What if any changes are you going to make to you're current system with costs going out of control.

yosemitesam1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118760505#Comment_118760505

Important to keep in mind that prices will be equally high next year, 2024 at the earliest before things might look more normal

Hard Knocks

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118760505#Comment_118760505

when is the best time to sow clover? Was thinking of putting in the spreader with fertilizer

Reggie.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118760600#Comment_118760600

We already tried it. Sowed 19 acres last year with 5kg of clover per acre. Fed 70 heifer calves last year for 6 months on a half bag of urea and only 7 acres got approx 3000 gals of slurry. Think the whole grazing block of 60 acres is getting clover in May.

Reggie.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118760971#Comment_118760971

Do be honest that won't work. It's a waste of clover esp with it at €10 a kg. To have a good chance of germination you need to stitch it in. Know plenty of lads who claim clover won't work but they tried to sow it with that method and sure there's no way to be accurate or get it down to soil level.

Reggie.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118760921#Comment_118760921

Trying to reduce the fert burden

joe35

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761006#Comment_118761006

If you were spreading lime could you mix clover in with the lime.

Reggie.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761080#Comment_118761080

It's upto each farmer really but the most accurate way is stitching with airseeder. It's hard to be accurate with spinners or wagtails as the seed is so small the slightest amount of wind will affect it so there's no way to be accurate with it. Also unless it bulls rain there's no way it'll get to the soil even after the rain. I use a guttler here and its never failed yet

roosterman71

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118756127#Comment_118756127

Green diesel doesn't have 56c a litre excise. As of March 2021, it was 11.8c per litre. I don't know if it went up since. The 2c comes off that. The carbon tax remains (gotta keep the green people happy (and hungry))

kerryjack

2 farming lads on live line yesterday 1 lad blaming the large dairy lad for running farming talking over all the small family farms, mad stuff how much some lads hate the large scale dairy farms.

Jjameson

We are carrying more cattle nationally than we have a “do” for. There was a crisis in the west in around 1999? But there was reserve enough in the east to carry through. 2013(a result of 2012 weather) was a rough one but again we limped through however 2018 where 2017 was only a marginally reduced year before and a spring that was protracted by 6 weeks was very rough but only a warning shot for our vulnerable position.

We are importing vast amounts of fertilizer and feed for a high volume beef export and government policy is same.

I am putting no fertilizer out this spring, am not saving ground for silage, and will reassess in June. I have no duty to our import export business in this country that has a lot of parasites living off my back with little care for me!

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761396#Comment_118761396

Listened to that lad.

He was off his melt.

Though off topic, his Amish approach is very successful in Agriculture in America where they are buying land nonstop.

I agree with him in that it is skewed against the farming industry.

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761093#Comment_118761093

Agree with that …guttler /stitcher is best ….I’ve got good results from putting it out with slurry too …suck in 2 kg clover when filling 2509 gallon tank and out at 1509 gallons per acre …usually start going with this from mid April on weather dependant and roll ground few days later

Packrat

2017 to 2020 I was ramping up numbers of sheep, pondering what to do with the loss making sucklers, and generally trying to get this run down place back in shape having come back into it in 2014.

Workload went mad (I have a summer occupation as well) and winters became utter misery with bad house/yard setup, poor fencing and grass management etc.

After being at home all 2020 and most of 21 due to Covid (No tourism) all I had out of it was bigger co-op bills, more work needing doing, more stock and no money with herself getting right sour over it all.

I had decided to go organic before the current sh1tshow and had changed out the Limo/Shorts for Dexters.

I culled the ewes ruthlessly last Autumn and will cull again this year.

No fertilizer going out bar dung and a bit of imported slurry this year, and I've barely any ration fed to sheep yet.

Those two alone will halve my coop bill and assuming I get in, the payment will be for jam.

I really wanted to build up the operation, but it's pis5ung against the wind with input costs, workload, and modern life.

I'm 48 and the housing/slurry management investment alone I'd need I couldn't ever pay back without breaking my hole until I'm 80.

My children are small and if they ever want to go farming, they'll know how and have the land, but not grow up resenting it because I'm never there.

I'm planting a couple of ridges of garden this year for the first time in decades because I have the few minutes to spare.

When I was doing an MBA a few years ago the first thing they taught us was "Turnover is for vanity, and profit is for sanity"

ginger22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118755664#Comment_118755664

This idea that Ireland is a low cost producer because of our grass based system is nonesense. In most european countries like France, Germany, Holland, Denmark farmers grow most of their own feed with tillage crops like wheat, maize etc, that are far more fertilizer efficient than our intensive grass that requires 8 or 9 applications of nitrogen per year. It is not the cost of fertilizer that will force reduction in milk production on the continent but environmental pressure and shortage of labour.

mr.stonewall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761787#Comment_118761787

I'm looking at it from the beef side of things. Fertiliser applications are few and low. This stands us in a better position if we can sort some self sufficiency around the grain issue. 8-9 fertiliser applications is just chronic, it's the crack cocaine of farming

The 3 F's are now the major pressures. Feeding beef cattle on grazed grass has the lowest of the requirement, when not over stocked. It's about finding that sweet spot in every farming system.

