2021 Irish Property Market chat - *mod warnings post 1*

Hubertj

Villa05 wrote: »

Interesting the the initial budget for this was 75m and he was trying to get the banks to match this. Freedom of information showed that the minister wanted to allocate far more to this scheme
4, 000 units is 2/3 of the current Ftb market. It shows how the state needs to subsidise citizens to the tune of up to 40% of the price of the house so that they can compete with entities that pay little or no tax.
If they paid the same amount of tax as the first time buyers it might level the playing field somewhat

What’s wrong with Navan? Part from the accents.

awec

dor843088 wrote: »

The future will be WFH. The government can make huge inroads to curing a lot of problems with the stroke of a pen . Traffic congestion, emissions targets, stretched services and an overcrowded capital can be greatly reduced through legislation towards WFH. There is more legislation coming down the tracks leaning towards WFH rights for workers. Even the CEO of Dublin bus who would be having close contact with government officials has stated this is how it will be and he only expects buses to be half full in the future due largely to WFH. WFH is a huge win win for everybody especially the government there is no way they wont push for it.

Got a link for this?

PropQueries

dor843088 wrote: »

The future will be WFH. The government can make huge inroads to curing a lot of problems with the stroke of a pen . Traffic congestion, emissions targets, stretched services and an overcrowded capital can be greatly reduced through legislation towards WFH. There is more legislation coming down the tracks leaning towards WFH rights for workers. Even the CEO of Dublin bus who would be having close contact with government officials has stated this is how it will be and he only expects buses to be half full in the future due largely to WFH. WFH is a huge win win for everybody especially the government there is no way they wont push for it.

That's definitely true and I think the state has already stated they're looking at c. 20% WFH from their own staff in the near future. Interesting point on Dublin Bus's future projections as well.

But I would disagree that the capital is overcrowded. Copenhagen has 600,000 people living in the same footprint as Dublin City has 100,000 people living between the canals.

dor843088

awec wrote: »

Got a link for this?

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/business-podcast/inside-business-with-ciaran-hancock-dublin-bus-ceo-ray-coyne-on-the-future-of-transport-in-the-city-1.4500064?mode=amp

awec

dor843088 wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/business-podcast/inside-business-with-ciaran-hancock-dublin-bus-ceo-ray-coyne-on-the-future-of-transport-in-the-city-1.4500064?mode=amp

Cheers will take a listen to that later.

dor843088

PropQueries wrote: »

That's definitely true and I think the state has already stated they're looking at c. 20% WFH from their own staff in the near future. Interesting point on Dublin Bus's future projections as well.

But I would disagree that the capital is overcrowded. Copenhagen has 600,000 people living in the same footprint as Dublin City has 100,000 people living between the canals.

Dublin is not built or planned for dense population and does not use its footprint efficiently. That's the whole point. Redesign the city or simply encourage people to move out through legislation. It's an obvious choice let alone the other problems it will cure.

Hubertj

dor843088 wrote: »

Dublin is not built or planned for dense population and does not use its footprint efficiently. That's the whole point. Redesign the city or simply encourage people to move out through legislation. It's an obvious choice let alone the other problems it will cure.

I would agree with that. Public transport is an embarrassment, provision of services is an embarrassment, councils politicised. Public servants have lost sight of the meaning of their roles - serve the public

PropQueries

dor843088 wrote: »

Dublin is not built or planned for dense population and does not use its footprint efficiently. That's the whole point. Redesign the city or simply encourage people to move out through legislation. It's an obvious choice let alone the other problems it will cure.

Or to use a variation of a vacant property tax, maybe an under-utilized property tax on properties in high demand areas.

This really wouldn't impact Irish people as much as it would the international funds who most likely own many of these types of properties in our cities at this stage IMO

And, as David McWilliams said, if they're rich enough to under-utilise a million euro property in a city location, they're rich enough to pay such a tax IMO

Villa05

Hubertj wrote:

What’s wrong with Navan? Part from the accents.

Nothing,
The issue is the commute and its cost to the commuter, the environment and to the state in helping the country break its co2 emmisions target helping to achieve that 500million annual fine.

JimmyVik

Villa05 wrote: »

Nothing,
The issue is the commute and its cost to the commuter, the environment and to the state in helping the country break its co2 emmisions target helping to achieve that 500million annual fine.

Sure they say in their sales blurb you are 45 minutes from Dublin.
I had to laugh at that.



It reminded me of the time they used to say Dunshaughlin was 20 mins from Dublin city center.

Hubertj

Villa05 wrote: »

Nothing,
The issue is the commute and its cost to the commuter, the environment and to the state in helping the country break its co2 emmisions target helping to achieve that 500million annual fine.

