Is crypto era over?

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120346653#Comment_120346653

If you want to be your own bank, cool. People generally don't want to be their own bank, if they did, they hold their cash under the mattress. Most don't.

Your local currency loses value due to economics.

There's little demand for non-speculative crypto use. No one I know uses it regularly or even infrequently. The numbers for crypto expenditure in businesses are absolutely tiny.

The vast majority of crypto use is for speculative gains, aka to try and make real money. Chainalysis showed that this figure was close to 99%. The vast bulk of which are artificially scarce digital tokens that do little and produce nothing (except maybe more of themselves)

I'm not moaning at all, step outside any crypto bubble and speak to anyone, most people I know who aren't into it describe it as a scam or a ponzi. I wouldn't describe all crypto as a ponzi myself, but it's definitely a scheme. And whoever Satoshi was, he/she/they didn't have a clue about economics that's for sure.

erlichbachman

Jaysus, its starting to look like the banks are the actual ponzis, the irony

erlichbachman

https://www.gsb.stanford.edu/faculty-research/working-papers/monetary-tightening-us-bank-fragility-2023-mark-market-losses

many more banks at risk

polysteamtoken

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120347131#Comment_120347131

You know what? I actually respect you. Thank you for not becoming aggressive or nasty or even worse name calling. You don't sprout off about things without proof of at least some thought because people who stamp out a whole technology just because some abuse it are not intelligent people.

Ok so being your own bank I understand is not for everyone I really do. People should a technology they feel comfortable with. People often joke about keeping their money under their mattress 🤣 We both know it's a metaphor and many people do keep their money in assets infact any rich person uses asset not currency. It's much better to own an asset like a house or factory then have the value in money. Because money loses value over time. A factory for example won't so long as it's used and maintained. The reason is they feel the government are greedy and they bloody are. I can't find a single person who will tell me they agree with how much tax they pay. So something outside government control is appealing you see.

Here is one massive advantage. So you say the local currency is due to economics and you are correct but let's say the government didn't have full control over the economy? People did instead. This would prevent the government giving another country millions of dollars instead of helping its own country. This doesn't help the economy and it's the government making stupid choices that drives the value down. Which is why I keep American dollars in either assets or USD tether coins. Obviously I use a ledger and so not interact with other addresses or contract other than my own so it's very low risk lower than with my bank.

On my bank account a few months ago I had to cancel my card as I found transfers of "amount due" which I find no records for. The bank is not like the blockchain where I simply look at my address and see where the transaction went. Instead they hide it just like a scammer would saying "payment due" my bank was not capable of telling me where this came from and it scared the hell out of me that it even happened since I rarely use my bank. I had tried to buy Fortnite vbucks on the epic store when the charge went through about an hour later. Very strange. My bank is ok now but the fact is they can't help me or even know what's going on is so bad. With crypto I can solve the issue without them. For a fact I wouldn't be having debt charges to begin with. I don't trust the bank or the government forgive me for having little faith in a system that tries to keep you in debt. Nevermind the loans the bank tries to get me into knowing full well I'll never pay it back. They even "as a customer service" apply me for debit cards and spending cards and various outlets.

However, as long as people are involved things go wrong. Crypto that has little involvement of people which is written by a smart contract is very safe so long as it's been audited. It's because it cannot be changed. The problem happens when people change or hide things. This is why we call them shitcoins. They nothing more then trash that clogs up the blockchain and pushed by shills. I've never invested in hype nor have I ever though I will become rich over night. Such thinking is the penny pinchers of the crypto world and there so many of them. These people are greedy and don't care for the technology. Thanks to them crypto gets a bad name.

I absolutely agree with you they things are out of god damn hand like wtf when I look around I feel sick. It annoys me so much that scams take money that should go to legit projects because of greed. Some people seem to think all you do is buy crypto and it magically goes up it's amazing how stupid ppl are. I'm very disappointed with how things are going tbh and I totally understand when people say it's a waste of energy and time. Because these people don't understand the technology and are not developers but they hear bad see all the filthy scams plagueing the place.

Proper crypto investors don't buy these shitcoins these shills try sell us they all worthless junk that do nothing. I mean have you seen the fk fest that is NFT lately? Dear god. Monkeys with caps that do bloody nothing. Just a collection like kids collectable cards. Not even a game. If the NFT was cards for a card game then cool but nope. It's just a freaking monkey. Then people wonder when others think it's just a scam. They is not what crypto or NFT is all about that's just some idiots selling crap to other idiots. Or maybe they not idiots just lack morals and decency? I can't imagine selling something to someone that does nothing and telling them it's awesome and will save the planet. It still amazes me how many people fall for scams.

