I get angry when other people choose not to have kids

Undividual

I'm in my mid 30s with a wife, 2 kids (hoping to have a 3rd / maybe a 4th) and a mortgage.

Over the past few years, a fair number of friends and family have told me that they don't see having children in their future. For those who CANT have children, I can only sympathize. For those choosing not to have children, I really struggle to understand their point of view. A few female colleagues have said "If it happens, it happens." (which is the most flippant attitude to creating a person I can imagine).

I think that, personally, children made sense of the world and life for me. Suddenly I had a purpose beyond pleasure/comfort seeking. The things that used to seem important to me seem ridiculous now. I'm embarrassed by how much I used to waste time. I now have 2 jobs, and am looking for a third in order to provision. Before having kids, honestly, I resented having one job. Also, there is NO feeling like my child greeting me when I come home. NO ONE is happier to see me than my children. When mine started learning things and speaking, that feeling only intensified.

I basically think its selfish not to have children. In my opinion, it is taking your share without giving your share. Every person who will ever help you was raised from a baby to adulthood. That required SIGNIFICANT effort on the part of parents (and usually extended family). Both of my parents families often didn't have enough to eat. I think of all of the absolute MISERY that our ancestors went through, digging in the dirt for food, freezing to death, hunting wild animals, starvation, disease, war. regularly burying children, and other things too grim to contemplate. Even throughout those immense struggles, they managed to care for at least some of their children. Now, we allow the fact that we cant afford homes etc to prevent us from fulfilling our primary biological purpose, what the vast majority of parents consider to be their biggest achievement in life. Or people now simply can't be bothered with the effort required, and would rather play videogames, watch p*rn. or 'travel'.

Nowadays there seems to be a lot of people who feel guilty for existing, for taking up space/resources, not seeing that they are part of the beautiful, chaotic chain that is humanity. I heard someone say the other day that it is selfish to have children (I can't recall being so angry at someone I never met before). Having children is never an evil act! Children are not bad! They begin life COMPLETELY PURE! They are YOU, x number of years ago.

My mother is a carer and she often tells me about the last days of peoples' lives. I wonder do most young(ish) people seriously consider what their 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, and possibly 90s will look like. When friends have their own families to occupy their time, and there are less and less suitors knocking, and less desire to entertain them. How many holidays, pets, hours of videogames etc. does it take to feel content? We better pray there are robot carers (or willing immigrants) because there are simply not enough children being born to look after the ever-growing pensioner demographic. I dread to think how grim the world will be if we continue in the direction we are going.

If someone had said all of the above to me before I had kids, I probably would've laughed it off or dismissed the person as a nut. I don't know why I feel so strongly about this. I think a part of it is the shock I felt as I discovered how many people see a minimal responsibility towards the future of their own society. A part of me would prefer if I didn't care, but I don't know how to turn it off. I'm posting this because I want to know what other people think, and whether I'm alone in feeling this way.

Jequ0n

Congratulations on having found your purpose in life. Now leave the rest of us alone because we have better things to do than dedicating our lives to your cause.

Autosport

Does having a fur baby count 🤔🤔

StevenToast

Fascinating...i suggest you avoid the "Childfree by Choice" threads on boards!

I guess I'm strong and confident enough in myself and who I am to not seek fulfillment in a child.

notAMember

Gosh I definitely don't feel the same way.

I have children, and love them dearly, they enrich my life. But I thought long and hard before going down that road. Why should I procreate when the world is already over populated. Why should my genes go to another generation above any one elses? What if I had children who had illnesses or significant healthcare needs? How do I ensure my children contribute to humanity rather than being a drain.

If anything, the selfish choice is to have children, create more consumers on this planet for my own emotional well being. I'm fairly eco-conscious, but as they grow they consume vast amounts of clothes, food, plastic gifts are showered on them. It's a waste parade and I'm painfully aware of it.

Also, I don't know what age your kids are, but the teen years are definitely not the stream of Happy To See you joy you currently experience. ;)

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521160#Comment_119521160

What cause are you referring to, out of curiosity?

