Will you take an approved COVID-19 vaccine?

Icantthinkof1

ballyharpat wrote: »

Does anyone know what would happen if you were in line for the Astrazeneca vaccine, but refused it because you wanted the Pfizer or Moderna one?

My consultant advised me to grab whatever one I can.
All of the vaccines are preventing serious illness.
If you refuse an AZ for Pfizer’s there is still no guarantee that you would even get the Pfizer’s vaccine at a later date so it would be a gamble.
I chose not to take that gamble and got the AZ vaccine and am very glad I did

endacl

Email arrived last night. Jab 1 at 9:30 tomorrow.

And just got a text to offer another appointment at 10:30...

Red Silurian

Renault 5 wrote: »

Would it be possible for Ireland to have a state run vaccine production facility and instead of buying vaccines, buy the licence to produce vaccines ourselves.

This would future proof supply of many types of vaccines live Covid19, Influenza, Measles, Mumps, etc.

Yes it would be possible and it is a great idea but it would take about 5 years to get such a factory set up in this country - at which point I'm sure the supply won't be an issue anymore

Amirani

I can't see how this would work. There's far more to producing a vaccine than just having a license or blueprint to make them.

Certain vaccines can only be produced in certain kinds of factories, hence why the mRNA ones can be produced at the same scale as the likes of AZ and J&J at the moment. That's before getting into the fact that certain companies have proprietary steps all along their production chains; so for example the Pfizer vaccine will use certain materials and machines at different stages of the process in order to arrive at what is needed for their vaccine ingredients. I'm not sure how possible it would be to build a one size fits all vaccine factory given this. There's also a good chance that if you did build one, it may become redundant quickly.

Absolutely not. They would make a hames of it and bankrupt the country in the process.

Amirani

Amirani wrote: »

I can't see how this would work. There's far more to producing a vaccine than just having a license or blueprint to make them.

Certain vaccines can only be produced in certain kinds of factories, hence why the mRNA ones can be produced at the same scale as the likes of AZ and J&J at the moment. That's before getting into the fact that certain companies have proprietary steps all along their production chains; so for example the Pfizer vaccine will use certain materials and machines at different stages of the process in order to arrive at what is needed for their vaccine ingredients. I'm not sure how possible it would be to build a one size fits all vaccine factory given this. There's also a good chance that if you did build one, it may become redundant quickly.

100x this - essentially we would need the capacity to produce all types of vaccines and variations in manufacturing process and have the country littered with white elephants costing millions to maintain, or have the right type for this vaccine, but have a the wrong type for the next which would cost 100's of millions to refit.

The large pharmaceutical companies have networks of plants with particular processes in certain areas and can shift production around their networks to accommodate new products. A country of 5 million would never have the scale to achieve this

moonage

endacl wrote: »

Aside for a vanishingly tiny cohort of outliers, the only lingering effect of any approved and tested vaccination programme tends to be extended lifespan.

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

beggars_bush

moonage wrote: »

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

Stay at home forever so
Looking forward to getting the jab and moving on with things

runawaybishop

moonage wrote: »

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

The drop in deaths of the over 85s is being credited to the vaccine rollout, not the drop in cases.

Don't take one if you don't want to, but at least educate yourself properly. There is nothing especially risky, undertested or experimental about these vaccines. We have a massive amount of data on them.

robinph

moonage wrote: »

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

Whilst testing back a year ago is totally pointless statistics, jn the UK the first lockdown was more closely followed by people that this time round.... Yet looking at the drop in death numbers, which is comparable as its known if someone dies, the rate of drop in deaths and from a higher peak is steeper curve down and not showing signs yet of a similar curve at the bottom either.

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths

Obviously it won't end up with negative deaths and will flatten out, but if not for vaccines then what has caused the difference? Similar restrictions, but better adhered to during wave 1, colder weather this time round as its three months earlier in the year, but that should help the virus rather than us trying to fight it. More people at work, more kids in school and more people out doing stuff and interacting this time round but the rate of death is dropping way quicker.

Only other difference is people are vaccinated.

Detritus70

moonage wrote: »

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

Explain how with examples, logical arguments and sources to back up this wild and baseless assertion.

Ash.J.Williams

moonage wrote: »

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

Some countries are coming out of hotter months

endacl

moonage wrote: »

The number of "cases" and deaths would be naturally falling anyway, as we come out of the colder months.

