Relaxation of Restrictions, Part XI *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

gozunda

VinLieger wrote: »

Its not acceptable but its also not acceptable to tell everyone to go enjoy them outside and not provide facilities to do so and then do shocked pikachu faces when people do exactly what you told them to and leave a disgusting mess because you didn't prepare in any way.

Not at you btw - but where is this nonsense about an "outdoor summer" as some kind of crazy free for all with no regard to social distancing coming from?

The comment regarding an outdoor summer made by MM was in relation to indoor / outdoor dining and not a pissup in what another poster aptly described as a 'mosh pit.

This is the quote from the Tanaiste:

"The gap between indoor dining and outdoor dining is not going to be big, it's only going to be a matter of a few weeks, so outdoor dining will be allowed first on June 7 and then we will agree a date in early July for the return for indoor.

"What I can say to you is that in the first week of July there will be a major set of reopenings, mostly linked to indoor activities...it's going to be an outdoor summer but not outdoor only.

Tbh there are no excuses for recent scenes from Dublin City centre. With large crowds, little or no social distance, close contact / face to face / contact over extended periods

Neither being young, being restricted, kids just doing things, old foggies being bitter etc etc or pretending that people have been told to have an "outdoor summer" is an excuse for people to act with total and absolute irresponsibly regardless.

And yes whilst things are looking good for all of us overall - we're not out of the woods yet.

Lumen

gozunda wrote: »

Not at you btw - but where is this nonsense about an "outdoor summer" as some kind of crazy free for all with no regard to social distancing coming from?

The comment regarding an outdoor summer made by MM was in relation to indoor / outdoor dining and not a pissup in what another poster aptly described as a 'mosh pit.

Outdoor dining is not open yet. Young people living in the city centre do not have gardens. Where exactly do you expect them to go?

timmyntc

gozunda wrote: »

Not at you btw - but where is this nonsense about an "outdoor summer" as some kind of crazy free for all with no regard to social distancing coming from?

Outdoor socialising is of negligible risk of transmission - regardless of distancing.
We've seen it from the various protests throughout the pandemic, and the studies worldwide - well ventilated areas (none better than actually outdoors) have such a low chance of virus spread.

Why do you think outdoor hospitality is opening ahead of indoor? Because we know that outdoors is low risk

NIAC Fanboy

gozunda wrote: »

Not at you btw - but where is this nonsense about an "outdoor summer" as some kind of crazy free for all with no regard to social distancing coming from?

The comment regarding an outdoor summer made by MM was in relation to indoor / outdoor dining and not a pissup in what another poster aptly described as a 'mosh pit.

This is the quote from the Tanaiste:



Tbh there are no excuses for recent scenes from Dublin City centre. With large crowds, little or no social distance, close contact / face to face / contact over extended periods

Neither being young, being restricted, kids just doing things etc etc or pretending that people have been told to have an "outdoor summer" is an excuse for people to act with total and absolute irresponsibly regardless.

And yes whilst things are looking good for all of us overall - we're not out of the woods yet.

Would you ever cop on. Indoor house parties, sheebeens etc. are far more dangerous. The crowds in Dublin were largely independent groups of people, mostly between 6-12 people I'd wager.

No risk of a superspreader event. These people are saving lives by not organising or attending gatherings indoors.

Because the Gardaí are tasked to respond to this social media outrage the highly dangerous sheebeens and house parties are going unchecked.

Richard Hillman

gozunda wrote: »

Not at you btw - but where is this nonsense about an "outdoor summer" as some kind of crazy free for all with no regard to social distancing coming from?

The comment regarding an outdoor summer made by MM was in relation to indoor / outdoor dining and not a pissup in what another poster aptly described as a 'mosh pit.

This is the quote from the Tanaiste:



Tbh there are no excuses for recent scenes from Dublin City centre. With large crowds, little or no social distance, close contact / face to face / contact over extended periods

Neither being young, being restricted, kids just doing things, old foggies being bitter etc etc or pretending that people have been told to have an "outdoor summer" is an excuse for people to act with total and absolute irresponsibly regardless.

