Question for engineering or creative minds please

Andrea B.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170256#Comment_121170256

In fairness some other posters have suggested similar too regards anglepoise and microphone arm up above in other posts.

Just started looking at gas spring monitor arms and they would likely cover somes axes.

If we envisage a pint glass in a cradle at lip level, it needs to raise at back, with fulcrum close to and below glass rim, to be drunk from.

Ideas?

Ginger. Hate asking, but you said it is a lifting issue.

But could you envisage having strength to squeeze a rubber bulb (think blood pressure type of old) lying on a table connected to tube, to tilt glass each time?

Thinking this way, as air is a good way to dampen and absorb shakes.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170421#Comment_121170421

Hi i have very poor grip. My illness is progressive so I could lift a pint with one hand and then started needing two hands but as my arms get weaker the glass feels heavier and heavier.

Andrea B.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170633#Comment_121170633

Ok I am sorry. I really think we can work something.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170660#Comment_121170660

It is what it is. I've lived beyond the expectancy but I'm still eating very well and I intend to enjoy food and drink while my swallowing is good 😊

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170660#Comment_121170660

Maybe a foot pedal instead, or a air bag that you could press an elbow down onto?

I'm thinking something that doesn't require a lot of fine motor control but still allows for precise control

Maybe even just a long handle would be enough, it's got a lot of leverage so doesn't require significant strength, and also a large movement of the handle translates to a smaller tilt of the cradle and glass, so easy to control

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170881#Comment_121170881

I like your idea of the handle that doesn't require fine motor control. I don't suppose you have a sketch in your head?

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121170954#Comment_121170954

I have it in my head but I'm afraid to put it to paper given my drawing skills 😂

I'll see what I can do tomorrow

But if you imagine something like a monitor arm with a cradle on it like @Andrea B. described, then just a long handle coming out the bottom

You put the glass in the cradle, then when you want a drink you rotate the arm to bring the glass towards your face then push the lever at the bottom to tilt the glass and take a drink

When you're done you just release the lever and the glass tilts back to vertical, and push the arm out of the way so it doesn't obstruct the TV

This is probably a good example of the kind of arm I'm speaking about

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B09963RQ6Y?ref_=cm_sw_r_apan_dp_FZ8KC2JJJA92X09E0904

The "elbow" pivots around the vertical axis, so it's fairly easy to rotate the cradle to and from you when you want a drink

funkey_monkey

@Ginger83 - there is a charity in the UK called Remap:

https://remap.org.uk/

They have a branch in Northern Ireland. They may well have encountered this before and either have something for you to purchase or to 'donate' for or get sketches for building yourself.

Maybe you should contact them? They might even know if there is an equivalent in Ireland. Or a user here could get in contact for you and build it.

How it works out and you get something sorted.

kirving

With the best will in the world to those who have suggests, messing about with Arduino's and stepper motors to generate a usable, safe device is fraught with problems. Power supplies, chargers, batteries, waterproofing, etc. Off the shelf is the only way to go.

The cheapest way to get something to tilt a glass, in my opinion would be to buy a second hand camera gimbal.

You need to be able to make at least two movements.

1) rotate the glass about it's rim which the gimbal can do, with a modified mount for the glass rather than camera. Some even have remote controls.

2) move the glass horizontally to come closer to your mouth. For this I think the best option might to be used a spring loaded, but tall pole. Like what is used on some signs to allow them to comply with the wind. It would move in an arc, yes, but would be simple, and the camera gimbal would keep the pint level as you pulled it toward you.

For a trial, you could rent a DJI gimbal from a number of different photography shops around the country. It would then need some testing, in order to position the pint correctly (ie: as neutrally buoyant as possible, while rotating about the rim)

https://www.mpb.com/en-eu/product/dji-rsc-2/sku-2087309?utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=EU%7CGoogle%7CBuy%7CPmax%7CNew%7CPmax%7CAll%7CAll%7CIE%7CEN&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIzP_Owb7PgQMVSeLtCh3qkw7YEAQYASABEgLbavD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

To be honest, this is a prime time of year too, to approach any nearby engineering colleges, who I'm sure would be more than happy to help out with 3D printing, some machining, and give someone a project out of it, and importantly help others in future. Where are you based?

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121171905#Comment_121171905

I'm in Cavan but not too far from Meath

Capt'n Midnight

https://hackaday.com/2023/09/27/hackaday-prize-2023-an-anti-tremor-handle-with-no-electronics/

mechanical anti-tremor cup handle. see pdf pages 14-16

Another gimbal - repurposing a handheld camera stabilizing gimbal to hold a soldering iron might not hold a pint

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121171769#Comment_121171769

Hi i have been in touch but unfortunately they cannot help

funkey_monkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121185499#Comment_121185499

Did they say why - geographical reasons or they had nothing suitable?

