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Can't put weights down ! Fitter at 40?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 81,310 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    Well done on the 140 pb :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Well done on the 140 pb :)

    I forgot to mention that I loaded 150 onto the bar afterwards and didn't manage to budge it off the ground :o
    This 500lbs deadlift and sub 5 mile might take need some juicing :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    While you haven't mentioned any form checks or issues with it on deadlift, just record your sets from the side and make sure. Sometimes it feels ok but looks less so on the video. Better to just keep it in check at this early stage.

    But well done on dismissing the negative thoughts.

    Thanks man , I'll record my next deadlift and upalod it I don't think I've issues but I know from swimming that what you perceive yourself to be doing can be very different to what your actually doing.
    I keep the bar close to the body and the back neutral my flexibility isn't great so I imagine I probably sit down into the lift more to allow for the back to be neutral I'm not sure if that's an issue but that's my perception of how I lift .


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    new2tri19 wrote: »
    Thanks man , I'll record my next deadlift and upalod it I don't think I've issues but I know from swimming that what you perceive yourself to be doing can be very different to what your actually doing.
    I keep the bar close to the body and the back neutral my flexibility isn't great so I imagine I probably sit down into the lift more to allow for the back to be neutral I'm not sure if that's an issue but that's my perception of how I lift .

    Even just watching it yourself you'll get a good idea of how things are.


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    week 5 Day 3 OHP

    2 hours on bike last night , hard day at work and a 15000 target steps done I had planned to take tonight off. I don't really do rest days well , nap on couch after dinner and decide to just go out to shed and try get something done and take tomorrow off .

    Overhead press is tough my pb is 52.5kg and I've had a few attempts and failed to better this with gzclp program so this is a tester to me if I can break through this plateau.
    Last week was 50 X 4
    Warm up
    20 X 10
    30 X 5
    40 X 3
    50 X 1 it's feeling heavy but not as heavy as I expected
    52.5 or 55 now for a 2 rep max , I don't want to go 55 and fail I feel it be too hard to go down then .
    52.5 X 2 that was much easier than I expected.
    Shake out the arms wait 3 minutes .
    55kg X 1 first was hard got locked out took a deep breath dropped bar to chest and had nothing for 2nd rep , still a new 1 and 2 rep max . This program works .
    4 sets to 2 at 40kg 2/2/2/10* amrap .

    T2a incline bench
    7 sets of 2 at 50kg off 1 min

    I messed up and did 60kg instead of 50 I lifted the first set and it felt ok so decided to plough on with it , by set 7 I was feeling it .

    T2b t bar row
    find 6 rep max and 3 more mrs

    So I've done these with a towel and then lately been doing them holding bar , I've just realised when watching someone doing them on Instagram that the towel around the bar increases the range of motion and you can pull your elbows back further hence why it's harder and probably better .
    55kg X 6/5/4/5 , nice feeling in back squeezing at top getting elbows back fully .

    T2c upright row
    Find 6 rep max and 3 more mrs

    37.5kg X 6/5/4/4

    T3a lateral raises with band
    Find 12 rep max and 3 more mrs

    12/11/9/7 with 2nd heaviest band .

    T3b ab workout
    Planks - reverse crunches - ankle taps .

    Completed 1 hour 15

    Positives - new pb on ohp 1 and 2 rep max
    Negatives - wasn't really in the zone , was hoping to do some new variations of stuff but a combination of tiredness and lazyness meant it was one of them just workout for the sake of it nights . No flow basically to the workout . Anyways.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    Sometimes you don't need to have a negative. Most times, actually. Tonight was one of those nights...you've just reached for a negative for the sake of it :pac:

    Well done on the PBs :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Sometimes you don't need to have a negative. Most night, actually. Tonight was one of those nights...you've just reached for a negative for the sake of it :pac:

    Well done on the PBs :)

    Thanks man ! True I look for a negative because you can always perform better and I don't want to get comfortable doing the same routine over and over until it doesn't tax the body . I want to be uncomfortable.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    new2tri19 wrote: »
    Thanks man ! True I look for a negative because you can always perform better and I don't want to get comfortable doing the same routine over and over until it doesn't tax the body . I want to be uncomfortable.

    I hear you...just don't frame it as a negative. At least not to yourself. There's always something to be improved. That's part of the attraction.

    It's not positives and negatives as though there are polar opposites. Just things that went well and things you learned.


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Week 5 Day 4 Squat Friday 9th April

    squat
    Find 2 rep max and working sets at 72.5kg.

