Partner moving into my house

YellowLead

Doesn’t matter if you buy furniture etc if he is contributing towards your mortgage and living with you for 5 years he is entitled to claim an amount of which a court will decide based on his contribution.

What you could do either is just don’t take any payments from him? Then, he would be very unlikely to be awarded anything at all in the event of seeking any equity post split.

If you are expecting him to help pay your mortgage then it’s odd you wouldn’t feel you needed to pay him back in the event of a split in my opinion.

accensi0n

YellowLead wrote: »

If you are expecting him to help pay your mortgage then it’s odd you wouldn’t feel you needed to pay him back in the event of a split in my opinion.

Not really.

Let's say average cost of rent for a room in a similar property is €600.
They agree that he pays €400 euro and she covers all repair/improvement costs.

In that scenario I would find it way more odd for the other person to be pushing for money in the event of a split.
Looking for money back even though the arrangement was done in such a way that it allowed him to save more than he would have been able to if he was renting on his own or even in a house share.

Mrs OBumble

InterestedK wrote: »

Can a prenuptial agreement be put in place if we are not married etc? I always thought they were just for couples who were about to get married.

Prenuptial agreements have no legal status in Ireland. No matter what your marital status is.

runawaybishop

accensi0n wrote: »

Not really.

Let's say average cost of rent for a room in a similar property is €600.
They agree that he pays €400 euro and she covers all repair/improvement costs.

In that scenario I would find it way more odd for the other person to be pushing for money in the event of a split.
Looking for money back even though the arrangement was done in such a way that it allowed him to save more than he would have been able to if he was renting on his own or even in a house share.

That's not how it works. If he's paying towards the mortgage, he is entitled to partial ownership. Doesn't matter what rent is, he could have decided not to rent or to get his own mortgage.

ToddDameron

Personally would never put myself in a position where my partner would want me to have nothing if things went wrong. I would always be uneasy knowing that I was paying rent into a black hole, and it would never feel like home.

YellowLead

accensi0n wrote: »

Not really.

Let's say average cost of rent for a room in a similar property is €600.
They agree that he pays €400 euro and she covers all repair/improvement costs.

In that scenario I would find it way more odd for the other person to be pushing for money in the event of a split.
Looking for money back even though the arrangement was done in such a way that it allowed him to save more than he would have been able to if he was renting on his own or even in a house share.

Why not let him live there rent free and he just pays for half of the bills/food. Why look for mortgage payments out of him and then expect him to walk away with nothing in the event of a split many years down the line?
If he’s been paying half the mortgage (it might be less she’s asking for but it could be half) for 10 years (let’s say the split happens then) why should he be left with nothing? He could have been living with parents and saving or paying his own mortgage. It’s not like he could claim half the house itself OP remains the legal owner, just a portion of equity he’s entitled to.

Irishphotodesk

InterestedK wrote: »

Hi all,

I'm looking for some advice.

I'm thinking about asking my partner to move into the house that I own (took out a mortgage last year), but I want to make sure that I do it in the right way, so that should something happen between us, that he is not entitled to any piece of the property and contents etc.

I have heard that the best way to do this is to simply set up a rent book and keep track each month of the rent that he will pay me, plus bills, so technically he is a lodger, but I just want to be sure that I am not missing something here.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks!

Firstly, look at your relationship, you say you are ready for the next level ? Is he ?
Moving in together has its complications, especially if you own the property and he will have to bring all his stuff and find space -in your home, to store everything.

This exact situation happened to me, I was delighted to move in with my girlfriend (despite her house being 2 counties away from work, instead of a 10minute commute, I now had an hour or hour and a half commute in each direction).

I was very conscious and still am...that this is her house - it's our home, but she got the deposit and mortgage (thankfully a tracker) , I'm here over 10yrs now, we are married and have kids and I still know this is her house.

At the start I was paying rent/bills but after we got engaged, and married money was just put into a general bills/mortgage account, I encouraged her to take redundancy around 2011 (she was being bullied) , so I have been paying for everything since around then.

So, I guess what I'm saying is .... If he is ready for the next step - to move in, then you will need to be willing to accept changes in your home, at the end of the day it is your home.
As regards the financial situation, no harm in asking him to pay rent and put it aside into a different account and just hold it..... You could always review the living situation after a few months/year (as has been mentioned, he doesn't have any entitlement until 3yrs if kids are involved or 5yrs if no kids)

Congrats on being ready to live together... It's a big step in a relationship.

