Marriage in doubt over relocation.

Francie, here's what I'd do in your shoes.

Drop the discussion of her moving back out of Dublin, as thats not going to happen. She has given you the reasons why it hasn't worked out for the last eight years, including racism, so I think you're going to have to accept that she is not going to change her mind about that.

But, the two bedroom apartment in the city centre obviously isn't working out for you. So, I'd go onto the various rental sites and look up 3 bed houses to rent on the outskirts / north county Dublin that would allow you to commute within a reasonable time to your exisiting job, but also has transport links back into Dublin city centre for her (does she drive?). Print them out and bring them with you to show her.

Bring up the issue of her getting back into education with a goal to getting back to work. - NOT just talking about it. DOING it. - Put it to her that she should be looking into self-development / education courses that would lead to employment which in turn will help supplement the extra costs that arise from living in Dublin. It is likely there will be more opportunities for her in Dublin for training and work that will also work around the kids. She could find work part time during the day once the older kids are in school to help supplement the extra costs and study part time.

If you really want to stay with this woman, you need to show her that you are interested in helping her achieve her goals, not that you're trying to get her to dismiss them or worse, dismissing them yourelf. But that she also has to see your point of view on the unsuitability of the current living arrangements. If she is unwilling to budge on anything, then I guess you'll have your answer - and at least you can say you tried.

(eta) oh, and one other thought. Keep your family out of your marital problems. It sounds like she and your sisters don't get on too well? When a man marries, his loyalty and priority should always be with his own wife and children, first.

francie81

YellowLead wrote: »

Who is going to fund all of this? Is she pinning all of these hopes on influencer success???
A second home and even IVF are out of the affordability realms of a lot of people never mind those currently relying on welfare and parents for assistance with housing etc.

Did she assume because you were from the West that all of these things would come her way of she married you and got a land when she arrive in ballygobackwards?

There is nothing wrong with having dreams and aspirations but her head is in the clouds. Equally for your part you should give Dublin more of a go and in future wait and see what happens - you both might feel differently about lots of things esp with kids involved. The reality of what goes on in the schools in the city might kick in too.

This is the the stuff I had to listen to over the years with most notably it would be good to start a business preferably in Dublin what she wished for and got in a different way.

What do you mean the reality of what goes on in schools? Since you mentioned this my son who was in baby infants at the time said the teacher mentioned something about skin colours so when this filtered through to my wife she instantly said she is teaching racism to kids when perhaps my then 5 year picked up on something that may looked like what my wife got into her head, I honestly for the life of me couldn’t imagine a teacher in a primary school setting discussing skin colours.

francie81

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Francie, here's what I'd do in your shoes.

Drop the discussion of her moving back out of Dublin, as thats not going to happen. She has given you the reasons why it hasn't worked out for the last eight years, including racism, so I think you're going to have to accept that she is not going to change her mind about that.

But, the two bedroom apartment in the city centre obviously isn't working out for you. So, I'd go onto the various rental sites and look up 3 bed houses to rent on the outskirts / north county Dublin that would allow you to commute within a reasonable time to your exisiting job, but also has transport links back into Dublin city centre for her (does she drive?). Print them out and bring them with you to show her.

Bring up the issue of her getting back into education with a goal to getting back to work. - NOT just talking about it. DOING it. - Put it to her that she should be looking into self-development / education courses that would lead to employment which in turn will help supplement the extra costs that arise from living in Dublin. It is likely there will be more opportunities for her in Dublin for training and work that will also work around the kids. She could find work part time during the day once the older kids are in school to help supplement the extra costs and study part time.

If you really want to stay with this woman, you need to show her that you are interested in helping her achieve her goals, not that you're trying to get her to dismiss them or worse, dismissing them yourelf. But that she also has to see your point of view on the unsuitability of the current living arrangements. If she is unwilling to budge on anything, then I guess you'll have your answer - and at least you can say you tried.

(eta) oh, and one other thought. Keep your family out of your marital problems. It sounds like she and your sisters don't get on too well? When a man marries, his loyalty and priority should always be with his own wife and children, first.