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121185771#Comment_121185771

They are only in the UK but also said insurance wouldn't let them make something capable of lifting hot liquids.

Fair point

funkey_monkey

Sod that.

I hope some of the engineering minds on here can get something sorted for you.

Have you tried contacting Guinness directly?

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121186640#Comment_121186640

I thought someone was joking but I will email them.

funkey_monkey

Keep us updated.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121186768#Comment_121186768

I have emailed Guinness and Diageo so you'd never know

Turbulent Bill

Would you consider a non nitro-headed stout (like O'Haras in bottles) as an alternative to Guinness? Might make it easier to have the pint in a fixed position, with a straw for drinking.

If your fine motor skills are degrading, I think anything that involves positioning or leveraging the pint might become very frustrating over time. Lots of spilled beer and swearing, neither due to the football! Powered options will be overly complex and still not replicate the supping-a-pint motion. Something simple like a straw might help you retain both beer and some autonomy.

Best of luck with this, really hope you find something that works for you.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121195822#Comment_121195822

I would be willing to try some. MND can be incredibly frustrating.

StupidLikeAFox

Keep it simple with one of these op - straight into the mouth.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153167#Comment_121153167

A stepper motor is not complex, and I don't think anybody said it was. The degrees of and movement in the whole movement are what makes it complex. Lifting and rotating at the same time. The movement pattern needs to adjust as you drink a pint, so weight sensors would be needed and something to run angle calculations.

Not incredibly complex. Certainly doable. But the very definition of an overengineered solution imo. IMO the best solution is the one that designs out the engineering requirements.

 I can't lift it with my arms anymore and because you drink through the head it's not possible with a straw.

This the is only part that triggers the Guinness being different to a lager. I'd question how much you need to lift and tilt a glass to drink Guinness enjoyably. As lifting and tilting the glass is what is adding the complexity.

Hijpo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121195951#Comment_121195951

You don't need to lift it. His wife pours his pint, place the glass in a cradle that holds close to the rim and pivots at that point at a height level with his mouth. The only thing that needs to happen is a tilt.

You could even program it to do slow incremental steps, with the previous step being the new wait position so its not being raised from 0 before the next drink is taken.

There is nothing forcing it to be over engineered unless you throw in unnecessary things like weight sensors and kinematics. If anything it's probably the cheapest and most future proof solution given the progressive nature of the condition.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121195958#Comment_121195958

The post I was referring to as overly complex to was talking about a lifting arm that brings the glass to him. The counter balanced cradle was my suggestion for a simpler solution.

Ginger83

Just a little update

Diageo got back to me saying that they have not encountered my problem before and intend to explore this to see if they can assist with a solution.

Anaki r2d2

There is a company in Dublin called Dolmen design. In Gaslnevin area. They designed the nitro surge device, the zero pub tap and the very high end home tap. The home tap tilts the glass.

Got lots of Red Dot design awards. They also have products designed for users with multiple different life challenges.

They have lots of industrial designers/software/mechanical , who would if willing (or allowed to) be able to sort this into a solution in no time at all.

I wish I was smart enough to help or had contacts to point you to.

But _No harm in asking. Guinness is good for you.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121230233#Comment_121230233

Thanks for this. I will email them and they might be willing to help

mickdw

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121230450#Comment_121230450

I guess diageo will have been straight on to them if they have genuine intention to help.

kirving

I've been having a think about this, and it's really got to be something as basic as possible, ideally without a power supply.

There are three actions at minimum when drinking a pint.

1. Lifting the glass (linear)
2. Bringing the glass close to your mouth (linear)
3. Tilting the glass - but the centre of rotation needs to be at the rim, not the bottom of the glass.

The below concept is by no means a final design, but just to show that actions 2 and 3 could be completed reasonably well by a simple linkage mechanism. The idea is that the pint glass could sit in a hole in the red plate, so that the rim was approximately at the pivot point.

The height of the unit allows for some linear travel, before the tilting mechanism kicks in. It could be actuated by pulling the left side green upright, toward the drinker. The mechanical disadvantage of the lever woul mean that a gas spring would probably be needed to add some force to lift the glass. It would also need to be very securely mounted to the floor.

mickdw

That is the basis of what is needed.

If the angled bar was slotted at the top pin, it would allow an amount of movement towards the drinker before tilting at all. The slot could easily have adjustable travel.