Irish Under-20's 2023

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120129108#Comment_120129108

Yeah, and tbf, success at that level typically has been relatively synonymous with players successfully converting to the next level.

Take our best ever U20s side that were hammered by England in a JWC final in 2016, that crop yielded all of Jimmy O'Brien, Jacob Stockdale, Hugo Keenan, Shane Daly, Andrew Porter, James Ryan, Will Connors and Max Deegan (plus a few other guys who made it as pros).

The 2019 GS team has already provided guys like Ryan Baird, John Hodnett, David McCann, Niall Murray, Scott Penny, Josh Wycherley, Harry Byrne, Craig Casey, Cormac Foley, David Hawkshaw, Stewart Moore and Rob Russell who've played a lot of senior interpro or international rugby in a few cases (plus a future Scottish 10).

realhorrorshow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120129232#Comment_120129232

The class of 2016 was ridiculous. Nine full internationals (Sam Arnold missed the JWC through injury), one of the best Sevens players in the world, and three additional major prospects who were wrecked by injury in Conor O'Brien, Peter Claffey, and Cillian Gallagher.

Dubinusa

Indeed: Even 2017 produced some good players in a poor year.

Lyttle, Larmour, Nash, Coombes, Dowling and Boyle.

It's tough to get a sense of where these young lads are and how they will develop.

ulsteru20s

I … kind of think that last year’s side while successful won’t produce as many elite players as some of the previous ones. Def could be wrong.

I’m more optimistic about this one but no idea if that lines up with success for the team this year.

Dubinusa

Last season there was good prospects. I think Devine will be grand. King wil be a good wing and Campbell looks to be very good already. The pack was pretty good last season too! I thought that Wilson and McGuire were very good.

Who knows? We won't get a handle for a while.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130626#Comment_120130626

Hard to know, still very early. The ones I'd be optimistic on reaching full international level at some point in future are James Culhane and Matthew Devine.

Outside of that, I think all of Patrick Campbell, Chay Mullins, Rory McGuire, Conor O'Tighearnaigh and James McCormick look like they could be future internationals, and obviously Jack Boyle would be in my first grouping if I'd more clarity on his injury situation.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130653#Comment_120130653

My thing about last year is usually there is someone where you think this is almost a cant miss elite prospect, or as close to that as possible.

I see more candidates this year for that than last. Everything I’ve heard about McCarthy the prop makes me think he could be a better prospect than Boyle. Quinn played so well against actual men in a preseason game (which to me is still a higher standard than under 20s) that i wonder if he is also a different level of prospect to culhane. Prendergast seems a level above tector. The top 14 winger.

Obviously, this is all speculation, but i’m more excited about this year as of now.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130685#Comment_120130685

Yeah, I do agree. McNabney looks a serious prospect too this year, and I'd be extremely high on Sam Prendergast.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130670#Comment_120130670

McCormick i wonder about size but otherwise agree. I’d include Postlethwaite and McLoughlin on that list too.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130697#Comment_120130697

Yeah, I’d forgotten Postlethwaite tbh but he looked serious prospect. Another guy seemingly injured since then though so hard to read how he’s going since.

Lost Ormond

Interesting to see Wales warming up for the 6Ns with a game against the Polish senior national side.

England played Oxford and Loughborough universities. Scotland and Wales played each other before christmas.

ulsteru20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130741#Comment_120130741

I’m not sure what’s going on there. He’s on a 4 year deal so we must rate him.

Wegians89

What’s the likely first choice 15?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132851#Comment_120132851

IMO:

15-9, 1-8: Henry McErlean, Rory Telfer, Hugh Cooney, Hugh Gavin, Ike Anagu, Sam Prendergast, Fintan Gunne, George Hadden, Gus McCarthy, Paddy McCarthy, Conor O'Tighearnaigh, Evan O'Connell, Diarmuid Mangan, Ruadhan Quinn, James McNabney

Reps: Danny Sheahan, George Morris, Fiachna Barrett, Charlie Irvine, Brian Gleeson, Jack Oliver, Harry West, Sam Berman.

LRind2008

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120132887#Comment_120132887

ye probably spot on with that

PMC83

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ik1_Y33Gek

Interview with Ike Anagu, could be a serous prospect. A bit awkward when he couldnt remember where in Ireland he was from.