Your right. But as far as my job is concerned being closer and looking at alternatives on the suburbs ie Balbriggan but she just doesn’t seem like she will budge because to her that would be out of the city away from what she wanted, and I have being mentioning Drogheda which was I was for but she dismisses this and brandishes the people there as small minded, what do you do just hold firm wait for a year then hit her with this again?
She is still on a learner permit.

francie81

francie81 wrote: »

This is the the stuff I had to listen to over the years with most notably it would be good to start a business preferably in Dublin what she wished for and got in a different way.

Over the years? So this is not something new.

What was your response when she brought up things like starting a business?

The only option here is that she becomes a successful social media influencer as she doesn't want to live out her days looking after kids in a small village in rural Ireland where her in-laws argue with her and the town mindset affects her and she doesn't seem like she will be getting a job that will make up for the loss of HAP and any other social welfare benefits.

francie81

francie81 wrote: »

Your right. But as far as my job is concerned being closer and looking at alternatives on the suburbs ie Balbriggan but she just doesn’t seem like she will budge because to her that would be out of the city away from what she wanted, and I have being mentioning Drogheda which was I was for but she dismisses this and brandishes the people there as small minded, what do you do just hold firm wait for a year then hit her with this again?
She is still on a learner permit.

When does your current tenancy run out? If you can stick it out until then, but you're going to have to work hard to get a move to the suburbs. Put it to her as her meeting you half way (literally!). If she wants the marriage to survive, she also has to be willing to make some compromises.

If she gains her full licence and can drive unaccompanied, she might feel differently then, a little car might make all the difference?

I'm not familiar with Drogheda myself, so I couldn't really judge that one. One other thought, would you consider changing jobs yourself? If the right opportunity presented itself.

If she is still not willing to make any compromises after this, then as I said before, I think you have your answer, but can honestly hold up your hands and say you did all you could to try and save the marriage.

francie81

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Over the years? So this is not something new.

What was your response when she brought up things like starting a business?

Where do you start, living in a rented house, kids, no savings etc.
This sort of thing obviously takes proper planning and not just say it and to be fair my wife has tried to put herself out there with makeup on Instagram tried abit of blogging also with looking after kids at same time, almost desperate to try and make a change for the better and whatever about what we are going through I fully praise her in that way but sometimes you have to look at the reality of life than wonder what could be.

YellowLead

francie81 wrote: »

This is the the stuff I had to listen to over the years with most notably it would be good to start a business preferably in Dublin what she wished for and got in a different way.

What do you mean the reality of what goes on in schools? Since you mentioned this my son who was in baby infants at the time said the teacher mentioned something about skin colours so when this filtered through to my wife she instantly said she is teaching racism to kids when perhaps my then 5 year picked up on something that may looked like what my wife got into her head, I honestly for the life of me couldn’t imagine a teacher in a primary school setting discussing skin colours.

I just mean that I have friends who are teachers and who spent time in certain schools and wouldn’t send their kids there in a million years - let’s just say scumbags have to go to school somewhere and your wife’s idea of an accepting school might not match with some of the hard nosed rough kids attending Dublin City schools. That is all.

Also - with Balbriggan there is quite a large non ethnically Irish community so that could work - I get the not wanting a small country town but don’t see why the only alternative is Dublin City.

It’s a shame there’s no compromise to be had but sounds like she isn’t budging so maybe be the bigger person and tough it out for a year. Your kids will at least appreciate it. And if you try and look at the positives maybe your relationship will improve.

MissShihTzu

I think the pair of you are being unrealistic. Your wife is being extremely childish. How is it OK to block your number, rather than having an adult conversation? It's fine to work with her Instagram and her blogging but that won't pay the bills, and clearly your salary won't cover everything. Is she able to take a part time job to help? What has she said about moving out to the northern suburbs?? Very soon that flat will be too small, especially if your mother in law's looking to move in with you. What does your wife think about it?

Just noted you've been there since April, by next April she may feel differently about staying in the city centre herself. It sounds like she loves it for right now because it's all new. I presume you signed a year lease?

Being stuck in an apartment with 3 kids will be no fun in the winter, and in all honestly, in her shoes I wouldn't like to think about about my spouse making a long commute in bad weather or on icy roads either, I'd worry of my head.

francie81

YellowLead wrote: »

I just mean that I have friends who are teachers and who spent time in certain schools and wouldn’t send their kids there in a million years - let’s just say scumbags have to go to school somewhere and your wife’s idea of an accepting school might not match with some of the hard nosed rough kids attending Dublin City schools. That is all.