Elessar

Dial Hard wrote: »

It doesn't really matter what you do, he'll be entitled to look for an interest in the property after 5 years regardless, 3 if you end up having children. It's not an automatic entitlement and he doesn't "get" 50% or any particular share, despite what the doom-mongers here will tell you, but if you broke up after either of those time periods, he can apply for a share in the house.

What that is will depend on what you both brought to the table initially, what he contributed to the house while he was living in it, both of your financial situations at the time of the break-up and, finally, the judge in question on the day.

Yes this is mostly true but under the 'Rights of Cohabiting Couples' in Ireland, if a cohabiting relationship breaks down, a person must prove that they are a qualified cohabitant and were financially dependent on their partner. What exactly 'financially dependent' means I don't know, but if they were working full time and had a steady wage I would think they wouldn't qualify, even after 5 years.

But even then it's not entirely clear as some sources are saying if they financially assist with say mortgage payments, they may have some ownership rights to your house.

https://www.lawonline.ie/law-guides/personal/living-together

EDIT: If they were 'financially dependent' they could take you to the cleaners - they can claim maintenance payments, pension order adjustments and property adjustments :eek: That could lead to a bizarre situation where you could be paying maintenance/pension payments for your ex girlfriend/boyfriend from years ago that you never even married!

Dial Hard

Elessar wrote: »

Yes this is mostly true but under the 'Rights of Cohabiting Couples' in Ireland, if a cohabiting relationship breaks down, a person must prove that they are a qualified cohabitant and were financially dependent on their partner. What exactly 'financially dependent' means I don't know, but if they were working full time and had a steady wage I would think they wouldn't qualify, even after 5 years.

But even then it's not entirely clear as some sources are saying if they financially assist with say mortgage payments, they may have some ownership rights to your house.

https://www.lawonline.ie/law-guides/personal/living-together

EDIT: If they were 'financially dependent' they could take you to the cleaners - they can claim maintenance payments, pension order adjustments and property adjustments :eek: That could lead to a bizarre situation where you could be paying maintenance/pension payments for your ex girlfriend/boyfriend from years ago that you never even married!

The financially dependent qualification only applies to redress orders. There's no such requirement in place for shared property. If you contributed financially, you're entitled to look for a share after 3/5 years*. Doesn't matter what your financial situation is.

* In the event of a break-up, obvs.

Piollaire

This is not a partnership - he will have to pay you so that you let him live in your house. He will never have anything to show for all the cash he has handed over. This is a landlord tenant-relationship where he will be subservient to you. You will be able to evict this guy from his home (your house) at your whim. Tell him to stay in his own place to retain his dignity, his freedom and his mental health.

ebayissues

Does anyone actually have concrete examples of cases as to what was awarded to the otherparty who didn't have the home?


I still find it a mind boggling. How can the party who doesn't have a home want a share if they split up after a couple of years? On what grounds. What if they rented for 4years and they split up why isn't rent demanded from the other pary or the LL?



Moving from rented accomodation to sharing with a partner that owns a home should be cheaper. Now if the partner that didn't own the home did some much like bought loads of furniture, did loads of DIY that improved it, then I'll understand it. There is also the pychological/emotional aspect aswell. Thinkk of moving into a house that required loads of renovation. Party that spent less financially might exert more mentally, emotionally.


It also depends where you are in the relationship. Like if its 10 years like a poster mentioned and one has been contributing to the mortgage payments, should both names be on the title of the house? Argueably - one might say you are forgetting the deposit which the lone party might have to forgo


Also one should keep in mind that in some cases both individuals might say this house doesn't work, so trading up might be required.



I certainly do not feel one paying the rent on the other persons mortgage should make one worse off. Unless like, they massively paid majority of payments or they spent more on the home than the other individual.



To each party, make note of spendings but don't be scabby about it that one is fghting for the last euro. Spendings all add up.



I still feel both parties shoud protect themselves.



Just my 2c. Interesting tho

Get Real

random_banter wrote: »

The advice here is sound. Perhaps set up a tenancy agreement (as if your partner is renting a room) and keep track of the monthly rent. You should protect yourself.
.

Could just be me, but I'd view the exact opposite. Regardless of how you word it, it's two people in a relationship living in a house.

In fact, this "rent" could come back to bite before a court(god forbid anything bad happened) as it could be argued the bf was contributing to the mortgage and therefore entitled to a part of the house value.

People may think they are getting around it by entering a tenancy agreement. But it can also be painted, and viewed by a judge, as a cohabiting couple, in a relationship, for x amount of years, with both parties contributing to the mortgage.