Yep, if only the relevant stakeholders engaged constructively to provide adequate public transport

yagan

JimmyVik wrote: »

It reminded me of the time they used to say Dunshaughlin was 20 mins from Dublin city center.

"ATHLONE, THE GATEWAY TO DUBLIN! BUY NOW!"

JimmyVik

JimmyVik wrote: »

Sure they say in their sales blurb you are 45 minutes from Dublin.
I had to laugh at that.



It reminded me of the time they used to say Dunshaughlin was 20 mins from Dublin city center.

Maybe not o connell St but it is 20 mins from Dublin, tbf

PropQueries

Hubertj wrote: »

Yep, if only the relevant stakeholders engaged constructively to provide adequate public transport

But isn't regular public transport just a hidden subsidy to landowners outside the main urban centres? By spending billions on rail, bus, motorways etc., it just makes land with planning permission in places like e.g. Navan worth more than it would otherwise be as very few people (who work in Dublin) would consider living there otherwise.

There was an analysis I read a while ago about if the costs of the rail, motorways etc. were factored into the selling price, the cost of delivering homes in places like e.g. Navan would actually cost more than the cost of delivering a similar house in e.g. South Dublin.

Like the shared equity scheme, motorways, rail etc. are just another taxpayer back-door handout to landowners in the commuter counties IMO

awec

PropQueries wrote: »

But isn't regular public transport just a hidden subsidy to landowners outside the main urban centres? By spending billions on rail, bus, motorways etc., it just makes land with planning permission in places like e.g. Navan worth more than it would otherwise be as very few people (who work in Dublin) would consider living there otherwise.

There was an analysis I read a while ago about if the costs of the rail, motorways etc. were factored into the selling price, the cost of delivering homes in places like e.g. Navan would actually cost more than the cost of delivering a similar house in e.g. South Dublin.

Like the shared equity scheme, motorways, rail etc. are just another taxpayer back-door handout to landowners in the commuter counties IMO

You've officially jumped the shark. We're now on to how good public transport is actually bad.

Up next, how provisioning of essential services like running water or electricity are just back door handouts for landowners.

PropQueries

awec wrote: »

You've officially jumped the shark. We're now on to how good public transport is actually bad.

It is if it results in houses being built in the wrong locations IMO

fliball123

PropQueries wrote: »

But isn't regular public transport just a hidden subsidy to landowners outside the main urban centres? By spending billions on rail, bus, motorways etc., it just makes land with planning permission in places like e.g. Navan worth more than it would otherwise be as very few people (who work in Dublin) would consider living there otherwise.

There was an analysis I read a while ago about if the costs of the rail, motorways etc. were factored into the selling price, the cost of delivering homes in places like e.g. Navan would actually cost more than the cost of delivering a similar house in e.g. South Dublin.

Like the shared equity scheme, motorways, rail etc. are just another taxpayer back-door handout to landowners in the commuter counties IMO

Come on your stretching now for god sake we need public transport , the builders didnt all get together and say lets get them to build more roads and put more buses and trains on to make land more valuable.

Sure be careful as there are reports with the continued lockdown that builders and other trades people are leaving Ireland for England. The british are trying to start a building drive and poaching Irish talent

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/british-recruitment-drive-for-builders-sparks-fear-of-exodus-1.4508053

https://www.newstalk.com/news/its-like-the-recession-ireland-facing-construction-skills-shortage-as-workers-flee-covid-closure-1164215

https://www.independent.ie/business/irish/lockdown-endangers-vital-sector-as-builders-flee-to-uk-40186968.html

We are already behind with new builds. If people like you want to keep villainising them for trying to make a living then I dont blame them going. No one has to buy a house no one puts a gun to their head and says buy now. it should not be left to the private sector to build for people on the margins that is the public sectors remit. Please stop with your over the top attacks on builders. You have made some good points with price gouging but you ruin your reputation with regards to honesty and credability when you post utter sh1t like this.

Cant believe you have me defending builders but your on a different planet with your opinion props

awec

PropQueries wrote: »

It is if it results in houses being built in the wrong locations IMO

What is the "wrong locations"?

If Ireland had a proper public transport system with regular services and wide coverage everyone would be better off for it.

cnocbui

awec wrote: »

What is the "wrong locations"?

If Ireland had a proper public transport system with regular services and wide coverage everyone would be better off for it.

Not if they had to pay for it.

timmyntc

PropQueries wrote: »

It is if it results in houses being built in the wrong locations IMO

If there is public transport to efficiently bring people to where they need to go then I wouldn't say it's the "wrong" place at all.

