Relaxation of Restrictions, Part VIII *Read OP For Mod Warnings*

Kermit.de.frog

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Most understand the problem and just get on with their lives.

Rubbish, a gross simplification which negates the economic and psychological turmoil affecting a significant portion of the Irish population. Have a bit of cop on and nuance, instead of wielding the sledgehammer approach. Thankfully a person with your empathy deficit isn't near a position of influence.

SusieBlue

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Rubbish, a gross simplification which negates the economic and psychological turmoil affecting a significant portion of the Irish population. Have a bit of cop on and nuance, instead of wielding the sledgehammer approach. Thankfully a person with your empathy deficit isn't near a position of influence.

It’s the equivalent of telling someone with depression to ‘just be happy’ or someone having a panic attack to ‘just calm down’. Tone deaf and oversimplifying to the extreme.

Kermit.de.frog

Deleted User wrote: »

Rubbish, a gross simplification which negates the economic and psychological turmoil affecting a significant portion of the Irish population. Have a bit of cop on and nuance, instead of wielding the sledgehammer approach. Thankfully a person with your empathy deficit isn't near a position of influence.

My empathy is with those affected, in hospital, healthcare professionals, those in ICU, those struggling and those dieing.

You're empathy appears to be on the side of those suffering what could be described, at it's most charitable, as "first world problems".

Many people currently are going about their lives normally contrary to what you say.

You seek to over dramatise restrictions to try suit a narrative.

Windmill100000

SusieBlue wrote: »

There are death concerns for the other group as well, but but because they aren’t covid related and are due to other areas of concern they don’t seem to be given any consideration.

The suffering and sacrifice of one group is needed to protect the other.
That was a fair and reasonable ask last March and well into the first lockdown, but as more time passes and with no end in sight, that group is going to become weary and angry at what is being asked of them with little else but a bit of lip service about how ‘we’re all in this together’ as thanks and the €350 a week they’re supposed to be on their hands and knees with gratitude for.
And that’s what’s happening now, and the longer this goes on, the more the frustration and dissent will grow.

It doesn’t make them bad or selfish people, they are just looking out for themselves and their loved ones EXACTLY as the other group are. But no one wants to acknowledge that.
Calling them granny killers and sneering at their concerns and dismissing them as more inconveniences seems to be the go-to response, time and time again.

What do you want me to say? The war is waged on both sides. If you believe in lockdowns you are called are doom and gloomer thriving on misery.

Like everyone on here, I have my own opinion.

I have read countless false information on here about the health service. I get it, some people are out of work and my job is secure, but that's not my fault.

Of course some people are going to post pics of themselves on social media in masks and say they are exhausted. The vast majority of healthcare workers go to work, do their job and go home. I read on here a few weeks back that staff in hospitals arent wearing masks - right at the time when there was more anger than ever being thrown at health workers. Yes, it was false, the poster eventually admitted this was at the start of the pandemic when they were not compulsory. However, the aim was to let people think healthcare staff don't give a **** so why should we be in lockdown. So yes, that sort of talk from those against lockdown is unfair.

People should post the truth, it's all I have ever done on here. It's rarely acknowledged because this thread is largely anti lockdown and whether someone agrees with me or not is neither here nor there. I am not here to rack up mass thanks from the pro-lockdown camp or change people's mind. We can all believe what we want.

We should all strive to be fair and accepting of others, even those we don't agree with, because ranting on here is not going to end lockdown any sooner.

Lundstram

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

My empathy is with those affected, in hospital, healthcare professionals, those in ICU, those struggling and those dieing.

You're empathy appears to be on the side of those suffering what could be described, at it's most charitable, as "first world problems".

Many people currently are going about their lives normally contrary to what you say.

You seek to over dramatise restrictions to try suit a narrative.

If this is your normal life then I feel very sorry you.

FintanMcluskey

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

My empathy is with those affected, in hospital, healthcare professionals, those in ICU, those struggling and those dieing.

You're empathy appears to be on the side of those suffering what could be described, at it's most charitable, as "first world problems".

Many people currently are going about their lives normally contrary to what you say.

You seek to over dramatise restrictions to try suit a narrative.

Ironically people most at risk are those living into their 80s and those suffering obesity.

1st world problems

Kermit.de.frog

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

My empathy is with those affected, in hospital, healthcare professionals, those in ICU, those struggling and those dieing.

You're empathy appears to be on the side of those suffering what could be described, at it's most charitable, as "first world problems".

Many people currently are going about their lives normally contrary to what you say.

You seek to over dramatise restrictions to try suit a narrative.