Also - with Balbriggan there is quite a large non ethnically Irish community so that could work - I get the not wanting a small country town but don’t see why the only alternative is Dublin City. 1800 seems like a very low rent for a two bed in Dublin so it must be in a sort of dodgy area - greater likelihood of drug dealers as neighbours etc.

It’s a shame there’s no compromise to be had but sounds like she isn’t budging so maybe be the bigger person and tough it out for a year. Your kids will at least appreciate it. And if you try and look at the positives maybe your relationship will improve.

Am with you with the whole school thing.

Yeah the apartment (well secured) would be the hutch end of the city if you know what I mean.

That’s right I don’t get it myself I know Balbriggan has indeed a big non ethnic Irish community for its size as does Drogheda.

I have two alternatives as most have pointed out here is to tough it out (as you say) or accept it’s over and prepare arrangements with the kids, currently as it stands she still has me blocked despite me texting her brother to pass my message on.

francie81

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Just noted you've been there since April, by next April she may feel differently about staying in the city centre herself. It sounds like she loves it for right now because it's all new. I presume you signed a year lease?

Being stuck in an apartment with 3 kids will be no fun in the winter, and in all honestly, in her shoes I wouldn't like to think about about my spouse making a long commute in bad weather or on icy roads either, I'd worry of my head.

Exactly in the depths of the winter. Yeah we signed a year lease but with HAP it states you must stay 2 however there is exceptions.

You're rent is low (from your own funds) and she did end up pregnant at a young age in small town Ireland. It wouldn't be the worst thing to spend 2 years there so she can get that experience as she is unhappy with small town Ireland and that's not a good thing for the mother of your children to be feeling when the kids are still young so a good few years to go before they fly the nest. After that you see what the story is.

By the Hutch end of things you are basically around the Dorset Street area I assume so be very careful about your choice of school. The are a lot of kids around there that will eat a country kid alive and they can pick up a lot of bad habits from a young age.

francie81

francie81 wrote: »

She also tells me that as a single mother that she would be better off financially thus not relying on me.

Just seen this. I think you are in real bother here Francie as she has looked into this. Time to knock on the door and have a calm chat without the older kids listening.

francie81

whatnow! wrote: »

By the Hutch end of things you are basically around the Dorset Street area I assume so be very careful about your choice of school. The are a lot of kids around there that will eat a country kid alive and they can pick up a lot of bad habits from a young age.

Summerhill area.

SunnySundays

For a multitude of reasons, it appears that you and you wife are miles apart in opinions and both of your ability to communicate seems poor.

At this stage, if both you of you (and it needs to be both as one person cannot save a marraige on their own!), I think you should try marraige counselling so that you can both listen to each other without interruption and try to understand the others concerns better.

Without some sort of intervention like that,I cannot see this turning out well.

It has a poor reputation and is close to a few areas with much worse reputations and the kids will all mix in the same schools until a lot drop out in early teenage years. A lot of good people there also (many young and without kids) but quite a few drug treatment centers in that general neck of the woods when you head up towards Connolly station things start to take a turn for the worse. Really can't put much of a positive spin on the area when proximity to the IFSC is not a priority. I would be very unhappy if my kids were in that area having grown up in a similar area to you and the type of kids that it produces and then seeing a lot of little street rats in that area of Dublin it's not something I would compromise on when the alternative is a 20 minute bus ride in to O'Connell Street from a better setup.

Just for the sake of the kids Beaumont or Santry is a much better place to be and she can be in town in about 20 minutes.

francie81

SunnySundays wrote: »

For a multitude of reasons, it appears that you and you wife are miles apart in opinions and both of your ability to communicate seems poor.

At this stage, if both you of you (and it needs to be both as one person cannot save a marraige on their own!), I think you should try marraige counselling so that you can both listen to each other without interruption and try to understand the others concerns better.

Without some sort of intervention like that,I cannot see this turning out well.

