Do traditional hurling counties honestly want hurling to grow or stay as is?

gormdubhgorm

This thread is sparked by the furore that Donal Og created recently when making comments about the other code.

So I listened to his podcast the 'Hurling Nation'/Morning Ireland from two episodes - I wouldn't normally. On the face of it is tongue and cheek and a persona - a dictator/cult leader addressing the masses those in his 'nation'.

But I see it as giving Donal the opportunity to hide behind that premise and have a cut at everything he doesn't like, and can drastically talk Munster up. That seems to be the basis of it. 'No slow games in Munster etc'

But despite being a good analyst when on TV - hurling tactics etc. I was shocked by his sneering attitude to not only the other code, but hurling counties that are basically not Munster, KK or Galway etc.

How in the name of Jayus does that sneering attitude grow the game of hurling? And encourage other counties?

Yet on the other hand Donal Og 'claims' he wants huriing to grow. His answer is throw money at it. It doesn't seem like much of a thought out plan does it?

https://twitter.com/i/status/1518356596337819651

But this line that Donal Og is spouting above is incongruent with his sneering attitude when he talks about the games/counties on his 'Hurling Nation'. There does not seem to be sincerity to the man

Are the majority of 'traditional county' hurling people like this? Secretly happy with the status quo when it comes down to it? Honestly?

Are people like Liam Griffin who is (worried about the growth of hurling) the exception to the rule ?-

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-41042672.html

Liam Griffin - 2023 'I can’t say that hurling has come on greatly in my lifetime.' 

For many decades he has been going on about the growth and development of hurling - in contrast to Donal Og there is a real sincerity about the man IMO.

Brian Cody saw how an improving Dublin could be good for hurling well over a decade ago. And he was always quick to praise the development Dublin hurling did.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/hurling/2011/0418/278996-codyb/

Brian Cody 2011 -

 'I am thrilled to see the quality of hurling in Dublin and I would love to see every county playing the same quality to what they are playing.'

Again is Cody the exception to the rule?

Is the real traditional county view quietly happy with the status quo? A very small select club that has not changed much or does not look likely to change much ever.

Davys Fits

Im not here to debate Donl Ogs comments.

As a Clare hurling fan I can recall from a young age the devastation of being regularly beaten out he gate in big hurling matches. Decades later we are riding the crest of a wave and enjoying every minute of it. There is no easy route to top level hurling. It literally takes decades to move up to the top. My question is what are other counties doing for themselves in promoting hurling rather than turning to the so called top counties an blaming them for their demise. Ultimately there has to be a desire and love for the game and a genuine desire to promote the game within the county to make it happen.

What do you propose the top counties do? Is providing top level entertainment week in week out not enough to encourage it elsewhere??

I says

Look best way to develop hurling is group the top teams as is in Munster. And add the top three in Leinster KK, Galway and Wexford or Dublin. Have an eight team all Ireland series play 7 games league format. Top 2 or 4 into semi or a final. Relegate one team and promote JMcD winners.

leinster is nothing but arse boxing till the Leinster final. Munster still keeps the intensity with derby games. Who wants to see Offaly, Westmeath or Carlow/Laois get hammered and get nothing from it.

Until most county boards who favour football over hurling that’s the way it’ll be. It’s cheaper supply clubs with footballs that sliotars and helmets to get kids playing gaa.

County boards must do better.

CrabRevolution

The whole discourse about hurling is bizarre, every week the commentators try to outdo themselves with hyperbolic guff: "greatest game on earth, what a spectacle, classic Munster championship game for the ages etc." but then in the next breath will say hurling is on the brink of death.

I don't honestly believe Dónal Óg has much more than a boilerplate interest in hurling growing, nor is he obliged to have any interest in it really. I can reassure him that it's utter nonsense to think that Free to Air vs. GAAGO for 2 Munster Championship games will be the deciding factor in whether hurling grows or dies in Meath. It's punditry's version of "Think of the children" .

It's a complete red herring anyway; how come hurling didn't explode in strength countrywide 2 or 3 decades ago solely because provincial games went from almost no coverage to every game?