I think this person is on a windup though.

wench

If you're out working 2 or 3 jobs to provide for your ankle biters, when do you even see them?

I give my share by paying my taxes towards things I will never use, such as education, maternity hospitals, children's hospitals etc.

All the money I am not spending on children should cover a nurse/robot to look after me when the time comes.

frash

Personal issues is over there ------>

erlichbachman

TLDR - the purpose of genes is to create a brain so that genes can be replicated, and the op is unhappy if said brain is used for anything else

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521180#Comment_119521180

He's as bad as some of the angry gowls in the Childfree by choice gang!

Needs more CAPS.

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521182#Comment_119521182

Haha I'm sure the teens will be difficult, but that's fine.

Please, please, please don't measure your children's right to exist against trivial resources. People will figure out the problems that we are facing environmentally, and I am sure that we will get a lot wrong before we find the balance. But it takes time. Why are we pulling the handbrake on procreation for a problem that really is only widely acknowledged for the last 30 years?

wench

People pulled the handbrake on procreation as soon as contraception became widely available.

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521194#Comment_119521194

I WFH most of the week and I don't work on the weekend (yet).

I would guess that taxes wont be able to cover pensions and healthcare in 20-30 years. What will the age of retirement be in 2050? With luck, technology will drastically reduce the cost of living and healthcare, but that is not a guarantee.

SnuggyBear

Is this guy for real? 3 jobs? Fair play I suppose.

I'm selfish and lazy so I don't have children. I also find them very annoying.

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521243#Comment_119521243

Fair point

Citizen Six

Jesus christ, four kids sounds like a nightmare to me.

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521248#Comment_119521248

He is 😅

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521198#Comment_119521198

TLDR - Says it all really

mrcheez

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhirAQ7lR6E

...just as soon as the right one comes along 🤣

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521252#Comment_119521252

A lot of work, to be sure. One set of my grandparents had 10 children, the other had 5.

I basically see it as an initial 10 year investment (of which the first 6 months is the toughest), after which things should get gradually easier.

erlichbachman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521261#Comment_119521261

"If someone had said all of the above to me before I had kids, I probably would've laughed it off or dismissed the person as a nut. I don't know why I feel so strongly about this."

you now know the reason you feel so strongly about it, set yourself free, use the brain for something else

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521300#Comment_119521300

I think we've perfectly juxtaposed the difference between a person who is concerned about the society s/he lives in and a person who is concerned about the society her/his children will live in.

You think that what you're saying is clever. I think that if your parents thought as you do, there would be one less comment on this topic.

Does freedom mean not having responsibility? If so, you can keep it.

Eggs For Dinner

OP, I know for sure you're the type of family I dread to be near in a restaurant, on a plane, in the park etc. Full of smug self satisfaction as your perfect kids behave like feral cats 'in a charming way' to the detriment of those around you

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521181#Comment_119521181

To be clear, I didn't seek fulfilment in a child. I wasn't expecting to see things differently. It's impossible to expect.

If you've never heard fathers talking about the experience of seeing their child being born, I'd recommend asking one. Personally, it was the pivotal moment in my life.

I'm glad you're strong and confident, though in my opinion, it's a shame you won't pass those qualities on to your children. The world would be a better place if good people had more children.

Ben D Bus

You think it's selfish to not have children then go on to say how having kids is necessary in order to be looked after in later life? Then in a later response refer to children as an "investment"?

Hypocritical, no?

amdublin

I think you should mind your own business

Undividual

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521403#Comment_119521403

You haven't a clue about my family. Feel free to speculate if you must.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119521422#Comment_119521422

It's possible I won't pass them on to potential children. Perhaps they will only have the worst of me? It's also possible I would be devastated at the end of my life as I know it should I give birth and I do know many a father and indeed mother who do not share your views on childbirth.

In fact I think there is a lot of starry eyed bullshit around the reality of pregnancy, birth and the first few months of a child's life.

It is a very good thing Undividual that there are people who choose not to have children.