Michael D Higgins insists he is President of Ireland, refuses to commemorate partition

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903206#Comment_117903206

Incorrect. The full title is President of the Republic of Ireland & Environs.

Of course he should not attend! I can't believe anyone actually thinks he should.

As for posters not knowing the name of their own country 🙄🙄

Sunny Disposition

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903535#Comment_117903535

He would slaughter them in any debate, that's for sure. Realistically he'd have declined to attend anyway, but there's no question that the invitation was a very blatant attempt at a political insult.

Itssoeasy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903202#Comment_117903202

No he isn’t. His title is president of Ireland, which when he visited the UK a couple of years ago and gave a speech in Westminster hall, he was referred to as president of Ireland by then speaker of the House of Commons and whatever else the British civil service know a thing or two about diplomatic protocol and people’s titles. It should be the bare minimum to get that persons name right when you invite someone you invite to an event. When queen Elizabeth visited here, we addressed her by her correct title and we do it for any other head of state.

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903272#Comment_117903272

He is president of Ireland. The country of Ireland that he is president of does not contain northern ireland. I'm sure you understand that and are simply trolling as I don't believe you are that stupid.

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903325#Comment_117903325

Nope, it's from the Constitution.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/cons/en/html#part7

Article 29.7

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903423#Comment_117903423

OK, so he is the president of Ireland but not the 6 counties....

billyhead

I'm not sure what the controversy is about this. Would you attend a birthday party of thieves who robbed your house?

FunLover18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903633#Comment_117903633

He is the President of the country of Ireland which does not include the 6 counties but is still called Ireland. He is not president of the island and no one has claimed he is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903633#Comment_117903633

Do you think the country of Ireland includes northern Ireland?

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903651#Comment_117903651

Some have, indeed previously he hinted that he was president for the whole Island of Ireland.

This will go down as another spanner in the works for a UI. You know when you are on a bad one when the Alliance Party and sympathetic sections of the British media like the Guardian are scratching their heads at this move. To say he is not going because he was called by his wrong title is both juvenile and pathetic tbh.

However, if you are like me and want to kick the can of a UI down the road of a few decades, this will do nicely.

LillySV

He should be going and not be so divisive.....hes well able to hop on the plane to other countries such as Italy and getting involved in religious and political ceremonies... no such high standards when theres a nice trip with lots of t&s involved....he likes goign abroad and spouting shite poetry from rich irish men long gone...

Northern has been thrown under a bus by a crap eu-uk deal that isnt serving the country well...we can argue that thats uks problem etc...but thats not the point...ireland should be showin our closest neighbours that we are willing to meet and work together...and most important of all...we are there to help and support Norhtern ireland people...

Cilldara_2000

This naming thing. Dev et al f*cked up big time IMO by claiming Ireland as the name of the state. I can't really see the point of view of that if they didn't, they'd be leaving it to unionists to claim, and by using it as the name of the state, they gave and continue to give great succour to partitionists and staters to claim that the North is a different country. The name should not have been used as the name of only part of the country theretofore known as Ireland. But anyway I suppose there's no squirting that milk back up the cow's udders now.

IMO Ireland the island is a country, the same as Germany was a country while it was partitioned, and Korea is a country too. Poland during the times it was occupied and partitioned was also a country. And ofc the 26 county state is also a country and also named Ireland.

FunLover18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903667#Comment_117903667

Anyone who claims he is the president of the island is wrong. End of. But I think you must have misinterpreted.

His correct title is the President of Ireland and the only spanner here is the one thrown by the DUP by not using it.

R.odders999

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903667#Comment_117903667

No way should you have an O in your username......definite soup taker.

McMurphy

....

https://twitter.com/DrHaroldNews/status/1438618878049914880?s=19

gmisk

Fair play to him, right decision.

Plus Jeffrey is p#ssed off...bonus.

Butson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903731#Comment_117903731

Souper.

Christ, its 2021. Ireland, Irish, bla bla.

Just a matter of geography where you were born. We are on a spinning planet hurtling through space and this is what occupies your mind.

Fionn1952

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903667#Comment_117903667

That'd be the Alliance Party, who's leader at the time, David Ford refused to attend any commemorations of Irish independence, referring to it as a, 'commemoration of violence?