Gusser09

Donal og doesnt give a toss anyway. The more hurling is on tele the more he gets on the tele. That equals more money for him. He'd sicken the stomach of ye. He was a disgrace yesterday when questioned about his nasty tailteann cup comments. Wouldnt bother answering the question. Just wants to say what he wants and not be challenged. Arrogant. This is the man who downed tools during his career thus hurting the game he loves so much. All for money again.

Gusser09

And one question. What is the measurement used to decide if hurling is growing or not? Is it solely success or is it playing numbers and interest?

Take my county kildare. There are more youngsters than ever playing the game. We have new adult clubs come online this year because underage in those clubs has thrived.

I dont think the situation is as grave as some who have a vested interest would have is believe.

What about football in Killenny? Who is trying to promote that? Ffs. Some of these hurling lads need to be told a few home truths.

"Thats proper munster hurling championship" "Holy moses"

A good game yes. But some of the cliches, nicknames and commentators having sex with their microphones is laughable.

Mad about baa baas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120628762#Comment_120628762

All clubs in kilkenny participate in football league/ championship at all ages ...

Do all clubs in Leitrim/ cavan/probably 15 more participate in hurling league/ championship?

To answer the original question I think kilkenny are better than most at helping promote/ improve hurling in weaker counties..they regularly allow teams from kildare/ carlow to participate in kilkenny league/ championship at several grades underage

bucketybuck

Don't know much about Cusack, but I know he came across as a complete and utter pillock when Cantwell asked him about those comments.

If he represents the hurling fraternity then **** the lot of them.

Treble double

Hurling can be an enjoyable game to watch when closely matched teams go at it hammer and tongs and it goes down to the wire. But the guff out of the the likes of Cusack, Anthony Daly, Brendan Cummins etc. about it being the game of the God's and no other sport in the world to match it, would turn your stomach. They seem to feel the need to completely over egg it and it comes across as a bit of an inferiority complex. If they cut out all the guff and gave it straight good or bad I think it would be a more enjoyable experience for everyone. A good game of hurling is a thrilling watch but talk about its issues aswell, the huge scoring zone, lack of goals, diffulty implementing rules like the handpass and small number of elite teams etc. A balanced approach to analysis would garner more respect.

shockframe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120629311#Comment_120629311

Cusack is at times worth listening to but he made a right clown of himself with the jibes about Football.

Fair enough he adores Hurling and the culture and riverdance that go with it but equally so a vast majority of people across the country have the same passion if not more so for Football.

James O Donoughue said he wasnt bothered in the slightest about what he thought as he is enthralled by Football and doesnt need to go down slagging other sports to make a point.

Jamsie O Connor mentioned that he was at Clones last Sunday and enjoyed it thoroughly but nothing would top Hurling for him. He's always spoken fairly well on Hurling and even Football when I hear him.

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120628806#Comment_120628806

Kilkenny are the only county not to enter the championship.

I says

Having made a point earlier regarding the promotion of the game of hurling some of the comments here show football followers hatred of hurling. I can only conclude that football is played by people not skilful enough to play hurling. Gaelic football is a form of soccer using your hands.

This craic about KK not entering the football so what they’ve more clubs playing football than a lot of football counties combined have hurling clubs. The mandarins above in Croke park aren’t doing enough to promote hurling in all counties.

Mad about baa baas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120629543#Comment_120629543

This discussion has nothing to do with the promotion of hurling .feel.free to start another thread regarding football

Last thing I'll say is the senior county team in any code is not the only indication of its participation. Club/underage is where the vast majority of gaa is played

WesternZulu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120629668#Comment_120629668

Case in point about the way hurling followers go on. Can't speak about football without classing it as an inferior sport.

It really is off putting and obnoxious.

I think you'll find that it's hurling supporters who have a hatred for football far more than the other way around.

I says

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058297403/do-traditional-hurling-counties-honestly-want-hurling-to-grow-or-stay-as-is

The Munster council is not growing the game with them locking in the big five and no relegation. They then crib about Leinster sides eg. KK and Galway having an easy time into the AI semis. As I see it the Munster council and Munster final are holding back the development of the game. Get the top eight teams in the country into an AI series(with relegation). Then get the gaa to start heavily investing in coaching in the so called lesser counties . The kids school got a new coach who now does a mix of hurling and football with them. The last one wouldn’t do anything if it was any way wet. As a hurling man now living in a predominantly football county I see the way hurling is such a poor relation to football. Hurling is a hard skill to pick up it needs coaching and a lot of effort from co boards to promote it. It’s easier kick a ball and master than skill quicker than hurling. So coaching is vital to keep young people playing it and interested in it. I’ve mine in the garden everyday doing hurling drills and football drills, to keep them at it.