Naturally you couldn't give a fiddlers about the half million livelihoods lost to lockdown. Zero comprehension of their daily trials, many burdened with mortgages and young families to support. You're a nasty piece of work.

PowerToWait

acequion wrote: »

So maybe you are blessed with a resilience many don't have but I think your claim that "most" are "just getting on with their lives" is wildly optimistic.

Everyone I know is getting on with it. Nobody is happy about it, but they're ALL making do and not being hysterical. A few of them have businesses and they're not in a good place, but there is a reluctant acceptance that that's sometimes the way things are. Sometimes life is ****. This is one of those times.

Maybe I'm just blessed with resilient friends who can accept reality?

Kermit.de.frog

Deleted User wrote: »

Naturally you couldn't give a fiddlers about the half million livelihoods lost to lockdown. Zero comprehension of their daily trials, many burdened with mortgages and young families to support. You're a nasty piece of work.

What happens now is that you present the data showing that 500,000 jobs have been lost.

Go on then.

Windmill100000

PowerToWait wrote: »

Everyone I know is getting on with it. Nobody is happy about it, but they're ALL making do and not being hysterical. A few of them have businesses and they're not in a good place, but there is a reluctant acceptance that that's sometimes the way things are. Sometimes life is ****. This is one of those times.

Maybe I'm just blessed with resilient friends who can accept reality?

I would agree with you entirely. This thread is not a fair representation of the strong views in the wider community. Most are getting on and doing the best in difficult circumstances, pissed off yes but not raging about it. I must have resilient friends, too.

Kermit.de.frog

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

What happens now is that you present the data showing that 500,000 jobs have been lost.

Go on then.

You'll instruct me to do nothing, take your passive aggressive codology back to your creche. You've heard of the acronym "PUP" I assume, if needs be have a google to ascertain what the "U" stands for and connect the dots from there.

Kermit.de.frog

PowerToWait wrote: »

Everyone I know is getting on with it. Nobody is happy about it, but they're ALL making do and not being hysterical.

Exactly. You'd think people were imprisoned in their homes the way some go on here.

In reality all that's changed is there are some things people can't do right now. Most things people can do unhindered.

It's frustrating and irritating, yes, but nothing much more than that.

And most people are just getting on with it.

FintanMcluskey

Windmill100000 wrote: »

I would agree with you entirely. This thread is not a fair representation of the strong views in the wider community. Most are getting on and doing the best in difficult circumstances, pissed off yes but not raging about it. I must have resilient friends, too.

No most people are afraid to be honest with a certain type of person.

It’s totally not PC to ask questions about the cost effectiveness of stay at home orders or business closures, so I would only have discussion with my more intelligent pragmatic colleagues about the matter. Usually the type that can see the wood from the trees

Kermit.de.frog

Deleted User wrote: »

You'll instruct me to do nothing, take your passive aggressive codology back to your creche. You've heard of the acronym "PUP" I assume, if needs be have a google to ascertain what the "U" stands for and connect the dots from there.

So you won't be providing the data that shows 500,000 jobs you claim have been lost to prop up your argument? Very reasonable request since you mentioned it.

OK. We can take from that what we will.

acequion

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

And most people are just getting on with it.

Believe what you want. Your posting style would indicate a refusal to consider any other point if view.

If only you were right in that statement, but unfortunately you're very wrong.

Windmill100000

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

No most people are afraid to be honest with a certain type of person.

It’s totally not PC to ask questions about the cost effectiveness of stay at home orders or business closures, so I would only have discussion with my more intelligent pragmatic colleagues about the matter. Usually the type that can see the wood from the trees

I would imagine that if more people felt as you do to the degree you do then lockdown would be challenged in more ways than swinging insults on an anti-lockdown thread on boards.ie

Most people are going along with lockdown. You can insult them all you like and take the superior moral high ground, but who is really listening to you? Because we are still in lockdown and will be for the foreseeable

SusieBlue

Windmill100000 wrote: »

What do you want me to say? The war is waged on both sides. If you believe in lockdowns you are called are doom and gloomer thriving on misery.

Like everyone on here, I have my own opinion.

I have read countless false information on here about the health service. I get it, some people are out of work and my job is secure, but that's not my fault.

Of course some people are going to post pics of themselves on social media in masks and say they are exhausted. The vast majority of healthcare workers go to work, do their job and go home. I read on here a few weeks back that staff in hospitals arent wearing masks - right at the time when there was more anger than ever being thrown at health workers. Yes, it was false, the poster eventually admitted this was at the start of the pandemic when they were not compulsory. However, the aim was to let people think healthcare staff don't give a **** so why should we be in lockdown. So yes, that sort of talk from those against lockdown is unfair.

