Picard 3x10- 'The Last Generation' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** }

Mollyb60

Maybe I've missed this somewhere along the way but are we to understand that the Vadic choppy hand communicatey person was the Borg Queen? Was that made clear at any point?

Absolutely loved this season. Great send off for the crew. Unsure if I can endure more Raffi for the Legacy show but we'll see. She's definitely better when she doesn't talk. Did she even say a single word to her beloved JL this season?

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120514068#Comment_120514068

It was definitely the queen, though there was no way for anyone to really state it, as only Vadic (and her crew) knew this, and she got spaced.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120514076#Comment_120514076

It was a shtty misdirection is what it was.

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120514365#Comment_120514365

I don't necessarily think it was misdirection just the speculation that it was something to do with the Pah Wraiths ran wild.

There are Borg hints all the way back in episode four. The end of the episode when Jack is looking in the mirror is almost an exact recreation of the opening of First Contact with Picard's nightmare.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120514444#Comment_120514444

It was.

The Borg queen suddenly looked like some skull face man. If you are doing a mystery it's a cop out just to have stuff like that.

corkie

The Borg Queen communicating with Vadic as "The Face"

She communicated with Vadic via Vadic's severed hand, with which the Borg Queen formed a simulacrum of a face in mid-air.

~~ https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Borg_Queen

Wiki has the details, but don't think it was confirmed in the show.

eadrom

Unable to imagine how to conceal the Changeling / Borg relationship, although maybe the mistake was in thinking that they needed to in the first place?, they just decided to use a character which looks, sounds, and acts nothing at all like the Borg before revealing that it was actually the Borg and never even pretending to explain why it was the way it was.

Also I hear a lot (from Reddit ama, Twitter, etc) that they’d actually wanted to do X, Y, or Z in terms of extra cameos, story points, or plot, but the cost of the D bridge or the time or budget constraints held them back. But like, that’s the whole job, isn’t it? Every show works with the constraints that it has to produce the story that we’ll see on screen. I get that it’s tough decisions sometimes but it’s not a great excuse to say “it would have been better if only…” when it’s your job to know the if only’s going in, and to make a great show regardless.

That just annoyed me a bit. Must be bloody tough working on a show like this in the social media era though.

ixoy

I'm not sure I get the point above. They absolutely have budget consideration so , if they had wanted another storyline, the cost might have meant not being able to recreate the bridge of the Enterprise.

Now maybe all the decisions weren't amazing but they still had to happen. Personally removing Raffi would have freed up time and money..

From reading the AMA with the show runner it looks like they were editing scripts very late into the process.

breezy1985

Why did a changeling have to cut off her hand off with a knife to make it work ?

E

Where is this communication through bloody hand technology coming from ?

eadrom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120515805#Comment_120515805

Not doing a more expensive storyline is fine, and maybe that is more accurately what was being spoken about in the Q+As or wherever. My point above was more about doing the same storyline anyway and then excusing yourself with "that would have made more sense but we didn't have the budget or time to do it properly", like the Borg/Changeling connection.

corkie

According to Wheaton, "One of the fundamental rules of being in the Travelers is that, once you've joined, you must NEVER interact directly with the people, places, planets, etc. that were part of your previous life, because it can affect your judgment and break reality." He continued, saying that while "Wesley would like nothing more than to visit his mom, and meet his brother," he knows that "not seeing them is a sacrifice he has to make in service of something so much bigger than anything else in his reality."

~ https://collider.com/star-trek-picard-wesley-jack-crusher-wil-wheaton-comments/

So that is one explanation for not seeing him in the final.

Bobtheman

So we are looking at a new series of seven as captain? Too bad she lost the cat suit but we must all grow up.

I could deal with such a series so long as we get the odd NG guest star and turn the lights back on

It's a shame season 1 and 2 were so bad. It should have been the old cast from the beginning. That's what the fans wanted.

Trying to go in a new direction with an 80 year old actor was a mistake. Added to that they didn't really manage to develop new characters of substance bar that captain from season 1 they left in the past

ItHurtsWhenIP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120515936#Comment_120515936

Wasn't there a scene in sickbay, after they discovered there were changelings about, where Beverley noted they were different in that they didn't immediately turn to goo when they died, unless there was severe damage. I have a vague recollection of her poking at something solid, breaking it apart and then it went gooey.