Also people who use crypto to try to make "real money" miss the point and honestly aren't welcome or needed in the crypto realm. They are a scourge. Crypto is real money that's they point. If you want more crypto then you have to work. These people that want to sit and do nothing and think they will make money are dilluaional. Crypto is a currency and like any currency must be earned. I get paid in crypto and I sometimes help other crypto projects and trust me there so many bot account and little shills that will promote anything they don't even check the liquidation before hand because they don't understand then get paid in worthless coins. I do my research and work for projects that have an actual market and use. Many users who are paid in the project's tokens dump right away and get paid nothing.i wait for the project to develop and usually the tokens price goes up. Then I sell. These are not people that help the community all they do is convert to fiat and buy whatever crap they waste their money on and offer nothing to the project they also spam their work and have no worth ethic.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409837#Comment_120409837

Just to address some points:

People generally don't want to be responsible for their life savings or large amounts. It has nothing to do with technology, that's all down to risk.

You're right about local currency, I've always said crypto has a potential use to protect against domestic currency failure. Keyword: potential. However so far it's failed to do that, few people in countries like e.g. Venezuela use e.g. BTC for normal every day payments and stable coins have shown themselves to be risky.

Crypto is a highly risky sphere, it's chock-full of scammers, hackers, sim-jackers and charlatans. The decentralisation aspects work for them and against the user. I've seen just as many users lose funds due to hacks as I have people who've permanently lost funds due to a single lost password.

Crypto is not "real money", Doge isn't "real money", the many forks of BTC are not "real money", they are simply artificially scarce digital tokens that people speculate on, like baseball cards. It only becomes real when cashed out.

I have "done my research" on over 100 crypto projects, it means nothing. I look for a token that, sorry to say, will attract more chumps, and I go into that early. The price going up means someone else, e.g. your brother or friend or colleague is paying more than you did, that's all it is. It doesn't mean the underlying token is anything but trash. Some crypto "things" are less trash than others, but overall they are all pretty much the same thing.

polysteamtoken

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409966#Comment_120409966

Yes, yes there need to be regulated tokens if we want the risk as little as a bank with regards to the keeping of your "money" If we actually had proper legal companies that went through a regulation process and were held responsible by law things would be different. Still allowing people to buy more decentralised tokens knowing the risks. This way blatant scams can be traced to the trade between the regulated token and the decentralised one. More incentive for a regulated token to find scammers then simply allow them to do as they please. That is what crypto should be.

You don't have to "cash out" you can buy something from someone who is willing to accept crypto payment without cashing out anything. This whole "cashing out" thing is another dillusion of the penny pinchers mentality. People who think about "cashing out" should stick to fiat and merely use crypto as a vessel for payments or investing. There many job and "get paid to" websites that pay in crypto. Most do infact. For many it's a much easier choice. Banks are a pain the transaction takes long if it's from another bank and then there all these laws about transferring currency to your local one and thus big fees. It's a pain. I was never able to be paid online until crypto came along and that's why I use it. I use it as it's meant to be used. Also btw it's easier for me to fund fiat payment processes like Skrill payee and the like using crypto. Because otherwise I have to connect my bank account and it doesn't always work or work well or at all because I'm transferring from my local bank into an international one. With crypto I add an address type the amount and hit enter then I can use my Skrill account. Also I prefer not to give my banking info out too often. I don't mind giving out my wallet address. Banking is also alot more expensive.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410084#Comment_120410084

Buying something large with crypto e.g. BTC or Doge doesn't work well due to the price volatility. Likewise buying a car or house with Tesla shares, technically it can be done, but it doesn't make much sense outside being a novelty.

Works better with stable-coins, but as mentioned it's massively risky to hold anything in stable-coins.

Being paid entirely in crypto, e.g. BTC makes no sense. It's far less widely accepted than cash, it's value can dramatically fluctuate (e.g. someone might not be able to meeting their monthly payments), there's little resource/insurance and it's just awkward as hell.

Indeed banks are slow with transfers (mainly due to reconciliation), but these are speeding up, with e.g. Revolut I can transfer funds within a few seconds to most places. It's not a deal-breaker for all the other benefits that cash offers over crypto.

Crypto fees and costs are horrendous. Eth gas charges are ridiculous, exchange fees, transfer fees. In contrast, banking costs me a few euros a month or is entirely free.

polysteamtoken

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410192#Comment_120410192

Why would you use Eth? Just wrap it on the polygon network and you can send it for $0.01 . Bank costs $20 but PayPal fees are like 7% no thank you that feels like I'm being robbed. I'll never spend more than a few cents sending crypto. Which is why I use polygon not Eth or BNB I'm not paying those crazy fees. Exchange and transfer fees are merely 0.5% It's your own fault if you paying more.

