I get angry when other people choose not to have kids

con___manx1

I Think the opposite to the op. having kids is selfish as your only having them to furfill your own life and give yourself a purpose.

This is the case with most people.

Your bringing them into a world where climate change, war and also possible future pandemics much worse than covid.

They will have to spend 60 hours a week to support there own 2 kids. Supporting them but actually not really raising them.

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119777960#Comment_119777960

So most people don't raise their kids yet spend 60 hours a week supporting them. Ok so Ted.

You know what I find? Most people who choose to not have kids are so wrecked with anxiety and their own personal issues that they cant have kids because of their own insecurities about life. These are people who can barely get by in life themselves, nevermind raising a family.

Greyfox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778341#Comment_119778341

Or maybe they just think there's loads of better ways to spend their free time

con___manx1

A few facts people dont think or care about before having kids.

During world war 2 the population of the world was around 2 billion. Today its over 7. Only 77 years after the war ended.

There was a serious pandemic during world war one which wiped out millions called the spanish flu.

With the population as big as it is today another serios pandemic is only a matter of time.

The plane was invented in 1903 today only 120 years later millions of planes are in the sky everyday.

We can already see the effects of climate change the last few years especially. Its only gonna get worse. Places on earth will become uninhabitable. This will happen in the next 30 to 40 years. You will then see mass immigration and most likely war.

People dont really care or even know about these facts because it doesn't afftect them to much today.

This is the world people are bringing there kids into. You most likely wont have to deal with it but your kids and there kids will thats for sure.

I love kids by the way. Me and my wife just dont want our own. We look after nieces and nephews and thats enough for us.

The above facts are pretty bleak. I suppose you cant look that far into the future. Could b dead tomorrow and all that.

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778371#Comment_119778371

That can be true too.

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778454#Comment_119778454

The world of today is infinitely better than the world of 50 years ago, 100 years ago, or ever really.

People who think that today's world is so bad that they don't want to bring kids into it, are into another form of religious/death cult talk that has existed for hundreds of years. Reminds me of those fools who think the world is going to end on a certain date because god wills it.

c.p.w.g.w

I think people have a choice now, whereas previous generations only option to remain childfree was celebasy...

The idea of having to get up every weekend to bring a child to ballet, gymnastics, football, hurling, rugby and/or soccer... And all the birthday parties then ...and the forced socially with other parents... seriously that is a full time job alone and then you have to work and do the school run, homework etc

3DataModem

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058260360/i-get-angry-when-other-people-choose-not-to-have-kids

You have some issues and you should seek to resolve them.

I share your purpose regarding kids, but I understand it not being a priority for younger people. The traditional family unit (one working in the home, one working outside) is more difficult to achieve and is also socially much less acceptable than it used to be, and that is leading young people away from setting up households or if they do, keeps them from starting a family. I cannot imagine two parents raising kids with both parents working; it seems utterly bonkers and impossible to me, but most people do it and are happy, so I know that it is largely my own bias and prejudices.

We've societally made it a lot easier for people to live independant and child-free lives, and the consequence of that is ... er ... less people wanting kids.

Potential-Monke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778341#Comment_119778341

Just to play Devils Advocate and even things out a bit.....

I reckon most people have kids to fill a void they have in their hearts/souls that they think will be filled with the alleged joy of being a parent. These are people who usually have such shallow materialistic lives, they think they need a mini version to compare to others to validate their own existence and make themselves feel better, but it's actually not about being a parent, it's still just all about them, as it always was, sometimes to the detriment of the children involved.

Tony EH

I basically think its selfish not to have children.

You have this arse backwards.

Having children is the most selfish thing a person can do. You make the choice to bring a person into this world, completely irrespective of their own wishes and as purely something that YOU want. You couldn't do a more selfish thing.

Making a choice not to have kids is actually an unselfish act.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782323#Comment_119782323

Exactly. The logic gets twisted to suit some warped way of thinking. I daresay a lot of people would be quite happy to never have been born at all. That's before we talk about the damage people do to the environment and the planet as a whole.

Having children is a perfectly natural thing. It should be treated as anything else and definitely not some noble act.

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782323#Comment_119782323

So unless you were an unplanned pregnancy your parents are selfish feckers?