Obviously the best approach is to build densely - that way the travel distance for people is as low as it can get.
But after that public transport is the answer. Of course it will push up land prices, but so does having shops nearby, or a garda station. You'd hardly call these developer subsidies?

PropQueries

awec wrote: »

What is the "wrong locations"?

If Ireland had a proper public transport system with regular services and wide coverage everyone would be better off for it.

Well, if Copenhagen has 600,000 people living in the same footprint as Dublin has 100,000 people living in between the canals, there would be no reason to build in places like Navan for commuters working in Dublin.

If we utilised the city centre properties in the same way that Copenhagen does, the majority of young people sharing three-bed semis in Dublin would move into the city, which is where they obviously want to be and families could then move into their three-bed semis, without having to commute from e.g. Navan.

Problem solved. But, that's too easy a solution in Ireland

fliball123

PropQueries wrote: »

Well, if Copenhagen has 600,000 people living in the same footprint as Dublin has 100,000 people living in between the canals, there would be no reason to build in places like Navan for commuters working in Dublin.

If we utilised the city centre properties in the same way that Copenhagen does, the majority of young people sharing three-bed semis in Dublin would move into the city, which is where they obviously want to be and families could then move into their three-bed semis, without having to commute from e.g. Navan.

Problem solved. But, that's too easy a solution in Ireland

How much and how long do you think it will take to do what you suggest? It would not be easy to do or cheap.

PropQueries

fliball123 wrote: »

How much and how long do you think it will take to do what you suggest?

A lot lot lot lot quicker and cheaper than applying for planning permission and building houses from scratch in places like Navan IMO

cnocbui

PropQueries wrote: »

Well, if Copenhagen has 600,000 people living in the same footprint as Dublin has 100,000 people living in between the canals, there would be no reason to build in places like Navan for commuters working in Dublin.

If we utilised the city centre properties in the same way that Copenhagen does, the majority of young people sharing three-bed semis in Dublin would move into the city, which is where they obviously want to be and families could then move into their three-bed semis, without having to commute from e.g. Navan.

Problem solved. But, that's too easy a solution in Ireland

Just nationalise all the buildings in Dublin, do a 100% government haircut of every bank account in the country and use that money to make all those buildings props compliant. But that's too easy a solution, right, comrade?

A couple of easy moves and you have a socialist workers paradise.

fliball123

PropQueries wrote: »

A lot lot lot lot quicker and cheaper than applying for planning permission and building houses from scratch in places like Navan IMO

Really so you think having to knockdown current buildings and then building from scratch is quicker and cheaper than building else where? Your living in a fairytale and they all lived happily ever after

PropQueries

cnocbui wrote: »

Just nationalise all the buildings in Dublin, do a 100% government haircut of every bank account in the country and use that money to make all those buildings props compliant. But that's too easy a solution, right, comrade?

A couple of easy moves and you have a socialist workers paradise.

No need to nationalise. Just implement a similar derelict property tax like the socialist paradise that is Washington D.C. has of 10%. That would be incentive enough to bring many of them back into use IMO

A similar tax for under-utilised commercial properties in our towns and cities and the market will take care of the rest IMO

hometruths

You know all is well in the property market when it only takes 850,000 of your hard earned/borrowed euros to buy a detached house with large garden in prime SCD:

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/detached-house-24-dundela-avenue-sandycove-co-dublin/2953175

cnocbui

PropQueries wrote: »

No need to nationalise. Just implement a similar derelict property tax like the socialist paradise that is Washington D.C. has of 10%. That would be incentive enough to bring many of them back into use IMO

A similar tax for under-utilised commercial properties in our towns and cities and the market will take care of the rest IMO

Give us an example of the success of implementing such a moronic scheme.

JimmyVik

Why is the answer to everything in Ireland to tax them?
I pay enough tax. Fcuk off with your suggestions of more tax.

fliball123

schmittel wrote: »

You know all is well in the property market when it only takes 850,000 of your hard earned/borrowed euros to buy a detached house with large garden in prime SCD:

https://www.daft.ie/for-sale/detached-house-24-dundela-avenue-sandycove-co-dublin/2953175

Is anyone forcing you to buy this. Sandycove would be a very desirable location

There you go there are a few detached houses in Dublin for you all under 250k

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/23a-st-catherines-drive-rush-co-dublin/4485962

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/28a-virginia-park-finglas-dublin-11/4333193

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/91-brookford-rush-co-dublin/4483402

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/91-brookford-rush-co-dublin/4483402

and ifs southside theres one for under 300k

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/13-killakee-court-firhouse-dublin-24/4353005