People should post the truth, it's all I have ever done on here. It's rarely acknowledged because this thread is largely anti lockdown and whether someone agrees with me or not is neither here nor there. I am not here to rack up mass thanks from the pro-lockdown camp or change people's mind. We can all believe what we want.

We should all strive to be fair and accepting of others, even those we don't agree with, because ranting on here is not going to end lockdown any sooner.

Yes, I agree, but the difference is we have completely prioritised one group since March to the total detriment of the other, so it isn’t really fair to say the war is waged on both sides. It isn’t really a fair fight, for lack of better word, when it’s actively negatively impacting one group for the benefit of the other.
One side is being looked after, and the other side is making monumental personal sacrifices to facilitate that.

You said people should be honest about what they’re saying and the motives behind it, and if they aren’t, to expect to be called out on this.
I completely agree with this but unfortunately it only seems to apply to one side of the argument.
I have always been very honest and said that I am not in favour of heavy lockdowns & restrictions because it’s had an extremely negative effect on me and my family, none of whom are high risk to this illness.

But instead we have those in favour of lockdowns pretending that ‘we’re all in this together’ when in reality, they’re directly benefiting from these lockdowns in some way in other too.
Whether that be due to genuine fear, concern for themselves or a loved one with an underlying condition, or because they’re financially benefitting from working from home or whatever.
They are looking out for themselves JUST as much as the anti lockdowners are, and they need their sacrifices to continue to facilitate this.
But they will never, ever admit that. I’d have more respect for them if they did.
So we have come to a scenario where being anti lockdown is seen as socially unacceptable, reckless and selfish, and a pro lockdowner is seen as a self sacrificing kind hearted hero for the elderly and vulnerable.

Both sides are being selfish for different reasons but only one side is telling the truth about it, and that’s what I take issue with.

FintanMcluskey

Windmill100000 wrote: »

I would imagine that if more people felt as you do to the degree you do then lockdown would be challenged in more ways than swinging insults on an anti-lockdown thread on boards.ie

Most people are going along with lockdown. You can insult them all you like and take the superior moral high ground, but who is really listening to you? Because we are still in lockdown and will be for the foreseeable

If most people are going along with lockdown, and Ireland has had the most prolonged lockdown in the world, yet the case numbers were highest in the world recently, wouldn’t that mean lockdown doesn’t actually work?

Windmill100000

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Most people are going along with lockdown.

Nothing about wanting to make sure that lockdowns are the best course of action suggests a refusal to go along with restrictions. There is harm either way, but I only see that being acknowledged from one "side". Wanting to find the balance of that harm and have the powers that be set policy accordingly is not some demonically evil wish to see people choke to death on Covid in the street, and talk like it is helps nobody.

Some people going as far as to say these times are massively impactful and society-changing out one side of their mouths while spouting nonsense about first-world problems out the other.

Windmill100000 wrote: »

You can insult them all you like and take the superior moral high ground

Rich, given this entire thread.

Kermit.de.frog

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

So you won't be providing the data that shows 500,000 jobs you claim have been lost to prop up your argument? Very reasonable request since you mentioned it.

OK. We can take from that what we will.

"We" inferring "me, myself and I". I'm not participating in your petty game further, ask a stupid question to which you already know the answer and you will receive short thrift. That's the way these things work, you can come to terms with it like an emotionally mature adult or continue your sulk.

Windmill100000

SusieBlue wrote: »

Yes, I agree, but the difference is we have completely prioritised one group since March to the total detriment of the other, so it isn’t really fair to say the war is waged on both sides. It isn’t really a fair fight, for lack of better word, when it’s actively negatively impacting one group for the benefit of the other.
One side is being looked after, and the other side is making monumental personal sacrifices to facilitate that.

You said people should be honest about what they’re saying and the motives behind it, and if they aren’t, to expect to be called out on this.
I completely agree with this but unfortunately it only seems to apply to one side of the argument.
I have always been very honest and said that I am not in favour of heavy lockdowns & restrictions because it’s had an extremely negative effect on me and my family, none of whom are high risk to this illness.

