How long until we see €2 a litre and will it push more to EV's faster?

mikeecho

I'm at the point, where I'm toping up the car every few days, just trying to keep the car filled at the lowest price possible.

I'm genuinely concerned at the prospect of a bad winter, fuel bills are going to be astronomical.

Oil & gas has a knock on effect on everything.

The CSO say we are at 7.8% inflation, but look at the cost of food.

Pasta up 20%, noodles up 98%, butter up 68% etc bread milk meat everything up.. up a lot more than 7.8%

Heating oil up 102%... 102%.. ONE HUNDRED AND TWO PERCENT.

F UC K ME

macvin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180011#Comment_119180011

When TV came along Radio would die, when Netflix came along Cinemas would die.

Fuel stations will not close in any big numbers.

Have a look at any fuel station and see how many parking spaces they have for those just visiting the shop. Even where I used to live in the south, the local village station (and it was a village) had 12-14 parking spaces that were consistently used and never had many cars at the pumps.

Look at any motorway service stations and the vast majority of cars are not buying fuel.

Super fast charge points that will take 5-6 minutes for a decent charge will be the main fuel points. Petrol & diesel will be relegated to sidelines and the shops/cafes will become the centerpiece

as for fuel costs, its a world issue and causing severe pain n far poorer countries. Add mid term elections in the US and you will see determined action quite soon. Already you have the start of talks about joint purchasing between US & Europe.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119178502#Comment_119178502

Why are you cherry picking the 50k models, there are plenty of new EVs on the market for less than 50k. There are options suitable for people starting around the 30k mark.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180302#Comment_119180302

No one wants to talk about the fact that food price increases are not in anyway keeping up with input cost rises in Agriculture.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180519#Comment_119180519

Which models are 30k that can get you from Carlow/ Wexford/ balbriggan (commuting areas) with no destination charging and without relying on the public charging network?

By the way 30k loan is still €600 per month over 5 years.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180208#Comment_119180208

I agree we would need a sufficient supply of public chargers that always work.

As regards for the charge of using them, higher mileage EV users have the option of a larger battery, PV panels at home etc.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180605#Comment_119180605

That’s when your into 50k territory plus the cost of panels on top of that.

josip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180605#Comment_119180605

They'll also need the 'option' of a powerwall to store the PV panel electrons because they won't be at home in the day time

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180526#Comment_119180526

As in, cost for food should be more?

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180703#Comment_119180703

Not necessarily, just a return to the division of payments years ago, the % given to the producer has fallen substantially over the last 10 years and that in itself was after a 20 decline.

The producer's share has being going down for years. Food in shops has not declined for years.

I know that is not going to happen though, even the idea of below cost selling being outlawed again is a non runner.

HBC08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180112#Comment_119180112

Apologies in that case,

I agree with you on both points.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180674#Comment_119180674

Is there not feed in tariffs now back to the grid?

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119180603#Comment_119180603

Wexford to Dublin is a 280km return journey, pretty doable for most cars on the markets. If your doing 1300km a week on your commute the fuel savings are going to go a substantial way to paying any extra per month compared to a comparable ICEV. Maybe you should do the math and be pleasantly surprised.

Montage of Feck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119176963#Comment_119176963

I currently drive a 12 year old car, so hopefully I'll still be burning petrol in 13 years time.

HBC08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181112#Comment_119181112

I've done the math and that doesn't change the fact that I live in a townhouse and therefore dont have the option of a EV.

Same as anybody in an apartment,townhouse,certain terraced houses etc,a huge chunk of the population, I'm going to guess 20% to 25%.

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119179860#Comment_119179860

I read a study about 4 or 5 years ago that said, iirc, the daily car use for 80% of the population was 60km or less.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181112#Comment_119181112

I have.

Doesn’t work out when you have a debt free ICE car and would have to pay monthly repayments to drive an EV and take on a large amount of debt

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181331#Comment_119181331

Everyone's different, we traded a debt free diesel passat for a brand new 40kw leaf, monthly outgoings are now less than before.

