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Dublin Lord Mayor Hazel Chu to stand as Independent in Seanad elections

  • 24-03-2021 2:41pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 35,024 ✭✭✭✭Baggly


    https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2021/0322/1205504-seanad-election/

    Lord Mayor Hazel Chu is reported to be standing for election to the Seanad as an Independent. What do you think of this?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,877 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    What has she done to deserve a place in the Seanad?

    Then again, what have 3/4 of them done to deserve a place there.

    Fcuk Putin. Glory to Ukraine!



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Baggly wrote: »
    https://www.rte.ie/news/politics/2021/0322/1205504-seanad-election/

    Lord Mayor Hazel Chu is reported to be standing for election to the Seanad as an Independent. What do you think of this?

    It can't be long now before the Greens split.
    As a bit of an environmentalist, I actually can't stand most of them (funnily enough bar Ryan). They're after getting a decent climate bill through the Oireachtas, and all you hear from some of them is screeching about racism and pervert teachers.

    One of her backers, TD Costello has even taken a case against the state...
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/varadkar-criticises-green-td-s-high-court-ceta-challenge-1.4500000


  • Registered Users Posts: 546 ✭✭✭POBox19


    Fair play to her, and Good Luck Hazel.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    One of her backers, TD Costello has even taken a case against the state...
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/varadkar-criticises-green-td-s-high-court-ceta-challenge-1.4500000

    Costello is her husband, so a bit more than just a backer.

    I don't have a particular issue with her running for the Seanad, all power to her. No real problem with her choosing to do it as an Independent if she wasn't getting party support. However, she should have resigned as Chairperson of the Greens in order to do so.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,524 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    What has she done to deserve a place in the Seanad?

    Then again, what have 3/4 of them done to deserve a place there.

    She has a lot of twitter followers and the media love her


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,377 ✭✭✭boardise


    What a shame we didnt get rid of that silly Senate when there was a golden chance some years back.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    boardise wrote: »
    What a shame we didnt get rid of that silly Senate when there was a golden chance some years back.

    I think it is a useful function of a democracy to have an upper house to review legislation... But the senate in its current form is not fit for purpose and seems to be a holding pen for politicians who can't get elected by the general public or are unelectable full stop.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,853 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    She has a lot of twitter followers and the media love her

    Politicians on Twitter is generally a bad idea.

    If she is bringing something worthwhile to the table politically best of luck to her.

    I would suggest she stop kicking the hornets nest of identity politics via her twitter account and concentrate on her job for everyone's sake. She helps give more attention than practically anyone else in political office to fringe groups who are only too happy to engage in harassment and abuse against her. The point has been made, time to concentrate on serving the people of Ireland, God knows we have enough lousy politicians in this country already.

    Glazers Out!



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Amirani wrote: »
    Costello is her husband, so a bit more than just a backer..

    Jesus H Christ.
    I did not know that!

    #embarrassed

    Makes it even worse so


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭TomTomTim


    nullzero wrote: »
    Politicians on Twitter is generally a bad idea.

    If she is bringing something worthwhile to the table politically best of luck to her.

    I would suggest she stop kicking the hornets nest of identity politics via her twitter account and concentrate on her job for everyone's sake. She helps give more attention than practically anyone else in political office to fringe groups who are only too happy to engage in harassment and abuse against her. The point has been made, time to concentrate on serving the people of Ireland, God knows we have enough lousy politicians in this country already.

    I disagree, for different reasons. One of the only benefits of social media is the fact that we get to see exactly what these people think. For many of us it's been illuminating. Any suspicions people have had about the unethical nature of politicians and journalists, have been completely validated due to social media.

    “The man who lies to himself can be more easily offended than anyone else. You know it is sometimes very pleasant to take offense, isn't it? A man may know that nobody has insulted him, but that he has invented the insult for himself, has lied and exaggerated to make it picturesque, has caught at a word and made a mountain out of a molehill--he knows that himself, yet he will be the first to take offense, and will revel in his resentment till he feels great pleasure in it.”- ― Fyodor Dostoevsky, The Brothers Karamazov




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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,853 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    ****


    TomTomTim wrote: »
    I disagree, for different reasons. Twitters only benefit is the fact that we get to see exactly what these people think. For many of us it's been illuminating. Any suspicions people have had about the unethical nature of politicians and journalists, have been completely validated due to social media.