    I'm happy to build these slowly .
    Working up just the bar then 10kg increments
    20 X 10
    30.x 10
    40 X 5
    50 X 5
    60.x 4
    70.x 2
    80 X 2
    90 X 2 that felt heavy enough that the second rep I was starting to lose stability in the legs so I didn't go heavier .
    3 working sets of 72.5kg

    T2a Deficit deadlift
    7 sets of 2 at 105kg

    Didn't mess up and used a 2 inch platform .
    Nothing much to report they feel heavy but manageable trying to keep the chest up .

    I was about to start the rest of my workout but we had visitors :confused: don't they realise we are in lockdown , so wife called me in to say hello then it was too late when they left .

    Week 6 Day 1 Bench Sunday 11th April
    I had intended to finish the rest of my workout from Friday on Saturday but the day got away from me and I wasn't sure if it was worth it then with a 1 rep max attempt to come .

    T1 Bench
    find 1 rep max

    Everyone it's seems benches 120-150-170kg except me , it's funny when you tell people you are starting to lift weights they ask you what you can bench , I don't really try 1 rep max attempts it's probably around 70 odd doesn't seem to be the answer they are looking for as they all seem to tell me they can bench 150+ kg . I dunno I must be doing something wrong .

    Started with 50kg this morning for 5 and it felt really heavy , j couldn't figure why I didn't feel like I was engaging the whole body and using the legs like last week , felt weird adjusted the bench position and no better .
    Anyways
    50 X 5
    60 X 3 I'm already not cleanly pushing the third rep up it's goes up with some resistance. F@#k this man this is going to be tough
    65 X 2 meh just about made the double . I am confused and check the plates hopeful I've more on than I counted ...:rolleyes:
    70 X 1 this just goes up ( 1 did 75 X 2 for 2 rep max last week )
    75 X. .... I load 75 onto bar then think this likely ain't going up and if it does it's going to hurt so much it'll likely kill my next attempt .
    So load
    80kg - this is heavy just unhooking the bar I can feel the weight in my arms over me , I lower it slowly ( too slowly ) it touches my chest and I get it up about 3-4 inches then nothing I've no power at all and it hangs there for about 10-15 seconds as I try summon the power but it won't budge .. fail :mad:

    I don't know what to do now but decide to try 72.5kg , I get that and load 77.5kg , it goes up and I'm chuffed it's a new bench pb.
    I load 80kg again but exact same as last time it hangs a bit longer and I try push from 3 inches off my chest but can't .

    77.5kg X 1 new pb but wanted 80kg, hopefully at the end of next 6 week block I hit it .

    Nothing planned for work sets but I want to cool down a little and do 50 X 5 for 3 sets , these feel heavy .

    T2 rest week for T2 exercises

    T3a Skullcrushers
    Find 10 rep max and 3 more mrs.

    I use just the bar but I'm feeling a twinge in my left arm - tricep area, I did a warm up of 20 X 10 then 32.5 X 3 it's too painful this movement I dunno if I overloaded it during bench .
    I drop it for now .

    T3b barbell curls
    find 10 rep max and 3 more mrs

    35 X 10/8/6/5

    T3b lateral raises with band
    find 10 rep max and 3 more mrs

    10/9/7/6 for sets off 1 min.

    T3c tricep push downs with band
    find 10 rep max and 3 more mrs

    10/8/7/6 off 1 min .
    The arm was fine for this movement .


    I couldn't of just overloaded the arms on bench it is fine now . It's funny I never feel my chest after bench press I feel it in my arms more than chest maybe I'm doing it wrong but I don't think so.

    Completed today in under an hour .

    Positives - a bench pb I grinded out .
    Negatives - didn't hit 80kg which would have been nice .
    Weighed In today at 75.4kg so I lifted more than my bodyweight which is probably the first time I've done that.

    More bike later and an hour walk . Although I'm feeling ok the fact these next two weeks are a rest of T2 in week one and T3 in week 2 is nice little reset .


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    Most people that bench 120kg+ have been doing it an awful lot longer than you.

    Just keep putting in the work and the numbers will follow. They won't always follow when you want them to but the will. Patience :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    I just found this website strength standards gives you a estimate of what you should be lifting for your height and age .

