Abuse of Referees

Leroy42

And the ref did all that you said. He requested they come out. They refused. One minute ref, turned into another minute, and another. And you yourself wanted another 30 seconds.

This is 100% on Ballinagleary. I am not reaching for any angle. People are looking for excuses for them. But the facts are clear. HT is 10 minutes. THey were informed they needed to return to the field, and they refused. (Again, doesn't matter why they didn't come out, the end result is they refused to heed the instructions of the ref).

I get that teams sometimes are out late, and refs gives some leeway and allowance. In this case it would appear that rather than taking that leeway, Ballinagleary decided that the rules are as they saw them and refused to return to the field.

Your first post on this was that it was the ref causing the problem. You continue to say the ref is to blame. He isn't. They are. 100%. They decided the rules didn't apply to them, ignored the pleas from the ref, and then got annoyed when they were called out on it.

I fully expect the game will be replayed, as the GAA always sides with the teams and it is always someones else's fault. HT is 10 minutes. That is the rule. That it is normally given leeway does not remove the rule. They broke the rule, the ref called the game.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120803041#Comment_120803041

"I fully expect the game will be replayed"

So do i as the ref did not follow protocol, regardless of the actions of the Ballinaglera team.

His mistake was more detrimental to the game, than a team being a minute (s?) late back out onto the pitch......

For example :

 "A player may not play with a hurley the bas of which exceeds 13 cm in width with the exception of the Goalkeeper Should a player, who has already been warned by the Referee, persist in playing with a hurley which does not comply with the above, she shall be dismissed from the field of play in accordance with Rule 41.9 (c)." 

Martin Fogarty ;

The oversized bas is another issue Fogarty addresses. The vast majority of those currently being manufactured are illegal as per the GAA Official Guide Part II, Rule 4.5 – “the bas of a hurley at its widest point shall not be more than 13cm”.

In his work as development manager, Fogarty took photographs of well-used hurleys and the area of the bas where the ball was being struck most.

“There was an inch if not two of wasted bas. This massive bas is only adding weight to the hurl. A bigger sweet spot is mentioned but I’ve looked at the hurls and it’s still the same spot that’s being hit. The larger bas is awkward.” 

Its clear to see that a lot of elite hurlers are using hurlers whose bás are bigger than 13cm.

So should the refs be sending off Gillane, Callanan , Reid etc ?

Cos technically, 'that is the rule' ?? (as you say)

callaway92

Leroy and Bass Reeves get it thankfully

Stop with the victim blaming here

Lads trying to take the piss out of a ref and then when he calls their bluff they throw a tantrum. Fck them

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120805070#Comment_120805070

🤣🤣

Fairly simplistic reply there kid.

Leroy42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120806907#Comment_120806907

Simplistic because it cuts to the chase.

Ballinagleary refused to come out to start the second half. Ref gave them plenty of opportunity to rethink this decision. They refused to obey the instructions.

The Ref, fed up with the lack of respect for his time, their opponents, the supporters and the GAA rules, deemed that they were taking the p1ss.

However, instead of outright abandoning the game he restarts it and at that point, Balliagleay decides that the rules do actually matter and abuse the ref for not sticking to the rules. They could have retaken the field, and using the illegal advantage they took from the extra time at HT, taken on their opponents. Instead, they decided to abuse the ref to the point where the ref abandoned the game.

Thats it. 100% fault to Ballinagleary. You, from the very start, have looked to blame the ref when it seems that the ref did everything he could to try to get Ballinagleary to abide by the rules. They chose not to and paid the price.

I think the game will be replayed, but I hope Ballnagleary are kicked out of the competition. Teams need to learn that the rules are not there for whenever they think they should apply and can act like this and then claim they have been wronged. They screwed up, why should anyone but themselves pay the price?

Once again, Ballinaglealy could have retaken the field, finished the game and then lodged a complaint. They, again deciding that rules don't relate to them, instead abused the ref and that is what caused the game to be abandoned.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120807087#Comment_120807087

I dont agree. At all.

