Moving my kids to another GAA club

AineM2013

I've 5 kids and 4 of them play for a local club. We registered last year but not this year due to a number of issues i can't go into here. We did not register this year to see what we might do. One of my kids is 15 currently but was under 14 last year, the other child is 12 now and was under 12 last year, the other two are a good bit younger. My query is that we want to move the kids to another club. They are putting obstacles in our way. They will only release the kids to the club of my wife hometown or my club in my hometown where I grew up. One is within the county and one outside the county. I'm not sure if the club have a parish rule. They won't allow us to move the kids to a club about 15 miles away. The club we want to move hasn't as good a record or as high as numbers.

So if anyone out there can assist or help with advice that would be amazing. I have not been in touch with the County board only the club. TIA

keeponhurling

I feel that to be able to assist, a little more context is needed. Like, what is the reason for the request to move ?

AineM2013

I can't go into the specifics or the particulars but the kids moved to a different school and two of the kids were experiencing issues with some kids on the team. We have had a number of meetings and the outcome was we were not allowed to move to the new club where the kids attend school only to the club the parents are affliated to.

howiya

I'd contact your county board. It is strange that the current club is telling you who your kids can move to. It could be related to the bye laws within the county governing club transfers.

Just from my own experience (Dublin), transfers are adjudicated on by the county board. Our club wouldn't be able to say you can leave but only if you go here. That's not how it works but different counties have different bye laws.

Former Former Former

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248142#Comment_119248142

Why on earth should a parent have to explain why they want to move their kids to another club?

munsterfan2

Make it a Child Welfare issue, nothing like waving that stick to put sense into people. Involve the club / county child welfare officer. Some people in some clubs seem to forget that underage football is just a game and it should all be about enjoyment, and personal development for the kids.

homewardbound11

This is the sickening part of the GAA. It happened to me and I stopped playing it .

was playing with one club but went to school on another . Transferred to the other club as it was closer and I had a better connection . I was in a neutral parish so I had no affiliation to either back in the day.

the old club objected to 2 titles I won with the new club and their so called representatives turned up a soccer matches to abuse me verbally . “ your no f€€€king good “ etc “ your only out of bed “whilst his own son was playing on the same team as me .

That individual played “briefly” for the county back in the 70s and what a little man he turned out to be . I watch him now stand by his grandchildren as they line out for the county and wonder would have have said that to them what he said to me .

By the way I’m a soccer coach .

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119251542#Comment_119251542

Yeah I gave it up years ago also. The whole organisation is full of politics and corruption.

I remember one team having 2 managers with 7/8 kids between them. There were players who never saw a game. I got sick of it so did relatives. We don't get our kids involved now. They pursue other interests

BnB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058251640/moving-my-kids-to-another-gaa-club

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119248854#Comment_119248854

You mention that "they won't release the players" and "we were not allowed to move to the new club". You also say, that you have not been in touch with the county board so I presume that it is the current club that is standing in your way.

It is not the current club who gets to decide where your kids can and can't go. It is 100% the County Board that decides. Your current club can object to the transfer based on whatever grounds they want, but ultimately it is the county board that decide.

So, you need to get onto the County Board and look for a transfer request form. In the form, I would keep in simple and just say they are transferring to the club where they go to school. Then your current club will have a chance to object if they wish and the county board will make a call on it..... From there, if you are not happy with the decision, you can appeal etc

But, nothing is going to happen until you formally apply.

Also, I don't know if you have done it already, but it would also be worthwhile talking to someone in the club you wish to move to as they may be able to give you a hand with the paperwork/process etc

fatherted1969

Are transfers processed in January in most counties ?

TheAnalyst_

Simple solution is take them to the nearest rugby club that suits.

CornerForward10286

I’m some parish ruled areas you cannot just play with who u like. You live in a town, you have an address in the town, you play with club in the town. You live in country area, you play with club in the boundaries of the parish. In certain circumstances this may be changed.

Uncle Pierre

OP - it would be helpful to know at least which county you're based in, even if you don't want to give away too many details. Transfer bye-laws vary from one county to the next.

