Boosters

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117933141#Comment_117933141

Well, it seems to be those vaccinated but most at risk who are ending up in hospital so not really surprising.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117934030#Comment_117934030

Are vaccinated now numbering more than unvaccinated? I thought it was about 50:50 a week or so ago.

Black Swan

What I have read regarding the spread of Delta across the pond is that:

1. states with the lowest vaccination rates are having the highest spread of Covid Delta;
2. there have been reports of breakthrough cases of vaccinated catching Covid, but this represents a tiny number when compared to the infections of unvaccinated;
3. to spread Covid you must be positive with the virus; in other words, in the vast majority of cases vaccinated do not test positive and do not spread Delta;
4. in the small number of breakthroughs, in most cases hospitalization was not necessary;
5. Recent JNJ data submitted to the FDA and CDC for review and approval of their vaccination boosters reported an efficacy improvement from the 70s to the 90s, including no Covid deaths after boosters.
6. There was an interesting article in the Atlantic titled: No, Vaccinated People Are Not ‘Just As Likely’ To Spread the Coronavirus As Unvaccinated People. Not a scholarly source, but worth a read.

is_that_so

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117934198#Comment_117934198

It's about age and at risk criteria not numbers, that is a factor in current hospital cases. Over time we will see a higher proportion of vaccinated in hospital but there are a smaller number in ICU. Most of those are unvaccinated.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117934234#Comment_117934234

The last figures I read were that 50% of Covid patients came from the 10% of the population who are unvaccinated, is there a more stark statistic than that?

If you are saying that as vaccination rate increases further, patients are more likely to be from the vaccinated population, yes that stands to reason, but the proportion of patients from the unvaccinated population will still remain significantly higher if infection rates stay constant.

Edit: just published in the media:

https://news.google.com/articles/CAIiEI_IcmSYfdPu3MHX3syGvVYqGQgEKhAIACoHCAow6KD9CjDuy_QCMI7o0wU?hl=en-IE&gl=IE&ceid=IE%3Aen

238 cases, or 71%, reported as not having received a vaccine.

97 people, 29%, were reported as having received at least one dose of a vaccine.

Of the 62 fully-vaccinated ICU patients;

• 38 were male and 24 were female
• Median age was 67 years (range: 30 to 88 years)
• Mean age was 65 years
• 60 cases (97%) were reported to have an underlying medical condition
• 12 cases (19%) were reported to have died

bloopy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117934265#Comment_117934265

What is the reason behind April being used as the start date?

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117936016#Comment_117936016

I guess they had to pick a start date?

The start of April they had all of cohort 1 & 2 done (first jabs, which with Alpha was enough) and half of cohort 3.

So maybe that was the start of when they would have expected to see the link broken between cases and deaths and ICU admissions?

snowcat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117936016#Comment_117936016

It would be interesting to see the stats for September. In April May June there was a lot of unvaccinated due to unavailability. The earlier administered vaccines are now waning as well. I would not be surprised if the up to date icu figures for vaccinated are much higher.

Lumen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117936320#Comment_117936320

This from 3 days ago.

https://twitter.com/paulreiddublin/status/1440597050060541955

bloopy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117936342#Comment_117936342

Have they released new numbers.

The only thing I can find on the hse site still uses the report that has the April to September figures.

Lumen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117940508#Comment_117940508

Don't think so. The raw data is from CIDR which is not open access, presumably because it contains personal patient data.

https://www.hiqa.ie/areas-we-work/health-information/data-collections/computerised-infectious-disease-reporting-cidr

Big Gerry

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117931585#Comment_117931585

How come we never heard about "new strains" of HIV when AIDS was killing large numbers of people back in the 80s and 90s ?

Is covid the only virus were we get "new strains" ?

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117947883#Comment_117947883

AIDS is still infecting and killing large numbers of people, a 2019 a study put the number of current living infections world wide at 45 million. It is due to the diversity/mutation of the HIV virus that has made a cure so difficult to develope, but luckily, some of the research into a vaccine for HIV was used in the making of the Covid vaccine.

Incidentally, it is changes to behaviours, use of barrier protections, improved awareness of cross infection and medications that have reduced the infection and death rate from HIV. Sound familiar?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117947883#Comment_117947883

We do. The strain that is the most common in the US is not the most common globally for example.

https://www.webmd.com/hiv-aids/types-strains-hiv

joseywhales

So I live in the US and my wife is a surgeon. The staff in her hospital are currently receiving boosters. We talked about it and we are a bit hesitant. We reasoned that getting more people to get at least one dose would be far more effective than having a small number of people getting three doses both for both collective and her individual risk. Introducing the booster further alienates and entrenches the vaccine hesitant, the benefit of a booster for a small number of medical staff is probably outweighed by the political effect. There was also the issue that americans are going to receive three doses while the majority of the world have access to none. Finally, we do not feel that we are in an emergency anymore, therefore we will not take any medical regimen that is not fully approved by the FDA. So I think we will remain at two doses and perhaps get a booster after one year.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117959586#Comment_117959586

FDA approved booster shorts for occupations at risk of exposure to Covid, this would include your wife, on 22/09.