"The Ref, fed up with the lack of respect for his time, their opponents, the supporters and the GAA rules, deemed that they were taking the p1ss."

you are trying to guess what a ref is thinking, and using that as a fact.... Mindreader?

"Ballinagleary refused to come out to start the second half."

Once again, you are supposing - As most people say they didnt/wouldnt come out on time? ie delaying the start of the 2nd half?

"They could have retaken the field, and using the illegal advantage they took from the extra time at HT"

What ?? Its common knowledge that they were on their way out of the dressing room ! About 15 seconds after the ball is in the net the Ballinaglera player are on the pitch.

"Once again, Ballinaglealy could have retaken the field, finished the game and then lodged a complaint. They, again deciding that rules don't relate to them, instead abused the ref and that is what caused the game to be abandoned."

Why would Ballinaglera have to lodge a complaint??? 😣

Well, they do now im sure, after the ref didnt follow procedure.

The game will be replayed, and Ballinaglera will be fined for delaying the game.

*and the clubs name is Ballinaglera 

callaway92

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120806907#Comment_120806907

‘Kid’

Are you taking the piss or what saying stuff like that? Cop on

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120807549#Comment_120807549

🤣🤣

Whats your problem ?

flatty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120807248#Comment_120807248

So, in your book, any team is able to delay the start of the second half for as long as they like, subject to a financial penalty only?

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120809435#Comment_120809435

Where did i say that?

delay by 1 hr ? 2hrs? etc Is that what you are lining up? Unlucky......

Leroy42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120809539#Comment_120809539

But what do you think should happen if they refuse to come out at half time or delay for 1 hour? Your posts suggest that everybody simply waits around and the ref writes a report afterwards.

callaway92

Everything else aside, whoever is ‘right or wrong’. Greenspurs, your attitude on the thread is pretty stink. Not enjoyable debating with etc.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120809970#Comment_120809970

Ouch... (Attack the post , not the poster???) 🤔

I have backed up every point made.

No one else has.

You are the one that got enraged.

Happyilylost

Rules are rules. They weren't followed by the referee. His decision to throw up the ball to restart the match is some symbolic gesture that somewhere along the line became "a done thing".

First off the rules. (Which to be fair have been posted but for some reason seem to be ignored)

Late Fielding. (i) A team taking the field late before game: Penalties: County or Provincial - Fine €100; Club Fine €20 - for every five minutes or part thereof up to 15 minutes, and thereafter for every minute or part thereof up to 30 minutes.  For over 30 minutes after the appointed Starting Time, the Game shall be considered as conceded and shall be Awarded to the Opposing Team, unless exceptional circumstances prevail. (ii) (a) A team responsible for a half time interval being exceeded as specified in Rules 3.3 and 3.7 Rules of Specification:  Penalties: County or Provincial - Fine €80 for every minute or part thereof; Club - Fine €10 for every minute or part thereof. (b) A team responsible for an Interval period allowed being exceeded by more than 10 minutes:  Penalty: Forfeiture of Game and Award to the Opposing Team.

So once the 10 minute half time is up a club can be fined for every minute they are late and if later than 10 minutes the referee can abandon the game and award to opposing team.

I'm not defending club or referee tbh. I ref myself and all I'll say is the decision the ref took he 100% knew the reaction it would evoke. So why do it? What if the team accepted the goal being conceded and carried on and finished the game? The result would of been thrown out anyway so what was he gaining from it? Club were obviously taking the p**s as well.

The referee had the rules to back himself but chose a different path for some reason.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120811855#Comment_120811855

Well put.

That was what i have been saying all along...

But thats 'Victim Blaming' apparently in here ?? 🤔😏

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120811855#Comment_120811855

Referees as you know yourself are getting scarce on the ground. The amount of lads in there 60's refereeing matches is absolutely huge.

