Partner Upset with Sex Play

hawley

We have been in relationship for over a year, but don't live together. Basically I attempted to choke her during sex last week and now she has become very distant. I haven't seen her in five days and have only received one word message replies. It's difficult to explain what happened. She was upset afterwards and I apologized to her. She has issues with her weight and can be prone to comfort eating. I told her that I wanted to simulate suffocating her, she didn't seem to be against it.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058200798/partner-upset-with-sex-play

I wouldnt blame her being honest.

YellowLead

I think that was a risky move if you didn’t ask her first? Not everybody is very sexually experienced or experienced on the non compete vanilla and she may now associate you with being physically abusive. You should talk to her about it. Call her up apologies that it was out of the blue and then have an adult conversation about what you are both into.

Jequ0n

Well she hasn’t rejected the idea so, like you, I would have read this as green light. Classic case of miscommunication.

If you want to salvage this you will need to make the first move and an apology will most likely get you in the door.

you should probably discuss using a safe word going forward, which will make this easier to manage.

Loveinapril

Not seeming to be "against it" is not consent. You did not ask permission first so I can see why she would be upset.

Dave0301

Not sure what relevance the comfort eating comment has?

Your post and the fact you say it is difficult to explain makes it sound like there is more to it possibly?

However, depending on if she actually gave explicit consent, or maybe you were more rough than you intended, she would be well within her rights to be upset with you.

She didn't seem to be against it doesn't exactly sound like she was chomping at the bit either...

lulublue22

She didn’t seem to reject the issue or she didn’t reject the issue ? They are two very different things. Did you actually ask can I stimulate suffocating you during sex or did you simply say it in a oh I’d love to stimulate suffocating you during sex in a by the way / random type conversation ? It’s not clear from your post but based on what you have written I think you were in the wrong as it certainly seems you weren’t specific and got specific consent. I’d be unhappy too if I was in her position as it seems from your post that you half floated the issue but weren’t explicit enough and she probably felt blindsided. I think too there is a difference between stimulating suffocation which indicates placing your hands on someones neck and actually having your hands around someones neck and adding pressure. At any stage during it did you ask are you ok ? Am I squeezing too tight etc ? Did you stop when you realised things were going wrong ?

I’m not sure what her comfort eating and being over weight has to do with the situation ?

Maybe she really really didn’t like it and it has forced her to reconsider the relationship ? She’s obviously very upset if she is giving one word answers a week later.

It does seem that there was a miscommunication between ye but I think you need to own that one.

honeyjo

This why consent is so important. If a partner did this to me I would end the relationship. You don't seem to understand that this is a deal breaker and you broke her trust.

_Whimsical_

If you were engaging in this wouldn't it be more likely to intensify her pleasure than because you enjoy potentially choking someone?

Asking a partner to do it to you is a vastly different thing to expressing a desire to suffocate a partner, you're essentially saying to them I want to hold your life in my hands for kicks. The truth is most people are going to be horrified by that even in theory, no matter how open-minded they are. I'm unnerved by you mentioning her weight in this context too, what does that have to do with anything? It sounds like a criticism. Someone with any critical intent doing that would be pretty terrible.

If you did float this idea with her I'd expect you'd have talked about it before quite a bit and made sure she was definitely up for it, at least enthusiastically curious, have discussed how much pressure she'd be ok with, a role playish scenario where you didn't really stress her body or a full on suffocation,talk about how you'd stop the second she wanted, how she'd communicate this to you etc. I'd think you'd ask directly again before you lay a finger on her neck and have her say an explicit yes, start gently and work up to it making sure she's ok if she's never done this before and it's not her fantasy wish but a fulfillment of yours. I'd expect you to demonstrate at least that care for her welfare and life and her basic comfort and enjoyment.

It sounds like none of this was part of your process. If you just went for it without all this I'd think she's probably deeply traumatised and upset, and sadly somewhat scared of you now. That would be the average woman's response, man too in the same circumstance.

The truth is most people are not into this sort of thing at ALL. I can't imagine for the life of me how you'd just go straight in on a "seemed ok with it".

she's just not into a bit of rough and this wasn't communicated correctly

or

maybe she is and didn't think she would be, and is conflicted/embarrassed about it now

as mentioned, communication was the problem here....

All you can do it address it head on, apologise and work from there on chatting about boundaries

But remember, it might not be salvageable, and that's OK too from both sides

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058200798/partner-upset-with-sex-play

Didn't seem against it? What the hell?

This isn't accidentally pinching a nipple too tight or being too vigorous on the frenulum. You do not go near what you proposed without damn clear communication and agreement.