These scenarios are nothing new, men and women have been cohabiting, without marriage in one partners owned house for decades now. I think the only new element to this is that it is now more common for the woman to be the owner of the house.

These types of questions are emerging more often. Yet, at the end of the day, regardless of gender or sexual orientation, a risk has to be taken on these things. Any relationship has the potential to break down and the ex to "make a move" for their "share". But the majority don't. For those that do, it's down to how it's painted, and the judge on the day.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/birth_family_relationships/cohabiting_couples/rights_of_unmarried_couples.html

Cohabiting has specific definitions in the 2010 act. If you're living together, and in a committed relationship, you're cohabiting.

Just because you write "rent book" on a piece of paper and record "rent" doesn't mean you're somehow watering down that law. Same as writing "prenup" on the top of a bit of paper and getting married, and both signing it. It doesn't make it so.

And just to repeat, rent, could be seen as direct payments, in the form of contribution to the mortgage, therefore giving a proportional right of ownership in the house. You can't say "but we called it rent" in the event a judge sees it a different way.

Claw Hammer

Dial Hard wrote: »

It doesn't really matter what you do, he'll be entitled to look for an interest in the property after 5 years regardless, 3 if you end up having children.

There has to be a relationship of dependency before the 5 years kicks in.

YellowLead

Claw Hammer wrote: »

There has to be a relationship of dependency before the 5 years kicks in.

No there does not. If one person in the cohabitation has contributed towards the others mortgage payments in the home they share (even indirectly) they have a right to claim after 5 years. (And yes I am speaking from personal experience here)

Claw Hammer

YellowLead wrote: »

No there does not. If one person in the cohabitation has contributed towards the others mortgage payments in the home they share (even indirectly) they have a right to claim after 5 years. (And yes I am speaking from personal experience here)

A perrson can claim what the like but the payment of mortgage payments is a claim for a share in the equity poroportionate to the amount of the principal paid off the loan by that person. The 5 years has nothing to do with it.
The 5 years arises when there is a relationship of dependency and there is a quasi judicial separation process under the co-habitation laws.

YellowLead

Claw Hammer wrote: »

A perrson can claim what the like but the payment of mortgage payments is a claim for a share in the equity poroportionate to the amount of the principal paid off the loan by that person. The 5 years has nothing to do with it.
The 5 years arises when there is a relationship of dependency and there is a quasi judicial separation process under the co-habitation laws.

Sorry, I misunderstood what you were saying. I thought you meant that dependency had to be in place in order for a claim to be made after 5 years. Apologies

cubatahavana

My 2 cents:

I bought an apartment with a previous partner, split up after 2-3 years. Apartment was on negative equity at the time, so I agreed with my ex that I will keep the apartment instead of having to sell it and owe money both of us to the bank. I accepted the negative equity. Fast forward a couple of years and met my now wife, that moved into my apartment. We had been living together there until mid 2020, when we sold the apartment and bought a new house.

If something would've happened, I would've expected that the apartment was part hers (my current wife), as she was helping me towards the mortgage. When we sold the property, I used the proceeds as if they were 50% mine and 50% hers, placing all of it towards purchasing the new house. We had been living there for the last 10 years.

Maybe I was naive, but i believe that if someone (that you have a relationship with) is helping you towards the mortgage, they should be entitled to a part of the property after a few years.

Edgware

dobman88 wrote: »

Jesus.

If you're with someone who would try and claim part of the house and take you through the courts, you need to rethink your relationship.

God forbid if me and my missus ever break up, I wouldn't dream of trying to do something like that.

The rock that many a ship sank on. Once a relationship is over all bets are off.

Stihl waters

dobman88 wrote: »

Jesus.

If you're with someone who would try and claim part of the house and take you through the courts, you need to rethink your relationship.

God forbid if me and my missus ever break up, I wouldn't dream of trying to do something like that.

God bless your innocence

dev_ire

What part should they get?
Didn't save deposit, didn't go to viewings, deal with bank/s, surveys, renovations, maintenance, insurances, paying cheaper rent for a better place (unless you bought a bad property or at a bad time).
Not saying it is not the law it is just mad the want some people have if they every chased someone up on this.

runawaybishop

dev_ire wrote: »

What part should they get?
Didn't save deposit, didn't go to viewings, deal with bank/s, surveys, renovations, maintenance, insurances, paying cheaper rent for a better place (unless you bought a bad property or at a bad time).
Not saying it is not the law it is just mad the want some people have if they every chased someone up on this.