20k km done since Jan and a couple of cross country trips. Really don't see how they wouldn't suit the majority of drivers.

I seriously doubt most people saying they're too expensive have actually done the maths on it or are just poor at maths.

The lads on the EV forum have all the data needed if anyone is interested

mikeecho

I like the security of knowing I have 1,200+km in the tank.

5 min at the pump, and 2 to 4 weeks of driving.

Can't beat that for convenience.

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181466#Comment_119181466

Never going to a garage is even more convenient.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181428#Comment_119181428

First of all a 40kw leaf won’t have the range for what I need.

So you had a debt free car, how much are your repayments now or did you buy the car for cash?

A quick look on the Nissan website tells me a brand new 40kw leaf SV is €29935.

A quick look at a loan repayment for 30k tells me that the monthly repayment is €600pm.

Are you saying you are saving €600 pm in fuel costs to balance out the €600pm repayment cost or did you pay cash, or is it a mixture of both loan and cash for the new car?

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181489#Comment_119181489

€450 a month. Less than what I'd be spending on diesel anyway, and that was when we ordered it in September before juice went completely mad.

No brainer really to have a new car.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181499#Comment_119181499

The problem a lot of people would have is getting approved for a €30k loan.

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181489#Comment_119181489

You're figures are off.

Bought on the 0%, €29,000 over 60 months is €483. €2.5k trade on passat brings it to €441 per month.

Savings on motor tax is €60 alone on top of that.

DaveyDave

I'd say it's less convenient than just plugging the car in when you're home and not having to stop off anywhere, fill up then queue at the garage. I look forward to not having to go to a petrol station anymore...

mikeecho

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181555#Comment_119181555

Dunno where you are, but I never have to Q for a pump. 8 to 12 pumps, there's always one free.

5 min per month.. that's the convince of diesel, the inconvenience, the price.

But electric is generated by gas , oil. Coal.

It's not much more environmentally friendly.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181499#Comment_119181499

So repayments are €450 pm whereas you weren’t spending any repayment before on your debt free car.

Would diesel have cost you €450 per month?

So 20k kms done since Jan (5 month period) so that’s 4K kms a month. That’s a fair bit of mileage per month- motorway driving? How do you find the range in the leaf?

If the Passat uses 6L per 100kms that’s 60L per 1000kms, so that’s 240L per 4000kms.

With a 60L tank thats 4 fills of diesel.

60L at €2 per litre= €120 per fill.

4x €120= €480 for the cost of diesel.

You now have a repayment of €450 plus however much it costs to charge the EV plus the limited range vs ICE. (Not a problem if you don’t go far but at your mileage per month I imagine you do, also not a problem if you don’t mind waiting at charging stations- I would).

As you say maybe I’m no good at maths, you might correct the above figures wherever I got it wrong.

By the way I didn’t actually realise it was this close before doing these figures, however the range on the leaf wouldn’t suit so I’d need a more expensive car such as a Tesla or EV6 or ID4, that price would keep me in ICE for a while.

waterwelly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181632#Comment_119181632

Electrics are grand for people who can afford a new car every few years anyway.

But if they can afford a new car they could keep driving their existing ICE instead and the extra fuel costs at the moment would just be cancelled out by not spending money on a new car.

The electricity is mostly produced from fossil fuels. Electric cars are a conjob, mined out of the ground by machines burning oil.

It will end badly at some point.

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119181632#Comment_119181632

While I have had some whiskey taken, a quick glance at your numbers looks spot on. (For my circumstances anyway, like i said first everyone's different).

Overall we're roughly about €100 better off every month including cheaper tax.

Although we're in the lucky position where both myself and the wife work shifts and can usually share the one car and charge for free at work.

Range is fine for me, 124km round trip to work. I can squeeze out the advertised 260km range but rarely put in the effort to do so. Herself has a heavier foot and does a bit worse. All about 90% motorway.