In terms of what you can do? You can only explain that you believed she had consented and hope that is enough for her. You, unfortunately, may have made her question if you two are sexually compatible. That will be on her to decide.

Hannibal_Smith

Mod note

Green Peter and tony1kenobi - your posts have been deleted. When replying to threads in Personal Issues/relationship Issues posters are asked to offer constructive advice to an OP. If you have no practical advice please move on to another thread.

Thanks

HS

notAMember

Sweet mother of god.

I'd have you reported to the gardai for attempted murder. You don't just attempt to choke someone.

mlem123

So she’s indicated she’s not against smothering and you took that as going in to choke? It doesn’t have to be a mood killer to ask if it’s ok for you to try something in the heat of the moment, consent is key here and the issue is you never asked for it.

Texting her isn’t going to help too much I don’t think, if you want to apologise and talk it through you’ll have to reach out and take the L on this one, own up and apologise to her

StringerBell

Obviously boards is a more vanilla place than I thought, it sounds like miscommunication as much as anything else OP.

It's possible you were also a bit too rough with he choke or did it the wrong way and genuinely scared her? If you misread the signals and she was actually not okay with that kind of sex play at all then clearly that is going to be a big problem to deal with now.

Either way to resolve it and move forward you need to have an open and adult conversation about it. I know the sex talk can be awkward but it is necessary to a healthy sex life imo.

First off you need to nail down that the actual issue was and go from there.

notAMember

It's a bit much suggesting it's "vanilla" to understand the basics of consent. Especially around breath-play. You need to trust your partner to not accidentally kill you. So it's a little bit more than a simple miscommunication given what's at risk actually is death / brain damage for this woman.

To be accurate, this woman has now been the victim of a sexual assault. So I'm not surprised she's not talking to you, that's the least of your worries tbh.

OP, Don't do this to any other women either. Whether they have weight issues or not.

Jequ0n

Whether or not this woman sees herself as a victim is entirely up to her and not to posters here, OP.

Talk to her and work out an agreement process to avoid miscommunication going forward.

Ash.J.Williams

She'll be back....

lulublue22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117664418#Comment_117664418

I don’t know if you ment that to be as creepy as **** but it sure is. It’s up there with the OP’s comment re weight and comfort eating.

OP going forward make sure you have explicit consent if you want to choke someone during sex.

If you want to salvage a relationship with this woman give her time to process what has happened. Own your culpability in this and apologise profusely. Be prepared despite her weight and comfort eating that she may actually have the self esteem to say no this is not for me and give you the boot or she may decide she is fine with it. Either way you need to ensure that in future you get explicit consent for any sex play.

You really should have had a proper discussion about this before just "going for it" and part of that discussion should have been clear communication on a safe word, or signal BEFORE you ever tried anything.

You may or may not be able to salvage a relationship with this woman, she may find it very difficult to trust you again. But if not, take it as a lesson learned.

Never ever engage in breath play without clear consent and understanding of your partner's limits and a safe word or signal agreed upon first.

Caranica

Consent, consent, consent. Breath play (because of its risks) needs absolute consent. I'd be kicking you to the kerb and you could count yourself lucky not to be reported to the Gardai.

OP please do some reading on consent, and have specific conversations before trying this or any risky activities in the future. I'm far from vanilla but it's top of my "absolutely not" list.

Frankie Machine

OP - strictly on the assumption that you didn't literally intend to choke her...

Don't worry about it. Don't overthink it. She either liked it or she didn't and time will tell.

Since you, according to yourself ''told her that I wanted to simulate suffocating her, she didn't seem to be against it'', then she didn't do enough, for her own sake, to indicate a preference against you doing it.

That's how the real world works, or at least should. You're not more responsible for an another adult's safety than they are for their own.

Ignore all the stupid talk here about calling the Gardaí.

MAULBROOK

She was upset afterwards and I apologized to her. She has issues with her weight and can be prone to comfort eating.

WTF has that got to do with anything.

PressRun

Don't understand how anyone could suggest that other people are being "vanilla" for criticising someone for attempting choking without explicit consent during sex. That is a scary thing to do to someone without prior conversation about it. It just isn't okay and I wouldn't be surprised at all if she isn't interested in seeing you anymore.

It's one thing to casually discuss something and quite another to actually say "do you want to try this some time? How would you like to explore it?" Saying "she didn't seem against it" is not the same as her saying that she is into it and happy to experiment with it.