Christ evening teaching how to grip the hurl is a skill in itself get the kids to master that and you’re 90% of the way there. But if you’re in a football county that isn’t there because if the parents never played they can’t impart that knowledge. That’s why getting coaches out to teach that is important. Nobody trying to rob players from one code to another. People think they can pick up a hurl and hit a sliotar straight away,and when the can do it after a few minutes it’s given up on,you need plenty of coaching. It’s not a hard game once the basics are right. Coaching coaching coaching.

cosatron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120630629#Comment_120630629

great post. A super eight league format with the top four going into semi finals and bottom one getting relegated would be a thing of beauty and same format all the way down,start in may and finish up first week of september. use the league for your seeded position so that you will get a favourable draw.

dmakc

All things considered going forward, top 8 with 1 getting relegated gives a rotation of one of Dublin / Waterford / Wexford in the new Joe McDonagh. Would do great damage to the counties while any of them are kept outside for a year, and Westmeath / Antrim would never get a look in to the AI Series.

Current format is fine, you can't predict Wexford going bad for a couple of years and quickly alter the format. Who's to say in 5 years time, Galway, Offaly, KK, Dublin and Wexford aren't living up to this year's Munster championship.

Teams will inevitably have down years. Waterford were bad this year but until recently they were the only ones giving Limerick a game in Munster. It's fine as is. Renaming the Leinster championship is as far as I'd go on changes.

cosatron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120630763#Comment_120630763

The standard of hurling would increase in the joe mcdonagh cup with a top team being relegated. also do wexford not deserve to be in relegated this year with their poor showing same as waterford last year. It's perfectly acceptable to be relegated at club level but not at intercounty level is a bit hypocritical and is serving the elitist view again. the current format is flawed with 3 teams progressing to the playoff stage from groups of 5 and 6.

hurlaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120631384#Comment_120631384

But waterford won't be regulated since the play in the o so special Munster championship how's that fair

dmakc

While you can get relegated from Leinster, it's harder to qualify from Munster, for me that's a fair enough trade off considering the geographical / legacy limitations we're working under

cosatron

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120631487#Comment_120631487

its not fair and this is the problem, westmeath,antrim and wexford will be fighting for their lives on sunday and waterford will go to tipp without a care in the world. If waterford lose on sunday, they will be the only team to not get any type of a result in a game but yet won't be relegated.

hurlaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120631505#Comment_120631505

So a team that is unlikely to win asinine match this year and only won one last year gets to stay up because of geography that's insane

jacool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120631505#Comment_120631505

Just to be clear here. I am not having a go at you, but this comment is a sort of answer to the OP's question.

"legacy" is an English translation for "status quo".

Mad about baa baas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120631505#Comment_120631505

Is it that much harder ?1 septic team which then means 3 out of 4 qualify..if you can't get out then I don't think you have many reasons to gripe

hurlaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120631815#Comment_120631815

And last year there were 3 teams competing for 3 places

TAFKAlawhec

I'm from a county not normally noted for its hurling - Tyrone, and I'm not from a hurling background myself. However about 20 years ago, hurling was introduced to my local GAA club starting with some U10 indoor coaching, with an U14 team entered a few years later. It suddenly stopped , but was revived again a few years later thanks to the efforts of a few outsiders that had played hurling when they were young and we're now fielding teams from Go-games to U18 levels. While the majority of our players also play football for us, we have several players whom are also dual players playing football with their "home" club next door.

Some personal observations from my roving eye...

* Hurling in Tyrone at county level is arguably now in its healthiest state that it has been at least in my lifetime. The senior county team is playing at levels this year that it never did previously, while the minor team - which my club had several players on its panel - had a decent run out in the Celtic Challenge tournament.

