30k speed limits for all urban areas on the way

When you're calling basic physics "propaganda", you've well and truly lost any argument you were trying to make. An anti-science position is not a strong one.

Added to the fact you appear to place a higher value on a bit of fuel than a human life is just, well, fkd up

Thankfully things are moving in the right direction with the new speed limits.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157560#Comment_121157560

It's 2km between Chapelizod and Islandbridge on the R109 in Dublin, for example

Ok, let's look at this from another angle: given reviews will allow for increased speed limits on roads where it can be justified, what justification would you put forwards for increasing the speed limit on this particular road at a time when they are trying to encourage more active travel and given that the road you refer to was by-passed by a much faster dual carriageway some decades ago?

Flinty997

It's marked as primary radial on their proposed map. It's an outlier.

To make it "fuel efficient" it would have to be raised from the current limit of 50 between 56 and 80 km/h.

You'd have a hard time selling that considering at least one fatality on that road that I'm aware of.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157588#Comment_121157588

It's hard to take concerns about fuel savings seriously from those who opposed every possible measure to support sustainable travel options. It's a remarkably narrow focus on fuel saving.

e87228722

it is a known fact that one of the largest factors on road accidents is the standard of our roads, we have hedges, telephone poles and all kindof obstacles on our roadsides. also the people whq were killed in monaghan a few weeks ago hit a tree where a person wqas killed because they hit the same tree a few years ago with a car. I remember some years ago the most dangerous road in Ireland was the NI heading north for deaths. the death rate dropped 90% after the motorway was built. if we want to fix the problem we need to identify what the problem is.

DoraDelite

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157902#Comment_121157902

I wouldn't describe things on the side of the road as "obstacles". Usually the reason for someone losing control and hitting something like that, is driving inappropriately for the road and conditions at the time.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157902#Comment_121157902

Has the report into that incident been published? Roads don't rate highly as a factor in incidents whereas inappropriate speed does!

Flinty997

...

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157902#Comment_121157902

Ah, the old "known fact" beloved of Liveline callers and in other evidence free zones.

You know drivers are required to drive to the conditions around them. If you can't manage to drive down a country road without slamming into a tree, you shouldn't be driving at all.

Unrealistic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157560#Comment_121157560

@SeanW It's 2km between Chapelizod and Islandbridge on the R109 in Dublin, for example, and a similar distance between the last junction/lights on the N59 in Galway and the end of urban limits. These are just some examples.

Well done on picking an example that actually proves the opposite of the argument you are trying to make. As part of the recent move to 30 km/h in Galway city the stretch of road you mention was actually increased to 60 km/h. It was one of a number of roads where the limit was increased within the urban area, some to 60 km/h and some to 80 km/h. So much for your claim that a 30km/h is going to be universally applied, even on long stretches of road without crossings or traffic lights......

magicbastarder

from one of the papers i found online which modelled a change in speed limits (this was done in simulations, not in real life)

"5 CONCLUSIONS

It is unlikely that imposing strict speed limits in urban areas has a significant influence on emissions of NOx or CO2. Concerning the impact on emissions of PM VeTESS results indicate that the exhaust from the diesel vehicles may show a significant decrease, whereas MEET functions assume a moderate increase. The effect on emissions of PM should be confirmed by further research, also focusing on the impact of acceleration or gear shifting behaviour."

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/237327146_IMPACT_OF_30_KMH_ZONE_INTRODUCTION_ON_VEHICLE_EXHAUST_EMISSIONS_IN_URBAN_AREAS

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121157994#Comment_121157994

ministersoffice@health.gov.ie <ministersoffice@health.gov.ie>;

Here it is and pretty well confirms what i am saying... the RSA used to build an manage and improve road networks, i think their mission statement was all principle routes M1 to M11 would be of a "standard" for complete length. They failed to do this and now its speed whearas a lot of the Irish are absolute death traps. Thats the problem, who will fix?