Also, it's worth pointing out that a lot of people who experiment with breath play aren't even doing it right and using the incorrect technique is how people end up frightened, hurt or even dying. You need to be sure about what you're doing. And never, ever spring this on someone during sex without having a proper discussion about it. It's dangerous and disrespectful, frankly.

OP, please ignore all the stupid talk trying to turn this around and somehow make your girlfriend to blame for what happened. 😡

radiotrickster

If she didn’t enthusiastically consent (which she didn’t, seeing as you say she wasn’t against it which isn’t a yes), then you shouldn’t have done it.

You took advantage of the situation, abused this woman and she’s likely terrified of you.

And bringing her weight and eating habits into it is completely unrelated. I don’t know if you were suggesting that she’s not as confident in bed because of her weight, but it’s just thrown in to distract from the fact that this woman did not consent to being choked but you did it anyway.

lulublue22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117665162#Comment_117665162

That’s pure rubbish - there is a power dynamic at play here in terms of physical strength between op and partner . By virtue of his strength in relation to his partner he most certainly has a responsibility for her safety.

consent in any sexual encounter is a must - even more so when there is a clear power dynamic at play and or potential for risk . she seemed not to mind is not the same as she consented to me trying to choke her. While I don’t think for one minute that the op literally intended to hurt or scare her- his description of events raises huge red flags around the issue of consent and safety - from his description it seems a poorly thought out venture initiated by the op without a clear discussion with both parties on the same page with clear boundaries. For his own sake if this is something he would like to continue to partake in he needs to accept responsibility for what happened and ensure that in future he has explicit consent and a either a safety word or signal organised before hand.

Jequ0n

Every comment is just based on what the OP stated in one post. There is little information and no details on a lot of things people are wondering about.

Seriously, based on some of the comments most people would not come back to comment/ clarify.

Maybe the OP acted like a dick, maybe he didn't, every situation is different. I have come across women who later "confessed" that they had disliked something we had tried, but that they didn't say it at the time. One said she had felt fine at first (adrenaline and the like) but felt terrible later with a delayed reaction.

It's not always black and white, and might just need a conversation to clear up boundaries. Likewise it might have been a boundary transgression that is too great to oversee.

Best of luck, OP.

Frankie Machine

OP -

I would reiterate that you need not berate yourself too much. Learn and move on, as in all areas of life.

Sometimes outsiders need their judgemental pound of flesh, but that she was/is upset is not necessarily grounds to think at all in terms of 'blame', for either of you.

It was a simple mis-communication with someone you've been intimate with for a significant amount of time. It's not as though it was a one night stand with a total stranger who speaks a foreign language. Just for perspective.

I would leave the ball in her court now though, communication-wise.

hawley

It's hard to fully explain what actually happened, but thanks for the advice. I'm in 40s have children from a previous relationship, she still lives at home, so I am much more experienced in life. She has issues with her weight and appearance. I can't say if I'm in love, but we have a good relationship. We previously had rough play, such as face slapping etc. I had the impression that she liked it, but am now thinking I could be wrong.

YellowLead

OP have you both ever talked about what you enjoy sexually? Or do you just do things and she doesn’t say she doesn’t like it? You say you are ‘under the impression’ she liked it - would you not ask? Not criticising you - but you are the older one here and need to take care as she doesn’t seem able to express herself but sometimes that comes with maturity/experience. She may suffer from low self esteem (just from what you said about the weight and comfort eating) and may feel that she should do whatever you like even if it makes her uncomfortable just to keep a boyfriend - but the choking pushed it too far. Communication is the most important part of sex - you both need to work on that it would seem.

Finally - if it’s been a year and you are not feeling a love vibe...should you consider moving on for both your sakes?

Piollaire

Did you research how to do choking safely and enjoyably beforehand? There's videos on Youtube that give guidance on this.

28064212

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058200798/partner-upset-with-sex-play

I told her that I wanted to simulate suffocating her, she didn't seem to be against it.

I was considering writing a long post covering aspects of consent, sexual experience, SSC, RACK, boundaries... but holy **** tapdancing Christ on a stick, anyone who reads the above sentence and thinks that's an appropriate precursor to actually choking during sex needs to take a long, long look at themselves

TheadoreT

I've some sympathy for the OP here tbh and some of the replies are a bit harsh.

Consent is a bit of a spectrum I find. Choking probably on the extreme end and should be always communicated first but communication of this sort can be a turn off for some women. Many women enjoy the spontaneity of spanking and hair pulling ect and if you were to ask them first the moment may lose some of the thrill of surprise.