And yes whilst things are looking good for all of us overall - we're not out of the woods yet.

What do you mean by not out of the woods? What cohort are you fearful for?

NIAC Fanboy

pjohnson wrote: »

So thats acceptable then. Cool.

It's perfectly acceptable for people to sh1t and p1ss, it's basic human nature.

If toilets are provided people tend to use them, not having sufficient toilets in the city centre is what is unacceptable.

Salvation Tambourine

Has anyone ever went drinking and brought their empties home? You should find a bin and use it but the implication that it's normal for someone to jump on the bus with a plastic bag full of empty cans is nonsense.

gozunda

Lumen wrote: »

Outdoor dining is not open yet. Young people living in the city centre do not have gardens. Where exactly do you expect them to go?

Its not one or the other and not my expectations btw.

The point is we have some using the excuse they've been told to have an "outdoor summer" .
Which somehow gives a thumbsup for huge crowds ganging together for a pissup with little or no social distancing / close contact/ face to face in those numbers - are all grand like. It's not.

As above - it's not a dichotomy between mass crowds in streets or nothing at all. Lots of open space for groups of friends to gather. Plenty of opportunities for people to get together outside get on the luas etc and go to any of the many public open spaces all over the city. What we saw - were the bulk of people acting irresponsible

And do you really believe all "young people " (where did I refer to age btw?) partying in Dublin City centre recently only live in the 'city centre' and none have any families / friends with access to any alternative outdoor space at all? I somehow seriously doubt that tbh.

timmyntc

gozunda wrote: »

Its not one or the other and not my expectations btw.

The point is we have some using the excuse they've been told to have an "outdoor summer" for huge crowds ganging together for a pissup with little or no social distancing / close contact/ face to face in those numbers - are infact grand like.They're not.

As above - it's not a dichotomy between mass crowds in streets or nothing at all. Lots of open space for groups of friends to gather. Plenty of opportunities for people to get together outside get on the luas etc and go to any of the many public open spaces all over the city. What we saw - were the bulk of people acting irresponsible

And do you really believe all those partying in Dublin City centre recently only live in the 'city centre' and none have any families / friends with any outdoor space at all? I somehow seriously doubt that tbh.

Ah yes, you mean the public spaces like portobello that were closed off?
Or Stephens green, that the gardai moved people on from?

Where are all these public spaces people are supposed to gather at?

And as to your assertion that its not grand for people to have a "pissup" with little social distancing - why is it not? Do you acknowledge that the risks of transmission are miniscule in these scenarios?

Lumen

gozunda wrote: »

Its not one or the other and not my expectations btw.

The point is we have some using the excuse they've been told to have an "outdoor summer" for huge crowds ganging together for a pissup with little or no social distancing / close contact/ face to face in those numbers - are infact grand like.They're not.

As above - it's not a dichotomy between mass crowds in streets or nothing at all. Lots of open space for groups of friends to gather. Plenty of opportunities for people to get together outside get on the luas etc and go to any of the many public open spaces all over the city. What we saw - were the bulk of people acting irresponsible

And do you really believe all those partying in Dublin City centre recently only live in the 'city centre' and none have any families / friends with any outdoor space at all? I somehow seriously doubt that tbh.

The most hazardous spaces over the weekend were the rail services. And your suggestion is...get on the Luas.

GeorgeBailey

average_runner wrote: »

I been at alot of beaches on the east coast during the summer and they are not left in the state we saw on Sunday morning. Not sure about dublin beaches.


Even when we went knacker drinking we always brought the rubbish with us.


Current generation are spoon fed, don't respect things and no idea of hard work.

Not eveything can be provided for you in life, do it yourself

Yip, this is the first time in history that an older generation has thought of the younger generation in such poor light. When I was young I had to get up in the morning at ten o'clock at night half an hour before I went to bed, drink a cup of sulphuric acid, work twenty-nine hours a day down mill, and pay mill owner for permission to come to work.