    40-49 75kg
    beginner /novice / intermediate/ adv / elite
    OHP 29 41 56 74 93
    SQUAT. 62 86 114 149 185
    Dead. 75 102 135 173 213
    Bench. 45 64 87 113 140

    It's nice just to get an idea to see where your lacking , I'm hovering around intermediate for most , good bit below in squat and bench . I've 9 years to get to elite :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,150 ✭✭✭holdfast


    Here is another one from Dan John

    For Men:
    Push
    Expected = Bodyweight bench press
    Game-changer = Bodyweight bench press for 15 reps
    Pull
    Expected = 5 pullups
    Game-changer = 15 pullups
    Hinge
    Expected = Bodyweight to 150% bodyweight deadlift
    Game-changer = Double-bodyweight deadlift
    Squat
    Expected = Bodyweight squat
    Game-changer = Bodyweight squat for 15 reps
    Loaded Carry
    Expected = Farmer walk with total bodyweight (half per hand)
    Game-changer =Bodyweight per hand
    Getup
    One left and right, done with a half-filled cup of water

    Just another option or more information


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    holdfast wrote: »
    Here is another one from Dan John

    For Men:
    Push
    Expected = Bodyweight bench press
    Game-changer = Bodyweight bench press for 15 reps
    Pull
    Expected = 5 pullups
    Game-changer = 15 pullups
    Hinge
    Expected = Bodyweight to 150% bodyweight deadlift
    Game-changer = Double-bodyweight deadlift
    Squat
    Expected = Bodyweight squat
    Game-changer = Bodyweight squat for 15 reps
    Loaded Carry
    Expected = Farmer walk with total bodyweight (half per hand)
    Game-changer =Bodyweight per hand
    Getup
    One left and right, done with a half-filled cup of water

    Just another option or more information

    Interesting thanks
    I reckon I could possibly deadlift double bodyweight amd bodyweight squat for 15 they both seem too easy to be game changers compared to the others . Obviously not easy but comparatively easier .


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Week 6 Day 2 Deadlift

    T1 Deadlift
    find 1 rep max

    Never sure how to best approach this kind of effort .
    Did 60 X 7
    80 X 5
    100 X 4
    110 X 2
    120 X 1
    130 X 1
    140 X 1 that was 9/10 effort .
    150 loaded no lollygagging I'm thinking just get it up , I go at it and boom it's up took a second to fully straighten . Happy out with a new pb . 2 X bodyweight as I weighed in at 75.4 this morning well actually just shy of 2 X bodyweight but close .
    Load 155 onto bar optimistic yeah I can't budge it .
    No working sets programmed but I like to go down the weights to practice form ( forgot to film myself tonight )
    120 X 3 , 90 X 6 , 60 X 10 and done .
    Good session.
    I feel that this plan has delivered very good results considering I had plateaued on gzclp.

    no T2 this week

    T3a t bar row
    Find 10 rep max

    55 X 10/8/7/6 off 1 min

    T3b rear delt fly
    Find 10 rep max and 3 more mrs

    New exercise don't have new dumbells yet so had to go with 10kg a bit heavier than I would have liked to practice with

    10 X 10/8/7/6. Off 1 min

    T3c skullcrushers

    Didn't get to do these last night wanted to test arm all good , although 32.5kg is getting heavy for this exercise could literally turn into a skullcrusher if I'm not careful .

    32.5 X 10/8/6/4 off 1 min .


    Positives - deadlift pb happy to hit 150 but would like 2.5 X bodyweight now , work in progress , lifting heavy feels great , heavy is relative but 150 is really heavy to me. Nice feeling moving that , thanks to you guys wouldn't of done it solo .

    Negatives - nothing really , need my dumbells hurry up Mr gymless .

    An hour done , a run tomorrow morning and bike tomorrow evening and then ohp Wednesday probably .


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Week 6 Day 3 OHP Thursday 15th April

    Trained Monday , woke Tuesday with a sore throat and blocked sinuses and generally feeling fatigued. Tuesday did a 90 mins walk in morning instead of run then 2 hours on the turbo that night. Kept effort at 6/10 steady hoping to sweat a bit of a cold out , this normally works for me . Woke Wednesday feeling achy and throat still sore so didn't do weights . Did 90 minute brisk walk and had nap on couch.
    Thursday throat better so went to shed for a session .

    T1 ohp
    Find 1 rep max .

    Warm up with empty bar for 10 reps and I knew I had nothing felt like I had been punched in the arms all day . I'm yawning between warm up sets but decide to push on , blare some music but nothings helping .
    20 X 10
    Attempt 30 X 5 ... I'm half asleep had 5kg on one side of bar and 10 on other :o was getting annoyed and considered just going in and watching tele .
    40 X 4 this was a struggle
    45 X 2 just up
    50 X 1 same
    55 X 1 felt really hard but up , it matched my 1 rep max I did last week after a 2 rep max .
    57.5 X 0 got the bar from chest to eye level but nothing .
    56kg X 0 same bar to eye level no power .

