Who has Priority here? Almost Fatal Accident

Wildly Boaring

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979178#Comment_119979178

Probably

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979178#Comment_119979178

Correct and right, lot of dudes, especially the gimps on scooters seem to think they can just barrel on and expect the car driver to know their intentions.

The sooner these folk understand the rules of the road apply to them the safer they will be.

Seth Brundle

The sooner these folk understand the rules of the road apply to them the safer they will be.

To be fair, there is a large portion of road users (regardless of transport mode) who don't seem to understand (or care about) the rules of the road. This would be obvious to anyone who looks.

Feisar

I don't know enough to comment on who's right or wrong, however what a dick move by the driver. I always check my mirror to see if someone is coming up my inside and let them on if there is. On this occasion they could see you!

FreshCoffee

Juts for clarity, the junction is not a 'factory entrance'. If you take the left turn, up the road on the left is the entrance to a private house and further up again on the right is the gated entrance to the factory. The junction discussed is a junction of two council roads.

In my opinion, the cycle lane clearly ended before the junction with a sign for the cyclist to re-join the road. The motorist had right of way over anyone leaving the footpath and entering the roadway at that point. Nonetheless both parties should have been paying more attention to traffic around them and driving/cycling defensively to avoid an accident at a poorly designed junction.

Jayuu

Awful thing to happen to the OP and I'm glad he wasn't hurt but let's not assume the driver is some sort of careless idiot. They may have assumed the OP was going to stop as the driver had signalled that they were turning left and were likely to reach the junction first. For all we know irrespective of what they OP was wearing they may have just missed seeing him. Unless they turned up here and commented we'll never know their side of the story.

What we do know if that the junction is an absolute mess and should be sorted immediately to make it completely clear where the right of way is so that nobody is likely to be in that situation again. I'm not sure if the responsibility of fixing this lies with TTI or the local council but I hope the OP has contacted somebody in officialdom with their video and the suggestion that remedial work needs to be done on the junction as soon as possible. It can't be that hard to rectify this.

magicbastarder

In my opinion, the cycle lane clearly ended before the junction with a sign for the cyclist to re-join the road.

there's nothing clear about that though; as mentioned, in the original street view, the stop line for the minor road takes the footpath and cycle path into account, so that would suggest the cycle path continues on the inside of the arrow sign.

Jayuu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119975494#Comment_119975494

Is this a private entrance? I don't know where this is exactly.

Also given the lack of properly designated lines at the junction it could be very easy for somebody driving to assume the bike lane stops at the junction and they have priority through it.

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979243#Comment_119979243

Correct and right,however the driver in this case was ‘in the right’ it’s difficult enough to watch what’s in front of you on the road and behind you on the road.

When another dimension is introduced like a cyclist traveling on the inside decides to barrel across a road where,for me anyway’ it’s obvious that the cycle lane ends and a yield or a stop is required, then it’s their blame completely.

Common sense required here.Doesn’t seem to be much of it from sources .

magicbastarder

They may have assumed the OP was going to stop as the driver had signalled that they were turning left

they'd signalled their intention to someone *in front of them* though. they passed the cyclist only about a second or so before they started the turn. and it's a well lit road, if you watch the video. there would be little excuse for not seeing the cyclist.

but you're right that the OP should contact the local authority about that junction.

magicbastarder

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979297#Comment_119979297

airport road in cork.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.8702137,-8.4796308,3a,75y,158.63h,81.24t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sjgfpZhW0fg2L9Q84rCAxDQ!2e0!5s20220801T000000!7i16384!8i8192

cruizer101

In the old pics the cycle lane is on right, but according to the signs now the cycle lane is on the left, so it's a complete mess.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979304#Comment_119979304

What utter nonsense. If it is too difficult for you to know what is ahead and behind you while driving that you cant manage to predict that a cyclist travelling parallel to you might not stop then FFS please hand back your driving licence. You are telling us that you are not competent to be driving

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979284#Comment_119979284

The stop line for the minor road took the footpath and cycle path into account in 2011. Eleven years ago.

It's been moved since, and is very clear where it is now. Whether that move was an error or not, it is what current road users would be guided by.

magicbastarder

so you agree they messed up further, an already badly designed junction.

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979307#Comment_119979307

What would the OP say to the local authority about that junction.

magicbastarder

something simple like 'can you please repaint it correctly and make clear who has priority' would be a simple enough start.

Viscount Aggro

I would be going after the driver, to have it out.

I always stop at similar junctions.

Reminds me of an altercation in Rathmines, out from Church avenue.

A motorist pulled straight out in front of me, tried to kill me.

I laid my bike in road in front of her, had a few verbals back and forth.

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979333#Comment_119979333

Yes, I get that , how would they “repaint it correctly and make it clear who has priority”

Its pretty clear to me based on the vid who has priority.

A small bit of cop on and common sense would tell you that.