But instead we have those in favour of lockdowns pretending that ‘we’re all in this together’ when in reality, they’re directly benefiting from these lockdowns in some way in other too.
Whether that be due to genuine fear, concern for themselves or a loved one with an underlying condition, or because they’re financially benefitting from working from home or whatever.
They are looking out for themselves JUST as much as the anti lockdowners are, and they need their sacrifices to continue to facilitate this.
But they will never, ever admit that. I’d have more respect for them if they did.
So we have come to a scenario where being anti lockdown is seen as socially unacceptable, reckless and selfish, and a pro lockdowner is seen as a self sacrificing kind hearted hero for the elderly and vulnerable.

Both sides are being selfish for different reasons but only one side is telling the truth about it, and that’s what I take issue with.

Who is 'everyone, saying we are all in this together. I've not said it and I think of course some people are benefiting more from lockdown than others. I think that's the case with most things in life though. If we are talking about your average Joe, no they are not benefiting at all and yet most seem to be adhering to the rules and holding out for better days ahead.

I disagree about only one side telling the truth, but take on board and respect your point.

I don't consider those sticking to rules heroes. They are doing what they feel is right. At this stage we are all aware of the costs of lockdown so we are all making informed choices on how we feel about it.

Kunta Kinte

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

Key word in your sentence there is might.

He had no proper walking gear while heading up a snow covered mountain in very cold temperatures. If he had fallen and suffered a broken leg or worse what do you think the likely outcome would have been? Anyway the point is that he was quite rightly fined for being outside the 5km limit without a valid reason so well done to the Gardai for enforcing the rules.

Kermit.de.frog

acequion wrote: »

Believe what you want. Your posting style would indicate a refusal to consider any other point if view.

If only you were right in that statement, but unfortunately you're very wrong.

Well, if I'm wrong then your argument is most people are not getting on with it (I have no problem accepting a small minority might find things difficult).

That's just not true from my experience. Maybe you're experience is different.

SnuggyBear

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

some things people can't do right now.

:pac:

Kunta Kinte

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

No most people are afraid to be honest with a certain type of person.

It’s totally not PC to ask questions about the cost effectiveness of stay at home orders or business closures, so I would only have discussion with my more intelligent pragmatic colleagues about the matter. Usually the type that can see the wood from the trees

Would these "more intelligent pragmatic colleagues" of yours also agree with your hyperbolic statement last night that we are experiencing "implementation of measures never seen before since the dawn of time"?

Windmill100000

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

If most people are going along with lockdown, and Ireland has had the most prolonged lockdown in the world, yet the case numbers were highest in the world recently, wouldn’t that mean lockdown doesn’t actually work?

They are going along with current level 5 restrictions and numbers are thankfully dropping.

I have noticed more people are wearing masks outside than in previous lockdowns. Anyone else noticed this?

SusieBlue

Windmill100000 wrote: »

Who is 'everyone, saying we are all in this together. I've not said it and I think of course some people are benefiting more from lockdown than others. I think that's the case with most things in life though. If we are talking about your average Joe, no they are not benefiting at all and yet most seem to be adhering to the rules and holding out for better days ahead.

I disagree about only one side telling the truth, but take on board and respect your point.

I don't consider those sticking to rules heroes. They are doing what they feel is right. At this stage we are all aware of the costs of lockdown so we are all making informed choices on how we feel about it.

The problem is, it’s seen as perfectly acceptable for them to do what they feel is right, but when say I, a person in their 20’s who is not high risk to the illness does what I feel is right, I’m a granny killer/only care about pints/should be arrested, prosecuted and imprisoned. (All of these things have been said to me on this thread)

One informed choice is seen as doing the right thing, the other, not so much. Even though it might be the right thing for the person in question.
We’re a year into this and people can only take so much. If there wasn’t so much sanctimonious finger wagging from people posting from the comfort of their secure jobs and full salaries, there might not be so much frustration from people who have lost and sacrificed the most.
And that’s not directed at you btw, but other people who frequent this thread.

Windmill100000

Windmill100000 wrote: »

I have noticed more people are wearing masks outside than in previous lockdowns. Anyone else noticed this?

Nobody wearing masks outside here. Kids playing daily on the green. Cases very low here for months.

Kermit.de.frog

Deleted User wrote: »

"We" inferring "me, myself and I". I'm not participating in your petty game further, ask a stupid question to which you already know the answer and you will receive short thrift. That's the way these things work, you can come to terms with it like an emotionally mature adult or continue your sulk.

I've asked you to provide at least a link to a news source or preferably the CSO to prove that there have been 500,000 job losses.

What's unreasonable about that?

You made the claim.

acequion

It is actually jaw dropping that you really think that only "a small minority" is affected by the biggest and most widespread closure of all aspects of social and economic life that [hopefully]we will ever experience in our lifetimes.