I think the OP may have wanted to try something new to spice up the relationship after a year and it obviously backfired. Hopefully she doesn't overreact too much to this and sees it for what it was.

lulublue22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117665653#Comment_117665653

YellowLead

OP looking back over some of your previous threads certainly adds a bit of context (wanting to find a woman to fatten up for your pleasure and previous conviction for assaulting a woman).

I would question if this is the right relationship for you. Both parties need to enjoy rough sex in order for it to work. So she needs to enjoy it - not just tolerate it for your sake.

Might you be better off finding somebody that you do love, somebody with self esteem and the confidence to say no, and somebody who enjoys the same type of sex you do?

I hope it’s not her larger size as fetish being the reason you are with her....

SunnySundays

Ah come on! I'm all for experimenting and trying new things but how on earth can you interpret "she didn't seem to be against it" as consent. You didn't get an enthusiastic yes, therefore how could you be sure it was something she was comfortable with?

Seems like you put your own needs well ahead of hers, what was wrong with discussing it in more detail first? Asking if it was something she would like to try etc.

If you can't communicate clearly about sex, you are risking a lot of misunderstanding & leaving yourself open to assault allegations. You need to read situations and responses better than you currently do.

The comments on her weight seems really weird as they don't add to the situation. A slim woman who doesn't comfort eat is like to have the exact same reason if she isn't comfortable or hasn't consent to something that happens sexually.

_Whimsical_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117665162#Comment_117665162

This response is beyond ridiculous.

The more I've thought about all this the more appalled I have been, the more I've put myself in that ladies shoes the more utterly chilled I feel.

I no longer think this was any miscommunication, it was an express desire to inflict a terrible violence. If that's what you're seeking of course it had to play out as you describe with no real forewarning. Of course you can't gently reassure in the middle, or go slow, or ask for safe words, or even for consent, you have to do as you did and go straight in at it to garner the kick you're looking for.

That's not just a bit of adventurous play time... you don't play with anyones life, no thrill should have someone's death or disablement or life long trauma hanging in the balance or depend on you not getting carried away. I don't think it's normal or ok to desire to choke another person OP. To seek to try asfixiation yourself is unusual, but it's your life, to seek to inflict that on another who has expressed no interest in it for your pleasure however is very wildly different and sits extremely uneasily. I don't think it is healthy to even contemplate.

I don't think you realise OP, or that some here, recognise just what a traumatic event you've put that girl through. I wonder if she'll always be fearful in future that someone else will pull something like this on her out of the blue again during sex. I think I would have a very hard job trusting anyone again for long while afterwards, even more if it was coming from someone supposed to love and care for me. For some that trauma lasts a lifetime. This was a shocking assault just for your pleasure, please learn the lessons from it now and look at coming at sex from a different angle in future, this is not what it's about and anyone telling you it's just a bit far west on the pleasure spectrum or a spicy vs vanilla issue needs their head read.

Yurt2

F*ckin' hell. When did Graham Dwyer get out of calaboose?

Seriously man, if there's going to be roughness in your sexual life, you need to establish what exactly it is with your partner and get their consent.

Atlantic Dawn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058200798/partner-upset-with-sex-play

Could you not have done something less life endangering as a complete surprise like wore a builders hat or pair of Snickers while you rode her?

Deja Boo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117664020#Comment_117664020

A.G.R.E.E.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058200798/partner-upset-with-sex-play

It is not difficult to explain what happened - you attempted to kill your partner for your own (sense of twisted) pleasure. You are lucky she didn't contact gardai. An apology wouldn't cut it, simple as. She is lucky she found out now and not later - may she find someone who prefers she live thru love making.

Instead of blaming her for (understandably) distancing, look to yourself to determine why you would actually consider choking anyone acceptable behaviour.

If you still find it difficult to understand, ask her father his opinion.

Idle Passerby

I find the OP quite disturbing to be honest and I don't think that makes me vanilla or a prude. There's a big difference between "simulating asphyxiation" with a partner who is fully on board and has discussed a safe word, etc. And just randomly choking your partner out of the blue during sex. This seems a lot more like the latter and that would be frankly a terrifying situation for the recipient.

It sounds like theres possibly a bit of low self esteem on the girlfriends part, body issues, less experienced and living at home so possibly younger than OP or at least less worldly wise. Id worry she is going along with situations she isn't confidant enough to say no to.

Sexual kinks are fine if everyone involved is fully aware and a willing participant. Personally this sounds like a guy who just wants to cause harm to a woman. You'd have to wonder about someone who wants to be the choker in this kind of "play" especially with a partner who has expressed no desire for it.

airy fairy

The weight thing struck me as a strange thing to add to your query.

