Speed vans on dark dual carriageway

restartagain

Does anyone else think it's dangerous to have these vans on the dual carriageway this time of the year when it's so dark. Motorists spot them at the last minute & then proceed to brake & continue their journey to the exit of the carriageway at 40 mph. There will be a serious pile up before long if the vans continue in this location

punisher5112

restartagain wrote: »

Does anyone else think it's dangerous to have these vans on the dual carriageway this time of the year when it's so dark. Motorists spot them at the last minute & then proceed to brake & continue their journey to the exit of the carriageway at 40 mph. There will be a serious pile up before long if the vans continue in this location

Just keep your distance, even the ones at 100km/h panic ..

restartagain

But that's my point, drivers panic even those driving at 80mph & even if you keep your distance on a wet, dark road it's hard to brake in time

biko

Moved out from old thread

Smee_Again

restartagain wrote: »

But that's my point, drivers panic even those driving at 80mph & even if you keep your distance on a wet, dark road it's hard to brake in time

Probably shouldn't be driving at 80mph on a dark and wet road.

Uncle Pierre

Smee_Again wrote: »

Probably shouldn't be driving at 80mph on a dark and wet road.

Not if it's a single lane rural road. Different story if it's a high standard national route or a motorway.

Smee_Again

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

Not if it's a single lane rural road. Different story if it's a high standard national route or a motorway.

80mph?

Uncle Pierre

Smee_Again wrote: »

80mph?

Sorry! Didn't spot how it said 80 mph instead of 80 km/h.

bazz26

So remove speed vans that cause speeding motorists to suddenly brake when they spot them? Sounds like another Irish solution to an Irish problems alright.

kirving

Drivers tend to brake when they see anything unexpected on the side of the road. An unlit van on the side of the road that quickly comes into view when your lights hit it does cause visceral reaction, even if you're below the limit.

The actual solution to the problem would be to install average speed cameras - but 100% compliance wouldn't allow a lucrative contract be awarded to your mates.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1333766/amp/Speed-camera-tycoon-Xavier-McAuliffe-caught-speeding-twice-week.html

Isambard

i think fixed cameras that may or may not be operational , as in the UK, would be better and surely cheaper.

redcup342

restartagain wrote: »

Does anyone else think it's dangerous to have these vans on the dual carriageway this time of the year when it's so dark. Motorists spot them at the last minute & then proceed to brake & continue their journey to the exit of the carriageway at 40 mph. There will be a serious pile up before long if the vans continue in this location

Whenever I visit Ireland I wonder how the hell you miss those things, big white van with luminous stickers all over it saying SLOW DOWN

Meanwhile on the continent they disguise speed cameras as wheelie bins, cover them with leaves, make them look like trailer tents.

I'd take your option any day :pac:

mickdw

redcup342 wrote: »

Whenever I visit Ireland I wonder how the hell you miss those things, big white van with luminous stickers all over it saying SLOW DOWN

Meanwhile on the continent they disguise speed cameras as wheelie bins, cover them with leaves, make them look like trailer tents.

I'd take your option any day :pac:

We still have the gardai for doing that type of speed check - motorbike cop hiding behind bus shelter with speed gun. That type of thing.

Eggs For Dinner

mickdw wrote: »

We still have the gardai for doing that type of speed check - motorbike cop hiding behind bus shelter with speed gun. That type of thing.

Good to hear

un5byh7sqpd2x0

redcup342 wrote: »

Whenever I visit Ireland I wonder how the hell you miss those things, big white van with luminous stickers all over it saying SLOW DOWN

Meanwhile on the continent they disguise speed cameras as wheelie bins, cover them with leaves, make them look like trailer tents.

I'd take your option any day :pac:

Those luminous stickers are not reflective.

On a similar note, I passed a dark green mini bus type vehicle last night parked up on the N24. Camera on a tripod at the back, and PC Plod sitting in the passenger seat in the front. Never saw such a trap before.

i57dwun4yb1pt8

where on the n24 was this setup ?

redcup342

mickdw wrote: »

We still have the gardai for doing that type of speed check - motorbike cop hiding behind bus shelter with speed gun. That type of thing.

Common in 30 zones (Housing Estates Netherlands) spot the Speed Cam



Or the ol park the van out of sight around the corner and do a bit of Camouflage.



The whole country is littered with these things;


You guys have it easy, flat fine for speeding as well, it's almost impossible to drive in NL without getting a few hundred quid a year in fines (taxes)

anplaya27

Quote:Redcup 342: You guys have it easy, flat fine for speeding as well, it's almost impossible to drive in NL without getting a few hundred quid a year in fines (taxes)[/QUOTE]

Not only a fine, a few penalty points too. Get more than 12 you're off the road. I dont suppose ye have them in the Netherlands. Must be handy just getting a fine in the Netherlands so.