Yet all the credit is given to the vaccine rollout!

I certainly won't be taking one of these risky, undertested, experimental treatments. For me, the risk is huge and the potential benefit tiny.

Just home from my 1st dose of AZ.

I’m right and you’re wrong. I won’t bother my hole trying to explain why. Reason didn’t lead you to your position, and reason can’t lead you out.

robinph

endacl wrote: »

Just home from my 1st dose of AZ.

I’m right and you’re wrong. I won’t bother my hole trying to explain why. Reason didn’t lead you to your position, and reason can’t lead you out.

Just got my 1st dose of AZ this morning. Thankfully they had stickers as well, would have been very disappointed if they had run out of them.

Despite it not actually changing anything, still have to stay home as much as possible, still can't meet up with people, still have to wear a mask to buy a pint of milk... Feeling much happier in the world now, and think that is more than having been stood around in a sunny carpark for 15 minutes incase I had an allergic reaction, even though it wasn't the vaccine which a couple of people had an allergic reaction to.

The world is a better place since this morning.

josip

robinph wrote: »

Just got my 1st dose of AZ this morning. Thankfully they had stickers as well, would have been very disappointed if they had run out of them.

What stickers are these?

robinph

josip wrote: »

What stickers are these?

It's the NHS knowing how to properly motivate a shallow population who are more likely to do things for pointless rewards and giving people stickers for being super brave on getting vaccinated.

I'm not ashamed to say that the sticker was the highlight for me though.

https://images.app.goo.gl/ATZFvGdAKoAbVDWBA

schmoo2k

robinph wrote: »

It's the NHS knowing how to properly motivate a shallow population who are more likely to do things for pointless rewards and giving people stickers for being super brave on getting vaccinated.

I'm not ashamed to say that the sticker was the highlight for me though.

https://images.app.goo.gl/ATZFvGdAKoAbVDWBA

You should stick it in your passport!

robinph

schmoo2k wrote: »

You should stick it in your passport!

Vaccination is a great thing, requiring proof of vaccination for being able to do normal things is a very bad idea and I hope that by the time anyone figures out how to setup such a system it is rendered irrelevant by high levels of vaccination so it just becomes another waste of money.

Compulsorily vaccination is a bad thing, and that is what vaccine passport are for.

endacl

robinph wrote: »

It's the NHS knowing how to properly motivate a shallow population who are more likely to do things for pointless rewards and giving people stickers for being super brave on getting vaccinated.

I'm not ashamed to say that the sticker was the highlight for me though.

https://images.app.goo.gl/ATZFvGdAKoAbVDWBA

Sticker, me hoop.

I got a badge!

robinph

endacl wrote: »

Sticker, me hoop.

I got a badge!

Not fair. I'm going to lodge a complaint.

schmoo2k

robinph wrote: »

Vaccination is a great thing, requiring proof of vaccination for being able to do normal things is a very bad idea and I hope that by the time anyone figures out how to setup such a system it is rendered irrelevant by high levels of vaccination so it just becomes another waste of money.

Compulsorily vaccination is a bad thing, and that is what vaccine passport are for.

Not true - When travelling to certain places (Sudan / Kenya) I had to provide proof that I had appropriate vaccines...

robinph

schmoo2k wrote: »

Not true - When travelling to certain places (Sudan / Kenya) I had to provide proof that I had appropriate vaccines...

But that is for a different purpose.

Vaccination in order to travel to certain countries is because they have a low rate of vaccination in their local population, a high rate of infection and they don't want these rich Western countries to bad their citizens from travelling there. The compulsory vaccination for travel is to stop you bringing the disease back home with you, it's not to protect you or the local population of the country you are visiting, who will still not be vaccinated and have high rates of infection from whatever it is.

Needing to prove you've been vaccinated in order to go to a pub, or a festival or whatever in your home country, where there will already be a high level of vaccination and low rates of infection before these things open up is purely about trying to force more people to get the vaccine. It does nothing to protect those other people at whatever event it is you are going to as they are protected by the high rate of vaccination in the country as a whole.

Edit: if you need to prove vaccination in order to travel somewhere then it's probably not yet a good idea to travel there.
If you need to prove vaccination in order to go to the pub then the pubs should still be shut.

schmoo2k

robinph wrote: »

But that is for a different purpose.