However, all have to comply with the general rules of the Association, with the main one still being the First Club rule (colloquially known as "the parish rule"). People can't just up sticks and move from any one club to any other at any given time, whenever they feel like it.

I'm involved in GAA admin at a fairly high level myself and would like to give you the most accurate advice possible, but in order to do so, I'd need the sort of details that I'm guessing you're reluctant to share publicly. PM me if you like.

Uncle Pierre

In the meantime, there's some correct and good advice above that it's not up to your current club to refuse a transfer, and application should instead be made to your County Board. And in particular, there's a rule of the Association that says no County Board shall stand in the way of a transfer of an underage player where there's a genuine and serious child welfare issue at stake.

Note that doesn't necesssarily mean though that you can choose any club to move to, as your County Board could still have bye-laws on which clubs are actually available to you.

Certain other advice given above is not so accurate or helpful, and that's all I'll say about any of those contributions.

Anyway, the offer to PM me for further advice still stands, so up to you.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119273499#Comment_119273499

That's mad - these are not inter county 'stars' - they're just kids 12-15 yr olds. You wouldn't like to see them lose out, but if I was the parent involved, I wouldn't go along with this bullying. Lots of other sports that can be pursued that don't have this nonsense. Saw a bit of this carry on with the Community Games of all things, neighbouring areas bitching about children and I mean children who wanted to go along with their friends. Shameful stuff.

fatherted1969

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119251422#Comment_119251422

Think this is awful advice, this is a club officer issue, no need to be putting a slight on the coaches

cj maxx

Munsterfan is basically saying what I think. My children are younger 9-11 but my ex wife took them to the club her football mad father was involved with, and away from the club ( but for the pandemic) i wanted to bring them where their school friends played at and they knew no-one and promptly quit. Underage sport is playtime, exercise

celt262

You will probably have to wait till next January anyway I think same County transfers are only allowed early in the year.

Peintre Celebre

God, absolute state of the club and GAA here. You'd swear it was the premier league. They're kids ffs you think they'd let them move

Clareman

My suggestion would be to make contact with the club you want to transfer to and explain the situation. More than likely they will take over the whole transfer sage but more importantly they'll make accommodations to allow your children play, they won't be able to be county board games but they'll be able to train or blitzes, common sense will kick in fairly quickly. Most clubs will have a policy to block players leaving and the executive will just go by the rules and not give any support, especially if communication is done over email or text.

celt262

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119278068#Comment_119278068

They wouldn't be insured unless they are registered with the club so not allowed play or train with another club.

StupidLikeAFox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119276412#Comment_119276412

Well it's one of the cornerstones of the organisation, its deliberately designed to prevent a transfer market and players moving at will to more attractive clubs, and it's v successful at doing that. Its bad when it comes to cases like the OPs situation (although we don't know the issue and they haven't actually been denied a transfer yet), but on the whole it protects the integrity of the club structures

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119278671#Comment_119278671

It's a very parochial structure - for a country that's not so fond of some borders, we've far too many borders at local level. Might have suited a carless rurally based agricultural society in the early 20th century where people grew up, married locally and lived/ worked locally. Not so much in the current modern Ireland.

Live near parish & county borders ourselves and it's striking how many facets of society from community games to GAA to bin collections to health services and school transport etc it impacts on.

BaywatchHQ

Spare a thought for Ballinderry Shamrocks, they are a Derry club as their pitch and church is in Derry but most of their members come from South of river in Tyrone. They have a long history of having good players on the Derry team but much of the area supports Tyrone. I am even aware of some of the Derry players being Tyrone fans.

Ahshurlookit

Have a word with someone in the club outside the county and explain the situation. Transfer in to them and immediately transfer out to the club you want the kids to play for. If the new club don't object there should be no issues.

StupidLikeAFox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119282050#Comment_119282050

You cant do that - you can transfer out of a county no bother but if you transfer back in o the original county within 96 weeks you have to go back to the same club.