    That is true.

    I was coming from the angle of certain politicians stoking fires that need not be stoked via twitter.

    Glazers Out!



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    Shenanigans afoot I'd say.

    Eamon Ryan will not be voting for his party colleague Hazel Chu in this Seanad by-election. According to the Examiner:
    "Green Party leader Eamon Ryan confirmed he would be voting for Fianna Fáil's Gerry Horkan on the Industrial panel, who is running against Ms Chu. Ms Chu entered the race as an Independent candidate yesterday as a late entry after securing nine signatures, seven of which came from her own party, despite the party agreeing it would not field a candidate for the ballot."

    Not voting for your own party's Chairperson tells a inquisitive story right there.


  • Registered Users Posts: 81,225 ✭✭✭✭biko


    In a letter to members, the Mayor said this was a "personal choice to ensure there is proper representation" in the election, adding: "It is important to have women and minorities."

    The Seanad is very close to 50/50 already - 24 women out of 60 Senators (40%).

    There were 9 women and 3 men appointed by the Taoiseach 2020, including one female Traveller rights activist.


  • Registered Users Posts: 87 ✭✭PunkIPA


    If a member of FG, FF, or SF attempted to stand as an Independent in a Seanad or Dáil election after being expressly forbidden from doing so as a member of that party they would have their membership suspended and would be certainly be forced to resign as from a prominent leadership position such as Chairperson. There is absolutely no question about that.

    There was a case recently where a simple rank-and-file Blueshirt had his membership stripped for the capital offence of knocking on a few doors in the last local elections for his father who was standing as an Independent councillor:-

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/donohoe-suggests-expelled-fine-gael-member-who-supported-fathers-campaign-may-return-after-election-38894588.html

    What the Lord Mayor is doing now is genuinely unprecedented.

    #NotANormalParty


  • Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    "Former head of communications for Diageo Ireland runs for the senate"


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,524 ✭✭✭Yellow_Fern


    Kivaro wrote: »
    Shenanigans afoot I'd say.

    Eamon Ryan will not be voting for his party colleague Hazel Chu in this Seanad by-election. According to the Examiner:
    "Green Party leader Eamon Ryan confirmed he would be voting for Fianna Fáil's Gerry Horkan on the Industrial panel, who is running against Ms Chu. Ms Chu entered the race as an Independent candidate yesterday as a late entry after securing nine signatures, seven of which came from her own party, despite the party agreeing it would not field a candidate for the ballot."

    Not voting for your own party's Chairperson tells a inquisitive story right there.

    I don't why you'd risk the party of a Seanad seat. The Seanad is very unimportant. If she plays the long game she would be well placed to get a TD seat and without disrupting the party. She was only elected as a councilor in 2019. Walk before you run like.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,004 ✭✭✭✭Richard Hillman


    She seen the sinking ship and grabbed a life raft for herself


  • Administrators Posts: 52,661 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Chairperson of the GP going against party decisions is quite the farce. This is just outright careerism. One foot in the GP, one foot as an independent, see which one results in a better position.

    I read in one of the papers that she was courting other independents for backing. Does this means she intends to be truly independent and not an unofficial Green? Is she going to vote against government bills?

    I'm repeating what I said in the politics forum but it is time Ryan took action against those in his party who cannot follow party discipline.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,516 Mod ✭✭✭✭Amirani


    Kivaro wrote: »
    Shenanigans afoot I'd say.

    Eamon Ryan will not be voting for his party colleague Hazel Chu in this Seanad by-election. According to the Examiner:
    "Green Party leader Eamon Ryan confirmed he would be voting for Fianna Fáil's Gerry Horkan on the Industrial panel, who is running against Ms Chu. Ms Chu entered the race as an Independent candidate yesterday as a late entry after securing nine signatures, seven of which came from her own party, despite the party agreeing it would not field a candidate for the ballot."

    Not voting for your own party's Chairperson tells a inquisitive story right there.

