Question for engineering or creative minds please

Ginger83 · 24-09-2023 7:48pm #1

Hi all. I have motor neurone disease and am slowly losing the use of my arms. I enjoy a pint at home and I can drink 99% of things with a straw.

The issue is when I'm having a Guinness. I can't lift it with my arms anymore and because you drink through the head it's not possible with a straw.

I was wondering if one of you guys had any ideas on something to lift a glass and tilt it? Look I'm not looking for a terminators robot arm and probably won't live long enough to invest substantial funds into it but I just want to enjoy a pint.

Thanks

Rows Grower · 24-09-2023 7:55pm

Try a cold pint bottle of it, there'll be no going back.

Ginger83 · 24-09-2023 7:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152025#Comment_121152025

Would I not have the same problem?

Will_I_Regret · 24-09-2023 8:08pm

If you could jimmy up some kind of glass holder and bought an Arduino with a motor. You could set something up like that.

0ea887f4a1f2ee03aabf6ec3ab9951482f9b9db9.jpeg

Hijpo · 24-09-2023 8:33pm

You could use a stepper motor with some kind of winch gear that winds on a length of string attached to the bottom of the holder to tip the glass. Plenty of basic downloadable arduino projects as demos for easy implementation.

Simple switch changes the direction and enables the output.

Ginger83 · 24-09-2023 8:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152230#Comment_121152230

Thanks for your reply. Would you have a link to a suitable project?

the_amazing_raisin · 24-09-2023 8:55pm

The range of movement when you drink from a glass is actually pretty complicated when you think about it

You don't pivot the glass around the middle, you pivot it around where it meets your lips so you don't pour it down your chest

So you'd want a sort of cradle to hold the pint sitting on a frame. The cradle would hang from a hinge on the top corner of the frame and that's where you drink from

Probably want it a bit lower than your head so you bend over a bit to drink it. Bit odd but easier to avoid spillages

The cradle would have a string at the bottom to lift it up and pour when your mouth is at it

You could use motors, but it'd be tricky to get the movement and controls well calibrated

A simpler solution might be to use the macro movements of your body that you still have a reasonable degree of control over

A handle that you could put your arm or foot into which pulls the string to lift the glass should be easier to control when you want to take a drink

Or perhaps a pedal like an old sewing machine table

You probably want to fine tune the size of the pulleys so a larger movement of your arm/leg moves the glass a smaller amount. Removes the need for fine motor control

Could also have an electric version rigged to a single button. Press button to lift glass, release and it drops down again. As you drink more, hold the button longer every time to tilt the glass a bit extra

Ginger83 · 24-09-2023 9:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152333#Comment_121152333

Yes I'm losing the finer motor movements. I can get my hands around a glass but after a lift or two it feels like lifting a bag of coal

Ginger83 · 24-09-2023 9:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152094#Comment_121152094

Thanks for your reply

Hijpo · 24-09-2023 9:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152255#Comment_121152255

https://youtu.be/SdNtf6v8AZI?si=70bbd3D06NpwVf7n

A very quick look gave me this.

Code and component links in the description as well. Stepper and driver board.

Gives an explanation on how steppers work, probably don't need to know that but could be interesting.

mickdw · 24-09-2023 9:34pm

You have the ability to hold a glass for a drink or two. That gives a good idea of what you movement and strength is like at the minute.

Surely for now, and to keep it as simple as possible, all you need is something to hang the glass in front of your mouth. With pivot about 1/6 down the glass. It should then take alot less strength to just tilt the glass while resting on your lips.

JIdontknow · 24-09-2023 9:42pm

A more simple solution could be a sort of A frame. If you sit in a chair with sides (arm chair, wheel chair, kitchen chair) a triangle shaped piece with a pivoting cup / glass holder at the top. That allows you to tilt the triangle towards your mouth (supported on the arms of the chair so your only muscle action is pulling the simple light frame towards your mouth) but ensuring the glass is upright because the holder pivots. Then something perhaps a cord or simple mechanism to pull that pulls from towards the bottom of the holder tilting the glass for you to drink.

MrMusician18 · 24-09-2023 9:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121152549#Comment_121152549

I think this is the best solution, stepper motors and arduinos are too complicated.

A pair of A frames supporting a crossbar with a drink cradle hanging from this. Attach a string and pulley system to bring the drink to the face and another cable and pulley to rotate the drink cradle to tip the glass.

It should be possible to create this from stuff available at the likes of a woodies.

Padre_Pio · 24-09-2023 11:27pm

Keep it simple.

Motors and arduinos are too complicated.

Take something that'll hold a glass, like one of those flexible goose neck arms, and make something that will pivot the glass around the rim. Use a lever,or wheel you can push with your arm to actuate the pivot.

As you lean in to take a sup, you just push the lever to tilt the glass.

Now, if you did want to get fancy, I'd hack a nitrosurge into a straw, so whenever you took a drink through the straw, the nitrosurge would give you a bit of a head.

CatFromHue · 25-09-2023 12:32am

How about a modified straw? One that has the end of the straw below the water line but floats so that a small hole above the water line could let some of the head in with each sip.

I'm thinking if you cut a straw in half lengthways, flatten it out so you have a long narrow rectangle and then cut that into 3 or 4 smaller pieces. You could tape 1 or 2 of these pieces towards the end of your drinking straw and fold the ends of the new attached pieces so they're perpendicular to the drinking straw. They're mini floatation devices. Then above where the waterline is pierce the straw so you've a small hole in the head of the Guinness.

