comment_121211718

Regarding residency and project players, Ireland is pretty good with homegrown talent. New Zealand, Wales, Italy and Scotland all have more players born abroad or trained abroad.

Also, soccer is pretty much the same. Maybe 20 competitive teams, and the rest got hockeyed in most world cups. A quick look at wiki tells me that only 8 teams have won the Fifa world cup since 1930..

Fr Tod Umptious

These threads are all the same.

Rugby people trying to claim their sport is popular.

It's not.

It gets big numbers for internationals and Munster or Leinster European games.

But after that the support just isn't there.

The numbers going to All Ireland League games are terrible, the numbers are in the hundreds.

Whereas with GAA thousands attend club games week in week out.

And even though the LOI doesn't get much support there are millions of soccer fans in this country following UK and European teams.

Rugby support just has no depth.

Padre_Pio

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211776#Comment_121211776

Nobody is claiming that Rugby is more popular as soccer and GAA in this country.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211653#Comment_121211653

They don't? At a loss.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211708#Comment_121211708

I agree. Lucky to get 500.

Progress though.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211751#Comment_121211751

Not just a question of winning the soccer, there is/was way more depth in the soccer than the Rugby. That is just a fact of life. For instance, England failed to qualify for the world cup in 1974, 1978, 1994 for instance. Would a 'tier 1' Rugby side fail to qualify for a world cup? Soccer has depth, teams have to earn qualifying it is not handed to them.

I still maintain Farrell has to win this or come damn near to winning it to get real adulation. Let's be honest previous Irish Rugby sides have massively underachieved finding ways to shoot themselves in foot. Which is a major reason why Ireland has never progressed beyond the Quarter Finals in a Rugby World Cup.

WesternZulu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211708#Comment_121211708

As a few of us have said rugby’s support is shallow beyond the national team and perhaps the provinces in more recent times.

Where were were the crowds watching Leinster and Munster back in the day?

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211841#Comment_121211841

But people are claiming it's more popular than it is.

It's not very popular with the general public.

The RWC has been ongoing for a month, Ireland are recognized as real contenders, but I've yet to see any flags or bunting showing interest in it.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211869#Comment_121211869

Really what's your point?

We're you there? Do you support rugby?

WesternZulu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211891#Comment_121211891

I wasn’t there. Evidently an awful lot of people weren’t there either.

Hank the DJ

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121208607#Comment_121208607

It's 20% 7 out of 35 weren't born in Ireland

MadYaker

I think it says a lot about Irish soccer fans that they’ll spends hundreds going to the UK to watch premiership teams and sing British chants but they won’t walk down the street in their own hometowns and spend a few quid to support their local team.

lbunnae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211864#Comment_121211864

They don't need to qualify hahaha

ottolwinner

I feel like my original question lit a match for some of ye.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121212063#Comment_121212063

You are incorrect.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121212063#Comment_121212063

They do have to qualify, but it will be rare that a 'tier 1' nation has to do so.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121212177#Comment_121212177

Finishing in the top 12 of the previous RWC "qualifies" you.

So it's probably impossible that a tier 1 team fail to qualify.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121211877#Comment_121211877

It would be a very localised support for the Rugby the likes of Kiely's pub in Donnybrook. Or the Sin Bin pub in Limerick etc. But in those areas Rugby is top dog.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121210615#Comment_121210615

When I lived in Dublin 5 for a while, I was always surprised by how little overlap there was between rugby and GAA, both players and supporters. The GAA lads would watch the six nations etc, just about, but Leinster rugby had very little traction.

In rugby, the province of Leinster starts in Donnybrook and ends in Foxrock

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121212185#Comment_121212185

Ireland did have to qualify once.

gameoverdude

Wrong. Maybe look where the Leinster players are from.

Great loi representation for the soccer team.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121212185#Comment_121212185

I heard mention that there was a tier 1 team that looked like they would struggle.

Anyway back to the question at hand will Farrell get the adoration Charlton received? As I said maybe if he wins it or becomes near to winning it.

But on reflection Jack Charlton had a larger than life personality, does Farrell have a personality to draw people in outside of their core support? I am not sure Farrell does, seems like a very wooden and dull character IMO. You need personality to get adoration, I think anyway.

So will Farrell win or come near winning a world cup AND turn into a bit of craic? An engaging personality? Nope not possible Farrell is just dull, very dull. He might get adoration from the rugby fraternity for even passing the QF mark. But it would be impossible for Farrell to get the pride, love, and affection that Charlton got. Part of this was because of Charlton's personality he was at ease with the public. Also when Charlton was successful Ireland was on it's arse, the only thing of pride Ireland had to speak of was U2. Anyone waving the Irish flag prior to that was probably only a Republican. The Irish psyche is in a lot different place than it was in Charlton's day.

Plus the other factor is the vast majority of those with a Rugby background are 'well to do' barring maybe Munster. Those from a well do background don't need a lift in the same way the Charlton lifted an impoverished and unconfident Ireland. Well to do demographics already have that confidence in themselves, they don't need to 'believe' it is almost expected.

K-9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121209162#Comment_121209162

Limerick always had strong rugby clubs so Earls wouldn't be unusual at all, it just was the outlier in being a working class sport in that city, you just wouldn't get that in Dublin, Cork or Belfast. I know that has changed significantly over the last 20 years and rugby is spreading to traditionally strong GAA areas.

Willie Anderson is great craic talking about how the Irish team has changed, Ulster used to be the strongest province by far in the 80s and early 90s and loads of representation on the Irish team. As he says now, you'll have a load of Leinster lads in the scrum now, with 1 token Prod!

That Donal Lenihan voiceover does my head in. They really need to get to a Semi final at least or that ad will really grate.