Most may not have kept up with the change in rules especially with regards to technical runes around matches

Look at what happened here. Ballinaglera were 2-6 to 4 points down I think. AnaG were back on the pitch and I imagine the 10 minutes had well expired. The BG coach decided in the dressing rooms he was not obeying the referee instructions ( which the whistle indicated).

It has become a habit of coaches at club level ( many now being paid) to think they should manage the game not the referee. I imagine he did not know the rule that HT is ten minutes just like many older refs are probably not completely au fait with rule changes around the technical aspect of match management.

I expect that the BG players and coach did not know the rules either and we're just abusive over the fact that the ''15 minutes'' was not up.

At the end of it if the CB decide it's a replay they should f@@k BG out of the competition or give them the maximum fine for abusing the referee.

BG should have finished the game and not abused the referee.

You also have to remember you as a referee should know that f@@k all would happen if the referee put in his notes BG were 5 minutes late coming onto the pitch after half time. The CB would not fine the club.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120811882#Comment_120811882

BS with your ''victim blaming'' the referees blew the whistle twice for them to come out. A BG club member went in and told the team management that the referee would start the game without them and they choose not to come back onto the field. They were losing a match and the team management decided that they were the most important people involved and did not need to obey the referee instructions.

It's pretty similar to the three lads being killed driving down the wrong side of the motorway. Blame the Garda who followed them.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812229#Comment_120812229

So much 'supposing' and ' i expect' being used...... No Facts?

At least do you research before lecturing people?

The score was 1-6 to 1-4 to Allen Gaels at halftime.

"Most may not have kept up with the change in rules especially with regards to technical runes around matches" - jesus...🙄

Fault : (I think most reasonable people would agree?)

Ballinaglera :

Delaying the restart of the game (no excuse to say they thought its 15mins allowed - Makes it worse actually )

Ref :

Restarting the game without following proper procedure - a massive mistake/error/ 'Ill show them whos boss'

Ballinaglera :

Some of their players surrounding the ref over/because of his decision

Ref :

Abandoning the game because he was confronted by aggrieved players due to his decision to restart without them.

I think they are the indisputable facts we can go on?

Whose the 'Victim' ? Whose to 'Blame' ?

Whats the ref a victim of ? My blame ?? Id say he'll live with that......

Happyilylost

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812229#Comment_120812229

I agree with a lot of what you say. To be honest a lot of these teams take the p**s out of us (referees). One I love in the same vein is this. Won't come out. Whistle after whistle. Then I go thundering in towards the dressing room. Lad keeping "watch" at the dressing room door and just as I get close enough to kick it in a knock on the door and they come flying out past me. (some laughing)

I've put in my match report if a team is late out but tbh honest I've no idea if this leads to a fine as it should. I'm guessing not.

This is my issue with the ref. Why oh f**king why. Put yourself in his shoes. Anybody in the GAA knows what reaction he was going to get (the abuse) yet he did it. Maybe he was annoyed or the game had been difficult to manage but this seemed an extreme response. Maybe people would rate him as a stronger ref than me and maybe that's right. But for me I want to be as anonymous as I can. So not in a month of Sunday's would I have taken his path. And at that his path was wrong. Now lets be honest if the 10 extra mins had lapsed and he abandoned the game and awarded it to the opposing team the abuse would of been the same and maybe worse.

Look if it's like the support we get here in Galway he'll probably be told he was in the wrong and brought it upon himself. Reason why it's so hard to ref. No support anywhere. For that reason I'm surprised he didn't go for the quiet life and get the team out and give them a bollacking. It's a no win situation sometimes....

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812415#Comment_120812415

Why not stay in at dressing rooms as the ref and dont leave until both teams are out on the pitch. you should enter pitch after both teams. that allows the ref to not let this situation happen.

Happyilylost

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812435#Comment_120812435

Not Croke we are reffing in unfortunately. Sometimes I'm coming from my car. Sometimes I don't leave the pitch at all. But again to be clear I have to be on the pitch and blow my whistle to indicate that the 10minutes has lapsed and teams are now late on the pitch. They can't be late if I have indicated this.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812415#Comment_120812415

Rule number 1 as a ref - Look after yourself.