Jayuu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979307#Comment_119979307

Yes but they may have assumed they had right of way on the junction given we all agree it's not entirely clear. Because we haven't the driver's side of the story we can't make an assessment of their thought process in the incident.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979333#Comment_119979333

Exactly. This would sort it. It wouldn't be a big job for anybody.

Brendan Bendar

It’s perfectly clear to me …….let’s not complicate a simple enough common sense situation

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979297#Comment_119979297

The OP was in the wrong. There are no cycle lane markings on the road in the area of the junction.

I looked at the video again. The car was clearly indicating well in advance of the left turn and was already rounding the corner before the OP reached the edge of the footpath / cycle lane. OP appears to have incorrectly assumed they had right of way.

A rule of thumb - if the OP would have ended up T-boning the car the OP would be in the wrong. If the car would have ended up T-boning the OP the car driver would be in the wrong. i.e. car has right of way unless the cyclist (or pedestrian) has already entered the junction bere the car starts to turn left.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119979252#Comment_119979252

Could easily say what a dick move by the cyclist. They could see there were no cycle lane markings through the junction and the driver had indicated they were turning left. On this occasion they could see the car indicating.

Stopping on an 80km/h busy main road during peak commute hours would create a significant risk of a rere end collision, if not for the car stopping and the car immediately behind, then for cars further back due to the accordion effect.

It would be clearer/safer if the end of the cycle lane was clearly marked with a yield marking and end of cycle lane sign at the kerb and a start of cycle lane sign placed at the far side of the junction.

From the video the OP appears to be cycling on the wrong side of the white line. Signs further down and further up the hill show the cycle lane to the left of the line and pedestrians to the right.

FWIW the entire length of that footpath?/cycle lane? is an absolute sambles. It doen't look wide enough for a segregated footpath / cycle lane. There's no signage at the start, what few signs there are are too far apart and there are no surface markings at all.

It needs signs at the start and end, repeated every 200m. Surface markings every 200m, staggered with the signs so there's some indication every 100m. Yield and end of cycle lane markings and signs at the juncion and cycle lane signs and surface markings after the junction.

If you look at the mess further up the hill, just beyond the traffic lights - some sort of wierd chokepoint/chicane aroud a wall, poles and bollards in the middle of the cycle lane, wtf!!!

If this is what passes for cycling infrastructure I couldn't blame cyclists for avoiding cycle lanes. Calling this shambles an afterthought would be an undeserved complement.

magicbastarder

Stopping on an 80km/h busy main road during peak commute hours would create a significant risk of a rere end collision, if not for the car stopping and the car immediately behind, then for cars further back due to the accordion effect.

there's a far greater danger created by not slowing for a cyclist who will clearly reach the junction at about the same time the driver will, and who you will potentially left hook, than there is by easing off the gas for a few seconds.

the thread title asks 'who has priority' but many people (me included) have given their verdict on who is in the wrong. you can have priority (and i don't even think that is clear here) and still be in the wrong. avoiding a collision takes precedence over priority.

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980191#Comment_119980191

You see, this is the major problem with cyclists.

The story here is …..clearly…. the cyclist is is in the wrong…..suck it up.

Then you have folk coming on with, quite frankly , bullshit arguments as to what everyone should do.

There would have been no problem if the cyclist instead of having all kinds of technology used ordinary common sense and stopped at the break in the cycle lane, fessed up and said ‘My Bad’ and learned a lesson instead of making a fool of themselves on here.

Sometimes you are wrong dude, put up your hand..

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980191#Comment_119980191

Why is the onus on the car, who you admit has priority, to avoid the accident rather than the bike, which does not have priority and will undoubtedly lose any altercation?

The thread title asks who has priority and the answer is clear cut, the car does. Anything else is just lycra tinted glasses speaking.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980344#Comment_119980344

You did see the post that quoted this point from Rules of the Road, right?

Motorists should watch for cyclists emerging from the end of a cycle track

Brendan Bendar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980386#Comment_119980386

Yes, I did…….motorists should watch out for everything.

How does that tie in with the Thread Title?

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980386#Comment_119980386

He wasn't though. He didn't merge into the road to his right, as he should gave. He rode though the end of the path into a road.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980403#Comment_119980403

It ties in with your claim that "clearly…. the cyclist is is in the wrong". Clearly, the motorist didn't watch out for cyclists emerging from the end of a cycle track. So clearly, the motorist is is in the wrong.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980408#Comment_119980408

He emerged from the end of a cycle track. Motorists should watch out for cyclists emerging from the end of a cycle track.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119980439#Comment_119980439

He didn't merge at the end of the cycle path. That was to his right, just at the start of the ramp. And if he had done that he wouldn't have been in the car's path. I'm a cyclist and I can't fathom how anybody doesn't see that the OP kept going straight when it was clear he should have merged to the right or stopped and crossed the road.