World's hottest day since records began

Shoog · 15-07-2023 1:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854448#Comment_120854448

Feel what you want, that's not up to me. Your correct though that much of the economic activity we take part in is a problem. I don't have an easy answer but I do see the issue. None of this is easy but why should we expect it to be.

I would be working on ways of saying sorry to our children for all the good it will do them.

cj maxx · 15-07-2023 1:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120850400#Comment_120850400

It is lovely in coffee

Thelonious Monk · 15-07-2023 1:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854509#Comment_120854509

Yeah I'm not even vegan but once you go oat in coffee there's no going back

Jizique · 15-07-2023 1:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854473#Comment_120854473

Children are the worst, not only is population growth the biggest contributor to emissions but they really have no interest in walking to school daily, doing without any summer travel, and they shell out alot of money disposable fashion.

cj maxx · 15-07-2023 1:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854522#Comment_120854522

Im not vegan or even veggie but it is lovely

Thelonious Monk · 15-07-2023 1:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854531#Comment_120854531

That's the fault of the parents though

cnocbui · 15-07-2023 1:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854204#Comment_120854204

I am talking about long term global climate change. In fact I have a fascination with really long term climate change on a geological time scale. The months and decades being referred to were not measures of the extent of climate events, they were referencing the time scale on which the climate altered dramatically.

Glaciation events have characteristics that are the complete opposite of what you suggest: They are not regionally localised, and they are not short term. We are currently in an inter-glacial period within an ice age that is probably on-going. The only thing short-term during this ice age is the incredibly brief length of interglacial periods, such as the one we are in and possibly most of the way through.

We are at 0 on the time line. The last glaciation period was not regionalised nor was it short lived. Suggestions that current CO2 levels and temperatures are abnormal for interglacials and the incredible catastrophism that is based on these assertions, seem somewhat questionable. In terms of the big picture, the claims seem exceptional..

Climate change is a thing, and there is nothing new about it and it can change a lot, very rapidly. Claims about hottest day on record and oceans boiling are nonsense.

Count Dracula · 15-07-2023 1:53pm

Probably due to the El Nino and then compounded by Solar Flare activity causing the Ozone layer to deplete.

Greece is always boiling in July, but if they don't get a decent northerly wind blowing , they are know as Meltemi winds, look it up children, things will heat up big fooooking time.

If the above factors form at around the same time it will give most environmental armageddonists a substantial opportunity to correlate a metre long tube of ice plucked from the northern tundra of Norway, with some other random contemporary weather anomaly and say this is reason why we are going to slaughter 200,000 Irish Beefstock, dramatically increase taxation on anything related to energy and thus VAT on that cost.... to also disrespect every other human's existence on the planet by constantly enforcing their virtue signalling opine in their direction, via threatening them with the destiny of the human race every time they throw a fag butt out their car window.

tom1ie · 15-07-2023 2:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854473#Comment_120854473

😂 I bet your great craic at parties!

Economic expansion is always going to trump enviromental health and that’s just the way it is- until economic expansion is impeded by enviromental health.

Thelonious Monk · 15-07-2023 2:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854573#Comment_120854573

Were they planning on not slaughtering any more cattle or something?

Shoog · 15-07-2023 3:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854573#Comment_120854573

Why this El-Nino, why not one of the thousands of others we have seen. Whats the underlying trend when you take the El-Nino out of the equation. Solar flares come and go and we have been through one of the quiets solar cycles ever experienced and yet global temps marched steadily upwards.

Whataboutarry strikes again.

Shoog · 15-07-2023 3:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854567#Comment_120854567

You will know then that the pre-industrial temperature trend would have put us back into an ice age in about 8-12K years time (yes it was on a steady decline). Care to guess when the post industrial trend puts us back into an ice age ?

We know most of the factors governing ice age progressions at this stage (the Milankovich cycle and continental drift) but current global trends are not what the Milankovich cycle predicts.

Shoog · 15-07-2023 3:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854761#Comment_120854761

The problem as I see it is that most people want someone else to do their thinking for them and their are plenty of people willing to take advantage of that tendency.

Gaoth Laidir · 15-07-2023 3:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120848211#Comment_120848211

Which crops are failing more frequently? Here's wheat, for example. Don't see any drop there.

Where's the megadrought in Spain? Their own met service tool shows no such event. Overally pretty average.

https://monitordesequia.csic.es/monitor/?lang=en#index=spei#months=4#week=1#month=6#year=2023

.Donegal. · 15-07-2023 4:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855049#Comment_120855049

Spain was under a severe drought but I think they had a bit of a reprieve around May.

This is from early/mid April.

MADRID (AP) — Drought now affects 60% of the Spanish countryside, with crops like wheat and barley likely to fail entirely in four regions, the main Spanish farmers’ association said on Thursday.

Spain’s long-term drought is causing “irreversible losses” to more than 3.5 million hectares of crops, the Coordinator of Farmers’ and Ranchers’ Organizations (COAG in its Spanish acronym) said in a new report.

Some cereals need to be “written off” in the prime growing regions of Andalusia, Castilla La Mancha, Extremadura and Murcia, and are likely to be lost in the driest areas of three other regions, according to the report. In the wine-growing region of La Rioja, farmers were in the exceptional situation of “having to irrigate cereals ... when normally they are never watered,” the association said.

The lack of available water was further impacting the ability of farmers to irrigate corn, sunflowers, rice and cotton, likely leading to reduced sowing of these crops over the summer, it added.