    T2 no T2 this week

    T3a incline bench
    Find 10 rep max and 3 more max rep sets

    Quick Google of best accessories for ohp shows incline bench , this is a T2 but can it be a t3 it's 11pm i ain't time to debate with myself.
    40 X 10
    50 X 10/7/5/5 off 45 seconds . Good pump .

    T3b rear delt fly with band
    Find 10 rep max

    Did these with band as my dumbells aren't coming till today .
    Seated chest to chair back , band hooked around barbell at chest height , worked through the band's till felt hard
    A set of 10/10/8/7 off 45 seconds .

    T3c Lateral raises with band
    Find 10 rep max and 3 more mrs.
    10/9/7/5

    T3d deficit push up with pause
    Find 10 rep max and 3 mrs

    I'm doing too many exercises but I'm annoyed about my poor ohp so decide to do these.
    3 inch platform.
    Trying to find 10 rep max I had to hold the pause longer after the first 5 when I realised I was going to make the 10 quite easily . Pause was about 3-4 seconds at bottom.
    10/7/5/4 off 45 seconds they where hard good burn in chest illl do them again .

    Completed around an hour.
    I was a bit annoyed after that workout , I hate poor workouts but have to accept they happen and move on , I tend to dig myself into a training hole when it's going bad and over train.

    An hour run today and bike for an hour tonight then squat 1 rep max tomorrow is rough plan .


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    new2tri19 wrote: »
    I hate poor workouts but have to accept they happen and move on.



    Dan John always spoke of a 'rule of 5': in 5 workouts, 3 will be standard, 1 will be great and 1 will be shíte.


    You felt under the weather in general, never mind in the context of training.


    I wouldn't worry about not continuing to increase your OHP at the same rate. You're likely headed for your absolute max. It's why they invented fractionals.


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Dan John always spoke of a 'rule of 5': in 5 workouts, 3 will be standard, 1 will be great and 1 will be shíte.


    You felt under the weather in general, never mind in the context of training.


    I wouldn't worry about not continuing to increase your OHP at the same rate. You're likely headed for your absolute max. It's why they invented fractionals.

    Good stuff thanks I'll factor in the 1 in 5 bad days. Glad I'm not alone.
    I always think to myself when lifting I need to tap into my inner strength like if it was life and death situation and you had to push 80kg up off you you could . My head is clearly giving in before my body . I just have to convince my body it's ok for me to lift heavier because I am going for bodyweight max for ohp , I have some 0.5kg plates and 1.25kg but mostly I just need to suck less and work harder . I think dumbells should help loads


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,785 ✭✭✭✭Dtp1979


    Don’t feel bad. Ohp is a pig of a lift as far as I’m concerned. I’m 4 years trying to get past 60kg. 55 is easy enough. But 60, no


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Dtp1979 wrote: »
    Don’t feel bad. Ohp is a pig of a lift as far as I’m concerned. I’m 4 years trying to get past 60kg. 55 is easy enough. But 60, no

    You need some motivation let's compete see who can get past 60 quickest :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,785 ✭✭✭✭Dtp1979


    new2tri19 wrote: »
    You need some motivation let's compete see who can get past 60 quickest :D

    Done. You’re on ;)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    new2tri19 wrote: »
    Good stuff thanks I'll factor in the 1 in 5 bad days. Glad I'm not alone.
    I always think to myself when lifting I need to tap into my inner strength like if it was life and death situation and you had to push 80kg up off you you could . My head is clearly giving in before my body . I just have to convince my body it's ok for me to lift heavier because I am going for bodyweight max for ohp , I have some 0.5kg plates and 1.25kg but mostly I just need to suck less and work harder . I think dumbells should help loads



    It's not an exact ratio but it serves to illustrate that bad days are common.


    On a separate note, I'd have incline bench as a T2.


  • Registered Users Posts: 81,310 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    Dtp1979 wrote: »
    Don’t feel bad. Ohp is a pig of a lift as far as I’m concerned. I’m 4 years trying to get past 60kg. 55 is easy enough. But 60, no

    I can Ohp the bar
    Yaaaaay


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    I can Ohp the bar
    Yaaaaay

    But that's not your max ? I've seen your log and you lift much heavier than me on squat and deadlift at least.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    Also, if you feel a lift is close to your max, don't try force yourself to go higher just cos its no more than last week. You can always use the back offs as a way to go a touch better, if there happens to be an extra rep there on last week's numbers. No need go chase PRs all the time. They will come once you keep putting in the work.


