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Fuel Price Protest Dublin 24th November

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Comments

  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 61,806 Mod ✭✭✭✭ L1011


    This is guaranteed to achieve nothing. They're wasting time and fuel and making people pissed off with them, nothing else.

    There are times when trying is a waste of time. This is one of them.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,635 ✭✭✭✭ Podge_irl


    What exactly is their aim?



  • Registered Users Posts: 665 ✭✭✭ Citrus_8


    Carbon tax annual increase is to discourage people use fossil fuels and use other greener fuels. It's a political way to create a demand for electric, hybrid and hydrogen vehicles. Fuel price also increasing now to cover the loses due to last year's record low demand. Also, fuel is pricier due to fuel additives' cost. So it's a mix of political and economical reasons. Protests won't fix this as the reasons are more global rather than local.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,635 ✭✭✭✭ Podge_irl


    Well, they are on to a massive loser then cause its never going to happen. Lowering fuel duties would fly in the face of what little steps are being taken to reduce fossil fuel usage. Ireland is not even out of kilter with the rest of Europe price wise. Ultimately gasoil prices have almost doubled since this time last year and there is nothing the Irish govt can do about that.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 493 ✭✭ mondeoman72


    It does not have to be a fuel reduction. A rebate system for licenced hauliers would do the job just as well. Like a business claiming back the VAT on purchases. They need some sort of a scheme put forward, otherwise, Joe Public will end up paying through the nose again by increased prices.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,635 ✭✭✭✭ Podge_irl


    The solution is prices in stores should be higher and truckers should be paid more. Shelves are "empty" in the UK because of logistical issues - if it was a problem that slightly higher fees would sort then it would be a lot easier to sort. Their ire should be focused at those paying them insufficiently.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,752 ✭✭✭✭ Wishbone Ash


    It's not that simple. Most of those protesting will be owner/operators. They tender for work in advance and are locked into a price. The rise in fuel prices wipes out their margins. It's a race to the bottom competing against larger operators who are hiring transient eastern Europeans on barely above minimum wages.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,635 ✭✭✭✭ Podge_irl


    Its never that simple and I appreciate that. But equally "cut fuel taxes" (or give us tax rebates) is equally an attempt at an incredibly simple solution. It is just more govt subsidies for what should be coming from the market - we should not be giving govt subsidies for what should be the normal cost of doing business.



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,752 ✭✭✭✭ Wishbone Ash


    I know what you are saying but Government subsidies are provided all the time to sectors that are not financially viable because there is a belief that they are necessary for the greater good, Most family farms here are not financially viable and are subsidised as it is considered beneficial in other ways. It's the same for off-shore islands, Irish speaking areas, public transport, regional airports etc. Otherwise the economy of the country would be focused on the east coast.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 43,480 Mod ✭✭✭✭ magicbastarder


    most obvious question is that are those who don't think the truckers shouldn't get a rebate, also happy to pay more for their shopping in the local spar?



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,097 ✭✭✭✭ callaway92


    Is there no market for a budget fuel operator to either sell fuel/petrol/diesel at a break-even or even a loss leader price point? At least in regards to the normal Petrol Station punters anyway.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,751 ✭✭✭ SouthWesterly


    If they used public transport to supply their goods like they've been told they wouldn't have these problems. 😁



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 43,480 Mod ✭✭✭✭ magicbastarder


    AFAIK most petrol stations make very small margins on fuel anyway; if they're using it as a loss leader, what do you expect them to make up the gap with?



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,233 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    was told this my a garage owner years ago, its probably still true, he said most of his income came from selling other goods

    governments obviously need to step in, and subsidies sectors affected by carbon taxes, if they dont, there ll be mayhem



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,097 ✭✭✭✭ callaway92


    I don’t know - I was only asking the question as someone who isn’t involved in Fuel sales but my guess would’ve been good quality Food Court/Deli/Coffee Area for a start - Something that can be sold easily at all times of the day that Petrol would also be bought.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 43,480 Mod ✭✭✭✭ magicbastarder


    governments obviously need to step in, and subsidies sectors affected by carbon taxes, if they dont, there ll be mayhem

    that's the rub though, the sectors most likely to be hit with carbon taxes would be (well, should be) those producing lots of CO2. and if you then subsidise them, it negates the point of the carbon tax.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,233 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    yea this wont be easy, but we clearly need to put protective measures in place for certain industries, or we re gonna have a major unemployment problem, and probably major supply issues, we need to make sure people can afford their most critical needs, this could potentially be another opportunity for a ubi style system, i.e. implement carbon taxes, but make sure the individuals affected are state supported, not an easy one though



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    You think this is bad...big push to get everyone into electric vehicles by governments just starting...vat at pumps will not generate enough revenue...Australia already ahead with electric vehicles and have brought in a law to charge by the km you drive to upkeep the roads.all the sheep too busy trying to make ends meet to see what's coming down the road..it will be like the visa and property tax every year...when people were protesting about water charges and got it reversed..where were you ? You get what you sow



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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,233 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    there are limitations to taxation, if we keep playing this game, i.e. keeping taxing the public, and not offering functioning alternatives, our economy will eventually fall over, we clearly have to get off fossil fuels asap, but im not sure we know how to do it, without crashing economies.

    oh and i wasnt protesting over water, as i am conflicted here also, we clearly need to preserve water, but again, we cant keep just 'taxing' to do so.... i also wont be involved in this protest either, but can understand why those that are



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