* At club level, hurling has a fate similar to the highest levels of the intercounty championship whereby a "Big x" dominate and its difficult for others to make a breakthrough. The big two hurling clubs in Tyrone are Dungannon & Carrickmore, and other than the JHC those two clubs have won pretty much every top club title in the county for at least a decade now. There are at present five clubs fielding adult & youth teams as well as another five currently fielding at various youth levels, though it is a bit of a challenge beyond U14 at the moment with just four clubs competing at U16 & five at U18 this year. There's a lot of conflict for dual players in their teenage years being able to give enough time to both codes without also their education and other things inc. other sports like soccer. In saying that, the U14 league & championship has enough clubs to be split over two grades, giving the more middling & weaker hurling teams at that age level games which are not a completely foregone conclusion

* One thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet has been the running of the Táin Óg leagues that operate in Ulster, northern Connacht & northern Leinster which from speaking to some people involved have been very successful in keeping young players interested in the game by grading teams to their ability accordingly. Yes there are some fair distances to be covered when traveling to fixtures, but the games are in general competitive for most involved. It's alright saying to gather 15 boys up for a county league game in a county like Tyrone where there might only be a handful at most of other (established) clubs to play against, but if you're getting thumped by at least 40+ points in most games against them it's not going to keep those players interested. At least in the Táin Óg, that shouldn't be happening unless a club has been seriously misgraded, and as such the players involved are enjoying themselves more.

* Simply throwing money at facilities & coaching into normally non-hurling areas will not & will never work on its own. In most of Ulster, there is simply no legacy of the game which outside of the Glens of Antrim & the southern Ards peninsula is seen as a game played in (most of) Munster, south Leinster & a bit of Galway. There's no cultural element in these places for hurling to the same capacity the likes of Gaelic football has. The phrase "you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink" springs to mind - you may as well try and introduce them to Olympic Handball or Canadian Football in that regard. Also, guff like "it's de best game in de world boi!" and "football's a game for bad hurlers" just doesn't cut it when trying to convince boys & girls to try and take up hurling or camogie, especially in Gaelic football strongholds. The clubs outside of Ulster's small hurling heartlands that have been the most successful in growing the game in their locality never come out talking such sh*te, instead they sell the game on to young children & their parents in a way to actually make them interested in wanting to play, and that building a successful hurling club up that is able to last generations involves having a love for the game develop that will take a lot of time & people to be involved, rather than be something that flies-by-night thanks to what was in place driven by one or two headstrong people that eventually burned out (which has been the case in the past Tyrone several times) where they eventually cannot take everything on, on their own, and there's no one else to fill the voids.

Yeah, I'd say both hurling & camogie in Tyrone are in a heck of a lot of a better position than they were ten years ago, when there was essentially only 4-5 hurling clubs operating in the county with only two or three teams playing at minor, and camogie was pretty much restricted to the eastern part bordering Armagh & Lough Neagh with a similar number of clubs whereas now the game is starting to grow again in the mid & west parts of the county.

I can't comment about other counties, though I do know Fermanagh have also been trying to develop their own hurling base within their county in the last few years too, for a short while there was only one hurling club in Fermanagh at all age ranges (Lisbellaw) but there's been some work in establishing a few youth hurling bases like in Belleek, Lisnaskea, Enniskillen & Belanaleck..Camogie's dead there though, there's not even an active county board.

BaywatchHQ

It is just like how people claim to want GAA to have a bigger fan base yet when the casual fans go to the games they are called band wagoners. So basically they can't decide if they want a large GAA fan base or not.

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120630629#Comment_120630629

Just on your first couple of sentences, I was wondering what comment the Munster Council made about Kilkenny & Galway having an easy time if it until the AI semi finals?

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120628694#Comment_120628694

Not sure Dónal Óg ever suggested the not having matches on GAAgo was so significant to hurling in Meath. This is putting his argument to absurdly specific measures just to undermine it. His point was promotion of the game in a broader way considering the saturation coverage of the English Premier League (he did reference Liverpool).

Your implication in the last paragraph that televising of sport does not promote the sport is fairly left of field I would say. I reckon most sports would believe otherwise. I'm not sure the obsessive interest in English soccer would be so in this country without TV.

I says

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120637745#Comment_120637745

Can’t have it all ways, they didn’t want relegation so don’t crib about kk or Galway. Top eight and let them battle it out you still have the derbies in Munster and kk Galway and 1 other in the mix.

keeponhurling

I do think hurling is in a much better state than, say, 10 or 20 years ago.