Obviously there's a lot of trial and error here to get it fully functional.

I'd a quick go at it and it is possible to get something that floats and keeps the small hole above the water line. A constant diameter glass will help here too as in the one I did the floatation devices got stuck as the glass narrows towards the bottom.

lostinsuperfunk · 25-09-2023 12:52am

I am thinking something like an Anglepoise lamp mechanism might work for you. It would take away the heavy work of lifting a full pint glass, you would just have to guide it and tilt it. You could replace the lamp head with a ring to sit a glass into. A full pint glass is a bit heavier than a lamp head, so if you used an actual Anglepoise I think you might have to replace the springs with stronger ones.

There is a variant of the mechanism which uses a counterweight instead of a spring which might work better (see the wiki link below). One problem is that the weight of your glass will decrease as you drink it, so it would get harder to control as it empties. It might help to use a heavier than normal glass so that the liquid makes up a smaller proportion of the overall weight of (glass plus liquid). The base might also need to have additional weight to keep it stable.

You can buy Anglepoise or similar lamps secondhand on adverts or ebay.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balanced-arm_lamp

Someone has even built a mechanism in Lego: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcBl9cXVKaU

Mellor · 25-09-2023 1:02am

Some very over compilated solutions here. Stepper motors, winches, etc.

A much simpler option would be a simple harness and pully with a counter balance. You could basically make the pint glass close to weightless so you can move it.

You shouldn't actually gulp the head with a pint of gluiness though, you'll get tiny amounts, but your mostly tilt the glass to get the black stuff underneath. When you get to the end of good pint, the head is mostly still there - and a large part of the reduction is due to bubbles bursting.

To keep it simple, I'd try it with a large gauge straw. When you stick it into the pint, you'll take up a bit of head too, Remove and reinsert every sip.

electricus · 25-09-2023 1:08am

I was thinking along the same lines but with a studio microphone arm. Something like this

https://rode.com/en/accessories/stands-bars/psa1-plus

They’re counter balanced so can be moved with minimal effort and hold a 1kg mic at the same angle when articulated.

A glass might work with the right clamp, adjusted for easy tilt, maybe based on this:

Hijpo · 25-09-2023 2:22am

Chap said he was losing the use of his arms, at some point he's going to need something to move the glass for him.

Small bit of difficulty now getting a stepper motor rig going will last him the duration of his illness. He could be in a situation where boom arms and A frames won't work after a week.

Not sure how people see a stepper motor and an arduino as being overly complex, they are teaching this stuff to 10 year olds. Schematics, hardware and software is all laid out.

Also, apologies for bypassing your story OP, very sorry to hear you are not well.

Andrea B. · 25-09-2023 6:57am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058315239/question-for-engineering-or-creative-minds-please

Hi Ginger.

Sorry you are going through this.

I am inherently lazy, with an engineering mindset, so sometimes come up with simple solutions to allow me feed my laziness😁

When you have your pint, are you sitting at a table like that in a kitchen, with a solid chair, or couch or mobility chair/wheelchair, or other?

Is it always in the same location in home? As in, if it was a pole fixed to table/floor/ceiling/wall...

I feel that we may be looking at something with a very rigid superstructure.

I have discounted anglepoise frames, because the moments from a pint in motion and counter forces from mouth of a drinker, just seem to be a recipe for a mess.

electricus · 25-09-2023 9:22am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153167#Comment_121153167

Of course, I was suggesting the arm as a starting point for other ideas. I had a quick look and it looks like a motorised/ robotic versions of what I was thinking already exists, like this (no pricing but probably expensive):

https://www.medicalexpo.com/prod/assistive-innovations-bv/product-108105-786629.html

Hopefully the OP can find something that works.

Padre_Pio · 25-09-2023 10:01am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153167#Comment_121153167

It's not complex to move a stepper with arduino.

But the human factors are very difficult. Tipping the glass at the right speed to get a sip, but not too much.. sometimes you want a gulp, sometimes you want a small sip. The liquid in the glass moves at different speeds depending on the tilt angle etc etc.

Andrea B. · 25-09-2023 7:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153531#Comment_121153531

Nice find.

If I knew someone working for Guiness/Diageo, I would flag this worthy cause as opportunity to spend some spare change on helping Ginger out.

Alongside the kit you have identified, I have no doubt that a big corporate could search for a solution.

Ginger83 · 25-09-2023 8:58pm

Thanks for all your replies. A little more information that might help.

I have MND 8 years. I can hold my hands around a glass however I would not be able to hold a pen or toothbrush. I use an electric wheelchair so I have 2 options when having a pint. I can sit in my wheelchair at the kitchen table and see the tv or I can go to my room where I use an old laptop on my lap, my Ryanair table as I call it. I have no problems drinking liquids and I have very good head movement.

I don't think I drink enough Guinness to ask about sponsorship haha

Slightly Kwackers · 25-09-2023 11:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121156710#Comment_121156710

As a matter of interest how do you get the Guinness into the glass?

The care and steadiness to prevent a vesuvius would present the problem I would have thought?

I well recollect that after a heavy weeks "celebrating" in my more stupid days, not wanting to call attention to the two handed steer the pint pot to my mouth, I developed the snatch and launch approach. I didn't generally miss my mouth.

I suppose it's maybe a shade different, but nonetheless, I would find the initial filling of the glass near impossible without a degree of strength and accuracy. If I were served with a bottle and an empty glass my drinking would have been a tad hit & miss :-(

Could you already have the answer?