How to get tenant to leave

Toby22

Family member moved abroad with work a number of years ago and rented her apartment, various tenants over the years and never any problems. Last September she was given opportunity to move back to Ireland this summer. She has given tenants required notice, date to move out was end of February. They are still in situ and refusing to leave because they like where they live. She has a friend working in a letting agency who had looked after the apartment, tenants have been shown five other properties by this friend, none suit, currently in duplex, won’t move higher than 2 stories, the list of reasons to refuse are endless. Family member had hoped to get work done on apartment and move in when she returns in June. What is her next step

L1011

Begin overholding procedures with the RTB. It won't be quick.

road_high

Are they still paying the rent?

Ginger83

The tenant has no desire to leave and is playing the system.

They will find something unsuitable with all properties so unfortunately the Rtb is the only option.

Toby22

They are still paying rent, but family member has been advised to stop accepting. It’s such a dreadful situation, I can understand landlord selling up

Toby22

How long does RTB take. She was also told that Threshold will tell tenant to stay put and court proceedings will take up to two years, even though landlord is in the right

macvin

This is so common now

I have an investment property. It's on Airbnb.

I have been asked several times if I'd rent long term.

No I won't. Ever.

For the exact reason you see above.

To anyone else even thinking of renting, just don't. It simply is not worth the utter crap you have to put up with.

screamer

That’s absolute disgraceful and wrong. They will drag that out and pay no rent to her. All the protection of the law will be in their favour. She may just go down the legal route.

airy fairy

Stop accepting payments. As long as they are being accepted, it's considered a continuation or acceptance of the lease.

Go to a solicitor. While I understand rtb can be approached by the landlord in person, it looks better and sounds stronger when you do eventually get a meeting. This could take months, so do it asap.

Hopefully, everything has been done above board, correct time frame for them to vacate etc. Don't give them any excuses.

It took me over 12 months for tenants to vacate my property, for non payment of rent. 3 rtb meeting where tenant refused to attend the first 2 meetings. Eventually led to a barrister in court. Judge gave him 7 days to vacate, we were advised to get the sheriff lined up as it didn't look hopeful.

€15k+ loss of rental and legal fees. (Not to mention the clean up🤮)

Act with this asap. It's a long process

houseyhouse

Agree that you should start proceedings with rtb ASAP. Don’t cut off the power/water. That’s illegal and you could get hit with a fine. I also wouldn’t stop accepting rent. It won’t get them out any faster and will leave your relative out of pocket. Good luck

Mrs OBumble

Offer to pay them to leave. It sucks, but is a lot quicker than the official process.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055090#Comment_119055090

DONT DO THIS. **** THEM!

If the LL is going to be out of pocket, better for it to be in legal costs rather than giving the tenant a payday. Get onto a solicitor and have them do it and if possible, have the solicitor request their work details. Might wake the fooker up a bit if the LL means business.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055103#Comment_119055103

Even if the LL means business, business can take up to two years to be done. The op’s friend should consider all legal avenues available to her, to bring this to a conclusion as soon as possible, including paying the tenant to go. It sucks, but they are the rules of the game and why LLs are leaving it.

maestroamado

I know someone who was in a similar situation a few years ago where people were asking for 5k to leave a property... He never told anyone he paid it but they suddenly gone...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055182#Comment_119055182

What stops them from taking the money... and not leaving?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055197#Comment_119055197

Lateral thinking.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055197#Comment_119055197

but they left... i am not giving advice just stating what happened...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055207#Comment_119055207

Okay, but I'm guessing there's no further guarantee that they'd move out other than an even greater appeal to the tenants conscience?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055198#Comment_119055198

or Lateral problem?

hope the person who paid the five grand notified revenue & welfare of this extra income the tenant had. Blackmail is a crime, isn’t it or would it be embezzlement?

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055221#Comment_119055221

He never said he paid... it was asked for and then one day he called and they were gone... thats all he knew... people do strange things...

Fian

OP - just in case the comments in this thread are muddying the water: it is not against the law to pay the tenant to leave and there is no reason that the payment and the conditions for same cannot be documented fully.

You could include a clause indicating the payment will be made immediately upon the tenant handing over the keys, providing a signed notice of termination and vacating the property. The contract could also record that the landlord & tenant waive the notice period for that (tenant) notice of termination.

All this AFTER the notice period has expired from the original notice of termination from the landlord.

And yes - it does suck that this is likely to be the best, quickest, most efficient and cheapest way to resolve a tenant illegally overholding.

Your relative should get a solicitor who will ensure that there is no defect in any of the notices provided or remedy them if there are and will help them navigate this - because the costs (and delays!) of getting tripped up on a technicality will be far more than the cost of obtaining legal advice.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055287#Comment_119055287

Change locks etc necessary...

Toby22

Hi, thanks for all the advice.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055301#Comment_119055301

If your friend did decidce to go for the cash i think it be better if the people asked... these things are not that hard to set-up...

spaceHopper

This tenant isn't going to take cash to go they simply don't want to go. As soon as legal proceeding are started they will stop paying rent and end up with more that was offered them. All they have to do is not pay rent, not show up till summoned to court then leave. All of that will take 1 to two years. When they were served with the termination notice I hope your friend used the correct template from the RTB, that would have given them 28 days to dispute the notice, which has long passed but they will try to dispute it anyway. Get a solicitor who has done this before and knows the system well.

