If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact

Only 4% of houses with smart meters are on smart plans



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,567 ✭✭✭Red Silurian

    Yes, what I noted is the discounted rate, not the standard rate, so what I gave was a like-for-like comparison

  • Subscribers Posts: 41,227 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat

    dont know why you were doing that??

    i was comparing my current plan to the standard rate.

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,567 ✭✭✭Red Silurian

    Because very few people are on the standard rate, just like you aren't paying the standard smart meter rate

  • Subscribers Posts: 41,227 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat

    and again, i wasnt comparing my case to all other people, or even a select group of people, but to the baseline measurement.

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭Citizen  Six

  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,232 ✭✭✭waterwelly

    I'd not be in favour of running appliances while people sleep, in case of fire or water leak etc.

    We tried setting timers on stuff before but it's a pain in the ass, if there is a power outage you would need to be resetting them etc.

    As well as this you have water all the time whether you need it or not so that costs money unless you go around turning it off etc.

    So if you are going away for a weekend you'd need to be turning off the immersion but then the day you get back there is no hot water.

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,045 ✭✭✭Icsics

    Only timer is immersion, others are delayed starts. Works well for us

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭Citizen  Six

    Yeah, I use delayed start on dish washer and washing machine, to bring on a best time for PV, and it works well. But I am running appliances when not there, which isn't the best idea.

  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,902 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk

    If you've got as far as home assistant you'd be better off getting a Shelly em for grid monitoring

  • Registered Users Posts: 65,058 ✭✭✭✭unkel

    Ah maybe I didn't explain myself very well. I wouldn't refuse to export / set an export limit just for the sake of it. Basically I use a lot of electricity with 3 EVs and a 20kWh power wall, electric heating an oldish house and electrically heating hot water. Indeed if the FIT was low (after tax), I would just self consume and charge up my batteries (power wall, cars, mining rigs, hot water, hot air). If FIT was high (no tax), I would export everything I produce and charge up my batteries at night rate

  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 8,567 ✭✭✭Red Silurian

    You were comparing a discounted rate to a baseline rate, nobody in their right mind pays the baseline rate so comparing discounted v discounted gives a better representation

    What you have done is made smart rates seem cheaper than what most people will pay

  • Registered Users Posts: 7,269 ✭✭✭MrMusician18

    That's far from being a universal truth. 5-7 is the point of peak demand but that doesn't always (frequently doesn't) correlate with it being the dirtiest time on the grid.

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,419 ✭✭✭DC999

    True, it’s not always the dirtiest at peak times if we have a heap of wind. But…if we (houses and companies) can easily shift power outside peak times to help drop emissions, why not?? For me personally that’s really important. Plus smoothing that demand means they can reduce the dirtier & more expensive plants. Which could / should lead to lower costs for us all (ok, if passed on but that's secondary for me).

    I've only learned in the last year maybe about the grid being cleaner at night. Never had a D/N meter to get the financial incentive before. So it's still fairly new to me and am trying try use juice at other times of the day (without becoming fanatical about it). Every day is a school day :)

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,557 ✭✭✭Gooser14

    You would be surprised how many people are on standard rates. There is an article on stating that 39% of electricity consumers & 40% of gas consumers have never switched supplier.

  • Registered Users Posts: 65,058 ✭✭✭✭unkel

    Sure, but statistically / by definition, the times of highest demand are on average also the dirtiest

    Personally, I'm an advocate of charging people most when it is actually dirtiest, no matter what time of the day or night. Not sure if this can be technically achieved, never mind politically 😂

  • Registered Users Posts: 7,269 ✭✭✭MrMusician18

    There is also an element of grid management that comes into play too.

    Real time pricing is technically possible and has been implemented in some parts of the US but in times of stress can result in astronomical bills. Politically it wouldn't be possible here - maybe real time capped I'd say is as far as we could go.

  • Registered Users Posts: 196 ✭✭UID0

    It can be achieved. Look at the Octopus Agile tariff in the UK. The prices change every half hour (with the day ahead pricing given every evening, so you can adjust your schedules based on pricing). While prices don't guarantee that the energy at a given time is the dirtiest, it does correlate well. They also adjust the price they pay you for your excess, and at times will pay you to take power from the grid. It shows what smart meter plans can be like.

    Once there is sufficient carrot as well as stick, it can be achieved politically.

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,567 ✭✭✭Red Silurian

    Those numbers are actually shocking! Likewise though for these people they would be on the standard smart meter rate, not the discounted one

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,731 ✭✭✭yankinlk

    this is true. like my mother for example who is 85 and must be getting a special old-age discount. i tried to use bonkers to save her money but it just didnt match up. so id be wary of their stats tbh. what do they say about statistics?

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,996 ✭✭✭jkforde

    "There is an article on stating that 39% of electricity consumers & 40% of gas consumers have never switched supplier."

    .. and that is exactly why we have inept regulation.. we reap what we sow. sad fact.

    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️

  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭Citizen  Six

    A lot of older people don't want to change supplier. My father believed Electric Ireland would "look after him" as a loyal customer. They clearly didn't judging by his bills.