Uncle Pierre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119278068#Comment_119278068

As @celt262 says in the very next post, absolutely do NOT do this. I know the suggestion was made with the best of intentions, but there's no getting away from the fact that it's not a good suggestion. If your children are not properly registered with that other club, they are absolutely not covered if they suffer any injury or other mishap even in training or practice matches. It would be wholly irresponsible of the other club to allow this, and they'd be badly exposed if anything did happen to any of your children.

You could even sue that club for recovery of medical expenses or other damages, on the grounds that they shouldn't have let your children play, even though they'd ostensibly have been doing you a favour in the first place. Might sound far-fetched, but similar things have happened in clubs in the past.

OP seems to have gone from this thread at this stage anyway, so unlikely to be back myself either. Offer to PM me still stands.

CornerForward10286

The parish rule is there in a lot of places as a Gaa rule and it protects the smaller clubs in general. Otherwise u have a transfer market type scenario where big clubs will swoop on top players of smaller clubs. That’s one of the biggest reasons for it.

Uncle Pierre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119278671#Comment_119278671

And just before I go - this is absolutely spot on, as regards the very ethos of the Association. From the Official Guide:

the Gaelic Athletic Association is community centred, based on the allegiance of its members to their local Clubs and Counties

Other sporting organisations are purely club-based. The GAA is community-based. Those of us immersed in the GAA consider it one of its greatest strengths. Others consider it a major fault. There are people here on both sides of that divide!

Clareman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119282444#Comment_119282444

Hold on a second, how is that not a good suggestion? The players want to move to a different club, how is talking to the other club a bad idea? They'll know what'll have to be done and will no far more than people on an internet forum, no club is going to let a player play without proper registration and insurance and I was never suggesting that. Talk to the new club to see what they can do, they will point you in the proper direction.

Uncle Pierre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119282551#Comment_119282551

From your first post:

"they won't be able to be county board games but they'll be able to train or blitzes" (I presume you meant to say "play in blitzes")

This is where it's not a good suggestion. They won't be covered for training, blitzes, or any other activity with that club if they are not properly registered members of that club. Club and parents alike would be irresponsible to allow children take part in such activity without being registered and therefore properly covered.

Not a bad suggestion to at least talk to the other club, but definitely not a good suggesion to say they could take part in training/blitzes with that other club in the meantime.

fatherted1969

You need to be registered with your club to be covered by insurance, there's loads of examples of clubs having to cover costs of an uninsured player. Don't go down this route.

In my county boys can only transfer during the month of January, not sure if this is the case in every county.

farmerval

In my County underage players can transfer at any time provided they have not played championship for their current team in the current year. e.g. they cannot play in a championship with two different clubs in one year.

Here in a dual county hurling and football are separated in the Calender and not all clubs have teams in both at all ages, so transfers are regular enough, e.g. a player that prefers hurling might be in a club that doesn't have a hurling team in their age bracket might transfer to a club that does.

The standard procedure is the club you wish to join sends the form to the County Board who contact the club you were with, and if they sign off all is well and done.

threeball

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119282465#Comment_119282465

The first club rule is certainly beneficial but its far too strict. There are plenty of cases where the kids just aren't compatible with the club due to ties elsewhere, not having friends there etc. and I know of one situation where the club isn't fit for purpose, Constantly not fielding, conceding games, randomly dropping age grades. Kids shouldn't have to deal with such environments and county boards should have enough cop on to deal with clubs like that and do the best for the kids involved.

theoneeyedman

Ultimately, you as the parent of the kids will decide who the kids play with, not the club who they have played with or anyone else. It just depends how much hassle you are prepared to cause to get your way.

There are rules and County bye laws, but ultimately the law of the land is what takes precedent. My own club has rightly and wrongly been involved in a few of these cases, and once parents dig the rules are meaningless.... Threaten to get the lads with the wigs involved and you'll see.

I'd normally be against getting legal eagles involved, but this rule is a very blunt instrument for today's society, with mobile families and different societal changes. Most officials know this and are very fair-minded, but all it takes is one asshole with a bit between his teeth to cause a lot of hassle.

deiseindublin

Some counties have Parish rule, others don't, so it sounds like yours does.