And so I looked down the rabbithole and found an early post by you, looking for a feeder, someone who you'd like to grow to a larger woman.

You've picked a woman to be in a relationship with, who has low confidence and self esteem and who comfort eats. Your perfect woman so it seems.

And to spice things up now, you thought she'd go for anything as you've had her under your power. She's probably putting on weight in the last year and you've had control over her without much issue.

It seems that you're perplexed that she has pulled away and you're put out over it.

Good for her, I say. She's had a lucky escape.

Leave her alone.

You've abused the woman by preying on her lack of self esteem and capitolised on your feeder fetish, not to mention the choke incident. And now you've just realised she's not totally under your thumb and is asserting some power by her ignoring you,you've tried to choke her you know?

Stay the **** away from her.

notAMember

indeed, the older posts are disturbing.

That post about giving a former wife a “right hiding” leaving her with black eyes and bloody nose stood out too.

You do not have enough self control to participate in breath play. You should not do this to anyone again.

You also need professional help OP. You are now a serial domestic / sexual abuser by having harmed at least two women you were in relationships with.

Caranica

OP I too have looked through your post history and see that you're not particularly experienced when it comes to relationships. Do you/have you watched a lot of porn? I'm guessing that that's where this came from? Porn is not real life and remember the actors have consented IRL, and have people standing by to assist should anything go wrong. You just decided to do it without explicit consent.

Repeatedly mentioning her weight and self esteem is a big red flag too. Your early threads show you weren't confident. Is this how you feel power?

Think of this as if a friend was telling you what happened and using this language, would you genuinely be comfortable with a friend who'd just do this because "she didn't seem to object". If a friend told me that they'd no longer be a friend.

Finally, thread title totally downplays what actually happened. It was an assault, not "sex play". She really should go to the Gardai. If you think it's ok to do that without consent, you're a danger to her and others.

Nothing says sexy love like a bit of face slapping and an oul strangle, eh.

The use of words like breath play - talk about polishing a turd. There are regular enough cases up before the courts in the UK with girls and women being killed from "breath play" and the defendants seek to claim a defense of consent.

Op, how about don't throttle your lover? How about lay off whatever stimulation has caused your senses to need pseudo violence to help you get your rocks off? And quit criticising her appearance in a patronising manner - either leave her or love her.

Honestly, bring back kink shaming. Make intimacy great again.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117665780#Comment_117665780

Consent is a spectrum, is it?

Spanking and choking don't even live on the same planet.

Big Bag of Chips

Hawley, have you ever spoken to a counsellor? You have had various threads here over time and I know that some of what you are in to may seem a little extreme for some people. But your sexual preferences do seem quite niche, and I wonder if you need to talk through with someone so that you learn how to get the satisfaction you are looking for, in a careful and safe way.

"She didn't seem against it" isn't the same as "she was very interested and agreed". Rough sex is different to "vanilla" sex. And it needs clear guidelines and agreed safe word/signal between both parties. The fact that this woman is now avoiding you is clear that she's not happy.

I couldn't help but think of Graham Dwyer when reading your post. He picked a vulnerable woman and abused her for his own pleasure. Ultimately killing her. You need to respect your partner and take her needs and desires into account too.

Maybe you just got this wrong, and maybe you felt this was going to be an exciting added something in your sex life. But now you are seeing that your partner wasn't on board. She wasn't comfortable and she didn't agree to it.

Maybe talking to someone yourself can help you work through these issues that you have where you seem to want to control a woman. Kinks and fetishes are fine, when both people are consenting and willing participants. Anything other than that and you have entered very dangerous territory.

Mrcaramelchoc

You decided to choke her without asking her. Wow

Communication is the key here i think.

tabby aspreme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117665653#Comment_117665653

Can you explain how you came to the '' impression'' that this woman liked being slapped

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117666535#Comment_117666535

I read this as the OP now questioning if he had interpreted her response correctly at the time.

OP, your second post does not really clarify a lot of things, but I am not surprised given the responses you received.

I still think communication is the biggest problem you both have. You mentioned twice that you tried practices and that you interpreted her reactions. This alone tells you that she is not clear when she communicates either. She still responds to your text messages with one worded responses, which is in itself another thing you are supposed to interpret.

You really need to speak to her face to face and have a conversation on what exactly everyone wants before this gets totally out of hand, because you will be the one who gets into trouble should something go wrong. I find most women are on board to try out things if a conversation was held beforehand, incl. agreement on a safe word.

And for God's sake: ignore the comments on kink shaming, it's like we're back in the 50s here.