You'd naive if you think every breakup is amicable (not saying you are saying this), so it's wise to consider what could happen. If a partner contributes to the mortgage then a court will assess how much they are entitled to. Typically not much heed is paid to time spent as it's not easily calculable, whereas direct financial contributions are.

dev_ire

runawaybishop wrote: »

You'd naive if you think every breakup is amicable (not saying you are saying this), so it's wise to consider what could happen. If a partner contributes to the mortgage then a court will assess how much they are entitled to. Typically not much heed is paid to time spent as it's not easily calculable, whereas direct financial contributions are.

Yeah I am just saying it is ****ty to claim this unless you are truly dependent or are overpaying your share of the payments.

runawaybishop

dev_ire wrote: »

Yeah I am just saying it is ****ty to claim this unless you are truly dependent or are overpaying your share of the payments.

Maybe I am misunderstanding you but I don't agree. If someone is contributing X to a mortgage in a partnership then if that partnership ends then they shouldn't be left with nothing. The courts will decide what that X is worth.

ebayissues

So let's say in a 3 year period, both party pay 8.5k. If a split happens, how much should the other party be get?

Tbh, this is utter ****ing BS.

runawaybishop

ebayissues wrote: »

So let's say in a 3 year period, both party pay 8.5k. If a split happens, how much should the other party be get?

Tbh, this is utter ****ing BS.

Whatever % 8.5k is overall, minus deposit. Just guessing though. Usually there is a period specified for that to be paid back. That doesn't seem unfair to me?

Detritus70

InterestedK wrote: »

Wow, I did not think I would get this amount of replies, but thank you all!

I'm still quite unclear as to how to proceed, as there seems to be different ways to approach this.

The best way to protect yourself 99% is to put up your partner in a separate apartment with a separate entrance, get a proof of employment, bank statements, police background check, check the insolvency database, have them sign a lease, get 6 months deposit and break up with them.
For 100% protection, have them live somewhere else and renting of someone else.
Once you're in a relationship, there are no guarantees of anything.

runawaybishop

Detritus70 wrote: »

The best way to protect yourself 99% is to put up your partner in a separate apartment with a separate entrance, get a proof of employment, bank statements, check the insolvency database, have them sign a lease and break up with them.
For 100% protection, have them live somewhere else.
Once you're in a relationship, there are no guarantees of anything.

Actually joking aside, that brings up a good solution. Op, move then in sure, but don't ask for rent/mortgage or anything like that. They can contribute to bills ofc. Have a chat to them and maybe consider your partner puts the money saved aside with an eye one day to becoming a partner in the financial relationship. This has risks of course, they can walk away after having paid nothing, put that to me sounds preferable to them walking away with a chunk of your house. Tbh there is no easy way around this. If everything works out then all this advice is useless. If, however, something does happen then forewarned is forearmed.

elperello

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/why-living-together-could-cost-you-tens-of-thousands-of-euro-1.4430713?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Flife-and-style%2Fhomes-and-property%2Fwhy-living-together-could-cost-you-tens-of-thousands-of-euro-1.4430713

This Irish Times article covers a lot of the issues.

It's behind a paywall but may be a good investment of €1.

ebayissues

runawaybishop wrote: »

Whatever % 8.5k is overall, minus deposit. Just guessing though. Usually there is a period specified for that to be paid back. That doesn't seem unfair to me?

They should be entitled to zero. Absolutely zero.

A buys a house by himself, pays for simplicity 30K deposit. Further 5k in fees and let's just 2k lusc expenses. 2yrs down the line, he meets B and another year B moves in and they decide to she pays 400 pm. 3yrs time, they split. What's the reasoning for B demanding % of 14.4k back? If B, was renting its likely she'll pay more than 400pm.

In this example, interest payment would account for likely 50% of mortgage, so equity would probably be 3.5k. I'd say another 30% is what I'd be willing to give but that's me being generous. B has to pay rent. If both parties were renting and thry split would she think of asking money back from LL?

Jesus ****ing christ, the laws in this country baffles me.

Come to think about it my solicitor told me if I have a gf and I can't sell the house without her permission.

ebayissues

elperello wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/homes-and-property/why-living-together-could-cost-you-tens-of-thousands-of-euro-1.4430713?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Flife-and-style%2Fhomes-and-property%2Fwhy-living-together-could-cost-you-tens-of-thousands-of-euro-1.4430713

This Irish Times article covers a lot of the issues.

It's behind a paywall but may be a good investment of €1.

Is this it?

https://dowlingfinancial.ie/news/why-living-together-could-cost-you-tens-of-thousands-of-euro/