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Tikka t1x .22lr ammo preferences??

  • 12-04-2021 8:33am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Good Monday shooters!
    I picked myself up a tikka t1x. 22lr 20inch barrel last Thursday and got to shoot a few groups with it on Saturday morning last.
    All iv to hand at the moment is cci subsonic.
    I started with a clean bore.
    It's best group is around 1 inch at 50m and larger out at 65m that's my zero !
    Can any tikka t1x shooters suggest a hunting round preferable a hollow point sub they find to shoot better than 1inch at 50m ?
    Besides the hollow subs what does this gun like to shoot ??
    Curious to hear
    Thanks .
    Il post a picture of the groups so far!


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Good Monday shooters!
    I picked myself up a tikka t1x. 22lr 20inch barrel last Thursday and got to shoot a few groups with it on Saturday morning last.
    All iv to hand at the moment is cci subsonic.
    I started with a clean bore.
    It's best group is around 1 inch at 50m and larger out at 65m that's my zero !
    Can any tikka t1x shooters suggest a hunting round preferable a hollow point sub they find to shoot better than 1inch at 50m ?
    Besides the hollow subs what does this gun like to shoot ??
    Curious to hear
    Thanks .
    Il post a picture of the groups so far!

    That's 65 m zero with so adjustments up and down I set turrets after the 5th group as it was as good as it got!! It shoots ok at 50 and the group at 80 wasnt bad bar the super sonic round...
    All if the rounds travel faster than sub sonic over 30 shots on the chrono iv an average of 333m/s or1090 fps...


  • Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭ no_4


    was it windy?
    was it bought new?
    if so it can take a few boxes to settle down and lead the barrel, 1 inch at 50 seems very high for a tikka; once it settles down id get as many brands as you can and just by trial and error you will find what works best in your gun ; ive not got a tikka but had good luck with cci standard, eley subs and sport, selier and belliot and aguila
    generally speaking the lower velocity rounds should give you best chance of accuracy at longer distances as the bullet is not affected by breaking the sound barrier. there are lots of brands that shoot less than 1100 fps, many are not marketed as subsonic but they are eg eley sport is rated at 1045fps and ive measured them at 1030fps.


  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    no_4 wrote: »
    was it windy?
    was it bought new?
    if so it can take a few boxes to settle down and lead the barrel, 1 inch at 50 seems very high for a tikka; once it settles down id get as many brands as you can and just by trial and error you will find what works best in your gun ; ive not got a tikka but had good luck with cci standard, eley subs and sport, selier and belliot and aguila
    generally speaking the lower velocity rounds should give you best chance of accuracy at longer distances as the bullet is not affected by breaking the sound barrier. there are lots of brands that shoot less than 1100 fps, many are not marketed as subsonic but they are eg eley sport is rated at 1045fps and ive measured them at 1030fps.
    Hi
    Gun bought new and 100 rounds through it so far !!
    Conditions on the day were perfect for the 22lr ... had frost that morning so v little breeze!! I took along a table and a rear bag as well as scope has bubble on it and all squared up to action !!
    Maybe after another box it may tighten up. The cci subs I'm using at mo all have a sonic crack when fired ..I'm presuming it's the ammo it may well be the longer barrel??
    Iv a box of Rws subs and Eley subs on order but still like to get shooters opinion ..


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 2,759 Mod ✭✭✭✭ cookimonster


    I can only talk about the ammo. I would have normaly shot Eley Subsonic Hollow Points or Winchester 42 Max Subsonic and at 50 yards my old Brno would clover leaf them. I tried the CCI Subs and they were dreadful in comparison, averaging a one inch group each time.

    I know some lads swear by them but I never found the CCI subs to be good.


  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    I can only talk about the ammo. I would have normaly shot Eley Subsonic Hollow Points or Winchester 42 Max Subsonic and at 50 yards my old Brno would clover leaf them. I tried the CCI Subs and they were dreadful in comparison, averaging a one inch group each time.