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782483#Comment_119782483

No child gets a say in whether it wants to be born or not. They're not consulted as to their existence in the world for good or bad. So, yes, having a child is an entirely selfish act on behalf of the parents.

walshb

What am I reading?

The very reason we’re here is because we procreate based off our nature to do so.

There is absolutely nothing selfish to procreate and nothing selfish to not procreate..

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782892#Comment_119782892

Interesting. The parents had no say either though. So who do we blame all this selfishness on ultimately?

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782921#Comment_119782921

I agree with just banging out 10 kids these days the way my grandparents did back in the 50s. Irresponsible in my view in these different times. Im a bit confused by the extreme angle of every child is a selfish act though. Should we just go extinct? 😆

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782948#Comment_119782948

Yep. Exactly. As if all us parents who decided to procreate and start a family committed the ultimate selfish act (because we didn’t consult the unborn first). Absolute bonkers.

amacca

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119778341#Comment_119778341

It might be something to bear in mind that some people who appear to be choosing have no choice

And I'm not just talking about reproductive issues

What if the person just can't meet anyone they are particularly interested in having kids with etc etc.....should they just accept whoever is willing and able around the next corner?

Tbh I've also met lots of people with kids wrecked with anxiety and their own personal issues and insecurities....having kids won't always take that away and might precipitate for some

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782972#Comment_119782972

You could get the ouija board out with your partner to consult.

Or get future dad to drop his plums in 1 end of these and see if you get the green light on the other end 😂

Ffs OP.

It's simply none of your business whatsoever what people choose to do with their bodies and wether they choose to have kids or not.

This isn't the dark ages, or even the last century when it was still seen as the sole purpose for people, especially women.

We've progressed, ya know?

And great, that's your opinion. YOURS.

Other people have other views. Tis life. Get over it.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119782923#Comment_119782923

If a person WANTS a child and they subsequently HAVE a child, then they most definitely have a say. They're they only ones who actually have a say in the matter. So, in that respect, they are engaging in a thoroughly selfish endeavour.

Not that point doesn't excludes the fact that most parents will, after the deed is done, bend over backwards to raise that child, which is where the unselfish part of the act comes into play. But still the main thrust of the argument remains that the new person brought into existence had absolutely no say at all in whether they wanted to be here or not. That's all on the parents, or usually parent, who wanted to fulfil their own desire in the first place.

It's very difficult for most of us to understand, but there are millions of people out there who, given the choice, would rather they had never existed at all, even if their lives are relatively ok in the grand scheme of things.

AyeGer

“I get angry when other people choose not to have kids”.

That statement alone makes me angry. Mind your own f##king business OP.

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119785702#Comment_119785702

I should have been clearer. I mean the parents had no say in their own births either.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119785728#Comment_119785728

That doesn't eliminate the point.

The amount of imagined notions on this thread and the lack of awareness of how it's just their own notions and not necessarily true is actually hilarious.

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119785733#Comment_119785733

Whats the Tony EH solution from this point forward? Obviously someone needs to make this "selfish" choice to have a child or we're doomed. Who gets to do it?

Some people have children, so don’t. There’s nothing noble in the act. It’s just a thing that people do. I saw a cool card in a store the other day with “congratulations…..you did a thing” on the front. That pretty much sums up my views on people who have kids.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119786073#Comment_119786073

I've never understood why questioning the alleged need for ever more people elicits these sorts of hysterical reactions. If you want kids, have kids. Just stop pretending it's anything other than a choice you made that's somehow virtuous and noble.

Tony EH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119786073#Comment_119786073

That's not the point I'm making. It's not about "who" gets to make a choice. Obviously the parents or parent gets to do that.

The salient issue is the fundamental problem with calling people who don't want to have kids "selfish", which was the opening gambit on the thread. I would posit that the opposite is true and that most people who want kids do so out of a selfish desire to fulfil a need in themselves.

I am unable to make this any clearer.

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119786090#Comment_119786090

Ok. You want people who decide to have kids to own it. Ive no problem with that. Whos saying its a virtuous and noble act though? Ironically hysterical language there also. Whats the actual argument here? Do people who question it actually want population controls or do they just want people who choose to have kids to hang their heads in shame to make those who disagree with it happy?