As you say - he knew (and so would everyone else) what would happen as soon as he threw that ball in and they scored.

Its a typical response from any team when a ref makes a massively important decision in any game.

As a ref you have to use 'common' sense also - Did he not weigh up what would happen ?

A) wait an extra 1 or 2 mins for them to come out of the dressing room? They are taking the pee, but i'll survive.

B) 'Feck them , ill just throw the ball in, that'll teach em.'

As i said before - Common practice would be the ref goes into his changing room if one, and/or both teams go to theirs.

You have control, and you dont give them the opportunity to stay in longer if you go out to the halfway line.

Then you can stay at the door, and 'force' them to go out on time.

If you feel they are taking the pee then, theres always 'ways and means' of 'getting your own back' during the second half. That does happen.

A soft free against them here and there, no free when they should etc ........ That is what happens. I know this.

And no, i dont think hes a 'stronger ref' for doing what he did. He was silly, and his maverick approach will cause the game to be replayed.

So now the other team will be aggrieved !

As a ref you must follow the rules/laws of the game - Not make them up to make a point!

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812435#Comment_120812435

It's a club match and this time of year a league match so a lot of these matches are at ground where county championship are not played.

Many ground will not have specialised referee rooms. Most referees come changed and will spend HT on the pitch talking may to an umpire or two they will have bought with them if the match is a contentious.

Referees is obliging both teams ya he gets a few bob but very few do it for the money. He may have had something in that evening, he may be a shift worker and due into work at a certain time.

He blew the whistle twice and a BG person told them he was going to throw in the ball without them.

It was total disrespect by BG coach and management. If the coach is being paid by the club it's worse.

No matter what mistake a referee makes he should not have to put up with personal abuse that seems common place now by coaches and players if they make any little mistakes or if a team loses a game by a point or two.

But of course we have the apologists who will bring ''victim blaming'' into it

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812714#Comment_120812714

What , does that mean???

Apart from the supposing/maybe/hypothesising ...... 🙄

downthemiddle

Awful story coming out of Tyrone tonight. Who brings a knife to a game?

evolvingtipperary101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815902#Comment_120815902

Police attended the scene of an alleged stabbing at a Gaelic football match in Cookstown tonight (Thursday). 

The alleged stabbing took place at the under 16s Championship semi-final match between Cookstown Fr Rocks and Fintona Pearses.

Cookstown Fr Rocks confirmed that a “disturbing and very serious incident” had occurred.

The Ambulance Service has confirmed the incident and one person was taken to hospital. 

A spokesperson said: “The Northern Ireland Ambulance Service received a 999 call at 9.03pm following reports of an incident in the Convent Road area of Cookstown on Thursday.

“NIAS despatched an emergency crew to the incident.

Seth Brundle

I read a tweet earlier that suggested that the U16 knife victim wasn't the intended target but the ref was...

https://twitter.com/CahairOKane1/status/1677063661448224770?t=oVJATnpNb1M8NikM-SG7cg&s=19

evolvingtipperary101

Two people stabbed

fullstop

Referees country-wide should go on a 4 week strike and hit the GAA where it hurts. The lack of action from the association towards violent incidents aimed at referees and players is an absolute disgrace and needs an example made of it. Lucky someone wasn’t killed tonight.

greenspurs

Who in the name of fcuk brings a knife to , or go gets a knife during, an u16 game on a thursday evening .....

For fcuk sake....... And then to go use it on someone.... Crazy , batsh1t crazy.

😣

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120812714#Comment_120812714

That many clubs dont have a specific dressing room for a ref is wrong but irrelevant. they shouldnt spend it on pitch. and same before the game. they shouldnt enter pitch until after both teams have entered the pitch. a coach being paid is irrelevant.

i do agree about a ref should never have to put up with any of that