The post above about Tyrone is an interesting read.

Firstly, the Joe McDonagh, Ring and Rackard cups have been a big success. While one could still argue they deserve more coverage, these "weaker" teams get much more coverage and structured games than ever before. Around 10 years ago I'd have known virtually nothing about the team and players from Kildare, Down, Kerry etc. but now I think most people at least follow the results and know the best players. I'll be tuning in for the McDonagh final between Carlow and Offaly. Last year Kerry v Antrim in Croke Park was a cracker.

Secondly, the Leinster championship round robin has played a key role. It has afforded the likes of Antrim and Westmeath to play the big guns (Galway and Kilkenny) while also having some matches where they can realistically hope to win. It seems to have benefitted both counties.

The winners of Carlow and Offaly can also see the Leinster championship as progress and somewhere they can stay.

Munster doesn't do as much but it is a great advertisement for the game. When the time is right Kerry will be admitted (i.e. when they win the Joe McDonagh) so there is a path there. There's little point adding other teams, e.g. Offaly or Carlow to the Munster championship, the Leinster championship would be better for their development.

Of course we could scrap the provincials but that just remove two big occasions from the calendar, and reduces the available prizes at top level from 3 to 1.

Like in the football, there are plenty teams are are not All-Ireland contenders, but winning or reaching a provincial title is a realistic target to aim for. Even in football where there are 31 "senior" teams, there are only ever 4 or 5 realistic All-Ireland contenders each year. You need to give the rest a target (in this case provincials, or Tailteann Cup)

hurlaway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120638216#Comment_120638216

Munster does nothing and alot in Munster would prefer if the Munster championship was the all ireland

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120637910#Comment_120637910

That's the same point you were making. What I asked was what the Munster Council said about Galway and Kilkenny.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120629668#Comment_120629668

Precisely! football is for fellas not good enough to play hurling.

CrabRevolution

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120637751#Comment_120637751

The Premier League is pretty much the opposite of what Cusack wants though. Live top tier English soccer was removed from free to air television with the advent of the Premier League. And for the first 10 years of the Premier League they only broadcast about 15% of games.

Feisar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120633693#Comment_120633693

Dunno why I thought of this:

https://youtu.be/XZo16Yb76p0

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120641264#Comment_120641264

I wasn't referencing the Premier League from the perspective of the TV model (nor was Dónal Óg), rather its support base and the comparative lack of promotion of hurling. It should also be said that soccer is not popular because of its TV model. It can have its TV model because it has such numbers supporting it in the first place. Young people in Ireland knew the Liverpool team long before Sky Sports.

Kilkenny played Galway at home recently and there was just 11k at the match (forget about TV). This is a game struggling to generate interest if a game like that in the home town of one of the teams has such a middling crowd.

Interestingly soccer has Match of the Day and all its biggest games are free to air, FA cup final, most Champions League games, World Cup etc..

In any event soccer is a professional sport with a demonstrated need to raise revenue, and frankly has the demand to put matches behind a paywall without damaging the sport. Not sure hurling can say the same.

I know many Irish teenagers who would know the Paris St Germain team (never mind Liverpool) but could not name two, or maybe even one, Kilkenny or Galway hurlers. Now maybe that doesn't matter but if it does hurling needs to consider the television model.

Of course holding the championship right at the time that other sports' seasons are reaching a climax is a problem too but no way will the GAA change that. If anything the championship will be played earlier in the year in place of the National League in the future.

Sunny Disposition

I think nearly all hurling people would like the game to be more popular. In most of the traditional counties there is a great love for the game and an awareness that it's narrow base is always a threat to it.

I don't know why it doesn't catch on in other places, it's popular enough as a spectator sport, but doesn't seem to make inroads. Maybe that's because of competition with Gaelic Football? I'd be from a very strong hurling area and 25 years ago there was very few playing rugby here, but once Munster got going it became normal. Somehow hurling never seems to expand even when its popular on TV.

Red Silurian

The current structure in All Ireland hurling includes Munster, Leinster and Joe McDonnagh, which is 17 counties across the 3 championships... The football has 4 pools of 4 so one less in football no?