    Apparently it was part of the agreement in Government that first 2 Seanad by-elections would go to the bigger 2 parties, and the next one would go to the Greens. Hence why her party wouldn't nominate her.


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 64,911 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    awec wrote: »
    Chairperson of the GP going against party decisions is quite the farce. This is just outright careerism. One foot in the GP, one foot as an independent, see which one results in a better position.

    I'm repeating what I said in the politics forum but it is time Ryan took action against those in his party who cannot follow party discipline.

    Party chairs are sometimes elected to or pushed to the role to try and quell their dissent; with the opposite results.

    Colm Keaveney was, briefly, Chair of the Labour Party without the Dáil whip (he then joined FF, lost his seat, went bankrupt and got re-elected as a Councilor for FF - so he's had an interesting decade)
    Amirani wrote: »
    Costello is her husband, so a bit more than just a backer.

    As far as I know they're not actually married - because the wedding had to be postponed due to COVID.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,710 ✭✭✭keano_afc


    Standing because the Seanad needs to more diverse? Doesn't she repeatedly tell us she's Irish? The Seanad is full of Irish people.


  • Registered Users Posts: 446 ✭✭Marcos


    I don't why you'd risk the party of a Seanad seat. The Seanad is very unimportant. If she plays the long game she would be well placed to get a TD seat and without disrupting the party. She was only elected as a councilor in 2019. Walk before you run like.

    The Greens are going to implode at the next General Election, just like they did the last time they went into coalition. And where is the bould Hazel going to get elected? She's in Eamon Ryan's constituency, Dublin Bay South, so that's no. Plus don't forget he's been TD there for so long, and is well able to look after himself. Remember him objecting to the Metrolink plans because they didn't sit well with his constituents?

    Can anyone seeing Neasa Hourigan standing aside in Dublin Central just to let Hazel in? Catherine Martin in Dublin Rathdown? Ossian Smith in Dun Laoghaire? Roderick O'Gorman in Dublin West? Joe O'Brien in Dublin Fingal? Even her partner Patrick Costello in Dublin South Central? No, there's not any spare constituency that will have her. So of course she's cutting and running while trying to hoover up as many Green votes by association as possible.

    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



  • Registered Users Posts: 87 ✭✭PunkIPA


    I don't why you'd risk the party of a Seanad seat. The Seanad is very unimportant. If she plays the long game she would be well placed to get a TD seat and without disrupting the party. She was only elected as a councilor in 2019. Walk before you run like.

    The problem for the Lord Mayor is that her advancement in Dublin in the next GE is effectively impossible. Every Southside constituency already has an incumbent TD. In the wider Dublin area, the constituencies without a GP TD are the ones where they will never in a million years take a seat. 2019 will be an all time high watermark for the party and I highly doubt they will perform as well again in the course of my lifetime.

    If, as is widely expected, their vote share decreases in the next GE, she will also be faced with the prospect of a lot of incumbent TDs, and in some cases former Ministers, who will have lost their seats. So when it comes time to arrange a vote for the next Seanad elections, the Lord Mayor will struggle to get her name to the front of that particular queue also.

    My suspicion is the Lord Mayor position was given to her as a sinecure - she was promoted over Cllr. Byrne who has been an incumbent since 2014, and Cllrs. Cooney and Conroy, who were candidates back in 2014 too. It certainly bought the party lots of excellent PR. The Lord Mayor's rapid advancement seems to have gone to her head, however. I don't think it was ever the intention of Minister Ryan for Mayor Chu to be his running mate in Dublin Bay South, for example.

    Remember, she is the Councillor for the Pembroke ward in Minister Ryan's back yard. I don't imagine he will be too keen for her to be breathing down his neck in the greenest seat in the country.


  • Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    She's had one foot out the door of the Greens for a good while now. She admitted to being approached by the Social Democrats not too long ago.