I'm presuming that, with five children, you are hoping to transfer both boys and girls, so don't forget that you will have to transfer for all three associations, which all happen at different times of the year. If you want transfer to go through without current club approving it/signing form you will have to find out the different lengths of time that you can't have played a competitive game with all three associations also. My advice would be to contact the country registrar for GAA, LGFA and Camogie and get the definitive answer.

TAFKAlawhec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119310559#Comment_119310559

The law courts on both sides of the border generally don't get involved in such cases that you mention above as they (quite rightly) don't get involved in the rules of private groups and associations with the exception of demonstrating visible harm or discrimination because of the rules they set i.e. they don't determine what group of membership can is provided. Some arsehole may try and threaten the legal route and while some might fold in the face of this others will simply tell them "Go ahead!" knowing that they'll likely win and get their costs covered. In any case, a failure to constructively go through the rule book regarding membership & transfers in the GAA both through the Official Guide & local bye-laws up to & including the DRA will highly unlikely impress a court of law. As it is, the DRA has in the past passed at least one verdict on a matter such as this and IIRC they determined that the players in question would have to formally nullify their GAA membership first, nothing that simply not paying annual membership dues with the last club you paid them to doesn't cease your membership of the GAA.

As it is, in most Ulster counties at least transfers of youth players away from their first clubs tends to attract very heavy scrutinty even when the club being left by the player has no objection to the transfer. Quite often a youth transfer will only be sanctioned by the county if it can be unambiguously shown that the player looking to transfer to a new club is now permanently living in the catchment area of the new club and has done so for a minimum time period e.g. three months. If even a sniff of cute hoorism is suspected in trying to get the transfer approved, it'll be immediately rejected.

Personally, all parents/guardians wishing for their child to get involved in GAA sports should be aware of the rules regarding youth transfers at both central and local levels if they have any idea that they might want to move them to a different club in the future. If you don't like the current rules, then either don't have your children get involved in elements of the association that you'd rather not wish to be associated with, or get a club in question to propose an amendment to either their county for local bye-laws or for the GAAs annual congress to change the Offical Guide on how such transfers are handled. Contrary to what many parents in such scenarios think, your child in over 99% of cases isn't deserving of special treatment when looking a transfer.

Uncle Pierre

^

Excellent post above.

And for what it's worth, it's not just Ulster counties where transfer applications for underage players are properly and thoroughly scrutinised according to the rule book. You can't just up and move from one club to another because of a personal grievance or some other such issue, no matter where you are in Ireland.

arctictree

Surely in this day and age, it should be soley up to the parents of a child where that child should play? Child welfare/safety should be the priority.

theoneeyedman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455903#Comment_119455903

It is.

It's not a professional sport, there are no contracts, and we don't live in the 1930's where where are defined family units that last a lifetime. People move, go to different schools, circumstances change, and for the most part players are rightly allowed to play where they want.

You do get lugs like the Killerrerin chairman who recently tried (unsuccessfully I may add) to dig his heels in to make an example of Shane Walsh, but ultimately while they can make it awkward of they feel like it, the player will play where the player wants to play, or else the player will just decide they don't want the hassle and give up on the game altogether.

I can understand up to a point why the GAA try to to maintain the parish unit, but increasingly, the parish has become less relevant in general. Many families wouldn't know or care what parish they live in nowadays.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119456251#Comment_119456251

Why would the Killererin chairman be trying to prevent Shane Walsh leaving Kilkerrin-Clonberne?

FlubberJones

Tell them to go and f*ck themselves and introduce the kids to a proper sport like football or rugby... all that bollox about the 'parish'... what a crock of inbred shite

crossman47

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119458551#Comment_119458551

I presume your tongue is firmly in your cheek.

crossman47

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119458606#Comment_119458606

Its a worthwhile protection against bigger clubs hoovering up all the best players in the neighbourhood.