I'd suggest the APNI check their own hypocrisy before trying to assert any moral high ground on the matter, and I say this as someone with a great deal of respect for the party in general.

Out of curiosity, Mark....is there a single topic relating to the politics of these islands on which you won't take the hardline Ulster Loyalist position on when it's an option? Your faux attempts to act like you can't distinguish between Ireland as a state and Ireland as an island just reads like another attempt to drag down any discussion such as this into the dirt of strawman arguments that no one made.

The fact of the matter is the state we live in is called Ireland when speaking English, this does not include the six counties of NI. The term Republic of Ireland is a description, not the name of the state. The title of the President of this state (again, in English) is the President of Ireland. Anyone with a modicum of diplomacy about them would refer to a state official by their correct title.

Your fake inability to differentiate between the island and the state to set up a strawman argument that anyone is claiming Higgins is the President for all 32 counties is ridiculous....and still doesn't change the fact that his title is President of Ireland.

trashcan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903735#Comment_117903735

Oh no. I was so looking forward to rejoining the commonwealth !

R.odders999

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903758#Comment_117903758

Don't mention occupying, touchy subject.

Brucie Bonus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903476#Comment_117903476

I think the Fine Gael lads are worried it might affect their KBE prospects.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117902617#Comment_117902617

he is the president of Ireland, you should read up on the Republic of Ireland Act

Brucie Bonus

Is the queen going so she can apologise? It was hardly a resounding success. I'd say Fine Gael and the other unionists had to lobby hard to get the queen to go. I'd say Andrew is afraid to leave the house incase he gets extradited.

Higgins is brilliant. He is completely right not to attend.

Sunny Disposition

Serious question. Who organised this ceremony? The churches, the UK State, the DUP, who?

Kermit.de.frog

Islam?

Dunno

topmanamillion

Fair play to President Higgins here.

He was prepared to go when it was dubbed as a service and reconciliation event but no way should the head of state be going to an event celebrating partition. That would simply be a kick in the teeth for a majority of people in Northern Ireland.

The DUP knew exactly what they were doing when they called him the President of the Republic of Ireland. I`m sure they wouldn`t announce "Queen Lizzy of Britain and less than 1/5th of Ireland" - no they`d be sure to give her, her full title even though she`s done nothing more than being born into the right house.

As for John Bruton..................the mans a laughing stock. There`s absolutely zero appetite here to join the common wealth.

castletownman

Good on Michael D for standing by his beliefs. I can think of a few sniffley West Brits that are allegedly our leaders that would have been straight up the M1 two minutes after opening the invite.

Of course, it's fine and dandy to criticise the DUP for their homophobic stuff. When our president is slighted by them, however, and this is a political stunt, for some reason, the DUP's aren't the bad guys. Madness.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903806#Comment_117903806

That is literally exactly what I said in the bit you quoted - "He is the president of Ireland".

seamus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903867#Comment_117903867

The DUP. They organised a celebration of partition in a protestant church. A large part of their reasoning was the hope that prominent Irish politicians would refuse to go and they'd get to moan about how the Republicans are not interested in unity.

They probably didn't foresee at the time though that the DUP itself would be in the middle of threatening to pull out of Stormont and trying to bring a hard border on the island.

JP Liz V1

Stand your ground Higgy

Ash.J.Williams

Is it just me or are we seeing a lot of valid threads with stupid titles lately? Are they teaching click bait in school or wha

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903907#Comment_117903907

no, you said President of Ireland is the short title giving to the "Republic of Ireland" the official title is Éire  or Ireland.

topmanamillion

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903922#Comment_117903922

Thankfully voters in the North are starting to wake up to the DUP. They`re the 3rd placed unionist party now with Sinn Fein having double their vote in most poll. They`re just a failing party with failed policies. If they bring down Stormont and there`s an election they`ll be wiped out.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903922#Comment_117903922

According to most reports including RTE, the service is being organised by the "main Christian churches" and not the DUP.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903021#Comment_117903021

Build unity by acknowledging our division............... or are we too small minded still to do that?

facehugger99

If Higgins was serious about unification he'd trot up there and apogise to the unionist community for the IRA atrocities and assure them of their place in a United Ireland.

Instead he decided to play to the galley of barstool republicans' in a fit of pique - we should expect no better of him I suppose.