SmartinMartin

Vincenzo Faithful Harpoon wrote: »

Those luminous stickers are not reflective.

On a similar note, I passed a dark green mini bus type vehicle last night parked up on the N24. Camera on a tripod at the back, and PC Plod sitting in the passenger seat in the front. Never saw such a trap before.

Were you in the UK?

Truckermal

SmartinMartin wrote: »

Were you in the UK?

On the N24? Pretty sure that's in Ireland.

Rather be in Spain where they have traffic helicopters that zoom in and record you inside the car then issue tickets for speeding, on the phone, taking hands off the wheel and whatever other offence is visible?

Ireland, where they use white vans with markings on the side and advertise the locations in advance parked in a straight section of a dual carraige = dodgy, unfair, money making and now unsafe.

Meanwhile the rest of the world records inside the car, disguises cameras, performs checkpoints on roundabouts and at the end of tunnels and doesn't use reflective markings or warn people online in advance = the right and fair way

SmartinMartin

Truckermal wrote: »

On the N24? Pretty sure that's in Ireland.

So what's the pc plod?

By the way, I think we have just about the easiest camera system to spot in the world.

kirving

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

straight section of a dual carraige = dodgy, unfair, money making and now unsafe.

Why position a camera on an otherwise safe section of straight dual carriageway, where wandering 10km/h over the limit is not dangerous? Hard to rationalise that one and get the general public behind their implementation.

SmartinMartin wrote: »

By the way, I think we have just about the easiest camera system to spot in the world.

Which in itself is a problem IMO. Drivers almost universally, instinctively brake when they see a van, just in case the limit has recently changed or they momentarily went over the limit.

The inbound N4 / M50 camera location was removed due to the negative reactions it caused among drivers. Far more important, and safer to be focused on maintaining a gap and match your speed to surrounding traffic that rigidly stick below the limit.

https://www.echo.ie/lucan/article/dreaded-speedtrap-on-n4-is-set-to-be-removed

Darc19

restartagain wrote: »

Does anyone else think it's dangerous to have these vans on the dual carriageway this time of the year when it's so dark. Motorists spot them at the last minute & then proceed to brake & continue their journey to the exit of the carriageway at 40 mph. There will be a serious pile up before long if the vans continue in this location

Can you show even ONE "pile up" or even a simple crash to back up your tabloid catastrophe syndrome post?

Ffs, "serious pile up"

Kevin Irving

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Why position a camera on an otherwise safe section of straight dual carriageway, where wandering 10km/h over the limit is not dangerous? Hard to rationalise that one and get the general public behind their implementation.[/url]

Allow me to educate, as per the website of an Garda siochana which has downloadable maps and statistics, all vans are positioned in areas where fatal collisions have occurred in the last few years. Thus, there is a constant movement of vans in response to the latest statistics.

What may I ask, is your alternative? Single Lane back roads on a bend, at night in the rain?

Uncle Pierre

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Allow me to educate, as per the website of an Garda siochana which has downloadable maps and statistics, all vans are positioned in areas where fatal collisions have occurred in the last few years. Thus, there is a constant movement of vans in response to the latest statistics.

That's what the website says all right.

But on the other hand, there are four regular speed van sites within 10 to 12 miles of where I live myself in Co. Wexford. Two of them are along what used to be a stretch of the N11 before the opening of the Gorey bypass about 10 years ago, and the other two are on what was the N11 before the Enniscorthy bypass opened last year. There hasn't been a fatal collision at any of them in the past ten years.

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

kirving

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

What may I ask, is your alternative? Single Lane back roads on a bend, at night in the rain?

I've already suggested it (hidden or average speed cameras), but you've gone to the extreme there.

In my experience, the vans don't really slow traffic, but do tend to invoke bad reactions. People drive as normal and slam on the brakes on a dual carriageway when they see a camera. That's human behaviour above all else, it's not stupidity per se.

There is also no need for an operator to be in the van, it's a complete waste of money (nevermind the terrible working conditions).

Smee_Again

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Allow me to educate, as per the website of an Garda siochana which has downloadable maps and statistics, all vans are positioned in areas where fatal collisions have occurred in the last few years. Thus, there is a constant movement of vans in response to the latest statistics.

What may I ask, is your alternative? Single Lane back roads on a bend, at night in the rain?

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

That's what the website says all right.