StupidLikeAFox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119458606#Comment_119458606

My nephew was on a very successful underage team in rugby up until he was around 15, then they lost 5 or 6 core players who went off to play for better clubs or schools teams and the club had to start from scratch. The same happened to the local soccer team when I was in secondary, they had a great team until few were picked up by academies in home farm, St pats etc and the local team fell apart.

I know its unlikely to be much comfort to the op but this is exactly what the gaa is trying to avoid, and they are pretty good at it

arctictree

I can see both sides to the transfer arguments.

There are two clubs near me, club A is very successful, has a great juvenile setup and plays in division I (and also has 2nd teams in lower divisions). They form the backbone of the county team too at all age levels. Club B on the other hand plays in division 6 and struggles to field teams. I cant remember the last time they had a player in the development squad.

I can really understand why a promising young lad would not want to play with Club B. On the other hand, club B needs these players. Its a hard one to call.

theoneeyedman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119458551#Comment_119458551

A typo, of course, no intention to beamirch the Killererin Chairperson in any way, assuming they are not involved in this saga 😂

By and large, protections against needless transfers, especially from smaller clubs to bigger ones, where players will fall out of the system somewhere along the line inevitably.

My point is that the parish rule is a poor mechanism nowadays. There are always ways around it, I've seen a So called bigger club poach 14 year old from us for instance, where the lads head was turned by a family member, and because his mother was born in that parish he got his transfer eventually (following a pretty overt threat of legal action.). As usual, the rulebook can always be beaten if there is enough pressure out on, and the threat of a long public battle (eg if poor Johnny has his picture in the paper saying the big bad GAA man won't let me play football with my friends).

threeball

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119459903#Comment_119459903

Sometimes Club B need to get up off their hole and actually put the work in to create the structures needed to hold on to players. There's far too many clubs that exist for the sake of it. Held together for the ego of a chairman who knows nothing about running a club but likes his name being front and center. If you are a child unfortunate enough to be born within the grasp of these lugs then it can be an near impossible situation. Kids caught in clubs with no nursey set up who decide they'll start entering teams at u12, can't field a team most days, disappear again at u16 only to resurface at junior. This is what some kids are told they have to put up with and no real way out without kicking up an unmerciful sink.

TAFKAlawhec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119458606#Comment_119458606

That'll be football (soccer) & rugby (union, I presume) that limit what countries you can represent at international level?

ReinaAbella

Since September 2022, I’m in coordination between the two clubs, and two coaches for my son's transfer - Under 14. At that time I was advise to send the form and when I send the filled form to Kill Club, they (KILL Secretary, through the Coach) informed me that the form is invalid due to a wrong version for 2023 transfer. So I went back to the website to look for 2023, but at that time it is not yet available. After that I don’t hear anything between coaches on when the form will be available on the website. We are new here and we don’t know the whole process, we are dependent on what the coaches will say. We don’t have direct contact to the Secretaries of both club. On Feb, 03 Naas Coach asked me, if the form was went thru the process and all I thought the form submitted on Sep,2022 will represent the transfer and it only a matter of replacing the 2023 Form. In fact there is no change on the content at all, just version. On that night itself I filled-up the 2023 form, submitted to Kill and Naas for them to process. After few days they came back that the deadline was on 01-Feb and we missed it!

We appeal to GAA Kildare County Board, Secretaries of Kill and Naas and they decline us twice. I’ve spoken also to Leinster GAA but they said they can’t do anything on the decision/rules of each county. I even contact the County and GAA National for 'Child Welfare and Protection', but we don't hear anything at the moment.

We knew Kildare GAA has set-up a rules, but we did not initiate this transfer overnight. My son is very devastated, very down at the moment, he can't accept the fact that he can't play matches for a year. We also received a message from Kill coach that his transfer is rejected this year and possible to be rejected also next year. Very sad to know how they run this organization.

Hope someone can give us advise on how we can help our son based on their experienced.

Thank you so much in advance.

brokenbad

What does the club Child Welfare Officer have to say on the issue?

Its hard to fathom the politics of the GAA sometimes - even at underage levels......