    I know some lads swear by them but I never found the CCI subs to be good.
    I went from a 22lr to a air rifles for a while and now I'm back to 22lr after maybe 3 years and back then I used cci subs shot from cz 455 .
    I found them to be very accurate and quiet with a sak mod on the cz they left the rifle with a little " thud" sound no there waking up the neighbour hood !! All going with a crack and some with even more !! The quality must be way down or else it's a bad batch ...
    Il try others for sure !! I'd like to stick to subs as I find them great on bunnies !!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13 Tuamer


    Good Monday shooters!
    I picked myself up a tikka t1x. 22lr 20inch barrel last Thursday and got to shoot a few groups with it on Saturday morning last.
    All iv to hand at the moment is cci subsonic.
    I started with a clean bore.
    It's best group is around 1 inch at 50m and larger out at 65m that's my zero !
    Can any tikka t1x shooters suggest a hunting round preferable a hollow point sub they find to shoot better than 1inch at 50m ?
    Besides the hollow subs what does this gun like to shoot ??
    Curious to hear
    Thanks .
    Il post a picture of the groups so far!

    I have the t1x in 16" and have only tried CCI subs to date. Using a bench and bag it shot half inch groups at 50 yards out of the box (first 10 shots)
    Over the next 100 rounds it maintained that standard but there was one group of 10 during that 100 that was absolutely brutal. If it was a couple of bad shots I would have put it down to me but 8 out of 10 shots were outside of the inch bullseye. Ran a cleaning rod through it 5 or 6 times with a bit of bore cleaner and it went back to half inch or so.
    I wouldn't give up on the CCIs entirely just yet.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 2,759 Mod ✭✭✭✭ cookimonster


    The cci subs I'm using at mo all have a sonic crack when fired ..I'm presuming it's the ammo it may well be the longer barrel??

    My old .22 was a 1960's model with a 'full' sized barrel on it and even without the mod it was fairly quiet.

    I just looked up the CCI website for some information
    Low velocity 40 grain BC .120
    Muzzle Velocity 1050 feet per secound

    Standard velocity 40 grain BC .120
    Muzzle Velocity 1070 feet per secound

    High velocity 40 grain BC .130
    Muzzle Velocity 1235 feet per secound

    So it looks like they are pushing out the same bullet more or less and using either a different propellant or grain weight charge.

    If the quality control is not up to spec (as is seen with the bulk production Federal Ammo) then you may indeed be seeing bullets with a muzzel velocity greater than 1100 feet per secound. If the LVs velocity is dropping off roughly to 950 f/s at 50 yards then this may cause a loss of accuracy as the shock wave passes. Even Eley give a variation of 40 f/s at the muzzel, so it wouldn't take much to tip a bullet into HV if it's already just below the threshold.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Are you using a suppressor?

    Have you done a twist check on the bore, or know it?

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Even Eley give a variation of 40 f/s at the muzzel, so it wouldn't take much to tip a bullet into HV if it's already just below the threshold.
    So you could have ammo in the super sonic range but always in the transonic range. Not really where you'd like to be for a rimfire.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 436 ✭✭ JP22


    100 rds is not a lot, it make take a few hundred to come into its own.

    With .22's, testing is the name of the game.

    Get as many different brands as you can and thoroughly test each one at the same distance and under the same conditions.

    Be sure to clean barrell before changing brands.


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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    My first check is always the scope being properly adjusted for parallax.

    If you have your rifle clamped so it does not move and you make no contact with it (not vital, but i prefer to eliminate any movement of the scope by touching the rifle), look down the scope to the target. Now slowly move your head, not your eye but your head, while looking at the target. If the crosshair "moves" with the movement of your head, or to be exact so there is no confusion, gives the appearance of moving then your parallax is not set.