Fuel and fertiliser is going to have a big pressure on these indoor systems. Just look at the chronic situation with the pig industry across Europe. It's the price of inputs that has pinched their margin. European dairy and beef will be under pressure.

Never waste a good crisis

This time is about the change the view on food production and security in europe. Being aware of international factors and a willingness to make changes inside your own farm gate is key to riding this situation with a strong business

fastrac

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118760505#Comment_118760505

Year 3 before that will start saving you fertiliser

Dunedin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761396#Comment_118761396

Heard it too - some craic Was on long work drive so it certainly passed the time. 😂😂

Box09

Cutting ewes by at least 20%, any lads in the breeding hogget game are in trouble.

Will seriously consider the use of the tractor for topping , hedgecutting etc.

A lot of dairy lads will be in big trouble when the fert dries up.

funkey_monkey

Nothing much beyond what we would have been doing anyway. 2 cows to cull that got a free pass for a few years.

Had some reseeding planned, but that is now on hold. All non-essential spend on infrastructure is on hold until prices drop.

Will try to make some better quality silage for the weanlings.

Packrat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761396#Comment_118761396

There is a case to answer there, but it's for another day and a different thread.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118763327#Comment_118763327

Part of my solution is a third more ewes. Lol

kk.man

I don't think cutting back on numbers is the answer. Imo playing havoc with the tax returns and I do believe prime stock will be dear in June and July because lads are spreading less fertilizer and cutting feeding. I'm very tightly stocked and I've never spread 7 rounds of fertilizer in my life, the most I did was two. I'm not advocating anyone to be a slave to any poor paying system but just because we have a crisis doesn't mean we cut stock. I told a wise well to do farmer a few years back that I might not purchase as many cattle going forward. He said the game you are in you got to take the good with the bad you can't change your system or you would be on a hidding to nothing. It's all very well for lads with big acres to let stock run around it but the smaller man doesn't have the luxury of a ranch.

Jjameson

An acre is an acre no matter how many of them a man has. And x amount of grass will grow on permanent pasture without any artificial fertilizer. I simply cannot see how you’d have a return on the fert out of extra grass grown to convert to beef. A lot of aul lads used to lecture us on the merits of sucklers with that same “have to keep your system” spiel. The taxman will get it sometime regardless.

I can graze one two year old beef/dairy’s fattening bullock across here to the acre(starting with that in April) with zero fert and and an avg of 300kg barley ration. Start killing with Gods grace and Favour in early July and all gone by October. I will have available nitrates to help out a oligarch farmer by taking a bit of slurry I hope.

If the weather comes wet I won’t be stressed out like I was in times past.

every farm has an optimum stocking rate, a sweet spot and this year it has moved back for a low margin enterprise like beef. in my opinion of course.

older by the day

Wrote out a check to the co.op for fert and some ration. 16000. I could have left it against the milk but I would have got depressed looking at the bill coming in every month. My wife has confiscated the check book and sayes that's my limit. Kk.man you are lucky because you have good land. Two rounds of fertilizer on middling ground would not work in most farms. It makes a huge difference

Jjameson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118765135#Comment_118765135

Your in a different enterprise. Fert and meal against milk price is still a big + under the equation.

older by the day

The dairy farmers costs are mental though. I spend more on detergent and electricity than my neighbor spends on fert. I have both and I know the milk is better. I know he has less numbers but he can go out and work a fulltime job as well. Milk have a lot to pay for

Reggie.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118762820#Comment_118762820

Didn't take that long here

farawaygrass

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118761396#Comment_118761396

I hate hearing farmers on live line. Joe seems to take the piss out of them always and farmers always end up coming out looking poorly. Live line is 95% tabloid trash

kk.man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118765371#Comment_118765371

I hate liveline never listen to Trinity educated, socialist, fat salary Joe. Even though that was my Alma mater.

kollegeknight

I’m going to wait and see. I’ve 3 cows out of the 13 that may go this year but I want to see how the two heifers In calf with the shorthorn turn out first.

my inputs will be low.

only spreading 2 tonne of fert on silage ground in the hope of getting similar returns to last year and it buys me time to see.

ive One 2yo bullock for the freezer that I will share with two brothers and a bit for my mam and I’ve one heifer for next year that they have to pay for it’s feed. Household costs will be huge so it will help all three of us.