    And even now, he pays standing charge for gas, which is only used for his hob. And with talk of power cuts, he doesn't want to be cut off with no way to cook.

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,473 ✭✭✭bullit_dodger

    To be fair though jk, that's not the regulators' fault. Is it?

    Lots of people out there who don't switch. I'd be more clued in than most, and I didn't change myself for 7-8 years until recently. I'm 100% sure during that time (I was with SSE) that there were a number of deals going where I could have saved a few quid, but I didn't out of laziness. Partly because it never seems worth the hassle. The last time I switched (2013?) there was a balls up with the move and it put me off moving as it was a pain to convince them I'd paid and they were saying I never closed the account. Swore I wouldn't switch again as a result as it wasn't worth my time.

  • Registered Users Posts: 10,686 ✭✭✭✭Furze99

    Some ESB one on earlier, explaining why smart meters are a good idea and electricity between 5-7 will be charged more, so use your smart meter to avail of cheaper rates outside this blah blah. This to save the planet and even out supply needs etc.

    Then went onto say that all customers will get detailed analysis of their usage, that ESB Networks will take this data from the meters and store it in, wait for it - a 'data hub'!!! A 'data hub' is obviously the ESB corpo speak for what common mortals know these days as a 'data centre'. Yes, the evil data centres that use vast amounts of power!! She didn't seem to see the irony of this...

  • Registered Users Posts: 10,686 ✭✭✭✭Furze99

    That's largely because the idea that you benefit by switching suppliers is BONKERS itself. It's the complete opposite of logic, that you should instead look after your loyal customers. There's a case for banning it for existing customers and obliging loyalty discounts instead

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,996 ✭✭✭jkforde

    but we have the same crack with insurance corps, corps will screw people unless held in check, it's a natural consequence of human nature with unregulated systems.

    my point is they observe the culture in which they operate and if they experience one in which people say 'era, i couldn't be arsed'... well then, you get regulation and corp behaviour to match.

    muscles waste away if not flexed!

    ..maybe we should move this to the random thread, or just stop! 🙄


    🌦️ 6.7kwp, 45°, SSW, mid-Galway 🌦️

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,419 ✭✭✭DC999

    Yeah, there are justified age and education barriers for some. My folks do change gas and leechie every year now. And set reminders on when it expires. But at the start my Mam wanted to know who was providing the power when they moved, as in what company. Were worried they would lose power or get messed around. Took a while of explaining for her to get the energy providers are just a broker really. For some of a certain age it's not like the days of ESB being everything. Or Telecom Eireann....

    Plus you have certain discounts for pensioners. My folks lost that when moved home phone provider years ago and didn't spot it for a while. So that could slow them moving too.

    My elderly neighbour asked me to dial in his meter reading (which I was glad to do) as he couldn't use the automated phone service (had no speaker on his house phone so couldn't see what he typed and hear at same time). He didn't have any computer or smart phone.

    But if people can help those neighbours / family, (as in give them time to find the better deal), they would save a lot.

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭Citizen  Six

    Yeah, I send in my dads meter reading without his knowledge. I try to remind him, and he never gets it done. He got badly stung when it was read, after two years of estimated readings, and had to pay out a big chunk.

    A lot of suppliers take advantage of old people.

  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,902 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk

    It's called the household benefits package and your entitled to it if your on the contributary state pension or a state pension. Or a few other things.

    It's mainly 35 euro a month off electric and free tv license.

    My dad in that bracket now, with that + fit + solar + batteries + whatever credit we get this winter, they'll prob not pay anything in total for electric this year.

    Since last Nov I think they've only paid about 200, (200 euro credit, 350 Cashback for switching to EI, and 50 euro penalty for switching early to Energia!

    Also would be due any FIT from Feb to Aug on a 5kw inverter

    If your at that age bracket or your parents are, make sure you look it up.

    If on electric Ireland or bord gais I think it comes off your bill, anyone else you just get it into your bank account

    Ps technically I haven't switched in 3 yrs, but I have renewed every year. Because they were still the cheapest for me.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,095 ✭✭✭✭KCross

    To be fair, that wouldn’t be the providers fault. They dont read the meter. They bill based on the data that they are given.

    Is there a reason why the meter wasn’t read in 2 yrs? Is the meter behind a locked gate/door or something?

    ESB normally read the meter every ~4 months so for it to go 2yrs there is definitely something else going on there.

  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,331 ✭✭✭Citizen  Six

    Ah yeah, I'm aware it's not the providers fault regarding the meter reading. His meter is inside the house, so needs access to read, and he's never been home when reader called. Then never submitted a reading as he can't read it himself, and isn't very tech capable. But doesn't someone else doing it for him.

    But he's stayed with Electric Ireland for years, and hasn't been getting discount off his bill at all. People in these companies should be helping older people navigate the best deal with them.

    Similar with Vodafone, where they would give him a new handset, a month before his bill renewed, and tie him into a new two year contract. They'd put him on a really expensive contract, and the last time they didn't provide him with the iphone they were supposed to. Had to bring them to the small claims court to have it dealt with, when they refused to supply the phone he was paying for. They didn't even engage with the court.