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-authorizes-booster-dose-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine-certain-populations

There does not seem to be any shortage of vaccines in the US, as one commentator put it, people saying they don’t want a vaccine because they feel others need it more in the US, is like saying I don’t want a Big Mac because there are people who can’t get a Big Mac.

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117959786#Comment_117959786

I specifically mentioned the world not the US. I agree with the WHO in this regard. You will notice the FDA approval is for an EUA. Again as already mentioned, we do not believe we are in an emergency.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117959849#Comment_117959849

The FDA approved its use, infection rates have increased significantly since June, but have dropped somewhat in the last week. And unless there has been a change in policy, the US have stockpiled vaccines for US citizens, so you booster would not be exported to other parts of the world.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/covidview/index.html

Is your post another “our cases are higher cause we test more, there is no emergency” moment?

joseywhales

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117960023#Comment_117960023

Nope, just stating that its the first time we have hesitated to follow the advise. We don't believe it's necessary for us to get a booster yet. There is an EUA for limited groups, I think when there is full FDA approval, we will probably use that to trigger us to reconsider. We are in a state where the incident rate was never very high and vaccination rate is top 3 in the country and at county level greater than 75%. It is not a simple command and control where the FDA recommends another booster for emergency use and we comply, we believe that we do not need booster until at least 2022.

Whocanibe

When I had my two jabs, that was it as far as I was concerned. When the talk turned to Boosters, I said it was not for me. I was still of that opinion but this evening, I received a text from the HSE, with an appointment for a booster. They said if I was concerned to talk to my GP, this is Friday evening, not a hope in hell, it's hard enough to get an appointment at any time, you even need an appointment for a phone consulation! My head is spinning and they have given me very little time until my appointment.

My concern is the booster is a different vaccine to the two I had, and that scares me. The link they gave me said a study showed it was safe, but has not been appoved by the EMA. I don't think I'd be as nervous if it was the same vaccine. They said if I don't show up, they will send me another appointment, if I keep not showing up, will they keep sending me appointments? Everyone I've spoken to in the past couple of weeks, said they won't take a booster. I have read and heard of nasty side effects to this vaccine, and I'm torn between should I or not. I'm not looking for medical advice by the way. My head is telling me one thing and my gut is going in the opposite direction. Has anyone here had a mix of vaccines and did you have any side effects?

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117964864#Comment_117964864

A bit more information? If you don't mind , what original vaxx did you get , what are you being offered and I presume you are at high risk ?

Whocanibe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117965112#Comment_117965112

I had AZ, the booster is Pzfizer. I have a weak immune system, but there are lots of people far worse then me. I should say the hospital referred me, as they did first time around.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117965169#Comment_117965169

I can't advise you but only to say that so many people have had Pfizer without any issues .

If you have been contacted already you are definitely immunocompromised .

It's up to you at the end of the day .

If you feel more comfortable wait and talk to your GP and defer your vaccine appointment .

Would there be a specialist nurse in the treating hospital you could talk to ?

Whocanibe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117965266#Comment_117965266

Thank you. I know what I probably should do. I wouldn't really ring the hospital at this time,they have enough to do. I'll sleep on it and maybe have a clearer head in the morning. It's the fact that it's a different vaccine that worries me.

Charles Babbage

Probably millions of people have had Pfizer after AZ. In places like Germany and Canada, not reckless places by any means, they gave young people second shots of Pfizer after a first shot of Astrazeneca when AZ was found to occasionally cause problems in young people. These combinations aren't the first thing to be tested, as Pfizer test theirs and Astrazeneca test theirs. But academic researchers have tested these combinations and found them very effective and without particular problems.

I got two jabs of AZ, I expect I'll be eventually offered a Pfizer booster and I will be happy to get one.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117965378#Comment_117965378

Afaik even Angela Merkel has had Pfizer after one dose of AZ , so you'll be in good company :)

bodhrandude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117934218#Comment_117934218

Sorry for going off topic but how did you manage to thank your own post?

snowcat

I see now in Israel you lose your vaccine cert if you dont get a booster.

https://www.ft.com/content/a1b2fd70-71b5-4e91-be0b-553b0e1e2639

ceadaoin.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117973729#Comment_117973729

They consider those with 2 shots to be unvaccinated now so that will make the breakthrough numbers look better I guess. Also, the pass is only valid for 6 months before it expires again, and previously infected are now excluded and must be vaccinated. So it's indefinite 6 monthly boosters then unless they put a stop to the whole thing. I see protests there are ramping up now in response.

https://mobile.twitter.com/Israelprotest/status/1444382549048967169

monkeyactive

Friends , where are we now regarding the booster situation here . I'm struggling to figure it out.

Likely that it will be a third shot for all , then another booster regularly like a flu jab , maybe once twice a year for the foreseeable? Or will we settle with boosters for the vulnerable groups and optional for all others.

Will those that refuse a booster shot for whatever reasoning be demoted to the same status as an unvaccinated person after a given period of time ?

Any good forecasters out there, maybe too hard to call as of yet ?