But the only thing is she would attempt to manipulate things or blow it out of proportion so as that it makes me look like am the problem that’s what I feel would happen there.

francie81

MissShihTzu wrote: »

I think the pair of you are being unrealistic. Your wife is being extremely childish. How is it OK to block your number, rather than having an adult conversation? It's fine to work with her Instagram and her blogging but that won't pay the bills, and clearly your salary won't cover everything. Is she able to take a part time job to help? What has she said about moving out to the northern suburbs?? Very soon that flat will be too small, especially if your mother in law's looking to move in with you. What does your wife think about it?

Exactly...well with regards to her mom coming here on a permanent basis thats nowhere near since my wife needs to be in a job for 3 years (have earned 60k) before that process starts similarly to when I brought herself, btw she could well have done this within the last 8 years despite having kids, and within the last year it has gotten tough because now that the son has started out himself she feels alone there which usually prompts the wife to go over with the kids and suffers from blood pressure. I was very supportive even in those tough going back and fourth with her it really wasn’t easy.

She said she never wants to return to my county anytime I mention it usually comes with ‘go back to your Louth and find a girl there’

francie81

whatnow! wrote: »

It has a poor reputation and is close to a few areas with much worse reputations and the kids will all mix in the same schools until a lot drop out in early teenage years. A lot of good people there also (many young and without kids) but quite a few drug treatment centers in that general neck of the woods when you head up towards Connolly station things start to take a turn for the worse. Really can't put much of a positive spin on the area when proximity to the IFSC is not a priority. I would be very unhappy if my kids were in that area having grown up in a similar area to you and the type of kids that it produces and then seeing a lot of little street rats in that area of Dublin it's not something I would compromise on when the alternative is a 20 minute bus ride in to O'Connell Street from a better setup.

Just for the sake of the kids Beaumont or Santry is a much better place to be and she can be in town in about 20 minutes.

Absolutely and this was my very concern when it comes to the kids but I guess it will be only a matter of time before it’s apparent to her because the father isn’t near the wheel here.

francie81

Am I doing the right thing by discussing my problem here as she would see it as being disrespectful but that’s what it’s for isn’t it.

SunnySundays

francie81 wrote: »

But the only thing is she would attempt to manipulate things or blow it out of proportion so as that it makes me look like am the problem that’s what I feel would happen there.

Have you got a better alternative? I think you both have valid opinions. I can see why you would want to keep your family somewhere safe, affordable and close to your job as the only income earner in the family.

I can also see why she may want a better life and not enjoy living in the country but I think the way she went about it is incorrect and also the her influences aspiration are questionable. Her blocking you also seems immature.

She came her when she was 21, she's probably changed a lot as a person in those years. Most people do.

The fact she mentioned she would be financially better off seperated is a cause for concern. She is probably right in terms of benefits. Has she checked out? Have you?

You have zero to lose with counselling. It might be the only thing that has a chance of rescuing this. Also, if you are splitting up,you need to keep things at least amicable in terms of parenting/access to children.it sounds like ye could use help with that if nothing else.

YellowLead

francie81 wrote: »

Am I doing the right thing by discussing my problem here as she would see it as being disrespectful but that’s what it’s for isn’t it.

The only thing I thing that could be disrespectful is if you are indentifiable and then yes it is disrespectful.

So you should not have given away details such as Pakistan, Louth, Summerhill and all of your ages. But that’s just my opinion.

francie81

YellowLead wrote: »

The only thing I thing that could be disrespectful is if you are indentifiable and then yes it is disrespectful.

So you should not have given away details such as Pakistan, Louth, Summerhill and all of your ages. But that’s just my opinion.

That’s right I guess that’s just going to much into detail but it was just to give a more understanding of it rather than wanting to.

Ah c'mon now Francie, there is no denying that you are part of the problem. Take your fair share.

It appears you either haven't been listening or have buried your head in the sand when it came to what your wife wanted, and you were happy coasting along in your little village thinking all was grand. But then your posts have revealed that she hasn't been happy and has been talking about moving to Dublin for years - this is not something new on her part.

As for the primary schools in Dublin.... honestly, they are not full of rabid wild animals ready to attack your children. Some posters need to cool the jets there, a little. I have a friend who is the Principal of a primary school in that very area, and she runs a very tight ship. Her kids are great.