    If the parallax on a scope is correctly set then when you move you head your crosshairs will remain on the same POA you set it at when clamping the rifle. If the crosshairs can "move" with your head movement due to improperly set parallax then the crosshair will give a, suppose you'd call it, false POA.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Tuamer wrote: »
    I have the t1x in 16" and have only tried CCI subs to date. Using a bench and bag it shot half inch groups at 50 yards out of the box (first 10 shots)
    Over the next 100 rounds it maintained that standard but there was one group of 10 during that 100 that was absolutely brutal. If it was a couple of bad shots I would have put it down to me but 8 out of 10 shots were outside of the inch bullseye. Ran a cleaning rod through it 5 or 6 times with a bit of bore cleaner and it went back to half inch or so.
    I wouldn't give up on the CCIs entirely just yet.
    Hope I dont have to clean it already lol!!
    Il keep going with the subs yet the least they will do is lead up the barrel ...


  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Cass wrote: »
    Are you using a suppressor?

    Have you done a twist check on the bore, or know it?

    Using a mod ... sonic ! And I believe the twist is 16.5 on the t1x
    I should really have fired it with out mod last weekend but just to see if it makes a drifferance!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Cass wrote: »
    My first check is always the scope being properly adjusted for parallax.

    If you have your rifle clamped so it does not move and you make no contact with it (not vital, but i prefer to eliminate any movement of the scope by touching the rifle), look down the scope to the target. Now slowly move your head, not your eye but your head, while looking at the target. If the crosshair "moves" with the movement of your head, or to be exact so there is no confusion, gives the appearance of moving then your parallax is not set.

    If the parallax on a scope is correctly set then when you move you head your crosshairs will remain on the same POA you set it at when clamping the rifle. If the crosshairs can "move" with your head movement due to improperly set parallax then the crosshair will give a, suppose you'd call it, false POA.
    The scope I'm using is a vortex diamond back TACTICAL ffp 4-16x44 with side parallax and strapped to tikka with sports match rings and yes I move my head to eliminate parallax...
    Another thing that might help is action screw torque!!
    When I first got my rifle I cleaned the bore ... chamber area... action and bolt and removed the stock I noticed that the front action screw was very snug it took 52in/lb of the fatboy to break loose as for the rear screw only 32.5 ish to break free ... I also reduced the trigger weight to 1.6/1.8 lb and when I replaced the action screws both were torqued to 32.5 in/lb ...I'm wondering if it worth playing with torque settings ??


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    I should really have fired it with out mod last weekend but just to see if it makes a drifferance!!
    My thinking too. Always zero and check without a suppressor so it can be eliminated as a cause.

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    ..... and yes I move my head to eliminate parallax...
    So long as the crosshair does not move when your head does you're set on that front.
    Another thing that might help is action screw torque!!
    It can make a huge difference.
    I'm wondering if it worth playing with torque settings ??
    Absolutely.

    From my F-Class days i can say that adjusting my torque settings helped reduce group size with no other external factors. IOW just adjusting the torque settings can tighten up or worsen a group.

    I'd go back to the original settings you had when you took it apart then adjust in increments until you get the desired grouping. Also make sure to do comprehensive group tests. Not three rounds only. Do at least 3 to 5 groups of 5 in timed intervals so the rifle/barrel "condition" is always the same with each group.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Cass wrote: »
    So long as the crosshair does not move when your head does you're set on that front.

    It can make a huge difference.

    Absolutely.

    From my F-Class days i can say that adjusting my torque settings helped reduce group size with no other external factors. IOW just adjusting the torque settings can tighten up or worsen a group.

    I'd go back to the original settings you had when you took it apart then adjust in increments until you get the desired grouping. Also make sure to do comprehensive group tests. Not three rounds only. Do at least 3 to 5 groups of 5 in timed intervals so the rifle/barrel "condition" is always the same with each group.

    Torque settings is worth trying..giving the front one was at 52in/lb and the rear screw at 32ish how would u go about the adjustments !! In what increments of torque would u adjust... and what screw first or two together ...
    It was easier when I had the krg on the tikka t3x I torqued both together in 5 in/lb increments till I got a tight group and that was at 50in/lb on both !!
    In regards to the tikka t1x could I start both at a low torque and increase there after till it looks like its grouped well ??