KrustyUCC

Love the fact that Martin and Varadkars default is to threaten the reopening for everybody instead of dealing with minorities who aren't following the rules

Have an outdoor summer they said

What in hell did they think would happen with everywhere shut and good weather?

It's terrible Joe, people socialising outdoors

None of my family or even my fiancé's family were out socialising this weekend yet you have Martin and Varadkar threatening those who are following the public health advice

Its an awful look and a pretty empty threat

They're broke and need the reopening to go ahead

People are going to be very very annoyed if they don't open in July seeing as our reopening is painfully slow as it is

gozunda

Richard Hillman wrote: »

What do you mean by not out of the woods? What cohort are you fearful for?

The old 'fear' sthtick? Nope.

What we know that to keep infection rate low - people need to observe social distancing/ avoid prolonged contact / crowded situations - and low risk outdoor does not mean no risk in those types of crowds.

As for cohorts? We have the absolute majority of the population including those deemed vulnerable who remain either unvaccinated or with just one dose of vaccine. Large numbers of group 7 - those at risk remain unvaccinated.

Those using the excuse "we've been told to have an outdoor summer" for the scenes from Dublin City Centre is simply bs as pointed out.

seamus

Salvation Tambourine wrote: »

Has anyone ever went drinking and brought their empties home? You should find a bin and use it but the implication that it's normal for someone to jump on the bus with a plastic bag full of empty cans is nonsense.

It doesn't matter whether it's "normal" tbh. If someone is too embarrassed to bring their litter home with them, then that's their crap. It doesn't make it OK for them to dump it.

Nevertheless you are right that it's not common, and therefore expecting people will start doing it because Tony, Micháel, Joe Duffy and Matt Cooper are "shocked and disappointed", is beyond naive.

silverharp

Kind of agree, leave the young people alone

https://twitter.com/MarkPaulTimes/status/1399294418499379204

gozunda

Lumen wrote: »

The most hazardous spaces over the weekend were the rail services. And your suggestion is...get on the Luas.

Are they? The absolute majority of people on the "Luas etc" are at least wearing masks and not acting like they're in Glastonbury or wherever

But hey I suppose you're going to tell us that in addition to all living in the city centre and no one having any access to any outdoor space whatsoever - that the same groups also have no access to any other forms of transport at all

Sure

Don't Chute!

Ordinarily I find this littering thing absolutely unacceptable and hate the type of people that do it but to be honest I’m kind of looking at this with a you reap what you sow attitude. Holahan and the alleged government seem to still be under the impression that they can take everything away from people give them no alternatives and then sneer at and humiliate them when they “step out of line”. They have been able to do this up to this point because of the amount of people who are only too willing to **** over their neighbors in return for a pat on the head from their masters. A lot of them are on here. But their influence is rapidly disappearing and it’s great to see.

boetstark

Lumen wrote: »

Outdoor dining is not open yet. Young people living in the city centre do not have gardens. Where exactly do you expect them to go?

It's not a case of asking them to stay at home. Go out enjoy the good weather, try not every single one of them congregate like lemmings in one area.
Oh yes if possible try to bring your rubbish home with you and don't piss and sh#t on public streets expecting others to clean it up.
As I said dirty uncivilised animals.

gozunda

NIAC Fanboy wrote: »

Would you ever cop on. Indoor house parties, sheebeens etc. are far more dangerous. The crowds in Dublin were largely independent groups of people, mostly between 6-12 people I'd wager.
No risk of a superspreader event. These people are saving lives by not organising or attending gatherings indoors. Because the Gardaí are tasked to respond to this social media outrage the highly dangerous sheebeens and house parties are going unchecked.

I could ask you to do the same? But let's keep this out of the sewer ftm.

So what you're saying there its either mass gatherings and pissups in the street or "Indoor house parties, sheebeens"

No other alternatives at all? Nothing? We have to have huge crowds of people acting irresponsibly or else all involved are going off to have huge parties indoors? Ok ...