There is plenty sense in being paid in crypto. I don't care if it's volatile so what? Don't keep crypto if you don't like that it's that easy. I get paid in crypto I believe in so I don't care what the USD equivalent is. Mostly keep stable coins very easy to use seconds to send. Again polygon network. Very nice to be a Dev on the network as well. Works very well and writing solidarity contracts is great using it I've never had an issue or works very very well. Also polygon matic is very stable for crypto. $0.80-$1.30 for a long time. Just spend when it's high if you can though you never know what's high so ya. So I don't worry about price. The fact I'm not obsessed with fiat value is the reason I'm even in green.

It's way easy to keep hand of my financial info and I can easily track payments I've made from years ago. I can't do this with the bank. I want my money to be transparent not hidden away. All my business is on the blockchain for everyone to see I hide nothing. Pity government won't use crypto oh wait.... Then we can track their payments for those expensive holidays and sports cars. Every cent out of the hands of government and banks is a win. I'm very happy with my cool internet money.

I don't like being told what to do especially when it comes to money so crypto works just fine. I can also spend it where I need to. As far as I care fiat and the bank can f off.

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120412009#Comment_120412009

I don't know who you bank with but my bank fees are not 20%. My main acc is a few euros per month and Revolut is completely free.

You personally might want to be paid in crypto, that's cool, someone else might want to be paid in Tesla stock. There's no logic behind it. In March 2020, BTC moved over 30% in less than a day. Imagine you were about to purchase a house? This is why people don't use volatile assets to pay for stuff, it makes no sense beyond novelty use.

I can see financial payments I made a decade ago, aggregated in one place, with my bank (which I had to do with crypto taxes)

You're happy with your magic internet money, cool, an entire financial system exists for when you get hacked, or scammed, or screwed, or it goes to zero, or your 2FA gets broken, or the exchange you were temp using to get some token when belly up or any number of things that can happen to crypto holdings.

You are against govt or banks handling cash because of course you are. Your system involves trusting unregulated private companies, private "money", dodgy internet digital tokens, cowboy exchanges, decentralization with no recourse/insurance and all that lark.

I'm happy you can seem to spend your crypto everywhere. I can't. Few places accept it without me having to go through additional hurdles or pointless hurdles. I couldn't pay my rent or mortgage with it, couldn't pay utilities. Can't pay my car insurance. Couldn't use crypto when I was abroad at the petrol pumps. I'd love a TV show where they take a crypto fundamentalist and drop them in India, or South America or hell even most European countries and see how long they survive with just crypto and not turning it into cash ;)

Call me crazy, I just like my regulated, relatively stable internationally accepted medium of exchange, that is insured, can pay in seconds, and it's accepted everywhere. It even works without electricity/internet. Nuts I know.

polysteamtoken

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120412428#Comment_120412428

I said $20 not 20% please read more carefully. How can your banks free be paid in % anyway if it's fixed?

Yes this is why never keep tokens on any exchange. Actually crypto has a blockchain and contracts deployed that can't be fiddled with by people hence why we have miners to protect that. Never once had a problem with an exchange as they solved my issues very quickly while the bank didn't even know what's going on. 3 hours to get back to me and sort my issue.

But yes it's far from perfect. In many ways what you say is correct. I hardly think regulation always counts because some "regulated" exchanges blocked withdraws under some "government order" btw you can get scammed and hacked without crypto. People scam others all over thile show it's hardly exclusive to crypto. Look at Forex for example and how they peddle that crap and it's regulated. 70% off people lose their money. You also get scam stocks on the stock market run by shell accounts that don't actually exist and stocks worth nothing. Don't pretend scams are exclusive to crypto. All the things you mentioned can happen with your bank or even cash in hand.

Irish_rat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120249859#Comment_120249859

It's been moving along nicely so far, BTC over 29k.

TinaTiernan

I have some BTC but it just behaves like a small cap stock. Big swings.

You might as well just invest in some wallstreetbets type stock like SOFI or Palantir, behaves similarly.

antimatterx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253820#Comment_120253820

I'm more confident we'll retest the bottom this year more than ever. Back half of the year will be brutal.

erlichbachman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120697369#Comment_120697369

The factors are completely political though, Gensler could be sacked, US congress could push through legislation on the back of Coinbase proposals, if either of these occur then confidence is restored overnight. The factors are not technical or economic, they are political with an abundance of subjective motives.

If neither of these occur then the landscape will have changed leaving the US behind, and nobody could ever know what such a market looks like.

WizardOfBoards

It is called the accumulation phase, it is this time around you need to add to your baggies

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120697491#Comment_120697491

The same old broken record "they're against us" conspiracy stuff that crypto has been creating for the last decade.

These are unregulated private currencies, it's pretty amazing (and surprisingly lenient) that regulators actually allow this stuff to have value, the majority of the public think crypto is mostly a scam (I wouldn't call it all a scam, but it's definitely a scheme). It's facing a bit of music is all, if they really wanted the regulators could regulate this stuff into the ground, but apart from e.g. India/China, they haven't really done much in that regard, so the whole scheme just keeps chugging along.