I agree with the poster who says she has already checked out. Her actions sound like someone who is extremely frustrated and just "over it" with you. I don't even know if there is anything that can be salvaged, but she may not be interested in trying and if that is the case, it would probably be for the best for you to part ways sooner rather then later.

francie81

SunnySundays wrote: »

Have you got a better alternative? I think you both have valid opinions. I can see why you would want to keep your family somewhere safe, affordable and close to your job as the only income earner in the family.

I can also see why she may want a better life and not enjoy living in the country but I think the way she went about it is incorrect and also the her influences aspiration are questionable. Her blocking you also seems immature.

She came her when she was 21, she's probably changed a lot as a person in those years. Most people do.

The fact she mentioned she would be financially better off seperated is a cause for concern. She is probably right in terms of benefits. Has she checked out? Have you?

You have zero to lose with counselling. It might be the only thing that has a chance of rescuing this. Also, if you are splitting up,you need to keep things at least amicable in terms of parenting/access to children.it sounds like ye could use help with that if nothing else.

Totally the wrong way of going about it could not agree more. She has looked into the financial aspect of it and that indeed is the case but I haven’t.

I think when it comes to counselling I should at least go for another reason that I could not mention here and she could use this against me should it go this way.

Caranica

Can I ask why you married her OP? Only meeting once doesn't sound like the strongest foundation for a marriage, that you've made it this far is some achievement!

How is she funding Dublin? I'm impressed that she was able to find a HAP landlord in Dublin city centre, given hotels are full of families who can't find hap accommodation. How did you fit her mother in a 2 bedroom flat with you, your wife and your kids?

I think you need both a counsellor and solicitor. Something is very off. You need very good legal advice.

Tork

Caranica wrote: »

Can I ask why you married her OP? Only meeting once doesn't sound like the strongest foundation for a marriage, that you've made it this far is some achievement!

Was this a marriage of convenience for you both? Maybe you both married for the wrong reasons. Did her lot improve by marrying you and leaving her home country? Why did you seek out a Pakistani wife? Maybe this is reaching its natural end?

francie81

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Ah c'mon now Francie, there is no denying that you are part of the problem. Take your fair share.

It appears you either haven't been listening or have buried your head in the sand when it came to what your wife wanted, and you were happy coasting along in your little village thinking all was grand. But then your posts have revealed that she hasn't been happy and has been talking about moving to Dublin for years - this is not something new on her part.

As for the primary schools in Dublin.... honestly, they are not full of rabid wild animals ready to attack your children. Some posters need to cool the jets there, a little. I have a friend who is the Principal of a primary school in that very area, and she runs a very tight ship. Her kids are great.

I agree with the poster who says she has already checked out. Her actions sound like someone who is extremely frustrated and just "over it" with you. I don't even know if there is anything that can be salvaged, but she may not be interested in trying and if that is the case, it would probably be for the best for you to part ways sooner rather then later.

Well my response to that is there was no logical planning in any of this or any compromise and with regards to the city I was more than happy to relocate on the basis it was fair to be in close proximity to the city centre for her and my job, what was so wrong with that I do believe that would be what I call a compromise.

francie81

francie81 wrote: »

Well my response to that is there was no logical planning in any of this or any compromise and with regards to the city I was more than happy to relocate on the basis it was fair to be in close proximity to the city centre for her and my job, what was so wrong with that I do believe that would be what I call a compromise.

I never said there was anything wrong with it, and indeed I said previously that it's to your credit that you made the move.

But you have only tried living in Dublin for three months, and already are expressing your unhappiness and pushing for her to return to your county, whereas she put up with living in your village for 8 full years. So I get why she is getting so angry and frustrated with you.

You may not think it logical, but it does sound like she has been planning this for some time - either with or without you. She did tell you that she wanted to live in Dublin and maybe start a business. I think you may have thought she would never act on it, and would eventually drop those ideas?

The compromise you offered was Drogheda or Dundalk, both of which, in fairness, can't really be called "close to the city centre" for her - especially when she is still on a learner permit.

Anyway, I actually think the area where the apartment is has really exacerbated your problems, because even us born-and-bred-Dubliners will admit it's not a great area. I think the only chance you have of saving the marriage, is a move to a more suitable housing situation, and yes, if I haven't said it already, professional counselling, as I don't think you really take her seriously, and I think she gets very frustrated with you.

As they say, communication is the key. I really do wish you the best of luck.