Rowley Birkin QC

I'm from Cork. Love the game, would love to see more counties competing. Anyone that wants to maintain a status quo is no friend of the game.

I'm playing a bit again with a Dublin club after years away from the game. The love for hurling is just as strong here as it is at home. It's also great to see the first and second generations of "new Irish" playing the game.

NewbridgeIR

It was much more enjoyable pre-1997

Straight knockout in Munster & Leinster. Winners go to All Ireland SF and kept apart.

Galway not in Leinster - they went straight into All Ireland QF playing the Senior B winners. They had plenty success in that system.

Ulster champions qualify for All Ireland SF

League taken more seriously and more potential for surprises (Mayo beating Waterford etc)

People played inter-county longer.

Once Kilkenny beaten, that was it for the year. They didn't get a second chance.

Great days.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120642260#Comment_120642260

My theory is it is a harder game to learn, it is much easier for a young fella to head towards football if he previously played other codes - Soccer, Rugby etc. So if hurling is not taught or really encouraged at a young age, then counties are playing catch up straight away. Not many 'wristy hurlers' produced. And if the fella that happens to be a good hurler is normally a good footballer as well.

If the fella is in football county he more than likely going to pick intercounty football - Con O'Callaghan Dublin for example. And years ago when was going to secondary school I have heard one of his former teachers describe Vinnie Murphy as one of the best hurlers he has seen as a young age, and he would have been a much better hurler than a footballer.

It is no coincidence that no-one talks about glorious Munster football, it exists in mainly only one County who happens to be the most successful in the country - Kerry. And another Cork who don't seem to pushed about the big ball game half the time. So that is Munster's hurling advantage.

Limerick are an interesting case though as a County they used to be a jack of all trades master of none - Soccer, Rugby, Football, Hurling - bit of everything. Now they are the masters of hurling because that was where the main focus was put .

Clare? I assume Ger Loughnane was the spark? By sheer singlemindedness/motivation?

Since then I cannot think of any county that has improved except Dublin but are only OK at the moment. Even that was a long so process started in the late 90's by bringing in outside help from other counties, getting the structures in place etc - first successful huriing Dublin minor team was in 2005 Leinster Final. I still remember a Kilkenny fan sneering behind me 'you would think they won the AI'. That is the type of attitude up and coming hurling counties have to face. But then there was the Dalo factor, and Dublin punched above their weight for a while.

As for Munster Hurling itself. A number of years ago (no idea what year) I wanted to see a good Munster hurling match live in Semple to see what all the fuss was about. It was Cork v Tipp. Tipp were hot favourites. But Cork really put it up to Tipp - it was a 90 mile an hour game, so fast you couldn't mark the scores. A great 'advertisement for hurling' as they say.

But Semple stadium itself does not live up the hype as 'the home of hurling', I find the stadium a bit ramshackle, auld uncomfortable benches, plus you can have obscured viewing etc. The teams are forced to make it more than sum of it's parts

I struggle to get excited about it as an non-Munster person to be honest these days, same teams, same faces, and a lot of bluster and noise. Plus you can fairly easily predict who is going to win the hurling match. The round robin hurling has a feel of a challenge match. Teams just do enough not much 'on it'. I was much more interested in the Dublin v Wexford match, would only half watch Munster as the impression is they are only half trying.

So I think overall hurling has a number of major issues and it seems like hamsters on a wheel with little changing even over the period of a number of decades.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120642405#Comment_120642405

In what way would you like to see it grow? This year Carlow and Offaly will both be involved in the last 8 of the All Ireland, last year we had Antrim and Kerry, the year before that we had Westmeath and Kerry.

Can it really grow much more?

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120642442#Comment_120642442

It wasn't very balanced though.

Munster had 5 strong teams and Kerry were always forgotten about. Now Kerry get minimum 5 championship games. Likewise Carlow would rarely make it through their first game while Galway and Antrim walk into the last 4

There's been a big improvement I think for small fish in big pond counties and the interest in these counties has improved as a result albeit from a low base

NewbridgeIR

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120642477#Comment_120642477

Kerry entered Munster occasionally (1977, 1978, 1993 are the ones that spring to mind)

Otherwise they played in the Senior B championship which was competitive albeit Galway always stood in the winner's way.

