Clontarf to City Centre Cycle & Bus Priority Project discussion (renamed)

Citizen Six

Granted I missed rush hour, as I was on the route shortly after nine. But it did look fairly chaotic alright 😂

Jayuu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444024#Comment_119444024

The problem here is that the entire change is being implemented under the title "Clontarf to City Centre Cycle & Bus Priority Project" so it's only natural the people assume all the disruption is because of the development of a cycle lane. It probably should have been labelled differently given the nature of the project.

It really is unfortunate because it does create an anti-cycling atmosphere which is unhelpful.

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444090#Comment_119444090

You said it yourself, "Bus Priority Project". So why would it be natural to only blame cyclists?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444090#Comment_119444090

Yes, I couldn’t work out why the water piece was relegated to a footnote. But it’s probably because DCC want to be bold and up front with their ambition rather than be accused of sneaking through surface reorganisations through the back door on the back of water works.

It should have been portrayed as an integrated project though. Make it a positive thing…..one piece of work instead of water and then road at at separate time. There’ll be loads of opportunity to reorganise surface organisation in coming years as water mains and electricity cables need replacing across the city. And should be in the future presented to affected people as integrated work

Pinch Flat

Has anyone checked in on marty whelan? Hows he doing?

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444059#Comment_119444059

I never said that you predicted the chaos but many people did (both here and elsewhere in the media). However, the speculation yesterday given the photo was that chaos was imminent. this transpired to be completely untrue.

As for the management of this project, I'll admit that comms has been poor, if not atrocious. However, there has been very little disruption otherwise and despite the foolish claims by a jeweller which were lapped up by an even more foolish media, traffic continues to move in and out of the city. However, communications by the council can be difficult when you see some councillors lying to the public and media about their knowledge of the project (unless these councillors are quite incompetent). Maybe you'd care to describe to us how you'd have approached the physical side of this kind of project?

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444126#Comment_119444126

..

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444024#Comment_119444024

" A cycle lane doesn't take a year to build" Tell that to the people who live on Grange Road Rathfarnham where a cycle lane project meant to last 4 months has over-run by 300%. Also, a sunny Monday in early August is unrepresentative of traffic conditions in the medium term.

However the media take on this is disgraceful. The Irish Times saw fit to publish a letter to-day from someone who seemed to think that the disruption was purely due to traffic-related road works: no mention of water mains. The letter went on to say that the 62m should have been spent on housing. Ill-informed garbage as usual in the IT!

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444126#Comment_119444126

I agree: the water infrastructure upgrade has been hidden in the details to an extent.

However, their letters to the public did refer to it along with Irish Water...

from https://www.dublincity.ie/sites/default/files/2022-03/2022.01.21-c2cc-project-english-accessible-leaflet-1.pdf

Citizen Six

From the Irish times last week:

“North Strand Road is the main route into the city centre, so I think a lot of people on Monday are going to be in for a surprise when they see that they have to divert,” he said. “Traffic is already bad on North Strand Road. Now, it’s going to be a nightmare.”

So removing traffic from the road is going to make the traffic on that road worse?

magicbastarder

not sure if i understand? someone commuting in from louth would have to have taken a weird detour if they're coming in via fairview.

AngryLips

Why are people commuting from surrounding counties traveling into the city centre in a car via Fairview? Did the letter drop informing local residents of the change need to go to households in Dundalk as well?

Jayuu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444115#Comment_119444115

Because the perception is that it's the construction of the cycle lane that is causing the disruption and the road closure as it's the most visible element of the scheme. Bus Priority projects have been around for a long while and haven't generally involved road closures for a year. That's just the reality of what people see and hear. This should have been labelled something like the North East Infrastructure Improvment Project.

I'll say it again - I'm not against this project and I understand disruption is inevitable. It should have been handled far better from a communication point of view.

AngryLips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444502#Comment_119444502

The road isn't closing for the majority of users though.

Citizen Six

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444502#Comment_119444502

No matter how it had been handled, people would still be complaining. There's people quoted in the papers recently saying they knew nothing about this project. That's just a reflection of how little people care about where they live, and projects that enhance their areas.

bikeman1

Took a walk through Fairview a short while ago (13:00). Everything moving along swiftly on all routes. Two lanes up to Edge's corner with the PT lane separated by bollards in advance of the junction. I can only guess that many people are avoiding the area. Swords Road was fine this morning too, nothing unusual at all.

The traffic will build up as the schools start back etc. But like I have said before. Fairview is and has been a mess for years, so that will be nothing different. Again plenty of alternatives for people to use should the need arise.

And guess what, you can still drive into town right now from Clontarf or Killester or Artane and move along fine. Amazing stuff!!

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444706#Comment_119444706

This is true - an awful lot of people just zone out from things like this for one reason or another until the diversions commence and work physically starts.

Having said all that, the comms could definitely be better - the water main replacement should be the lead explainer followed by explaining the separating of the buses and cyclists.

The water works ARE the lead item, though, when unbiased sources are used. The only people I've heard using the bike lane as a means to bash the whole thing are either a) completely uninformed about the project, b) just read a clickbait headline and went off on one or c) both. People hear what they wanna hear. Case in point:

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444502#Comment_119444502

This should have been labelled something like the North East Infrastructure Improvment Project.

Why? What's wrong with the official title of "Clontarf to City Centre Project"? What about that name is too cycle-centric that has everyone up in arms?

AngryLips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444879#Comment_119444879

So what you're saying is that the new temporary road arrangements have improved traffic in the area? Maybe it should be made permanent.

Jayuu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119444706#Comment_119444706

Your definition of "enhance" and theirs might be different! 😁

Thelonious Monk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119445352#Comment_119445352

the place is a kip now, the improved footpaths and planting of trees and public realm in general will have the place looking far better. We're not living there now but my partner owns a place on Strandville Avenue and we may be living there later this year or next year, we are both delighted with the works.

bikeman1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119445269#Comment_119445269

That's not what I said.

I said that everything is moving fine today, and made an educated guess that some people were avoiding the area following the media coverage of this. The way some people were going on was that Fairview would be a dead end for anyone wanting to go to town.

JRant

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119443930#Comment_119443930

If someone is travelling in from Meath and Laois and ends up needing to head southbound at fair view they’ve taken a wrong turn somewhere along the way.

Well done to the Gardai for proving that traffic enforcement in this country is an absolute joke. Clontarf Garda station is what, a kilometre away? Clowns leaving it to the construction workers to try to police.

"Light traffic on the first day of the new one-way system on North Strand did not deter a significant number of motorists from illegally using the bus lane to access Dublin city on Monday morning.

However, significant numbers of car and commercial vehicle drivers illegally used the bus lane and did not stop for construction workers who asked them to divert."

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/dublin/2022/08/08/ban-on-inbound-traffic-on-dublins-north-strand-comes-into-force/

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119446204#Comment_119446204

The Gardai are a jokeshop IMO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119446217#Comment_119446217

Nice bit of advertising from the Irish Times, drive down this road and you won't be caught

Even better from the article:

"Victor Coe, senior executive engineer with Dublin City Council, said Garda enforcement would be implemented if motorists did not obey the diversions."

How could you not start with enforcement on Day 1 and send a proper message. Ineptitude of the highest order.

spurious

They should have had them all out from Templemore for the first week and hammer anyone breaking the rules - cars and cyclists.

This will be a right sh*tshow if people think they can just ignore the diversion.

Is there any reason we don't use cameras for traffic enforcement in Ireland? Not just in this instance (but it's a prime candidate) but for example people breaking red lights?

Citizen Six

Do DPD even require their drivers to have a driving licence before giving them a job?