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭ Feisar


    There was a thread a while back here were a lad said CCI subs were cracking instead of popping so it may be the batch. And then those that don't, as Cass said are they in the transonic range?

    RWS Subs are a good hollowpoint IMO.

    Tikka guarantee half MOA at 50 yards with the T1x but that's probably with Tenex or something.

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    In what increments of torque would u adjust... and what screw first or two together ...
    5in/lbs per test.

    Do one screw at a time. Start with the front one as its set at 32 but you said it was over 50. If the rear screw is back to its original setting then the front is the one to start with. If you see no improvement by the time you're back to the original setting start on the back one. Increase only a slight bit beyond the original setting and then back off a little.

    If neither works doing one at a time then move to adjusting the two together but again in 5 increments and record everything you do. Last thing you want i to forget where you are and have to start over.

    This is not going to be a quick or easy process but the pay off will be worth it.

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Feisar wrote: »
    Tikka guarantee half MOA at 50 yards with the T1x but that's probably with Tenex or something.

    Standard for each manufacturer. Always check their website for what length barrel and ammo they use when testing and to make their claims.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 800 ✭✭✭ Wadi14


    your torque setting seem to be very high for a sporter rimfire, for me anyway mine are set at 20 for the sweet spot.


  • Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭ zeissman


    Wadi14 wrote: »
    your torque setting seem to be very high for a sporter rimfire, for me anyway mine are set at 20 for the sweet spot.

    It does seem high alright. I had my sako quad set at 22 inlbs.


  • Registered Users Posts: 980 ✭✭✭ chris20


    I swore by CCI subs for years, A few months back I started having awful trouble with them, there would be 8 or 9 kickers in a box and some sounded like mini mags, I have since swapped to Eley subs and found them much more consistent


  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Wadi14 wrote: »
    your torque setting seem to be very high for a sporter rimfire, for me anyway mine are set at 20 for the sweet spot.

    Lads at tikka must have driven them in with a cordless!!!


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,534 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Cass


    Something like this :D

    Milwaukee-M18ONEFHIW1-802X-18V-FUEL-ONE-KEY-Impact-Wrench.jpg

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  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Yep that looks about right!!!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    Iv 2 boxes of Rws subs and a box of Eley subs arriving today .. is there any other hollow point sub worth trying??
    I dont think round nose on rabbits would be the way to go!! I do all head shots but like the pcp would they pass through or ricochet?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,182 ✭✭✭ Feisar


    Cass wrote: »
    5in/lbs per test.

    Do one screw at a time. Start with the front one as its set at 32 but you said it was over 50. If the rear screw is back to its original setting then the front is the one to start with. If you see no improvement by the time you're back to the original setting start on the back one. Increase only a slight bit beyond the original setting and then back off a little.

    If neither works doing one at a time then move to adjusting the two together but again in 5 increments and record everything you do. Last thing you want i to forget where you are and have to start over.

    This is not going to be a quick or easy process but the pay off will be worth it.

    I presume preferred torque would/could change from ammo type to ammo type?

    First they came for the socialists...



  • Registered Users Posts: 850 ✭✭✭ zeissman


    Iv 2 boxes of Rws subs and a box of Eley subs arriving today .. is there any other hollow point sub worth trying??
    I dont think round nose on rabbits would be the way to go!! I do all head shots but like the pcp would they pass through or ricochet?

    The rws should be accurate, the older green box eley were very accurate in my sako but the new white box ones didn't shoot well.
    Winchester subs would also be worth trying. My mate uses them and says they are accurate and have good stopping power.
    I know some guys head shoot rabbits and use match ammo but I never tried it myself.
    I just got a new tikka myself . I tried some sk match yesterday at 50 yards and it shot well. shooting 1/2 inch or less for 5 shots.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 289 ✭✭ john jameson


    The Rws are worth a try for sure... half inch sounds spot on .. ya never know after iv a play with the torque setting the cci subs might tighten up !! But there still going with a crack. Even the new box I opened are loud!!
    I'd prefer nice and quiet at night with bunnies!!


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