But on the other hand, there are four regular speed van sites within 10 to 12 miles of where I live myself in Co. Wexford. Two of them are along what used to be a stretch of the N11 before the opening of the Gorey bypass about 10 years ago, and the other two are on what was the N11 before the Enniscorthy bypass opened last year. There hasn't been a fatal collision at any of them in the past ten years.

Don't believe everything you read on the internet.

It also includes serious collisions where speed was a factor.

Uncle Pierre

Smee_Again wrote: »

It also includes serious collisions where speed was a factor.

Well, none of the four I'm referring to are in particularly bad spots for speed-related crashes either. On the other hand, two of them are in locations where the cameras are trained on what's the last small stretch of a 60 km/h zone before you enter an 80, so that they can catch somebody who speeds up to a whopping 70 or 75 km/h just a little too soon.

For anybody familiar with the roads I'm talking about, the first one I'm thinking of is as you go through Clough on the way towards Gorey. There's a sneaky spot on the bend where they look back to what's still just inside the 60 zone, even after you've passed through the village. Basically, it's to catch people doing 70 km/h along here:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6436163,-6.3413434,3a,75y,21.45h,80.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s07U3OxEWeDJxlX5PPeGznQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

The other is as you leave Gorey, heading towards Clough. Along here is still inside the 60 km/h zone, and the speed van sets up near the speed limit signs ahead, again to catch anybody doing a dizzying 70 km/h here:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6708756,-6.305808,3a,75y,230.5h,76.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1ssyj0TqtCptuXV-DECCseDw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

However, I can think of two other locations I'm very familiar with too, where there are regular speed-related crashes (including fatal ones), but where I've never seen a speed van. These are Ballycarney Cross on the Bunclody to Enniscorthy road, and Kyle Cross between Oylegate and Wexford:

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.5826262,-6.5784291,3a,75y,180.85h,77.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdLHldyI1X7BAZw0-txF8NQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.3842747,-6.5181264,3a,75y,193.99h,78.15t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1stbqW6v3buyNJT0NkfRPjbA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Please forgive the long post and all the links. But if you look at those locations and consider the ones that regularly have speed vans, and those that don't (even though they should have), you'll see why it's easy to be sceptical about claims that sites are chosen on the grounds of history of speed-related collisions, and how it can look like they're sometimes about maximising revenue instead.

9935452

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

Well, none of the four I'm referring to are in particularly bad spots for speed-related crashes either. On the other hand, two of them are in locations where the cameras are trained on what's the last small stretch of a 60 km/h zone before you enter an 80, so that they can catch somebody who speeds up to a whopping 70 or 75 km/h just a little too soon.

For anybody familiar with the roads I'm talking about, the first one I'm thinking of is as you go through Clough on the way towards Gorey. There's a sneaky spot on the bend where they look back to what's still just inside the 60 zone, even after you've passed through the village. Basically, it's to catch people doing 70 km/h along here:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6436163,-6.3413434,3a,75y,21.45h,80.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s07U3OxEWeDJxlX5PPeGznQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

The other is as you leave Gorey, heading towards Clough. Along here is still inside the 60 km/h zone, and the speed van sets up near the speed limit signs ahead, again to catch anybody doing a dizzying 70 km/h here:
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.6708756,-6.305808,3a,75y,230.5h,76.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1ssyj0TqtCptuXV-DECCseDw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

However, I can think of two other locations I'm very familiar with too, where there are regular speed-related crashes (including fatal ones), but where I've never seen a speed van. These are Ballycarney Cross on the Bunclody to Enniscorthy road, and Kyle Cross between Oylegate and Wexford:

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.5826262,-6.5784291,3a,75y,180.85h,77.54t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdLHldyI1X7BAZw0-txF8NQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

https://www.google.com/maps/@52.3842747,-6.5181264,3a,75y,193.99h,78.15t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1stbqW6v3buyNJT0NkfRPjbA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Please forgive the long post and all the links. But if you look at those locations and consider the ones that regularly have speed vans, and those that don't (even though they should have), you'll see why it's easy to be sceptical about claims that sites are chosen on the grounds of history of speed-related collisions, and how it can look like they're sometimes about maximising revenue instead.

There is a spot at home where there was fatal accidents 15 years ago. And a few seeious crashes.
It was a 2 lane main road with a good few twists and bends in it and a cross roads.
At the time if speed vans existed there would have been nowhere for them to park safely.
7 or 8 years ago the road was straightened and widened.
The old section of the road still exists but it now services a few houses and farms.
The speed van now parks up regularily on the side of the new road where there hasnt been a serious accident in over 10 years.

Uncle Pierre

^^^

Sounds like a situation where they can just about claim that the speed van is at a site where there's been a history of speed-related crashes. So long as they don't say how far back in history they have to go!