They're still letting it live and giving it a slap on the wrist every once in awhile.

erlichbachman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120781814#Comment_120781814

Ahh me aul friend dohn, on the missing list since blackrock filed for a spot.

couple of questions for yourself, first, why do you believe the sec won’t make guidelines clear for crypto? Would you have any belief that it would then diminish their influence over the market if they were to clarify?

Also, would you still consider bitcoin a ponzi given that Blackrock have now filed for a spot?

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120782226#Comment_120782226

First question. Difficult for any regulatory body can make clear guidelines for crypto because crypto is a shape-shifter, and it's hard to regulate a chameleon, this both works for and against crypto (mostly for in my opinion)

Second Q. Not exactly sure what you mean. The SEC's key job is to protect the public/investors. Crypto is scam central, so it's the SEC's responsibility to do something about that. One of the latest tack's they are trying appears to be going after large exchanges in order to scare small exchanges into line.

I see Bitcoin more like a casino. Like a casino we all just gamble each other's money, and like a casino nothing is really produced (except some entertainment). There's a demand by bigger investors to enter that gambling game, but they don't want to use shady as **** crypto exchanges, they want something they can trust, hence Blackrock and similar enter the sphere, to meet that demand.

Crypto "investors" of course support bigger fish joining because it's another layer of money coming in, it also "legitimises" the whole scheme more.

andy125

Crypto, fiat, stocks and bonds all wont matter in 20 to 30 years, the way we are going barter seems to be the future we are destined for.

masterboy123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120796378#Comment_120796378

I am hodling!

XTRAVAGANZA

Crypto era is far from over, if anything, we are just getting started cos crypto is still in its nascent stage. Its ecosystem keeps growing with new narrative coming in play. From Play2Earn, to Learn2Earn, to Dance2Earn, to Type2Earn, to GameFi, to DeFi, to Fitfi, to Web3, to memecoins, to NFTs, to AI and several others too numerous to mention. There is a whole new world waiting to be explored in the Crypto space in my opinion. Don't even get started with the products and services offered by top crypto exchanges like Kraken, Kucoin, Bitget, Binance et all.

bigswingingrichard

Yes, sell all your bags at a loss just as crypto use accelerates in the real world.

Get out now before mass adoption of blockchain happens in the next few years, it’s the smart play. 😊

Shedite27

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120922758#Comment_120922758

Where are ya seeing its use accelerate in the real world? You have any examples of using it day-to-day?

Justin Sun is becoming seriously important to the wider crypto ecosystem.

The problem with that is he makes SBF seem like a responsible businessman. Seriously dodgy.

If he gets arrested then that a pretty huge jenga piece being yanked out suddenly.

GeneralEth

What i see here is that we should alll have the diversity in using currencies and this is supposed to be a plus for the usage of crypto assets and anonymity with funds is also a good one am making use of Bitget to store my crypto asset

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118558379#Comment_118558379

HerrKuehn

It really feels like crypto is dying a slow death, the hype has moved onto other things. I think many maybe expected a big bang ending, but it seems it is more like a punctured tire. It has been 6 years since the initial hype in 2017 and we haven't reached a point where it is used for anything other than speculation (yes, I know some of the niche enthusiasts will say they use it for things, I am talking about average joe).

erlichbachman

Is this a joke?

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120965050#Comment_120965050

No, Coinbase trading volumes down 58% YOY. Very little about crypto in media at the moment, hardly hear anybody talking about it in work etc. I mean you can't really think things are going well at the moment can you? I know some will point to the cycle and say it is to be expected, how many times has the cycle repeated so far? You would be basing your extrapolation on a very small sample size. Look at the posts in this forum, mainly newly registered users asking about memecoins and another newly registered user agreeing that is a great idea to get in early, etc. The forum is on life support, which is indicative of the level of interest

Shedite27

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120965961#Comment_120965961

So you think Crypto is only going well if people are talking about it "going to the moon"?

At some point a financial asset is gonna be boring, that's okay

Dohnjoe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120966179#Comment_120966179

Dogecoin, a financial asset?

Behind the price hype that has occurred approx every 4 years, there's relatively very little real-world use of crypto. If it all snapped out of existence tomorrow, the world would keep turning without a blink. Nobody I know uses it. I've had crypto for a decade now and have never any need for it.

The technology itself has some uses, but the majority of it are solutions for problems that don't exist.

99% of crypto use is trading/speculation and the market is pretty much a casino where people gamble each other's crypto and cash out for real money. With the house (coin minters) making bank in the process. Ultimately little or nothing actually gets produced (many would argue it consumes more than it produces).