No chance that the same acting the mick outside in Dublin City Centre don't give a flying proverbial and also have a tenancy to engage in "Indoor house parties, sheebeens" no?

Take a look at the photos. Large crowds no space and were practically on top of each other. And yes apart from the risks of public health of unfettered defecation etc - the risk is not zero. Large crowds with little or no social distancing/ close contact / face to face remains a risk. You mention "superspreaders". You only need one individual to be a superspreader tbf.

It remains the excuse that people have been told to have an "outdoor sumner" is bs as it does not stand up to the most basic scrutiny. Rather it would appear to be the usual suspects pushing the boundaries of what is responsible at this point in time.

Silentcorner

Don't Chute! wrote: »

Ordinarily I find this littering thing absolutely unacceptable and hate the type of people that do it but to be honest I’m kind of looking at this with a you reap what you sow attitude. Holahan and the alleged government seem to still be under the impression that they can take everything away from people give them no alternatives and then sneer at and humiliate them when they “step out of line”. They have been able to do this up to this point because of the amount of people who are only too willing to **** over their neighbors in return for a pat on the head from their masters. A lot of them are on here. But their influence is rapidly disappearing and it’s great to see.

Spot on....they either should have banned takeaway drinks or prepared for the surge in trade of take away pints.

It's another snapshot into the mindset of the people who have been allowed to Govern us without question over the last 15 months.

Arrogant, Incompetent, Pious bureaucrats imposing one illogical law after another....unquestioned in media or by political parties.

God help them if some one shows them the pictures of the hundreds of thousands of Brits who protested Lockdowns/Restrictions in London last Saturday, they've been doing it for weeks in growing numbers....

Stormyteacup

Disgusting scenes but definitely a little bit of a f**k you to the ‘I’m alright Jacks’.

Something nasty simmering underneath - things a looking better for most of us, but there’s a sizeable minority that sacrificed a disproportionate amount. Many peoples futures bleaker than before, even were all restrictions lifted in the morning. I’d say they’re pretty fed up being told to cop on and suck it up.

This will be clear to see as soon as a sanctioned protest is organised for housing.

timmyntc

gozunda wrote: »

I could ask you to do the same? But let's keep this out of the sewer ftm.

So what you're saying there its either mass gatherings and pissups in the street or "Indoor house parties, sheebeens"

No other alternatives at all? Nothing? We have to have huge crowds of people acting irresponsibly or else all involved are going off to have huge parties indoors? Ok ...

No chance that the same acting the mick outside in Dublin City Centre don't give a flying proverbial and also have a tenancy to engage in "Indoor house parties, sheebeens" no?

Take a look at the photos. Large crowds no space and were practically on top of each other. And yes apart from the risks of public health of unfettered defecation etc - the risk is not zero. Large crowds with little or no social distancing/ close contact / face to face remains a risk. You mention "superspreaders". You only need one individual to be a superspreader tbf.

It remains the excuse that people have been told to have an "outdoor sumner" is bs as it does not stand up to the most basic scrutiny. Rather it would appear to be the usual suspects pushing the boundaries of what is responsible at this point in time.

Despite all the gatherings outdoors last year, only 0.1% of transmission clusters were outdoors. This includes outdoors hospitality (beer gardens). This after all the protests, outrage inducing scenes like salthill, canals in Dublin, etc etc. But even with superspreaders, only 0.1% of cases.

Outdoor gatherings are not a risk - they arent and werent ever a significant driver in case numbers. There will be no 4th wave or surge from people gathering outdoors - the only harm theyre doing from a public health perspective is the heart attacks they are inducing in middle aged middle class people with too much time on their hands.

Boggles

silverharp wrote: »

Kind of agree, leave the young people alone

https://twitter.com/MarkPaulTimes/status/1399294418499379204

Older ppl owe the young a huge debt

What an absolute dribbling load of shíte, it's a global pandemic.

Unless "the young people" have become an homogeneous grouping with no family or friends?

NIAC Fanboy

gozunda wrote: »

I could ask you to do the same? But let's keep this out of the sewer ftm.