If I was your friend I would see if I could back out of the move till they have left.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055287#Comment_119055287

Great, all the t's crossed and i's dotted. AND if they still don't leave?

airy fairy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055989#Comment_119055989

And they probably won't because of the rental shortages.

OP get legal advice. I can't imagine any solicitor advising to pay a tenant off, in the hope they'd move their arses out the door. Even after court judgements ruled in favour of tenant eviction, they can still bear it out til the bitter end, resulting in getting a sheriff and locksmith and guards.

CreadanLady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055182#Comment_119055182

I am just joking here of course, but imagine if the LL did a Martin Cahill on it. Pay over the €5,000, then go down to the Garda station for an hour for some wild goose chase enquiry so as to have an alibi while arranging for an assistant to mug the tenant for the €5000.

Cuddlesworth

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055989#Comment_119055989

Basically, its "notice of termination"(has to be 100% correct), with a date set.

A RTB adjudication(do not do mediation), where you hopefully get a recommendation of eviction

A District court appointment with the RTB order where you hopefully a eviction order granted(usually with lead time for the tenants)

If they don't leave on the date set by the court, it's back to the court for permission to send the eviction order to the sheriff to be forcefully removed from the property.

If she hasn't bothered with any of this, then she has just been adding to the clock. The most hardcore tenants wait till the last step, very few actually get forcefully removed. If she is lucky, starting formal proceedings might kickstart the existing tenancy into moving. Otherwise, it can take years.

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055989#Comment_119055989

They don't get the cash until they have left.

Like i said it sucks. But it's what professional landlords end up doing.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056128#Comment_119056128

And if they leave and you decide not to pay?

L1011

Do not make suggestions of illegal behaviour, and please don't reply/quote them/reference them either.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119054519#Comment_119054519

There is no point in refusing to accept rent. there was a time when a landlord could accept rent after forfeiting the lease. that no longer applies in RTB land.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056041#Comment_119056041

I was at a meeting with a solicitor and barrister and the advice to the landlord was to pay the tenant off. Cheaper and more effective than court.

Claw Hammer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055119#Comment_119055119

It can take longer than 2 years. There is no outer time limit.

JimmyVik

Two separate cases I know of at the moment are going on 4 years and the tenants both still hanging in there and not paying any rent.

One even asked for a new carpet in the living room a couple of months ago.

Claw Hammer

o/p, was your relative ever married?

ThreeGreens

While the tenant refuses to leave, is there anything stopping the landlord moving back into her home?

Obviously they won't like sharing the property with the tenants who aren't supposed to be there, but presumably they won't like the arrangement either!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056527#Comment_119056527

No can do. The law is on the tenants side even though they are breaching tenancy law aswell.

homingbird

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056128#Comment_119056128

Would upping the rent to a price the tennant cant afford help sort it out tell tennant the house is going up for sale Get estate agent to stick a forsale sign up even if you are not selling cause them as much hassel as possible. What ever you can think of to get them out of there comfort zone.

CreadanLady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056527#Comment_119056527

I wonder about that. Like after the notice period is expired, then by right the tenant should be gone. Could the landlord just move into the property and sit himself down to have a dinner at the table and sleep in the spare bedroom?

airy fairy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056260#Comment_119056260

Well I suppose it depends on how an easy life a legal team want to make it. My solicitor and barrister refused to let me bargain or exchange anything financial, and were happy to fight for my case.

JimmyVik

Un fortunatley the tenant can break all the laws they like, punishment free. In fact actually gaining from breaking leases and laws.

But the landlord will only lose by breaking any laws or leases.

spaceHopper

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056607#Comment_119056607

None of that will help, needing the property back for yourself is a valid reason anyway. There are rent controls that mean 2% max for every year so. In this case they are paying rent and simply refusing to move simply because they prefer this to the 5 other properties they have been offered. I a lot of cases they stop paying anyway.

Op maybe it would be worth trying one more time. The EA friend finds them a suitable place, move or legal proceeding start and they will have to find their own place at the end of 2 year at a higher rent and they will not get a better one than is on offer now.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056617#Comment_119056617

No. Absolutely and utterly not.

airy fairy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056617#Comment_119056617

We asked this kind of question when our tenant overheld the property. Apparently, at the time anyway, the tenant is still covered as a tenant and all trespass rights etc even if the lease has expired and are overholding. The rtb will still represent him as a tenant.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056393#Comment_119056393

How would someone even approach asking for anything when refusing to pay rent?

GBX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119057377#Comment_119057377

Some people have no shame and necks like jockeys ******, regardless of the disruption they are causing.

whippet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119056617#Comment_119056617

no - as the tenant (despite over holding) is still a tenant and is entitled to enjoyment of the property as their home. Making any such move will land the landlord in a whole heap of trouble and more than likely a five figure sum in compensation to go with it.

JimmyVik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119057405#Comment_119057405

There are plenty of people i know of you play the system to the limit. All that happens is after a few years of no rent they eventually get made move out. Stright to the next victimm