Public Pay Talks - see mod warning post 4293

combat14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121814604#Comment_121814604

doesn't look like interest rates are coming down yet either, a sure sign inflation is stubbornly high

Iggy1986

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121813500#Comment_121813500

Ya I’m sure you’re spoken to 20 people in your workplace about it, we all believe you

Gusser09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121817356#Comment_121817356

Strange post from a strange poster.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121817472#Comment_121817472

Indeed, people talk about this over coffee, typically only when it is similar roles, and also only when it is known that everyone at the table is in the Union (not everyone is, and some don't want people to know that they are).

Its a mixed bag in my place, higher paid don't seem to concerned either way. Lower paid seem to be, love to vote No but probably won't take the risk of voting no.

Voted No myself. I knew it would never match inflation but I just think it is too poor overall timeline wise. Good for the lower paid and that's why I won't give out when it does pass.

CivilCybil

Most in our place are voting yes due to the pay increases being mainly front loaded in year 1. I'd imagine most will be a yes.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121825381#Comment_121825381

Everyone keeps saying this but I don't really think they are front loaded at all, 5% from January 1st is front loaded but that's just my opinion.

As I said earlier, if it was all inside 2 years, I'd probably have accepted it, but stretching it out to two years is marketing BS for huge savings. Makes the general population believe it's 10% in 2 years, in the same way 99c is cheaper than a euro. The last miniscule increase in year 3 of the deal is just a way of giving a huge cost saving. Anyway, rant over.

qzy

A (slightly desperate sounding) email from Forsa this morning urging people to vote and reiterating how good the deal is might mean that the vote is not going quite according to plan?

Gusser09

Dear member,

 

Your colleagues are voting in their thousands on the Public Sector Pay Agreement, but we need the strongest vote possible. You should NOT assume that this ballot will pass or be rejected.

 

The choice is the proposed pay increases - or a return to the drawing board and potentially lengthy industrial action. Either way, this will have very real impacts on your workplace and your wages.

 

We also know how busy you all are, so we’ve come up with a quick way to support the ballot.

 

Forward this email to just 1 of your colleagues and ask them to read the info below. You could also copy and paste it into a WhatsApp message. Or even just ask them in-person: Have you voted yet?

ahnowbrowncow

I see that they're now stating that this is 'valued at 9.25% over 2.5 years'.

It's a bit late in the day to be telling their members this now, since the 26th January they've been proclaiming that it is valued at 10.25% over 2.5 years.

The majority of members would have believed that they were getting 10.25% and weren't aware of the 1% local bargaining.

Very misleading by the union.

CivilCybil

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121826575#Comment_121826575

I agree but I think at first glance it is far more attractive in year 1 and gets worse into year 2 and is abysmal by year 3.

If they did it in reverse it'd be more obvious but most are finding things tight and the year 1 increases (especially backdated) are attractive.

caviardreams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121827652#Comment_121827652

Could not agree more. Have lost so much respect for the unions over this - it is a complete breach of trust and if you can't even trust your union what is the point?

pygmaliondreams

No worry lads we're getting a 100% raise except the other 90% will be negotiated at a later date sometime before 2100

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121827668#Comment_121827668

It's not even that attractive in year one, 5% from January is attractive, 5% from when it's accepted as tolerable but this, nope, it's only attractive compared to years 2 and 3 but not actually attractive.

CramCycle

Well UNITE have sent out an apology, that management did not make a unanimous decision as previously stated but it was a majority. I'd say there is more negative feedback than expected coming through reps. It will still pass but I'm thinking not by as much as expected.

Bit disgusted by @Gusser09 s Union, clearly worded in a, can you really afford a "lengthy" strike, type of way.

pc7

I'm with Siptu and their push was more try to recruit more people to the union, they get the rises but going forward they might not. Still undecided on how to vote tbh.

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831285#Comment_121831285

non-union members will always get the rises. Its a Government decision, not a Union decision and it makes the Governments life much easier.

pc7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831361#Comment_121831361

yeah I know, but that's all they seemed to be trying to push was to get us to encourage new members.

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831387#Comment_121831387

Yeah, SIPTU were certainly hammering that point.

I still have my ballot on the kitchen table. Yet to mark it myself.

kippy

Spotted that mail from SIPTU - I don't believe the mail to have been factual in relation to the possibility that non-union staff may not get these Union negotiated deals in future. A bit of scare mongering?

pc7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831424#Comment_121831424

Unless going by our faces they were thinking we'd all had enough and would leave!

Norrie Rugger Head

Well the smaller the numbers backing the negotiating team the less threat a strike or industrial action carries.

Small unions strengthens the government negotiating position

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831424#Comment_121831424

I've got zero emails from SIPTU that suggests that (or I can't see it). What date is on that email and I assume its from John King?

Augme

The problem is there is no incentive at all to join the Unions and the Unions seem oblivious to that fact. If a person is going to vote yes to the pay deals, then its a complete waste of time. If a person slips going to vote No then you have to accept your joining a union who has admitted they cant do any better. So what's the incentive to join a union who are that bad?

Hotblack Desiato

Apparently this is the economic 'good times'.

If our living standards are still being eroded in the 'good times' what hope is there?

granturismo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831231#Comment_121831231

Just a small correction - the workplace reps from the public sector committee made a majority decision - not the management of Unite. There should have been at least one representative at that vote from each workplace or sector represented by Unite. You are correct that the first letter was incorrect and unacceptable in my opinion. Despite this, I've decided to vote yes. I'm not a huge fan of Unite or most other unions efforts but on the ground being a member gives us invaluable contacts with other union members across the country in similar public sector workplaces.

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831693#Comment_121831693

For me, being a member of a Union isn't just about the Public Pay Deal. Its one benefit but I would likely get that anyway.

I am a member of a Union because if there is any issue in the workplace, I have immediate representation at no extra cost. When I started in my role, I was given a fixed term contract but 1/3 of the criteria to be made permanent wasn't attainable. The rules of my employer literally prevented me from achieving it. As such, I contacted the Union the day after my probationary period ended and after a few months the criteria changed. It would have been very expensive to hire my own legal team and I wouldn't know how to argue that myself.

Its such a small cost, I don't know why anyone in the Public Sector wouldn't join. You won't need a Union for 99% of your working life but when you need them, they can be invaluable (some Unions are just shite e.g. TUI).

Augme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831803#Comment_121831803

When you need them, join a Union. Otherwise it is a massive waste of money. Or else just pay for a solicitor. The cost of a solicitor might not seem cheap, but when you compare it to 0.8% of your salary over the course of your career, it is cheap.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831935#Comment_121831935

Alot of unions have a policy that they cannot or willl not intervene in a situation that had begun before you joined (and in some cases, also very soon after you join), so doing this makes it too late. This is obviously for the reasons you suggested people to join.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831584#Comment_121831584

It was yesterday and it was from the sector organiser - not John King.

bren2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121831935#Comment_121831935

They won't represent you for an outstanding issue.

I was giving my reason for joining a Union. 22e a month is nothing, it comes out of my paycheck. I would prefer to pay for that than a one-off for a solicitor etc. Each to their own.