So I'm guessing Vadic had to sacrifice her hand to let the Queen manifest for a chat ... or something. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

~Rebel~

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120516883#Comment_120516883

I think it still could've been quite a good idea, if they had half decent writers on board. Picard, late in life, getting involved in smaller scale slower paced mysteries could've been quite fun. Like, that's what Star Trek is actually about anyway, dealing with interesting subjects and ideas on a more local level in 95% of episodes. The writers obviously decided to go the other direction, of exclusively nonsensical illogical overpacked galaxy-destruction stories.

Bobtheman

I can understand stewarts idea to want Picard to go out on his own in season 1 but it was a **** you to the rest of the cast of the next generation.

Yes he was the main man but unlike the TOS it was more of an ensemble

Perhaps they could have dialled it down a bit and thrown in the odd guest star.

Though riker did appear season 1 I think

I lost hipe in that version of Picard with the, frankly, insulting "disguises" in one of the episodes.

I, honestly, don't even have the desire to find the name for fear of seeing images of it again.

CastorTroy

https://tvline.com/lists/star-trek-picard-series-finale-ending-explained-new-series/

Seems the reason for Laris not being in it again is because Orla had returned to Ireland.

Not sure if was personal reasons or not, but surely they would've let her know that she would be needed and to not go anywhere. unless they were making it up as they went. Unlike network series, I'd say the whole season was written or at least planned before shooting began.

Stark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120522722#Comment_120522722

I'd imagine if she was needed, it was only for a couple of scenes like in Season 1 so not worth the actress's time staying in the States for.

Spear

A end scene with Laris would have needed either a new set of CGI'd one. And given that they have Walter Koenig only do a voiceover, as they didn't have the budget for a filmed sequence, I suspect it's simply a case that they dropped it to save cash.

breezy1985

She was pretty much surplus to the plot once Beverly came back.

Her whole story in season 2 was practically a Crusher stand in.

corkie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120481484#Comment_120481484

All the Times the Borg Queen Was Defeated in Star Trek TNG / Voyager / Picard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2uXM0fyL9Q

Evade

Everytime she showed up and even few times she didn't?

TheValeyard

This is brilliant (not sure if posted already, fan made, but such great quality and related to S3)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KXU2Ob8gYY&ab_channel=OTOY

Edit: Its part of the Roddenberry Archive, theres a few vids even voiced by John De Lancie (Q)

ManOfMystery

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530078#Comment_120530078

Just saw that an hour ago, it's amazing quality. The Spock facial visuals are impressive.

eadrom

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530078#Comment_120530078

What is the Roddenberry Archive and why are they making these videos? Some incredible looking (very short) clips on their channel.

just tech demos? is it essentially fan-film stuff?

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120531768#Comment_120531768

It's the brainchild of Dexler and the Okuda's so I suppose it's mostly a museum of their work.

corkie

OTOY and The Roddenberry Estate Unveil the First Immersive Roddenberry Archive Experiences, Multi-year Roadmap to Preserve the History of Roddenberry’s Star Trek Work across Movies, TV and Literature ~~ Aug. 25, 2022 (8 months)

At Creation Las Vegas, the Roddenberry Estate presented the first real-time interactive and fully immersive previews of the Roddenberry Archive, a multi-decade collaboration to preserve Gene Roddenberry’s lifetime of work for future generations to experience in next generation media formats.

Above: Lawrence Selleck and Mahé Thaissa as Spock and Colt (c.2270’s / ST:TMP novel)

So maybe not Leonard Nimoy(/CGI) in the video linked earlier.

breezy1985

Apparently this also works way better in Chrome as phones and Firefox only let you scan round but you are supposed to be able to walk around the bridge.

ItHurtsWhenIP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120532090#Comment_120532090

Yeah ... you can use A, S, D and W to move around on Chrome on a laptop.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120533352#Comment_120533352

Had a "walk around" earlier. Very well done especially the concept stuff.

Kind of annoys me how much the 1701 and A bridge changed every movie.