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121158049#Comment_121158049

Thats the problem, dont find the cause, 5 people killed by a tree on side of road and its ok get real. liveline we pay that tosser duffy, tubs, we have 3 times the politiciand per capita as most EU countriea and most of our roads were built for bicycles, it may save the world if we stopped driving cars. Basically you are saying that the people who put up the road signage do not know what they at. national roads for the most part should have capisity of 100 km per hour, thats just an example. the norm in the EU is the road has capisity for this. ours do not. Urben roads are a different conversation.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161147#Comment_121161147

I've no idea what you're trying to say here.

Getting motorways to a certain standard had nothing to do with people crashing into a tree on a wet night in a county that has no motorways! I've driven that road loads of times and never crashed (thankfully) so how exactly did the road cause those people to be killed - maybe the crash investigation report contains that information (you do have those, dont you?) are you just making unsubstantiated claims (which I'm assuming)?

Plus I'm quite sure the RSA never designed, built or managed a road in their existence!

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161203#Comment_121161203

FFS 🙄

You may not like it but I seriously would contest that the tree or road was what led to the death of those unfortunates. In most cases, only one thing causes a crash and waffling on about Joe Duffy or the EU won't change that!

As for national roads being 100km, travel abroad and you might be surprised!

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161278#Comment_121161278

I think this conversation is about death rates on irish roads so why was the tree not removed after the fatality in the past. The RSA were not in existance when most of our roads were built as they were built by the brits who also likely planted the tree.

afaik the Rsa are just responcible for N roads and they pretty have 100 km limit though alot are not even close to this standard.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161383#Comment_121161383

What on earth are you on about?

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161383#Comment_121161383

afaik the Rsa are just responcible for N roads and they pretty have 100 km limit though alot are not even close to this standard.

Read this...

https://www.rsa.ie/about/role-of-the-rsa

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161295#Comment_121161295

I have driven in half the countries in Europe, most people who listen to duffy never broke any rules. Duffy is the man? There should be no tree or pole within a few metres of a public road,you would never see this abroad. i will give an example, just a few days ago i noticed where there was a celtic housing estate where there is a footpath. The telephone poles are about 1ft/30cm outside the footpath on the public in a line of 4/5 in a line. our principle roads are not up to EU standards.

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161412#Comment_121161412

What body is responsible for road infastructure on national routes?

Is there anyone stating the required minimun required standard?

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161448#Comment_121161448

Yeah, let's bulldoze every ditch around the country in case someone drives too fast for the conditions 🙄

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161460#Comment_121161460

So at least you agree that it's not the RSA!

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161506#Comment_121161506

I asked who is responsible? i thought RSA were part of NRA and i now just discovered the NRA no more. so it seems we have people responcible for safety and no organization looking at our road standards. There may be a new body?

e87228722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161500#Comment_121161500

absolutely i agree, put up road barriers where needed an ditches at least a metre, trees 2/3 metres where speed say above 60km allowed.

Flinty997

....

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161709#Comment_121161709

Lot of barriers on this road already. Just unlucky there none at this spot. Doesn't look especially more dangerous than much of the rest of the road.

e87228722

I don't know the road but the papers this tree resulted in a death before so it should have been removed. Having Gardai monitoring speeding a waste of money when it could be done with a few speed vans the technology is there. i do not see this as police work.

Is there no organization in charge of road standards in ireland?

patrickbrophy18

@SeanW Sadly, we are out numbered by those in favor of these ridiculous speed limits. I also think the continued comparisons of weight of cars vs. the weight of pedestrians/cyclists is kind of a David vs. Goliath style argument rooted in begrudgery and is akin to small man syndrome.

Some of the posters here advocating these speed limits are also the same ones advocating the charges for pick up and drop offs at the airport. In other words, they see motorists as the enemy regardless of context and are so heavily indoctrinated into the green agenda underpinning these proposals.

They want freedom of movement for pedestrians and cyclists in urban and suburban areas and to have all responsibilty and cost placed firmly on motorists. Darwin would be "proud".

Flinty997

...

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121161783#Comment_121161783

How many trees do we need to remove?

When a car crashes into a house or a school, do we need to remove the house or the school?