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Also, if you feel a lift is close to your max, don't try force yourself to go higher just cos its no more than last week. You can always use the back offs as a way to go a touch better, if there happens to be an extra rep there on last week's numbers. No need go chase PRs all the time. They will come once you keep putting in the work.

    Good advice thanks man , I got delivery off hex set of dumbells and adjustable bench . Had a little go of it there I have to say dumbells feel like a game changer. The range of motion feels nicer than the barbell . It feels really good lifting them . I did 1 overhead press with 25kg in each hand damn that is so much harder than 50kg on the barbell . Love it I'm hooked . Now to find more exercises to do .


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭the baby bull elephant


    Also, if you feel a lift is close to your max, don't try force yourself to go higher just cos its no more than last week. You can always use the back offs as a way to go a touch better, if there happens to be an extra rep there on last week's numbers. No need go chase PRs all the time. They will come once you keep putting in the work.


    This is a good point, in the blog where he outlined J&T2.0 Cody also said for block one (weeks 1-6) the primary means of pushing effort should be the optional AMRAP when there is gas in the tank and that this is also supposed to be a set done one to two reps from failure.

    Also in relation to week 6 he said:
    Week 6: Work up to a 1RM that you can confidently double if you wanted.
    The first block isn't about finding your overall max it's finding a good max for that day so you have good intensity on the drop down sets. It's much more of a hypertrophy focus while block two is more strength focus.

    Probably no harm for newtri at this stage though in many ways. It's always good to have a real idea of what actual failure feels like so you know you're not sandbagging your workouts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    This is a good point, in the blog where he outlined J&T2.0 Cody also said for block one (weeks 1-6) the primary means of pushing effort should be the optional AMRAP when there is gas in the tank and that this is also supposed to be a set done one to two reps from failure.

    Also in relation to week 6 he said:

    The first block isn't about finding your overall max it's finding a good max for that day so you have good intensity on the drop down sets. It's much more of a hypertrophy focus while block two is more strength focus.

    Probably no harm for newtri at this stage though in many ways. It's always good to have a real idea of what actual failure feels like so you know you're not sandbagging your workouts.

    100%

    I agree in that I don't think it's any harm at all as such, right now, and it's useful to know how lifts feel when you're close to failure and to know that you're not sandbagging your workouts, like you said. It's just something you'd need to be mindful of longer term.

    The bigger the foundation, the higher the tower. That was always a good reminder for me of how to build PRs - a 1RM is just an expression of strength built through all the sub max work.


  • Registered Users Posts: 530 ✭✭✭new2tri19


    Thanks lad for sure I messed up alot of the program it's why I just ran it instead of over reading it and planning too much cause you learn more as you go.

    Keep in mind that when performing max rep work
    always keep 1-2 reps left in your tank. (regardless of the tier)


    That bit I did find confusing not so much with the higher rep max attempts but it's hard to do a 1 rep max while keeping 1 or 2 reps in the tank , I don't get why he doesn't just ask for another 2 rep max attempt. I might edit the program myself for next time and just add 1 rep to each attempt so it tops out at 2 rep max .

    Week 6 is definitely the least enjoyable for me , I don't like how short the workouts are and 1 rep max attempts aren't that enjoyable.
    Week 7-12 look interesting working off % of rep max I definitely found the drop sets in block 1 too easy and amrap was coming in above expectations Cody suggested +3 or +5 for amrap or your probably programmed too light.

    I have made gains in all lifts that stalled on gzclp which I'm very surprised about considering it only took 6 weeks .


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,588 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    new2tri19 wrote: »
    Thanks lad for sure I messed up alot of the program it's why I just ran it instead of over reading it and planning too much cause you learn more as you go.

    Keep in mind that when performing max rep work
    always keep 1-2 reps left in your tank. (regardless of the tier)


    That bit I did find confusing not so much with the higher rep max attempts but it's hard to do a 1 rep max while keeping 1 or 2 reps in the tank , I don't get why he doesn't just ask for another 2 rep max attempt. I might edit the program myself for next time and just add 1 rep to each attempt so it tops out at 2 rep max .

    Its the same principle as 5/3/1...your 1RM here isn't supposed to be your absolute max. Your progress is driven by sub-maximal work. If the programme says to go for a 1RM, its saying to work up to a weight you could do 2 or maybe 3 reps with. Thats the basis for finding the weight you do the volume with.

    That's why you don't need to force the top sets. They're largely there to get a decent gauge of the actual workload while getting your hands on something heavier as well.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 81,310 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    Yeah working 1rm for me is usually like 90 or 95% of actual max or whatever


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