    I think it's a great move. She won't get elected but it lays out to the public exactly how much of a mess the Greens are and it's not going to get any better as long as Eamon Ryan is leader. The fact Catherine Martin (along with her husband and brother) signed her nomination papers says it all for me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,710 ✭✭✭keano_afc


    Marcos wrote: »
    The Greens are going to implode at the next General Election, just like they did the last time they went into coalition. And where is the bould Hazel going to get elected? She's in Eamon Ryan's constituency, Dublin Bay South, so that's no. Plus don't forget he's been TD there for so long, and is well able to look after himself. Remember him objecting to the Metrolink plans because they didn't sit well with his constituents?

    Can anyone seeing Neasa Hourigan standing aside in Dublin Central just to let Hazel in? Catherine Martin in Dublin Rathdown? Ossian Smith in Dun Laoghaire? Roderick O'Gorman in Dublin West? Joe O'Brien in Dublin Fingal? Even her partner Patrick Costello in Dublin South Central? No, there's not any spare constituency that will have her. So of course she's cutting and running while trying to hoover up as many Green votes by association as possible.

    She'll join the Social Democrats. Match made in heaven.


  • Administrators Posts: 52,661 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    I actually missed the fact that the deputy leader of the GP nominated her. Ha!

    Either Catherine Martin is absolutely certain that Hazel Chu has no chance of winning, in which case why embarrass the party for nothing, or she's playing a dangerous game with the parties reputation in government and should also lose her position.

    What a dysfunctional group.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Would have swore down she was going to run as a SD

    Seanad seems like a waste.

    (Thank fock)


  • Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    awec wrote: »
    I actually missed the fact that the deputy leader of the GP nominated her. Ha!

    Either Catherine Martin is absolutely certain that Hazel Chu has no chance of winning, in which case why embarrass the party for nothing, or she's playing a dangerous game with the parties reputation in government and should also lose her position.

    What a dysfunctional group.

    Catherine Martin is shooting out of both sides of the gun. She knows there's only one way to get your policies in place and that is through being in government, while also trying to ruffle Eamon Ryan's feathers simultaneously.

    I think the Green's should have ran someone anyway. It makes no sense not to. FG are running candidates so the Greens should as well. Fair play to them in my opinion.


  • Registered Users Posts: 446 ✭✭Marcos


    awec wrote: »
    Chairperson of the GP going against party decisions is quite the farce. This is just outright careerism. One foot in the GP, one foot as an independent, see which one results in a better position.
    You got it in one. Careerism is something the Greens used to be dead set against. Until some actually made careers out of being Green politicians. :rolleyes:
    awec wrote: »
    I read in one of the papers that she was courting other independents for backing. Does this means she intends to be truly independent and not an unofficial Green? Is she going to vote against government bills?
    She wants to run with the hare and hunt with the hounds and her tactic so far has been to describe anyone that calls her out a racist/bigot/misogynist/fascist/any other ist you wish to apply, as opposed to people who might genuinely have a problem with her approach.

    The question about her voting for government bills is a good one. I'd imagine if she actually was voted in as an independent then she'd be more than happy to vote for whatever she wants to vote for and not be bothered with anything like government policies.
    awec wrote: »
    I'm repeating what I said in the politics forum but it is time Ryan took action against those in his party who cannot follow party discipline.
    And risk pulling the government down before January 2022? AFAIK it's purely a coincidence that you have to serve in the Dail two years before TD and ministerial pensions kick in. Edit: Actually, after seeing Faugheen's post #32 with the Aoife Grace Moore tweet about the three green female senators putting forward a motion of no confidence in the Chair of the Party, Hazel herself, I could be totally wrong. Parties have split for less.

    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭Kivaro


    awec wrote: »
    I actually missed the fact that the deputy leader of the GP nominated her. Ha!

    Either Catherine Martin is absolutely certain that Hazel Chu has no chance of winning, in which case why embarrass the party for nothing, or she's playing a dangerous game with the parties reputation in government and should also lose her position.

    What a dysfunctional group.

    This could be the catalyst for the Green Party split.
    And if there was an agreement in Government that the first 2 Seanad by-elections would go to the bigger 2 parties, and the next one would go to the Greens, then the Green Party are deliberately reneging on their deal. Meanwhile, both Fine Gael and Fianna Fail are bending over backwards in order to fulfil their commitments to the Green Party in their program for Government.
    The Green Party is not looking good however this plays out.


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