TRC10

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120155899#Comment_120155899

Serious prospect but you have to wonder about his commitment to Ireland. Say he has a great u20s campaign and raises his profile, will he just take a big contract at a French club and play for them or South Africa in the future? Could be another Dan Kelly scenario.

Like, if playing for Ireland was his dream, he wouldn't be going on about how keen he is to become JIFF qualified.

PMC83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120157218#Comment_120157218

I guess professional sport is professional sport at this stage. But he was caught bull$hitting there. 'I've always wanted to represent Ireland...but I can't actually remember where I lived there, because it was so long ago...' He'll need to be a bit more media savvy next time.

nerd69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130685#Comment_120130685

Quinn played a few mins vs leinster and zebre also and didnt look out of place.

Evan o connell put in 15-20 mins vs ulster and is still eligable for nezt years 20s

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120159473#Comment_120159473

No, Evan O'Connell didn't get off the bench in that game. He hasn't made his senior debut yet for Munster.

snotboogie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120157218#Comment_120157218

And Oji has been completely cast aside to accommodate him. If any prospect needs a run of games at his age grade its Oji and being excluded from the squad will be enormously detrimental to his development. If Anagu uses this as a shop window for France and South Africa this whole exercise will have been a huge mistake, no matter how much he contributes to the 20's this year.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120159636#Comment_120159636

I don't think that's fair. By all accounts, Oji hasn't helped himself here, is underperforming at an AIL level and isn't hitting the S&C or fitness markers he's been given. If his development is stalling, 95% of the blame sits with him imo.

It sounds like Anagu is going to make a business decision about his future, and is being relatively upfront about that. There is huge logic in becoming JIFF qualified, it would forever make him a much more attractive option to the Top14 clubs.

Ireland have the option of taking a punt on him now and putting a full contract (presumably at a decent wedge) in front of him right now, or run the risk of him pulling up trees for the 20s and having others chasing him aggressively. I don't see us being outbid by the SA teams (but maybe Anagu prefers to play in SA?), but obviously there is a risk of a French team making him an offer we don't think is worth managing.

This is the business side of rugby, as distasteful as it appears sometimes.

LRind2008

Out of interest does anyone know the process thats involved in even finding irish connections like Ike, Playing his rugby in SA and now France with a name like Ike Anagu mustve been a hard find for an exiles scout to pick up, or is it more likely IKE reached out to the exiles set up ?. No idea how this process works.

snotboogie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120159832#Comment_120159832

I really don't think Oji is in a great fit at UL, no idea on his S+C markers but yes to be fair he does look huge. Saying that, he's put in a massive shift every time I've seen him play for Ireland or Munster development teams. It's also worth keeping in mind that Oji was playing for Douglas RFC two years ago, Anagu was playing South Africa schools at the same time. Its completely expected that Anagu is way ahead of Oji in his development curve given their respective backgrounds.

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120159932#Comment_120159932

They come to us for most part. He is with ROG, Donnacha Ryan etc in France and was born here so presumably coaches passed it on?

Varies a lot. England, Scotland, Wales have a few IRFU staff working to find and assess players through the exiles system but yeah beyond that its players reaching out for the most part

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120160029#Comment_120160029

Yeah, I completely get that. But I don't think Oji deserves to be in the Ireland U20s as a development milestone, if there are more talented players available.

ulsteru20s

On Oji, I’m going to reserve judgement until i see the wingers on the team. I know King was under utilized last year even though he was obviously the best athlete there. So, i think there might be a tad too much emphasis on polish maybe in selection. This is a development job not a results job, or that’s the way it should be.

I would say playing on a frankly bad AIL team as a winger is probably dispiriting. He is in the NTS system and is presumably at Munster training. So, hopefully they give him work ons and encouragement there. I think you’d still want that kind of athlete in your academy.

DJ31

It's seems very strange how Anagu who seems to know nothing about the country he is about to represent is welcomed with open arms and how Karl Martin has been cut loose because he was ambitious and brave enough to move to France. It surely would have been worth while bringing him back for last year's U20

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120169517#Comment_120169517

It wouldnt surprise me if Anagu either has agreed or is in negotiating a move to an Irish province, most likely the latter.

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120169556#Comment_120169556

Allegedly he's from Waterford? Munster may have the offer to get him.