Three years of very low rainfall and high temperatures have put Spain officially into long-term drought, the country’s weather agency said last month. Last year was Spain’s sixth driest — and the hottest since records began in 1961.

Spain’s agriculture ministry has called a meeting with farming representatives on Wednesday to discuss the crisis. COAG will plead for immediate financial relief, it said.

“This has been the most expensive planting season on record, and with harvests ruined or reduced by 60-80%, there will be many farms that will have a very tough time surviving if they don’t receive an injection of capital,” said Javier Fatas, head of water and the environment for the association.

In addition to crop failures, ranchers will struggle to feed cattle due to dried-up pasture, the farmers’ association further warned. This will also be the third consecutive season without honey for beekeepers, as bees lack vegetation and flowers to feed from in the mountains due to a shortage of water.

Anyway it goes on and on. The farmers coordinator says droughts are nothing new in Spain but the problem is that in recent years we have also suffered from a lack of precipitation against the backdrop of a noticeable increase in temperatures.

tom1ie · 15-07-2023 5:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854904#Comment_120854904

No.

The problem is economic growth is incompatible with environmental health.

Economic growth is consumerism

Shoog · 15-07-2023 5:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855587#Comment_120855587

Entirely true, but to ask someone else what you should feel about something is an example of trying to offload your thinking. This is a massive problem since only by owning the issues can you hope to have an active input into there solutions. The public is far to passive mainly because they are living in a state of denial and there are plenty of people who would feed that denial.

As I said what you or anyone else feels about a situation is entirely up to them to decide - but they must base their opinions on the evidence not what they want to be true.

Thelonious Monk · 15-07-2023 5:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855049#Comment_120855049

Donegal answered already but

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2023-07-13/2023-heatwave-drought-wreaking-havoc-in-spain-as-temperatures-soar

cnocbui · 15-07-2023 6:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120854899#Comment_120854899

Milankovich's prediction of ice age cycles does not match with actual geological records. He predicted a periodicity of 41,000 years, but the measured period is more like 100,000 years. It's called the 100,000 year problem.

Your speaking with assurance about the actual timing of the start of the next glaciation period, as if it were fact, is not based on any established or accepted theory. The timing of glaciation events can not currently be predicted and is purely speculative.

A few years ago there was panic over the measured slowing of the Atlantic Meridian Overturning Current (AMOC):

"Concern grows over Atlantic Ocean ‘conveyor belt’ shutdown...But the effects of anthropogenic climate change have diminished the flow of this vast conveyor belt system, known as the Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation (AMOC), and recent scientific research suggests it may even be headed for collapse." and then in the blink of an eye, there's a new study claiming it may not be that simple.

By the way, that atribution of a slowing of the AMOC being due to anthopogenic warming is as much of a nonsense as claiming glaciation event timing is understood... because it's probably not slowing!

We see no significant AMOC weakening trend over the last 120 years.

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2021GL093893

And even the prevailing theory that melting ice slows or stops the AMOC, has been challenged:

"The problem," says He, "is with the geological climate data."

Though the climate record shows an abundance of freshwater that came from the final melting of the ice sheets over North America and Europe, the AMOC barely changed. So, He removed the assumption of a freshwater deluge from his model.

"Without the freshwater coming in making the AMOC slow down in the model, we get a simulation with much better, lasting agreement with the temperature data from the climate record," He says. "The important result is that the AMOC appears to be less sensitive to freshwater forcing than has long been thought, according to both the data and model."

https://phys.org/news/2022-04-ice-caps-ocean-current.html

So given the AMOC was thought linked to glaciation events, perhaps being causative, and that's it's clear the AMOC is not as well understood as thought, it's clear that there is not any great understanding of the mechanisms that presage glaciatiation.

cnocbui · 15-07-2023 6:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855327#Comment_120855327

It's all happened before - causes unknown - but thankfully we all know the cause this time, somehow...

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/this-summers-drought-is-europes-worst-in-500-years-what-happened-last-time-180980711/

Gaoth Laidir · 15-07-2023 6:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855640#Comment_120855640

No, not a journalist's bread-and-butter hyperbolic article, I mean actual hard data from the AEMet official drought-monitoring tool to put things in an historic context.

tom1ie · 15-07-2023 6:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855619#Comment_120855619

No again the public fully understand that the economy is based on consumerism.

The vast majority will not reduce there living standards for the sake of the environment.

Shoog · 15-07-2023 6:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855821#Comment_120855821

So we all have to live with the consequences .....

Thelonious Monk · 15-07-2023 7:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855789#Comment_120855789

well i'm pretty sure you don't believe in man made climate change so it's pointless talking to you, you people think you know better than everyone else

tom1ie · 15-07-2023 7:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120855900#Comment_120855900

Pretty much.

Look we aren’t gonna stop climate change nor make much of a difference to it.

Telling people they have to consume less and can’t buy the latest car or iphone or a new couch is not going to go down well.

Shoog · 15-07-2023 7:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120856018#Comment_120856018

At this stage I believe in calling climate deniers what they are .... ****.

tom1ie · 15-07-2023 8:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120856166#Comment_120856166

If someone doesn’t believe climate change is 100% caused by human activity are they a climate denier? 🤔

Shoog · 15-07-2023 8:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120856204#Comment_120856204

Thats not a characturization of what people state, no one who accepts climate science denies that there are natural components - the only people who need to present it as a position really don't accept that man is making any significant difference to the climate. They are deniers who understand that a position of outright denial is now a socially unacceptable position to state.