The clappy seals that support Higgins are too dumb to realise they are setting back the prospects of a UI by decades - still, I don't fancy forking out an extra €20bn a year, so that's ok I guess.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903952#Comment_117903952

And in that I was wrong and glad to be corrected - I thought Rep of Ireland was the official name and Ireland the common name rather than the other way round.

You'll understand that where I come from, this distinction was not often made obvious.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117903236#Comment_117903236

That's exactly and precisely what our President is, in plain English.

McMurphy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904023#Comment_117904023

Why the fook would the president of Ireland apologise for IRA atrocities?

Was Mickey D a member of the RA? Would you expect the queen of England to apologise to us for the actions of the loyalist paramilitary forces???

The fcukin state of your post. 🤣

melekalikimaka

the issue here is, unless you are up to speed with our constitution the correct title can be perceived as misleading

Cilldara_2000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904023#Comment_117904023

Any Irish politician or NI nationalist politician could bend over backwards for unity. It will never make an ounce of difference to the DUP and their "we're British and nothing else" fellow travellers. Hence why every time anyone talks about border polls or building a "shared island" they always say they're not interested. Partitionists know this when they set this impossibly high bar for republicans and nationalists.

The only way they'll ever be shown different is when we vote in a united Ireland on a 50% +1 basis as set out in the GFA and then subsequently treat everyone equally and with dignity - IE do the opposite of what they did in their plastic "Protestant State for a Protestant people".

Dead right he shouldn't accept the invitation. It would be fairly ironic if the President of Ireland attended an event which celebrated partition. DUP are not very smart when it comes to diplomacy.

Queen Elizabeth will not attend the event anyway. Some lower royal might attend on her behalf.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904099#Comment_117904099

That's delusional - how do you think the Protestant people who lived down south were treated after the foundation of the Free State and later Republic. Like sh*te in case you don't know the answer. This 50+1% idea is mad and would lead to open hostility. We need to be aiming for at least 80% in favour on both sides of the border. Get working on it. And our president could do with showing a good example.

seamus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904059#Comment_117904059

Sure, if you're just some Joe Nobody.

There's no excuse for an Irish politician to not know the difference and understand the context. It was of course a deliberate misnomer by whoever sent the invitation.

hawley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904023#Comment_117904023

It's a dog whistle to a lot of the younger generation who never seem to tire of letting people know how anti-British they are. They are revelling in their own bigotry today. His behavior isn't far removed from that of Trump's presidency; taking offence to how they worded his title and sowing more division, instead of reconciliation.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904099#Comment_117904099

"It will never make an ounce of difference to the DUP and their "we're British and nothing else" fellow travellers".

You're quite right. Though it will make a difference to moderate unionists like me who have been brought up to believe British is best but suddenly find that we're closer to the ideologies and people of Ireland rather than Britain. We're not all DUP followers you know. The current UK government is the most corrupt and obnoxious that I have seen in my 50+ years and the DUP have been shown to be their bosom pals. There is an opportunity here to convince others of my breed that Ireland is our better path. To do that you need to convice that we are wanted and will not be mistreated. I personally believe Higgins attendance would have furthered that. But as I said before, the guy is entitled to his own choice.

FunLover18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904198#Comment_117904198

They could have just got his title right, it's not hard.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117904198#Comment_117904198

This is like saying Ukraine would be rude down the line for not joining Russia in celebrating the annexing of Crimea.

If there was any genuine attempt at reconciliation, the DUP's position for the last five years wouldn't have been attempting to return to a hard border.

ireallydontknow

The response to this on Reddit Ireland and Journal.ie shows you just how latent is poisonous Anglophobia in this country.

Higgins's umbrage at President of the Republic is not baseless, but it is contentious. The Republic of Ireland Act allows for Ireland to be referred to as ROI abroad. As regrettable as it may be for some, NI is abroad. So at least in a descriptive sense, President of the Republic is justified. But it's true that it's not his formal title. Yet, the name Ireland, for the political entity that only encompasses part of the geographical region of the same name, was and remains a provocative choice. In such situations as this, sense might be expected to prevail and allow an accommodation for the fact that many people in NI resent that the Irish State, and thereby our president, claims to speak for them.

Regardless, such breaches of protocol get handled behind close doors. It's scarcely believable that he would petulantly use it as explanation for his refusal.