So what you're saying there its either mass gatherings and pissups in the street or "Indoor house parties, sheebeens"

No other alternatives at all? Nothing? We have to have huge crowds of people acting irresponsibly or else all involved are going off to have huge parties indoors? Ok ...

No chance that the same acting the mick outside in Dublin City Centre don't give a flying proverbial and also have a tenancy to engage in "Indoor house parties, sheebeens" no?

Take a look at the photos. Large crowds no space and were practically on top of each other. And yes apart from the risks of public health of unfettered defecation etc - the risk is not zero. Large crowds with little or no social distancing/ close contact / face to face remains a risk. You mention "superspreaders". You only need one individual to be a superspreader tbf.

It remains the excuse that people have been told to have an "outdoor sumner" is bs as it does not stand up to the most basic scrutiny. Rather it would appear to be the usual suspects pushing the boundaries of what is responsible at this point in time.

Nobody is trying to excuse anything here, just stating it was obvious 6 weeks ago that this would happen. Or even a year ago (dame Lane, Bournemouth beach etc.)

Everybody, including Holohan and the government knew this would happen, but made the decision to keep beer gardens closed.

Holohan has nobody to blame but himself.

Don't Chute!

The “government” are now threatening us with local lockdowns if we don’t behave ourselves. I could be wrong on this but weren’t we told during level 5 that local lockdowns couldn’t/wouldn’t work? What’s changed?

Amirani

VinLieger wrote: »

Its not acceptable but its also not acceptable to tell everyone to go enjoy them outside and not provide facilities to do so and then do shocked pikachu faces when people do exactly what you told them to and leave a disgusting mess because you didn't prepare in any way.

Another issue with this by all accounts is the approach of Gardai seems to be at a certain time, rush in and clear a place out, sometimes quite physically. It doesn't really leave much opportunity for people to clean up when there's Gardai shoving them down the street.

There's also a good few reports of Gardai knocking plastic pints out of people's hands and stuff.

This doesn't excuse the state the streets were left in, but it definitely contributes to the problem.

rdwight

https://twitter.com/hazechu/status/1399079455394603012

Hazel Chu isn't wrong.

(But is it really possible for someone to spend over 15 years in the Irish educational system - primary school, private secondary boarding school, UCD - and qualify as a barrister and still be able to write such an illiterate sentence?)



.

Amirani

Salvation Tambourine wrote: »

Has anyone ever went drinking and brought their empties home? You should find a bin and use it but the implication that it's normal for someone to jump on the bus with a plastic bag full of empty cans is nonsense.

I'd imagine most taxis wouldn't lets you into them with a box full of empty cans either.

gozunda

NIAC Fanboy wrote: »

Nobody is trying to excuse anything here, just stating it was obvious 6 weeks ago that this would happen. Or even a year ago (dame Lane, Bournemouth beach etc.) Everybody, including Holohan and the government knew this would happen, but made the decision to keep beer gardens closed.

Holohan has nobody to blame but himself.

I'd disagree. Lots of people trying to excuse what happened.

I take it you're not a believer in personal responsibility or self determination then? And its all Tony's fault - because he made them do it?

That the only alternative to having a drink with friends is for mass gatherings and pissups like we saw in Dublin City Centre?

Or the fact that outdoor pub service is less than a week away?

Grand so.

Richard Hillman

NIAC Fanboy wrote: »

Nobody is trying to excuse anything here, just stating it was obvious 6 weeks ago that this would happen. Or even a year ago (dame Lane, Bournemouth beach etc.)

Everybody, including Holohan and the government knew this would happen, but made the decision to keep beer gardens closed.

Holohan has nobody to blame but himself.

Holohan was convinced that after a year of penance we would be all turned away from the demon drink, and our social activities would be formed by €9 substantial meals and a solitary glass of wine.

Although we might have to for-go the glass of wine as we all have a Charity 5k fun run in the morning, followed by sea swimming, as with our new healthy upper middle class, WFH lives.