I think things were more evenly matched in league than they are now - Kerry beating Clare, Down beating Kilkenny, Meath winning against Wexford etc.

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120642445#Comment_120642445

I definitely got the impression that the Munster teams were trying. It mightn't have had the quality of Dublin-Wexford or other Leinster games but I thought, for example, in the Limerick-Clare game they were taking it reasonably seriously.

techdiver

From my experience no is the answer. Traditional counties like the status quo. Just look at last weekend for evidence. Westmeath had their biggest win in championship history and the Sunday game showed a paltry 3 minutes of coverage, talked about how great it was for Westmeath for like 20 seconds and then focused on how bad it was for Wexford for the remainder of the slot. This all led by panelists from Kilkenny and Tipperary.

Hurling development in counties outside of the "traditional" strongholds has been and always will be lip service led by a patronising attitude full of condescension and little actual action.

windy shepard henderson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120642445#Comment_120642445

from a clare point of view to start with , in 2009 or 10 we were playing 3rd tier league hurling and beat wexford in a relegation matcch to the christy ring at the time

people became concerned and started to make themselves available as coaches at under age , it turned out we unerthed some of the best coaches in the country , people like gerry o'connor donal moloney peter casey alan cunningham and paul kinnerick a limerick footballer that was teaching in shannon at the time , thats why clare won the all ireland in 2013 and why we didnt drop further down the line

but i dont see anything like this happening in either wexford or waterford at the moment and worryingly i see dublin starting to slide again , i think dublin needs investment in hurling , wheres better coaching is needed under age for the other two

as for the munster championship , it is always easy on the eye but i regard galway and kilkenny as the better all round teams , leinster was always a grafters championship while munster was always the more entertaining , leinster v munster teams from semi final stage on is normally 50/50 so dont believe the hype

thurles is a little run down especially the old stand , but it is the most perfect town to see a game , the atmosphere is excellent there are so many side roads to exit the town after you would be a fool to get stuck in traffic , and the people down there know how to look after supporters an excellent venue in fairness

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120648959#Comment_120648959

Kilkenny & Galway better all round teams? So logically you would predict a Kilkenny-Galway All Ireland final then? For all the "hype" about Munster Kilkenny have lost to all bar Clare in their last championship meetings with Munster teams. Not sure they are definitely better than the Munster teams. The championship is set up to suit these two counties alright.

Mantis Toboggan

Do traditional hurling counties honestly want hurling to grow or stay as is?

Completely irrelevant, question should be what are each County and the GAA doing to grow hurling in the county?

This "ah shure we've only 5 hurling clubs, aren't we great to be competitive" no, you're not, you're a disgrace, how can a county board stand over such few clubs playing hurling, pathetic.

Poor hurling counties need to stop looking to the likes of kilkenny and Tipp to sort out their problems and sort it out themselves.

Rosita

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120647509#Comment_120647509

I think this badly misrepresents the tone of the commentary on the panel. Wexford have been one of the better hurling counties for decades albeit they have endured significant lows e.g. during the post-2004 period when they got a lot of bad beatings from several counties. But they had it in them to come back despite minimal underage success. Their current precarious position puts question marks around their future. As Offaly have shown bouncing back is not automatic.

Given their long association with hurling's top tier, Wexford's demotion is a bigger talking point than Westmeath's win. After all Westmeath lost to Galway by 6-33 to 0-17 the previous match and avoiding relegation appears to be the extent of their potential for now. To over-egg their win over Wexford would be patronising in the actual context of where they are at. The result appears to say more about Wexford's decline than it does to confirm the progress of Westmeath who actually drew with Wexford last year which many now praising them seem to have forgotten about. Wexford declining is not a sign that hurling is growing, quite the opposite maybe. Not sure that's something to celebrate.

Commentators are entitled to worry about Wexford's demise as anyone who thinks Westmeath are going to take a step up immediately and fill the reasonably competitive role Wexford did over the decades is naively optimistic. Hurling being the preserve of a select amount of successful teams may be irritating but every sport is the same. In fact, in sports when people get to choose their teams (soccer for example) they will nearly always choose a successful one and can be mocked for not doing so. So in reality most people don't mind this aspect of sport.