Vaccination in order to travel to certain countries is because they have a low rate of vaccination in their local population, a high rate of infection and they don't want these rich Western countries to bad their citizens from travelling there. The compulsory vaccination for travel is to stop you bringing the disease back home with you, it's not to protect you or the local population of the country you are visiting, who will still not be vaccinated and have high rates of infection from whatever it is.

Needing to prove you've been vaccinated in order to go to a pub, or a festival or whatever in your home country, where there will already be a high level of vaccination and low rates of infection before these things open up is purely about trying to force more people to get the vaccine. It does nothing to protect those other people at whatever event it is you are going to as they are protected by the high rate of vaccination in the country as a whole.

Edit: if you need to prove vaccination in order to travel somewhere then it's probably not yet a good idea to travel there.
If you need to prove vaccination in order to go to the pub then the pubs should still be shut.

IMO needing a vaccination passport to do things like go to the pub or concert won't happen, but I would like to see a requirement for people coming into Ireland to either be vaccinated or to quarantine for 2 weeks.

tom1ie

Why are we only getting the 600k of j+j at the end of q2 as opposed to getting the full 2 million we have pre ordered?
Is it down to lack of capacity on behalf of j+j?

robinph

schmoo2k wrote: »

IMO needing a vaccination passport to do things like go to the pub or concert won't happen, but I would like to see a requirement for people coming into Ireland to either be vaccinated or to quarantine for 2 weeks.

It is possibly as useful thing in that scenario, but only for the period of time where the country is being opened up earlier than it should be and the local population hasn't yet been vaccinated sufficiently. Once the population is vaccinated it doesn't matter hugely, assuming the chance of transmission is reduced as expected from the early studies on vaccinated people. Its the high level of vaccination which will protect us, not locking tourists in hotels for two weeks.

We're not there yet, but won't take long. By which time vaccine passport for tourists will be irrelevant.

astrofool

tom1ie wrote: »

Why are we only getting the 600k of j+j at the end of q2 as opposed to getting the full 2 million we have pre ordered?
Is it down to lack of capacity on behalf of j+j?

In a nutshell, yes.

The headline number is the total order (I think Ireland has something like 15M vaccine doses ordered), 600k is what will be supplied as part of the the EU allocation that we get (1.1% based on our population).

runawaybishop

robinph wrote: »

Just got my 1st dose of AZ this morning. Thankfully they had stickers as well, would have been very disappointed if they had run out of them.

Despite it not actually changing anything, still have to stay home as much as possible, still can't meet up with people, still have to wear a mask to buy a pint of milk... Feeling much happier in the world now, and think that is more than having been stood around in a sunny carpark for 15 minutes incase I had an allergic reaction, even though it wasn't the vaccine which a couple of people had an allergic reaction to.

The world is a better place since this morning.

There is talk of easing restrictions for fully vaccinated people. Sounds like a nightmare to police though.

Also you were screwed, should have held out for a badge.

Minier81

runawaybishop wrote: »

There is talk of easing restrictions for fully vaccinated people. Sounds like a nightmare to police though.

Totally agree, and I have been vaccinated. It also unfair, I don't see how the can ease restrictions for vaccinated only people until all have been offered the chance to get a vaccine.

endacl

Minier81 wrote: »

Totally agree, and I have been vaccinated. It also unfair, I don't see how the can ease restrictions for vaccinated only people until all have been offered the chance to get a vaccine.

Agreed. I must say, I'd have no problem with people who decline vaccination (without valid medical reason) having hoops to jump through to public spaces, or be barred outright from private at the discretion of the owner, but not before everybody has had a chance to say 'yes please', rather than 'no thanks'.

Probably a moot point given a sufficient uptake in the population, but if we see the unlikely scenario where, for example, 40% refuse based on facebook posts and youtube videos, and herd immunity cannot be achieved, I'd have no issue with the sensible majority being allowed get on with things while the numpties watch on from the sidelines.

I 'm a teacher, but also self employed in a private practise. I've a waiting list as long as my arm. I usually see clients based on need, but I can see a scenario in the coming months where I'll be refusing service if I don't see a vaccination card.

runawaybishop

Minier81 wrote: »

Totally agree, and I have been vaccinated. It also unfair, I don't see how the can ease restrictions for vaccinated only people until all have been offered the chance to get a vaccine.

I think it was more along the lines of mask requirements and social distancing, probably due to the recent cdc announcement.